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[Canada] Evangelical schools ordered to teach Darwin (Or be shut down)
The National Post ^ | October 24, 2006 | David Rogers

Posted on 10/24/2006 11:19:52 AM PDT by DaveLoneRanger

OTTAWA - The Quebec Ministry of Education has told unlicensed Christian evangelical schools that they must teach Darwin's theory of evolution and sex education or close their doors after a school board in the Outaouais region complained the provincial curriculum was not being followed.

"Quebec children are legally required to follow the provincial curriculum ... but these evangelical schools teach their own courses on creationism and sexuality that don't follow the Quebec curriculum," said Pierre Daoust, director-general of the Commission Scolaire au Coeur-des-Vallees in Thurso, Que.

Mr. Daoust's complaint sparked the province-wide investigation.

Quebec law requires school boards to assure the Ministry of Education that every child between the ages six of and 16, with the exception of home-schooled children, receives an adequate education, he said.

But the 20 elementary and high school students who attend a school operated by Eglise Evangelique near Saint-Andre-Avellin, Que., are being educated according to a Bible-based curriculum and their high school diplomas will not be recognized anywhere in Canada, he said.

Supporters of Eglise Evangelique, part of the l'Association des eglises evangeliques du Quebec, counter that the school teaches a "world view" that is essential for their students.

"We offer a curriculum based on a Christian world view rather than humanistic world view," said Alan Buchanan, chairman of a committee that reorganized the school's administration this past summer, as well as a former Quebec public school teacher.

Mr. Buchanan said Eglise Evangelique teaches evolution as well as intelligent design.

"We want the children to understand what they're going to meet in the outside world, and also what's wrong with the theory," he said. "We also teach that a better theory -- that God created the universe and so on."

While the school doesn't teach sex education, it does teach biology, he said.

"You have the Christian world view that says sex should only be in the marriage and a public school system that teaches kids about sexuality," Mr. Buchanan said. "We believe students should be taught abstinence."

He said the school met provincial guidelines during two reviews conducted in the 1990s, although they were asked to add a Canadian history course.

Ministry spokeswoman Marie-France Boulay said yesterday the province will negotiate for several weeks with an unspecified number of evangelical schools to determine whether they can meet provincial standards that include the teaching of Darwin's theory of evolution.

Ms. Boulay said two or three unlicensed evangelical schools in the Outaouais are affected.

In addition to the 20 students at Eglise Evangelique, another 40 students attend an unlicensed evangelical school in Gatineau, Que., which falls under the jurisdiction of the Commission Scolaire des Draveurs. There is a third in Hull, Que., Mr. Daoust said. The other school boards haven't complained.

The Quebec government knows of about 30 unlicensed religious schools in the province, including Hasidic schools and several evangelical Christian schools in Montreal, said Dermod Travis, who served on Quebec's Comite sur la langue d'enseignement, a tribunal that hears special cases from the province's educational system.

Other religious denominations may operate faith-based schools as well, but no one really knows where they are.

The Quebec government has known about unaccredited religion-based schools for years, but has tolerated them for fear of offending the denominations sponsoring them.

Members of the Pentecostal Eglise Nouvelle Alliance in Gatineau, which operates a school for about 40 students, refused to discuss the Ministry of Education investigation because their minister, Charles Boucher, is out of Canada until Nov. 1.

Ontario schools are not required to teach either evolution or sex education, said Elaine Hopkins, executive director of the 900-member Ontario Federation of Independent Schools, which has 120,000 children attending schools with a few as 10 students and as many as 1,000.

Many parents send their children to independent schools because they object to the teaching of certain subjects in the public schools, she said. "These are issues that should be decided by the parents, not the province."

At the elementary level in Ontario, there are no curriculum requirements for independent schools at all, although Ms. Hopkins points out that the industry is market-driven.

"It's called direct accountability to the parents," she said. "If you're not going to teach reading, writing and arithmetic, the parents aren't going to pay for it."

At the high school level in Ontario, independent schools are inspected by Ministry of Education officials to ensure that they meet curriculum and hours-of-instruction guidelines for credits to be accepted by the ministry.


TOPICS: Canada; Culture/Society; Extended News; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: ac; canadah; canaduh; censorship; coercion; crevo; crevolist; darwin; persecution; quebec; quebecistan; socialism
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To: DaveLoneRanger
The Quebec Ministry of Education has told unlicensed Christian evangelical schools that they must teach Darwin's theory of evolution and sex education or close their doors after a school board in the Outaouais region complained the provincial curriculum was not being followed.

Excellent.

41 posted on 10/24/2006 2:58:50 PM PDT by RadioAstronomer (Senior member of Darwin Central)
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To: VadeRetro; shuckmaster; DaveLoneRanger; DelphiUser; 4CJ; Nathan Zachary; VOA

I ignored your post that scientific progress has been made these past 150 years? Well of course. Duh.

From your lack of response to the elements of my posts we can agree that:

1. Ignorance of Darwinism does not preclude scientific brilliance.
2. Creationism never hurt anyone.
3. Another theory called Marxism murdered hundreds of millions.
4. Only radical lefties get lathered about what does not concern them.

Speaking of progress, the US did quite well for almost 200 years before the banning of prayer in public schools. Are we better off?


42 posted on 10/24/2006 2:59:10 PM PDT by Jacquerie (Democrats soil institutions.)
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To: Jacquerie
You relentlessly persist in fallacy.

Ignorance of Darwinism does not preclude scientific brilliance.

Knowledge is not to be confused with intelligence. Still, people with lots of one tend to have lots of the other.

Creationism never hurt anyone.

This is like saying a little white lie never hurt anyone. Creationist literature is almost entirely a body of discredited screeches against evolution, geology, cosmology, nuclear chemistry, astronomy, paleontology, etc. It isn't just wrong--it's a lie. There isn't a good penny in the whole canon of creo talking points, but every creationist just shows up with the same talking points day after day, feigning amnesia for what happened the last 23 times.

Another theory called Marxism murdered hundreds of millions.

Now there's tight logic! Ignorance is safer than Marxism! And I guess it's colder in Alaska than it is in the winter.

Only radical lefties get lathered about what does not concern them.

Funny, you look mightily concerned about the content of science class, but I don't get the idea you give a rat's butt about science. Does that make you a commie?

43 posted on 10/24/2006 3:13:50 PM PDT by VadeRetro (A systematic investigation of nature does not negotiate with crackpots.)
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To: VadeRetro
Ignorance of Darwinism does not preclude scientific brilliance.

I might also say that it's hard to push the envelope of human knowledge if you don't have the last several hundred years worth of work in your field under your own belt as a starting point.

44 posted on 10/24/2006 3:20:10 PM PDT by VadeRetro (A systematic investigation of nature does not negotiate with crackpots.)
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To: VadeRetro; shuckmaster; DaveLoneRanger; DelphiUser; 4CJ; Nathan Zachary; VOA
Do you think that you or the government or anyone else have the constitutional authority to ban religious teaching in a religious school?
45 posted on 10/24/2006 3:29:53 PM PDT by Jacquerie (Democrats soil institutions.)
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To: shuckmaster

So you don't believe that people are free to believe what they want to believe? You want to force your horse crap down their throats instead huh?


46 posted on 10/24/2006 3:30:48 PM PDT by Khepera (Do not remove by penalty of law!)
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To: Jacquerie
Ignorance of Darwinism does not preclude scientific brilliance.

Is this the best you can understand about what is happening? Is Canada forbidding religious schools to do religious instruction?

I do not believe you are dealing with what you understand. Is it easier to slay strawmen?

Canada is saying that a student educated in Canada should be able to meet some minimal standard of being educated. That means you have to provide, in science class, some instruction in science as opposed to in "How Science is Wrong." Nothing in this says you can't provide religious instruction in other classes.

Now that I've explained that, I would think further confusion would be impossible ... except that I know that such logic is naive. Creationists aren't just ignorant, they're people who embrace ignorance and think it's a weapon of some sort. Militantly ignorant.

47 posted on 10/24/2006 3:40:37 PM PDT by VadeRetro (A systematic investigation of nature does not negotiate with crackpots.)
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To: Khepera
You want to force your horse crap down their throats instead huh?

Can you say, "projection," boys and girls? I know you could.

At issue is science class: does science go in it? Canada is saying it has the right to close educational institutions that refuse to educate.

48 posted on 10/24/2006 3:42:38 PM PDT by VadeRetro (A systematic investigation of nature does not negotiate with crackpots.)
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To: Jacquerie

Do you think that you or the government or anyone else have the constitutional authority to ban religious teaching in a religious school?

Ughh, I doubt if anyone on FR would advocate that. What kind of question is that? Did you mean 'public' school instead of 'religious' school?

49 posted on 10/24/2006 3:44:40 PM PDT by ml1954 (ID = Case closed....no further inquiry allowed...now move along.)
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To: VadeRetro; shuckmaster; DaveLoneRanger; DelphiUser; 4CJ; Nathan Zachary; VOA

We all understand that you think evangelicals are knuckle draggers. Forget Canada. My question cuts to the nub.

I say again:

Do you think that you or the government or anyone else have the constitutional authority to ban religious teaching in a religious school?

Yes nor no?


50 posted on 10/24/2006 3:46:04 PM PDT by Jacquerie (Democrats soil institutions.)
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To: VadeRetro

Perhaps they don't really know what educate means. Just because they are the government does not mean they know anything.

Just because something is being taught in the schools does not make it the truth or even true.


51 posted on 10/24/2006 3:46:44 PM PDT by Khepera (Do not remove by penalty of law!)
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To: Jacquerie

To answer your questions:

"1. Ignorance of Darwinism does not preclude scientific brilliance."

Brilliance, no, accomplishment in the relevant fields, yes.

"2. Creationism never hurt anyone."
check up on the Baby Fae case. She died.

"3. Another theory called Marxism murdered hundreds of millions."

Wasn't the throry, it was dictators who claimed to be following it. I'm pretty sure it was tens of millions.

"4. Only radical lefties get lathered about what does not concern them."

Huh?


52 posted on 10/24/2006 3:48:20 PM PDT by From many - one.
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To: ml1954

Please see my posts to VadeRetro. He thinks you're a rube.

Also see post #50.


53 posted on 10/24/2006 3:49:09 PM PDT by Jacquerie (Democrats soil institutions.)
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To: Jacquerie
My question cuts to the nub.

None of your questions so far have cut to what the nub is for me. For me, the question is whether anyone has a right to lie to a generation of kids in science class about what science has learned thus far.

Do you think that you or the government or anyone else have the constitutional authority to ban religious teaching in a religious school?

This topic is not raised by the main article of this thread at all. I have exlained this to you in a previous post. I knew you'd be back again dumb as a stump, but I didn't think it would be this fast.

54 posted on 10/24/2006 3:49:41 PM PDT by VadeRetro (A systematic investigation of nature does not negotiate with crackpots.)
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To: Jacquerie; ml1954
Please see my posts to VadeRetro. He thinks you're a rube.

Are these your forthright best arguments?

55 posted on 10/24/2006 3:51:23 PM PDT by VadeRetro (A systematic investigation of nature does not negotiate with crackpots.)
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To: Ace's Dad

"(Eeek, I don't know French for the word Oh)"

O


56 posted on 10/24/2006 3:52:20 PM PDT by Vicomte13 (The Crown is amused.)
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To: Jacquerie

Let me guess....I think his answer would have to be "yes." The posts do have a DU whiff of fascism about them, of a "scientific" variety, of course.


57 posted on 10/24/2006 3:53:07 PM PDT by achilles2000 (Shouting "fire" in a burning building is doing everyone a favor...whether they like it or not)
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To: From many - one.
Only radical lefties get lathered about what does not concern them.

I should have worded that better. My point was that lefties get worked up about that which they do not believe, the bible. If I believe in the bible, and wish to teach the bible in a private, religious school, why should they demand that the government stop me?

58 posted on 10/24/2006 3:54:45 PM PDT by Jacquerie (Democrats soil institutions.)
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To: achilles2000
Posting as you have after my posts 47 and 54, you're proving as good a "predictor" as Jacquerie is a reader.

Here's a key passage:

Canada is saying that a student educated in Canada should be able to meet some minimal standard of being educated. That means you have to provide, in science class, some instruction in science as opposed to in "How Science is Wrong." Nothing in this says you can't provide religious instruction in other classes.
Is anyone arguing your side who isn't an evasive, squrimy "Twist and Shout" player?
59 posted on 10/24/2006 3:59:58 PM PDT by VadeRetro (A systematic investigation of nature does not negotiate with crackpots.)
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To: VadeRetro; From many - one.; achilles2000; shuckmaster; DaveLoneRanger; DelphiUser; 4CJ; ...
For Vade, I won't respond to your gratuitous insult.

For the third time:

Do you think that you or the government or anyone else have the constitutional authority to ban religious teaching in a religious school?

Yes nor no?
60 posted on 10/24/2006 4:00:39 PM PDT by Jacquerie (Democrats soil institutions.)
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