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Jeff Skilling Sentenced to 24 Years (Enron CEO)
WCHS Portland ^ | October 23, 2006

Posted on 10/23/2006 1:11:20 PM PDT by Lunatic Fringe

Breaking


TOPICS: Breaking News
KEYWORDS: corporatescandals; dupedinvestors; enron; kenlay; skilling
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To: A Texan

we=was


51 posted on 10/23/2006 1:46:10 PM PDT by A Texan (Oderint dum metuant)
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To: wideawake
Until the rules were changed beginning in 2006 most company matches in the 401k were for the company stock only and were not transferable while still employed. I agree that people who still haven't taken advantage of the new rule change and keep their match in one company stock are dumb but the folks at Enron had no choice if they wanted to take advantage of the companies retirement package at all. Skilling is going to prison for deliberately cheating them out of their retirements. I'd prefer to see him hanged.
52 posted on 10/23/2006 1:47:19 PM PDT by shuckmaster (An oak tree is an acorns way of making more acorns)
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To: the_Watchman

There's nothing to that argument. The trial ended this summer, there were lots of motions and then Lay's death postponed everything.


53 posted on 10/23/2006 1:48:10 PM PDT by wagglebee ("We are ready for the greatest achievements in the history of freedom." -- President Bush, 1/20/05)
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To: wagglebee
$60 billion in equity disappeared when Enron collapsed

On many days the market loses $60 billion in equity value in seconds. I lost money invested in Enron stock.

The only people significantly harmed were the people who unintelligently overweighted Enron stock in their portfolios.

several thousand people lost their jobs

Thousands of people lose jobs every single day, often due to unintelligent or self-serving decisions made by executives. I've lost jobs myself.

What Americans do when they lose a job is find a new one, not cry about it. Employment is not guaranteed in a free society.

if you think that the only people affected by Enron were the ones who had all of their money in Enron, then you are extremely naive

Millions of people, indeed all Americans, were slightly affected by the failure of this large corporation.

The only people who experienced a severe impact were those who placed the bulk of their fortunes in Enron.

54 posted on 10/23/2006 1:48:20 PM PDT by wideawake ("The nation which forgets its defenders will itself be forgotten." - Calvin Coolidge)
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To: Brilliant
Most murderers get off in less.

Murders usually destroy one life and the surrounding family. This guy conspired to destroy a hell of alot more.....lifetimes of savings by hard working people up in smoke.

He should be executed.

55 posted on 10/23/2006 1:48:20 PM PDT by zarf
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To: Prost1

Skilling deserves the death penalty. Thanks to him, and his cronies at Enron, "Sarbanes-Oxley" was born.

The excessive time and financial burdens associated with compliance, have wrought an enormous cost on doing business in the U.S.


56 posted on 10/23/2006 1:50:08 PM PDT by Night Hides Not (Closing in on 3000 posts, of which maybe 50 were worthwhile!)
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To: wideawake

I agree with everything you are saying. But what is your point? Do you think that Skilling should have just gotten a slap on the wrist? Skilling could have gone to the prosecutors and worked out a deal just like Fastow did.


57 posted on 10/23/2006 1:50:34 PM PDT by wagglebee ("We are ready for the greatest achievements in the history of freedom." -- President Bush, 1/20/05)
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To: wideawake
During the time when Enron stock fell from $85 to $15 they were fully able to pull out.

Show proof or admit that you're just making it up. Typical 401k plans at that time didn't allow pull outs or transfers while still employed.

58 posted on 10/23/2006 1:50:47 PM PDT by shuckmaster (An oak tree is an acorns way of making more acorns)
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To: Dog Gone
Report directly to jail.

Would that it were more common; we'd have better people in positions of power.

59 posted on 10/23/2006 1:51:45 PM PDT by Carry_Okie (There are people in power who are truly evil.)
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To: Hydroshock
Truly sorry for your friend and so many others - however those ENRON employees that maintained a more diversified 401K (i.e. other than investing all or most of their retirment funds into Enron stock )did not suffer meltdown There is a lesson to be learned here for others
60 posted on 10/23/2006 1:51:54 PM PDT by VRWCTexan (History has a long memory - but still repeats itself)
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To: kinoxi

Who's starting the pool on when Skilling takes a "Lay" and "dies of natural causes" prior to turning himself in to start serving his sentence.


61 posted on 10/23/2006 1:53:02 PM PDT by BritExPatInFla
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To: Lunatic Fringe

Bu ELF terrorists who torched part of the University of Washington are only facing 3-7 years.


62 posted on 10/23/2006 1:54:04 PM PDT by Ghost of Philip Marlowe (Liberals are blind. They are the dupes of Leftists who know exactly what they're doing.)
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To: Rockitz
No, you're wrong.

Many people go through extremely stressful circumstances.

I've lost large sums of money and I've lost jobs, in both cases due to circumstances beyond my control.

It's quite stressful to be out of work with a baby on the way, I can well attest.

But I didn't kill myself or worry myself into a heart attack - I got out there and found a job.

If someone ate themselves into a situation where their health was at risk and put all their retirement eggs into one basket it seems really silly to blame anyone but themselves.

63 posted on 10/23/2006 1:54:43 PM PDT by wideawake ("The nation which forgets its defenders will itself be forgotten." - Calvin Coolidge)
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To: Dog Gone

...do not pass Go. Do not collect 4.67 Billion dollars.


64 posted on 10/23/2006 1:57:51 PM PDT by Erasmus (I invited Benoit Mandelbrot to the Shoreline Grill, but he never got there.)
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To: VRWCTexan
Right. Most good financial advisors will tell you that you should never have more than 4%-5% of your retirement nest egg invested in any one company. Sometimes, an exception can be made (up to maybe 10%) for a company like General Electric -- which is involved in so many different lines of business that it almost functions like a mutual fund instead of a single company.
65 posted on 10/23/2006 1:58:58 PM PDT by Alberta's Child (Can money pay for all the days I lived awake but half asleep?)
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To: shuckmaster
Show proof or admit that you're just making it up.

Federal law provides people with the ability to roll their 401(k) investments from one strategy to another.

Typical 401k plans at that time didn't allow pull outs or transfers while still employed

False. 401(k) rules allow you to transfer assets except for unvested matching shares - which are gravy and should never be the cornerstone of anyone's retirement strategy.

Enron employees, like anyone else, could have rolled their vested shares into a number of diversified mutual funds at any time.

The window closed when Enron opted to change administrators - a move that freezes assets for 60 days to allow the new administrator to audit the plan and adjust its books.

66 posted on 10/23/2006 1:59:00 PM PDT by wideawake ("The nation which forgets its defenders will itself be forgotten." - Calvin Coolidge)
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To: Ghost of Philip Marlowe

Their sentences were too light. Skilling's sentence seems about right to me.


67 posted on 10/23/2006 1:59:47 PM PDT by NinoFan
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To: BritExPatInFla
Who's starting the pool on when Skilling takes a "Lay" and "dies of natural causes" prior to turning himself in to start serving his sentence.

My money has a fast helicopter landing in his yard tonight that transports him to Mexico where a private jet takes him to Brazil.

68 posted on 10/23/2006 2:02:25 PM PDT by wagglebee ("We are ready for the greatest achievements in the history of freedom." -- President Bush, 1/20/05)
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To: wagglebee
I'll take that bet.

If the scenario unfolds as you describe, I will donate $50 to FR to be attested to by a third party such as a mod.

If you are incorrect, I will accept a complementary $50 donation to FR to settle the bet.

69 posted on 10/23/2006 2:05:43 PM PDT by wideawake ("The nation which forgets its defenders will itself be forgotten." - Calvin Coolidge)
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To: Erasmus
...do not pass Go. Do not collect 4.67 Billion dollars.

LOL

70 posted on 10/23/2006 2:05:56 PM PDT by Dog Gone
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To: wideawake
Many people go through stress. Some, such as yourself, handle it better that others, but rest assured, it most definitely affects your lifespan. Many Enron employees lost most, if not all of their nest egg and most certainly some will die an early death because of it if they haven't already. Any time that happens, the source of the worry should be considered the culpable and held accountable.
71 posted on 10/23/2006 2:06:35 PM PDT by Rockitz (This isn't rocket science- Follow the money and you'll find the truth.)
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To: the_Watchman

Sim Lake is the judge. He's a good judge. Reagan appointee.


72 posted on 10/23/2006 2:07:29 PM PDT by Dog Gone
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To: Hydroshock

Your friend should not have had all of his money in one stock. Big no no.


73 posted on 10/23/2006 2:07:32 PM PDT by silentknight
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To: Lunatic Fringe
Skilling is a creep, but I am not crying as much as others for the hundreds of Enron employees who could have easily sold the 50% of their 401k plan that was not in "ENE" stock, thus saving themselves tens of thousands in losses. It was obvious ENE stock was on the road to hell from January of that year. It was falling $10 a month, down and down, yet nearly all of them left the discretionary 50% of their portfolios in the stock! Amazing.
It took an entire year to fall all the way down.


Key support broken below $65 in Mar 2001. Critical support broken below $40 in Sept 2001. The majority of employees were still above breakeven if they had sold at $40. But they didn't.

74 posted on 10/23/2006 2:08:06 PM PDT by montag813
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To: L.N. Smithee
He's not getting twice her sentence; he's getting about ten times her sentence. In adddition he has to start serving his sentence immediately, while that traitorous witch stays out while she's appealing her conviction. Not much justice.
75 posted on 10/23/2006 2:08:21 PM PDT by libstripper (!!)
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To: Lunatic Fringe
Interesting some of the responses on this thread.

Many seem to think the sentence is harsh based on the fact that some murderers end up spending less time behind bars.

I'm not really sure what one is supposed to do with the other. However, there are many instances of murder which need not necessarily translate into a life sentence or death. What about when a man catches his wife cheating and kills the boyfriend in an act of passion? Should that guy get life in prison or death? Or what about vehicular homicide that was an accident? What about when you are waken up in the middle of night by a prowler and shoot them, only to find out later that it was a drunken neighbor who wandered in the wrong house?

Of course, in cases of cold-blooded, pre-meditated murder, especally that of innocent people, the murderer should get a death sentence or life in prison without parole. But there are many lesser murders that do not warrant such a sentence.

In the case of the Enron fraud, some high level executives, in a pre-meditated manner, falsified company records to hurt other people financially in order to benefit themselves at their expense. They are greedy, ruthless bastards. These are not nice people and they do not deserve our sympathy. They are criminals just like those who rob banks and knock over liquor stores. Lock them up and throw away the key.

76 posted on 10/23/2006 2:09:07 PM PDT by SamAdams76 (The Program is Morally Good)
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To: zarf

I don't mind Skilling getting 24 years or more, but I think murders should get more than Skilling.


77 posted on 10/23/2006 2:09:22 PM PDT by Brilliant
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To: silentknight

So is fraud.


78 posted on 10/23/2006 2:10:07 PM PDT by Hydroshock ( (Proverbs 22:7). The rich ruleth over the poor, and the borrower is servant to the lender.)
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To: libstripper

I corrected my error in a subsequent post.


79 posted on 10/23/2006 2:11:27 PM PDT by L.N. Smithee (Normal people would kill to save their kids. Muslim fascists raise their kids to die killing others.)
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To: Lunatic Fringe
Too bad he wasn`t overweight with breast cancer.

"27 months! Oh the humanity!"

80 posted on 10/23/2006 2:13:27 PM PDT by Screamname (LET`S GO TIGERS!!! LET`S GO TIGERS! LET`S GO TIGERS! LET`S GO TIGERS!!!)
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To: Brilliant
I think there is a difference between violent and white collar crooks. Keeping the violent offenders in prison during their frisky years reduces crime. White collar types OTOH, offend again less frequently. For one thing, it's very hard for them ever to get another job where they would have the opportunity.
81 posted on 10/23/2006 2:13:42 PM PDT by colorado tanker
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To: wideawake

RE: Your post #27:

My, don't we have our perfectly diversified noses in the air, hmmm?

I agree it was primarily their own damn fault that so many lost so much in the Enron scandal. But why must you feel the need to take that opportunity boast? It's bad form.

(By the way, I have no stake in the situation, never having bought in to Enron in the first place. And hey, you have the right to brag all you want about your good fortune, if that's what makes you feel superior, and if that is a need you have...congrats on the schadenfreude buzz it gave you!)


82 posted on 10/23/2006 2:15:50 PM PDT by Husker8877
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To: Lunatic Fringe

There is no parole in the federal system. He will do almost 87% of the full sentence. His sentence length precludes him from serving in a minimum-security facility; no club fed for him. He has only three chances for a sentence reduction. One is to win his appeal. Two is if he provides 'substantial assistance' to the government, then the feds can file a 'Rule 35b' requesting a downward departure from his original sentence. Third is a presidential pardon. He will most definitely be surrounded by violent criminals. Although he will not be sentenced to a supermax or probably not even a penitentiary, he will be confined in a medium-security facility filled with gang members serving 20 or 30 years. It is those medium-security places where the gangsters make a name for themselves. In maximum-security, you have already earned the respect of the other convicts, unless you are a pedophile, terrorist, or ex-law enforcement. I've been where he is going, and the next time he posts to Free Republic, he should have eight digits after his name (like me). I hope he uses his time to get straight with the man.


83 posted on 10/23/2006 2:16:23 PM PDT by Brent Calvert 03969-030
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To: wideawake

Those who lost most of their life savings might have considered a bullet in the head a more humane act by this corporate criminal and the others whose names we don't yet know. Trust me; they're still out there!

I wish I could make it a requirement to have a VERY LARGE poster of Skillings -- in his cell in his prison jump suit or fatigues -- placed on the wall of EVERY corporate board room and accounting firm conference room in America JUST to give any Lay/Skillings wannabes some food for thought.


84 posted on 10/23/2006 2:16:31 PM PDT by Dick Bachert
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To: Lunatic Fringe

Chronicle article here - http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1724512/posts


85 posted on 10/23/2006 2:16:50 PM PDT by Ready4Freddy ("Everyone knows there's a difference between Muslims and terrorists. No one knows what it is, tho...)
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To: SamAdams76
Two flaws in your argument:,P>(1) We are talking about a direct comparison between people who are convicted of second degree murder. Not instances of diminished capacity like an enraged husband.

On that basis, 24-30 is more than 15-25.

(2) You wrote: "some high level executives, in a pre-meditated manner, falsified company records to hurt other people financially in order to benefit themselves at their expense."

That's not the case - the people they defrauded were stockholders - yet they themselves were wealthy insofar as they owned options in company stock. The absolute last thing they wanted to happen was for the company stock to collapse. They were certainly not premeditating a destruction of Enron's share price.

86 posted on 10/23/2006 2:16:54 PM PDT by wideawake ("The nation which forgets its defenders will itself be forgotten." - Calvin Coolidge)
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To: Dick Bachert
Those who lost most of their life savings might have considered a bullet in the head a more humane act by this corporate criminal

Those who lost most of their life savings loaded the gun themselves and asked Skilling to point it at their heads.

87 posted on 10/23/2006 2:17:52 PM PDT by wideawake ("The nation which forgets its defenders will itself be forgotten." - Calvin Coolidge)
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To: taxcontrol

Sounds like a list of Hillarys accomplishments.


88 posted on 10/23/2006 2:19:35 PM PDT by Screamname (LET`S GO TIGERS!!! LET`S GO TIGERS! LET`S GO TIGERS! LET`S GO TIGERS!!!)
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To: wideawake
Agreed - explained in detail @ link - certainly Enron encouraged employees to have more $$ in their stock - but is was never mandated - and there were other investment options

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/fr/606751/posts
89 posted on 10/23/2006 2:20:08 PM PDT by VRWCTexan (History has a long memory - but still repeats itself)
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To: Lunatic Fringe
The BIG guy goes to the Big House! :^D

90 posted on 10/23/2006 2:20:10 PM PDT by MeekOneGOP (There is only one GOOD 'RAT: one that has been voted OUT of POWER !! Straight ticket GOP!)
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To: Lunatic Fringe
I know a windbag who says "In the corporate world, what you get is what you deserve", over and over.

I can't help but wonder what (he or she) thinks about all those Enron folks who lost their savings, stocks, and retirement.

I don't expect them to be consoled by the fact that most of the crooks involved (Skilling, Fastow, Causey) will actually get theirs too.

Ken Lay, of course, has faced a different, and hopefully, merciful judgment.

91 posted on 10/23/2006 2:20:36 PM PDT by OKSooner
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To: taxcontrol

It's absolutely ridiculous that Skilling gets 24 years and Lynn Stewart gets 28 months.


92 posted on 10/23/2006 2:21:11 PM PDT by tdewey10 (Can we please take out iran's nuclear capability before they start using it?)
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To: SamAdams76
They are criminals just like those who rob banks and knock over liquor stores.

Thank you.

An ignorant inner city kid with no future who hits a bank to support his habit has more of a rational for criminal activity.

In a comparison of wrongs, the white collar criminal is worse in my book.

93 posted on 10/23/2006 2:21:17 PM PDT by zarf
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To: Husker8877
It's not a matter of being superior. I was not boasting about having a normal reitrement plan anymore than I would boast that I pay my electric bill so my lights don't get turned off.

Diversification isn't some kind of extraordinary achievement: it's extremely simple to do and a basic responsibility.

There is no Schadenfreude here - I'm not happy these people ruined their retirements, but I'm not going to pretend that what they did was wise.

And I did have a personal stake in Enron - I lost a chunk of cash in those shares I wouldn't mind having back.

94 posted on 10/23/2006 2:22:03 PM PDT by wideawake ("The nation which forgets its defenders will itself be forgotten." - Calvin Coolidge)
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To: taxcontrol

"Thou shall not steal" and "Thou shall not kill" are both commandments. The bible does not weight either one of these above the other.


95 posted on 10/23/2006 2:23:13 PM PDT by NYCynic
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To: wideawake
I'm not quite sure I understand why you think this fella is getting railroaded. He committed fraud, i.e. he stole money via deceit. The apparent stupidity of his victims does not excuse his actions. The magnitude of his theft should determine the magnitude of his sentence.
96 posted on 10/23/2006 2:25:27 PM PDT by NYCynic
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To: NYCynic
The bible does not weight either one of these above the other.

Yet it prescribes death for one and restitution for the other.

It amazes me the false blanket statements people routinely make about the Scriptures when anyone can check the Scriptures themselves to verify.

97 posted on 10/23/2006 2:25:37 PM PDT by wideawake ("The nation which forgets its defenders will itself be forgotten." - Calvin Coolidge)
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To: shuckmaster
but the folks at Enron had no choice if they wanted to take advantage of the companies retirement package at all.

This is not correct. 401(k) participants at Enron did not have to purchase Enron stock as a precondition of participating in the plan.

98 posted on 10/23/2006 2:27:30 PM PDT by Fury
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To: Dog Gone; Hydroshock; Erasmus
The judge also ruled that he cannot be freed during his appeal.

Aha! The justice system has wised up to Ken's old trick.....the "uh, yeah, uh, he died in Colorado, mmmkay! Pay no attention to the fact that his swim trunks and sunglasses and sunscreen and suitcase are missing...." trick!

99 posted on 10/23/2006 2:28:25 PM PDT by sam_paine (X .................................)
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To: NYCynic
I'm not quite sure I understand why you think this fella is getting railroaded.

I simply believe that the punishment should fit the crime. I believe that theft is a less severe offense than treason, for example.

If LynnStewart can commit treason and receive 28 months while Skilling can get ten times that for fraud then either her sentence needs to be harshened or his needs to be lightened.

Otherwise, our legal system is completely arbitrary and meaningless.

100 posted on 10/23/2006 2:30:25 PM PDT by wideawake ("The nation which forgets its defenders will itself be forgotten." - Calvin Coolidge)
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