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A Return to Triangulation (libertarion vs social right)
National Review Online ^ | 10/25/06 | David Boaz & David Kirby

Posted on 10/25/2006 11:10:46 AM PDT by Blackirish

As the Republican base fragments and Christian conservatives consider a “fast” from politics, the polling data point to a mid-term Republican thumping. Less than two weeks from now, Republicans will begin their post-mortem soul searching. And as the corpses of their House and Senate majorities grow cold, so should Karl Rove’s 2006 campaign strategy.

(Excerpt) Read more at article.nationalreview.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: besthijack; bestthread; blackirish; braad; creation; darwin; darwincentral; darwinhomebase; doublehijacked; evolution; frhero; frlegend; hero; hijack; hijacked; hijackedthread; legend; libertian; minifreepathon; monthlydonorthon; rehijacked; religion; science; socialright; threadjacked; threadjacking
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To: fatima

I appreciate your tolerence. I'll try to let it go.


801 posted on 10/26/2006 9:53:42 PM PDT by SoldierDad (Proud Father of a 10th Mountain Division 2nd BCT Soldier fighting in Mahmudiyah)
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To: Tench_Coxe
So much to address if I wanted to address a rant. And such a waste of time to do so. So I'll just waste some time addressing what might be considered by some to be halfway reasonable points.

Ooops...I can't find even one thing you wrote that is halfway reasonable. So for the hell of it, I'll pick one of the low hanging fruit that had nothing whatsoever to do with what I wrote.

..its none of your god d**ned business what they do for a living.

Any sentient being can go back to my post and see that I asked no one what they did for a living.

802 posted on 10/26/2006 9:55:35 PM PDT by ml1954 (ID = Case closed....no further inquiry allowed...now move along.)
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To: SoldierDad

Relax,(((Hugs))))


803 posted on 10/26/2006 9:55:55 PM PDT by fatima
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To: Liberal Classic; Jim Robinson
The GOP must be the party of reason and science.

The GOP must be the party of reason and science morals and integrity, areas that science has no qualifications to speak on. If there's any controversy regarding science, it's not the science itself but the ethics surrounding the science, the use and misuse and abuse of it. The election is not going to be won or lost on science, but the MORAL issues facing us; abortion, homosexuality, taxes, our Constituional rights, property rights, taxes, etc.

The evolutionists, for the most part, have way over-estimated their importance in the grand scheme of things. Science is a useful tool, a means to an end but not an end in and of itself.

804 posted on 10/26/2006 9:56:41 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: Tench_Coxe

Heehee,have to look up the big words:)


805 posted on 10/26/2006 9:56:50 PM PDT by fatima
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To: Senator Bedfellow

I didn't think you could do much better for an answer.


806 posted on 10/26/2006 9:57:30 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: nopardons

I said I don't care about being seen as important to FR. Doesn't mean I don't have other reasons for being here, though. If you must know, I'm just seein' which way the wind's blowing, that's all ;)


807 posted on 10/26/2006 9:57:46 PM PDT by Senator Bedfellow (If you're not sure, it was probably sarcasm.)
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To: fatima

I'm relaxing at this time ((HUGS)).


808 posted on 10/26/2006 9:58:24 PM PDT by SoldierDad (Proud Father of a 10th Mountain Division 2nd BCT Soldier fighting in Mahmudiyah)
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To: Jim Robinson

When have I done any of that?

Friends don't always agree, and sometimes friends have to level with each other on a sore subject.

What was that old Ben said? We must all hang together, or most assuradly we will all hang separately?

You need to come to grips with the notion that it's not just one side of this debate who are planting barbs. There's some bull-baiting going on from the other side, too.


809 posted on 10/26/2006 9:58:48 PM PDT by Liberal Classic (No better friend, no worse enemy. Semper Fi.)
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To: metmom

Great post!


810 posted on 10/26/2006 9:59:23 PM PDT by Jim Robinson
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To: Senator Bedfellow

And WHAT exactly is THAT load of rubbish ( "seeing which way the wind's blowing" ) supposed to mean?


811 posted on 10/26/2006 9:59:55 PM PDT by nopardons
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To: metmom

I've failed to impress you. Since I wasn't really trying, it seems to me that everyone's happy, eh?


812 posted on 10/26/2006 10:00:46 PM PDT by Senator Bedfellow (If you're not sure, it was probably sarcasm.)
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To: SoldierDad

Good .


813 posted on 10/26/2006 10:00:48 PM PDT by fatima
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To: Senator Bedfellow
Would you care if I suggested that this website was "anti-Darwin Central"? Should you?

Didn't this site start out in 1998 or so in reaction to certain aspects of the Clinton administration?

Posting science is fine, as an aside; but it is (somewhat) a non-sequitur.

Going from that point, and continuing on to (in effect) proselytizing for Darwinism, is going a little far afield from the stated purpose for this site.

There would be some analogy to the exclusion of ID from science classes, because ID is not *science*.

I agree that in order to fight the fatuous condescension of the Kerry-ites, it is important to have a representative sample of conservatives be scientifically literate. But if you go too far in that direction, then the cognoscenti themselves become an elite cadre, imposing their will on the ignorant masses--"these rabble that know not Darwin are accursed" so to speak.

(Yes, go ahead and point out the Hobbit Hole, or even my limericks...but those are conducted in a spirit of amity, not condescension.)

And if you click on the links supplied by Jim Rob in post 655, you will find a number of Freepers trashing FR and indirectly by extension, conservatism and/or the Republican party...not necessarily explicitly, but the tone is there.

But a number of them have seen fit to send me private Freepmails, inviting me to join Darwin Central as an honest doubter...so some rapprochement is still possible.

Cheers!

814 posted on 10/26/2006 10:00:54 PM PDT by grey_whiskers
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To: stands2reason; little jeremiah

Just a distinction from *fundie*. If *fundie* isn't an insult, then *evofundie* isn't.


815 posted on 10/26/2006 10:01:46 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: nopardons

You're lying.

Strong language. Apparently you think posting on FR and another site constitutes some kind of treason.

816 posted on 10/26/2006 10:01:50 PM PDT by ml1954 (ID = Case closed....no further inquiry allowed...now move along.)
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To: Jim Robinson
Have no idea. I'm sure you're the only innocent person here.

If you do not know of any insults that I have made, why did you address your previous posting to me?
817 posted on 10/26/2006 10:01:52 PM PDT by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: Liberal Classic

Ann Coulter is a dear friend of mine and one of our very early FReepers. The insults you direct to her and her beliefs fall very close to home.


818 posted on 10/26/2006 10:02:09 PM PDT by Jim Robinson
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To: Jim Robinson

Your response does not answer my question.


819 posted on 10/26/2006 10:02:13 PM PDT by Dimensio (http://angryflower.com/bobsqu.gif <-- required reading before you use your next apostrophe!)
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To: nopardons

Just kind of rolled off the keyboard, I guess - you know how these things go, I'm sure.


820 posted on 10/26/2006 10:02:18 PM PDT by Senator Bedfellow (If you're not sure, it was probably sarcasm.)
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To: Jim Robinson

That was an analogy of your flawed reasoning.

If I'm a Marxist tool for supporting science they try to use for their own purpose, then you are for saying what you did that echoed those leftists.

In other words, I don't think either of us are Marxist tools.

Republicans who embrace ID as science and demand it's taught as science when there is no scientific study behind it -- even the Templeton Foundation was willing to fund the research, Jim! There were NO TAKERS! -- WILL lose elections. I don't want that to happen. I don't want Republicans to attempt to politicize objective science for votes.

I'm still voting "R" because I agree with limited government, constructivist judges, the pro-life cause and the second amendment.
But science should be left alone. The only way to drive out bad science is good science, and when anti-evolutionists start doing science instead of apologetics, they will have my attention.


821 posted on 10/26/2006 10:03:17 PM PDT by stands2reason
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To: nopardons

Thank you nopardons.


822 posted on 10/26/2006 10:03:33 PM PDT by fatima
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To: grey_whiskers
And if you click on the links supplied by Jim Rob in post 655, you will find a number of Freepers trashing FR and indirectly by extension, conservatism and/or the Republican party...not necessarily explicitly, but the tone is there.

Sorry, but the set of conservatives (and Republicans) is much larger than just FR, so that dog don't hunt, I'm afraid. You can call it "indirect" criticism of anything you want, but that doesn't make it so.

823 posted on 10/26/2006 10:04:45 PM PDT by Senator Bedfellow (If you're not sure, it was probably sarcasm.)
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To: Jim Robinson

No surprise seeing orionblamblam wielding the knife there. What an insufferable prig.


824 posted on 10/26/2006 10:05:09 PM PDT by Petronski (CNN is an insidiously treasonous, enemy propaganda organ.)
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To: nopardons

WE are discussing politics.


825 posted on 10/26/2006 10:06:22 PM PDT by stands2reason
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To: metmom; All
..........Science is a useful tool, a means to an end but not an end in and of itself.

Ding! Ding! Ding!
AND!
We Have A Winner!

I hereby nominate this for Quote of the Day!
(On Second Thought Make that Quote of the Month!)

826 posted on 10/26/2006 10:06:36 PM PDT by Fiddlstix (Warning! This Is A Subliminal Tagline! Read it at your own risk!(Presented by TagLines R US))
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To: grey_whiskers
FR began in 1996, for the sole purpose to discuss CONSERVATIVE POLITICS and most of the aspects of the Clinton administration.

Though there are now many different forums within FR, it is still primarily a CONSERVATIVE POLITICAL FORUM. And as such, those who wander off their own forums withing this site and INVADE and HIJACK political threads, are not only breaking FR posting rules, but annoying the heck out of the vast majority of the regular FREEPERS.

827 posted on 10/26/2006 10:07:13 PM PDT by nopardons
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To: nopardons

Why are you telling me that? Tell it to LJ.


828 posted on 10/26/2006 10:07:38 PM PDT by stands2reason
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To: Senator Bedfellow
OBTW, here's the thing you were looking for:

Thanks, RWP mentioned his work once, but I never knew more than that mention. Does Faraday cage ring a bell?

829 posted on 10/26/2006 10:08:15 PM PDT by AndrewC
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To: Doctor Stochastic
It's been a problem for the last few years trying to support low-taxes, smaller government, and such. These are now welded to the idea of being a racist anti-science nut.

Welded by whom? RINOs or DU'ers?

Take a compliment from me. If anyone tries a line like that with you, use your IQ and flatten them.

But...as Patrick Henry says, "Be nice." :-)

Private Freepmail coming...

830 posted on 10/26/2006 10:08:36 PM PDT by grey_whiskers
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To: grey_whiskers
Does the phrase "dialectical materialism" strike a chord?

That vile nonsense has absolutely NOTHING to do with science or logic. NOTHING.

DM is a perversion.

831 posted on 10/26/2006 10:10:22 PM PDT by stands2reason
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To: Senator Bedfellow
His son is in Iraq.

So I should automatically adhere to his views in their entirety?

Please tell me what "views" to which you refer. I posted no "views" to/at/for you, but responded to what I perceived as an insult directed at someone I care a lot about. If that is a "view" then I think you should research the meaning of the word "view".

832 posted on 10/26/2006 10:10:22 PM PDT by SoldierDad (Proud Father of a 10th Mountain Division 2nd BCT Soldier fighting in Mahmudiyah)
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To: AndrewC
Does Faraday cage ring a bell?

Only in the general sense that I know what one is. If it's a reference to a specific person, place, thing, or event, it's not ringing a bell, sorry. :(

833 posted on 10/26/2006 10:11:33 PM PDT by Senator Bedfellow (If you're not sure, it was probably sarcasm.)
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To: Fiddlstix

Thanks, and with that I'm out. I've got company coming and a house to clean. Night all.


834 posted on 10/26/2006 10:14:00 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: SoldierDad
You've lost me, sorry.

AFAIK, I was merely illustrating the point that your opinions were not particularly significant to me, in the same manner as mine are surely not particularly significant to you. I mean, are you going to change your opinions or habits or whatever, based on what I think? I doubt it. Why should you? I'm just some random stranger on the internet, right?

And my point was that this cuts both ways. That's all. No insult intended for either of you. I'm sure your opinions are meaningful to lots of people; I just don't happen to be one of them.

835 posted on 10/26/2006 10:14:45 PM PDT by Senator Bedfellow (If you're not sure, it was probably sarcasm.)
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To: ml1954
Do NOT cherry=pick my replies, in order to make my own words appear to be something they were never intended to be read as.

Not "strong language" at all. It is MY educated opinion on another poster's reply to me; which had NOTHING whatsoever to do you your question.

Apparently you are incapable of reading the written English word with even a modicum of comprehension and understanding, or you a just a willful, malicious, duplicitous twister of other's words, intent, and meaning.

Why is it that you couldn't just ask your question, without misusing a bit from one of my replies? And WHY ask such a query? Are you feeling guilty?

836 posted on 10/26/2006 10:15:07 PM PDT by nopardons
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To: metmom


I was considering the converse: if "Fundie" is an insult, so is "evofundie."


837 posted on 10/26/2006 10:15:25 PM PDT by stands2reason
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To: Senator Bedfellow
No, I DON'T "know how these things go". Why don't you explain it to me?
838 posted on 10/26/2006 10:17:03 PM PDT by nopardons
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To: fatima

You're welcome, fatima. :-)


839 posted on 10/26/2006 10:17:50 PM PDT by nopardons
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To: metmom
You're welcome J

G'Nite J

840 posted on 10/26/2006 10:18:11 PM PDT by Fiddlstix (Warning! This Is A Subliminal Tagline! Read it at your own risk!(Presented by TagLines R US))
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To: Jim Robinson
Ann Coulter is a dear friend of mine and one of our very early FReepers. The insults you direct to her and her beliefs fall very close to home.

Okay, I had to look back to see exactly what I wrote, just to make sure.

I wrote this: I've enjoyed Coulter's polemics in the past, but her latest book was crap.

I didn't say she was crap, I said her latet book was crap.

It stunk.

Period.

I like what I read in High Crimes and Misdemeanors, but Clinton is an easy target. I have mixed feelings on what I read from Treason. I like David Horowitz as an author, and I read Coulter's columns sometimes from Frontpagemag. I don't hate Ann Coulter, but after reading Godless, I was embarassed for her. In Godless, she was writing far out of her area of expertise, and it showed.

Saying that I think an author's book stunk isn't a personal indictment. Good grief.

841 posted on 10/26/2006 10:18:13 PM PDT by Liberal Classic (No better friend, no worse enemy. Semper Fi.)
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To: nopardons
Why don't you explain it to me?

Sleep on it ;)

842 posted on 10/26/2006 10:19:30 PM PDT by Senator Bedfellow (If you're not sure, it was probably sarcasm.)
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To: ml1954
"Any sentient being can go back to my post and see that I asked no one what they did for a living."

Okay, chuckles, for the benefit of those who don't know the history:

For those who have the inclination to actually dig through tedious threads of mind numbing insults and mumbo-jumbo, Crevo threads have a long history of the equivalent of 'mine's bigger than yours'. And, as certain questions were raised from other scientific disciplines, the retort was essentially: 'well, you can't be a REAL scientist' or 'the discipline has no standing to comment'. Bullpucky.

Or, to put a finer point on it: certain posters would challenge the qualifications of those who raise a point in contention ( in other words, "its none of your god d**ned business what I do for a living). The two defaults (discarding the obvious) are mentioned above.

For pete's sake, these folks stand by and let a liberal arts major carry their water without stepping in and saying 'this is off the rails'(Except for one time--then again, I don't frequent the straight jacket threads. js1138 did chide a fellow for obviously carrying a thread into Rod Serling territory).

843 posted on 10/26/2006 10:19:41 PM PDT by Tench_Coxe
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To: Senator Bedfellow

You should be banned from the board you represent.


844 posted on 10/26/2006 10:19:41 PM PDT by fatima
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To: Senator Bedfellow
Only in the general sense that I know what one is.

Well, the technique RWP uses, requires electromagnetic absorption by the target. Faraday cages "hide" what is inside them.(shielding)

845 posted on 10/26/2006 10:19:58 PM PDT by AndrewC
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To: fatima

They speak for themselves; they don't need me to represent them. Regardless, I'll pass your suggestion along.


846 posted on 10/26/2006 10:20:54 PM PDT by Senator Bedfellow (If you're not sure, it was probably sarcasm.)
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To: Senator Bedfellow
Why is it that you NEVER answer a post, but write whatever you damned please, often making no sense at all?

Nobody was talking about ALL Conservatives, Conservative Republicans, and Republicans, in toto. What WAS/IS being discussed, is what FR was set up to do and what it's goals and objectives are. BTW...............NONE of these things has ever had anything at all to do with creationism V. evolution.

847 posted on 10/26/2006 10:21:57 PM PDT by nopardons
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To: AndrewC

Ah, I see. Of course, any container that would sufficiently shield the contents would look a bit odd on the old-fashioned X-ray, don't you think?


848 posted on 10/26/2006 10:22:08 PM PDT by Senator Bedfellow (If you're not sure, it was probably sarcasm.)
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To: stands2reason

No, YOU most assuredly are NOT "discussing politics" at all!


849 posted on 10/26/2006 10:22:53 PM PDT by nopardons
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To: Senator Bedfellow
You've lost me, sorry.

Obviously something not difficult to do.

AFAIK, I was merely illustrating the point that your opinions were not particularly significant to me, in the same manner as mine are surely not particularly significant to you. I mean, are you going to change your opinions or habits or whatever, based on what I think? I doubt it. Why should you? I'm just some random stranger on the internet, right?

Illustrations require more than words, especially empty ones. It seems clear that opinions of others do indeed make a difference to you, as you seem to have a need to continue to provoke people with out justification. Perhaps you are experiencing decompensation and should get back onto your meds to stabilize your mood.

And my point was that this cuts both ways. That's all. No insult intended for either of you. I'm sure your opinions are meaningful to lots of people; I just don't happen to be one of them.

The insult was there, intended or otherwise. If you cannot see how your words are being construed by those you post them to, then you have language issues as well. And, again, if the opinions of those you continue to put down are unimportant, then stop putting those people down and making posts which result in further comment (which is exactly what you're looking for as you obviously obtain some sort of sick satisfaction in doing this activity).

850 posted on 10/26/2006 10:22:57 PM PDT by SoldierDad (Proud Father of a 10th Mountain Division 2nd BCT Soldier fighting in Mahmudiyah)
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