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The Iraq War Is a Cake-Walk
Me

Posted on 11/02/2006 8:26:18 AM PST by Dominic Harr

In a month of fighting on Iwo Jima, we had over 6,000 dead, 25,000 wounded.

And that was a victory.

And now, many Americans consider 2,500 dead/20,000 wounded over several years to be a loss!?

The only hope for victory the enemy has is American public opinion. We've won all the battles. We kill more of them than they kill of us. We hold most of the territory.

Yet I even see Rs calling this a 'failed' war, and suggesting we can't win.


TOPICS: Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: deathbyhanging; iraq; killalqaeda; killhamas; killhezbollah; killmoreterrorists
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To: taxed2death
If you look at ANY war in the micro [one person] then all wars are the same. Unbelievably horrible! The only difference between a quadriplegic from WWI, WWII or Iraq is that today there is better health/rehabilitation care.

I think what the writer is referring to is the MACRO. In this context the Iraq/Afghan Wars losses are MILITARILY insignificant.....this may sound cold and heartless.....but facts usually are.

51 posted on 11/02/2006 8:58:30 AM PST by PISANO
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To: NYleatherneck
Can't say... Wasn't at Verdun.

Do you know anything about Verdun?

Okay, compared to Iwo Jima. Or Okinawa. Or Omaha beach.

52 posted on 11/02/2006 8:58:57 AM PST by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: Dominic Harr

Wasn't there either

Semper Fi,
NYleatherneck


53 posted on 11/02/2006 8:59:42 AM PST by NYleatherneck (It ain't a World War until the French surrender.)
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To: Dominic Harr
I am offering one insight into the misperception of our progress in Iraq. The top secret information that the press fails to leak out to the world is that we are winning the war in Iraq.

Has anyone wondered why information about the enemy body count is non existent? I know from a good source that we are decimating the enemy like roaches going to their deaths in a roach trap. Soon, the availability of "roaches" will have reached its end. Soon the word will be out that if you go to Iraq, you will not check out. Then, you will have crushed the desire for new martyrs to sacrifice themselves for worthless ideologs and a worthless cause.

The reason the knowledge of our success is not being talked about is that this is part of the war tactic. You never tell the enemy about your successes. You never let them know how well you are doing. The tactic is to make them underestimate your ability. Then you draw them in like a trap to their destruction.

Now repeat these words everyone: We are winning the war in Iraq."

54 posted on 11/02/2006 9:00:21 AM PST by jonrick46
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To: Dominic Harr

I think the title is insulting to families of dead Iraq War vets.


55 posted on 11/02/2006 9:00:47 AM PST by John Lenin
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To: Dominic Harr
We won't call it a victory because we haven't declared war, not officially.

Whether it IS a war or not is beside the point.

56 posted on 11/02/2006 9:01:06 AM PST by Just another Joe (Warning: FReeping can be addictive and helpful to your mental health)
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To: SAR_Bill
If I give you some email addresses of mothers, fathers, sisters, brothers, spouses and children of the dead, would you be so kind as to write them and tell them their loved-ones died in a "cake walk?"

If we told them their children died in a winning conflict, in one we won in a cake-walk, they'd be proud of how their children fought. Yes.

We've become so 'politically correct' that I can't even point out this is an easy war, compared to what a 'bad war' is like?

Every American soldier's death is bad.

That does not make the battles they fought in a disaster.

57 posted on 11/02/2006 9:02:06 AM PST by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: Dominic Harr

Vietnam was a "cake walk." For me. I survived...


58 posted on 11/02/2006 9:02:57 AM PST by donozark (ALWAY BUY YOUR SHOES IN THE AFTERNOON. YOUR FEET ARE BIGGER...)
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To: nicko
frankly, I could give a shit less if you "believe me" or not.

Compared to landing on Omaha beach, or Iwo Jima, is Iraq currently a cake-walk?

59 posted on 11/02/2006 9:03:26 AM PST by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: Dominic Harr

..you mean like "yellow cake"?


60 posted on 11/02/2006 9:03:55 AM PST by WalterSkinner ( ..when there is any conflict between God and Caesar -- guess who loses?)
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To: NYleatherneck
Wasn't there either

You're ducking the question, my friend.

You know what I'm asking. I'm assuming you refuse to answer cuz you don't like the answer . . .

61 posted on 11/02/2006 9:04:14 AM PST by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: Dominic Harr

Iraq isn't some isolated sterile volcanic island with virtually zip population..


62 posted on 11/02/2006 9:05:55 AM PST by oyez (Why is it that egalitarians act like royalty?)
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To: John Lenin
I think the title is insulting to families of dead Iraq War vets.

!?! Wow.

"Don, your son died fighting in Iraq. We're winning in a cake-walk, but in war some people die. He died a hero, as part of a massive victory."

And you think this is insulting?

63 posted on 11/02/2006 9:06:25 AM PST by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: Dominic Harr
Let me get this straight... Disaster. Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting Cake Walk
64 posted on 11/02/2006 9:06:26 AM PST by NYleatherneck (It ain't a World War until the French surrender.)
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To: Dominic Harr

Dude, you need to hang with smarter folks.


65 posted on 11/02/2006 9:06:52 AM PST by edsheppa
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To: Dominic Harr
We picked the time and place for the battle, chose ground we want to fight on.

Baloney. It's obvious by now it was part of their strategy not to engage us initially head on but to fight a prolonged gorilla war. Your analysis is so "MBAish", so "Wall Streetish", so "quarterly reportish". Really, you think you can just arbitrarily define success to be whatever you want it to be? You should not be so concerned about "selling" some baloney to the American public. Instead, you should be concerned with "sending" the "message" to those we're fighting.
66 posted on 11/02/2006 9:07:52 AM PST by Chief_Joe (From where the sun now sits, I will fight on -FOREVER!!!)
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Comment #67 Removed by Moderator

To: oyez
Iraq isn't some isolated sterile volcanic island with virtually zip population..

Exactly my point.

Iraq is *easier* than that was. Comparatively, it's a cake-walk.

We've become so scared by the PC movement, who has declared that if one soldier dies, it's a disaster!

68 posted on 11/02/2006 9:08:17 AM PST by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: NYleatherneck
Can't say... Wasn't at Verdun. Semper Fi, NYleatherneck

Since you are a Leatherneck, I assume you have heard of Belleau Wood?

69 posted on 11/02/2006 9:08:55 AM PST by LexBaird (98% satisfaction guaranteed. There's just no pleasing some people.)
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To: LexBaird

Sure have.


70 posted on 11/02/2006 9:09:37 AM PST by NYleatherneck (It ain't a World War until the French surrender.)
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To: NYleatherneck
Let me get this straight... Disaster.

Methinks you don't understand a word I'm saying. :-)

Both victories. And comparatively, Iraq is a cake walk.

71 posted on 11/02/2006 9:09:53 AM PST by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: george76
I agree with you; the military missions in Afghanistan and Iraq have had the lowest body count (percentagewise) of any war. This represents a new level of strategy, tactics, technology and training. I believe future military historians will look back on this as a turning point in the strategy of war.

Sometimes it is useful to look at wars objectively and disspassionately in order to evaluate them. It seems to me that most of the negative commenters are more focused on the emotional aspect of our lost soldiers rather than trying to understand the point you are making.

72 posted on 11/02/2006 9:10:49 AM PST by citizenmike
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To: edsheppa
Dude, you need to hang with smarter folks.

I assume you count yourself among the 'smarter folks'.

Then tell me-- compared to Verdun, Okinawa, the battle of the bulge, etc, is Iraq a cake-walk?

73 posted on 11/02/2006 9:11:09 AM PST by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: Dominic Harr
Ask them, compared to Verdun in WWI, is this a cake walk? . . . I'm so amused.

And I'm sure that US soldiers in Iraq appreciate your amusement.

I don't know where this moronic argument got started, but "not as many dead as [fill-in-the-blank]" reeks of typical talk-radio juvenilality, so I suspect that's its source.

74 posted on 11/02/2006 9:11:16 AM PST by atlaw
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To: Chief_Joe
Really, you think you can just arbitrarily define success to be whatever you want it to be?

Militarily, success is defined as:

You're mistaken, friend. This is a big win.

75 posted on 11/02/2006 9:13:19 AM PST by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: PISANO
I did a fact check and the least we lost in Vietnam while I was there in 1969-1970 was 350 in one WEEK. Yes this is a relatively low loss war. That being said every loss is tragic...just not as many tragedies in this war.
76 posted on 11/02/2006 9:13:34 AM PST by RVN Airplane Driver ("To be born into freedom is an accident; to die in freedom is an obligation..POW input)
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To: atlaw
And I'm sure that US soldiers in Iraq appreciate your amusement.

That attitude is what amuses me the most.

The soldiers *think* we're winning in a cake-walk, compared to Iwo Jima, etc.

You think they'd rather hear that this is a disaster??? Try and put yourself in their shoes. You're in this every day, and I come up to them and say, "Good job, it's a tough fight but we're wining in a cake-walk." Do you think they're insulted?

No way.

Amusing, to say the least.

77 posted on 11/02/2006 9:15:42 AM PST by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: Dominic Harr

yeah, I guess you're right...it's a cake walk...piece of cake...you know, this sounds like something Kerry might say..."...and you might get stuck in Iraq...good news is, though, that it's a piece of cake..." ...so I answered your question...now, how 'bout answering this one? Have you been in combat?


78 posted on 11/02/2006 9:16:41 AM PST by nicko (CW3 (ret.) CPT, you need to just unass the AO; I know what I'm doing- Major, you're on your own.)
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To: NYleatherneck
I'm curious -- why do you refuse to answer the question? It is the central point of this thread.

19 of our people died in our assault on Grenada. But that was a cake-walk.

If you are in Iraq, and I say, "Good job, it's tough on you but you're winning in a cake-walk", is that insulting?

79 posted on 11/02/2006 9:17:40 AM PST by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: Dominic Harr

this is nonsense. no war is a cakewalk.


80 posted on 11/02/2006 9:18:02 AM PST by ChurtleDawg (Go Mike Steele!)
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To: nicko
Have you been in combat?

No.

But I know several people who were in Nam, and I know several people who are, and have been, in Iraq.

Telling the Iraq folks, "Good job, it's tough and dangerous but you are winning in a cake walk" is exactly what they want to hear.

What they *don't* want to hear is, "Oh, some of our boys have died, time to run!"

81 posted on 11/02/2006 9:19:49 AM PST by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: 2banana
If you consider that there has been an average of 160,000 troops in the Iraq theatre of operations during the last 22 months, and a total of 2,112 deaths, that gives a firearm death rate of 60 per 100,000 soldiers.

So this death rate is actually 60 per 100,000 soldiers per month, right?

The firearm death rate in Washington, D.C. is 80.6 per 100,000 for the same period.

Waitasec. You are saying for the last 22 months, every month, 80 out of 100,000 citizens died in Washington DC? DC has over 500,000 citizens - you are trying to say that EVERY MONTH, OVER 400 residents of Washington DC are being killed by firearms? 4800+ per year? If I'm not mistaken, the total number of firearm deaths in the entire country is somewhere around 30,000/year. We're supposed to believe that over 15% of the firearm deaths in ALL of the USA occurs just in the confines of Washington DC? Sorry, I don't buy it. Got a source for this?
82 posted on 11/02/2006 9:20:42 AM PST by Stone Mountain
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To: Dominic Harr
No, it's not a cake walk. Our enemy this time has several powerful weapons on their side not available to the Germans and Japanese, weapons of proven effectiveness. We can lose Iraq and, if we do, the repercussions will be severe.
83 posted on 11/02/2006 9:20:47 AM PST by edsheppa
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To: ChurtleDawg
this is nonsense. no war is a cakewalk.

War is hell.

But do you agree that compared to Verdun, or to Okinawa, this has been a cake-walk?

19 of our soldiers died in Grenada. Yet that was a cake-walk.

It's all a matter of perspective. If we lose perspective . . . we don't understand what is going on in front of us.

84 posted on 11/02/2006 9:21:29 AM PST by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: Dominic Harr
I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt here because you're probably a pretty decent guy. The problem that people are having with you, is that you have taken all of the pain, loss, fear, chaos, death, noise, smell, loneliness, and any number of other things that occur in combat, and called it a cake walk.

I'm not saying that you don't have some valid points, I'm just saying that it wasn't a cake walk.

Semper Fi,
NYleatherneck
85 posted on 11/02/2006 9:22:09 AM PST by NYleatherneck (It ain't a World War until the French surrender.)
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To: Dominic Harr
Militarily, success is defined as:

There are many different ways of measuring success. Since you've brought those previous wars up for comparative purposes, how much have we spent on the current Iraq "Cake Walk" compared to those previous wars, and what do we have to show for it now and for the long term?
86 posted on 11/02/2006 9:22:25 AM PST by Chief_Joe (From where the sun now sits, I will fight on -FOREVER!!!)
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To: Dominic Harr

Life is like a box of chocolates, Forrest.


87 posted on 11/02/2006 9:22:38 AM PST by SAR_Bill (Not too fond of the Froggies.)
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To: Dominic Harr
We are about to exceed the number of combat deaths in the Iraq war that during WWII were lost in the U.S. in training accidents in one plane, the B-24.
88 posted on 11/02/2006 9:22:45 AM PST by Plutarch
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To: Dominic Harr
Sorry for the duplication, I sent my first comment to the wrong person.

I agree with you; the military missions in Afghanistan and Iraq have had the lowest body count (percentagewise) of any war. This represents a new level of strategy, tactics, technology and training. I believe future military historians will look back on this as a turning point in the strategy of war.

Sometimes it is useful to look at wars objectively and disspassionately in order to evaluate them. It seems to me that most of the negative commenters are more focused on the emotional aspect of our lost soldiers rather than trying to understand the point you are making.

89 posted on 11/02/2006 9:22:55 AM PST by citizenmike
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To: edsheppa
We can lose Iraq and, if we do, the repercussions will be severe.

The only way we can lose in Iraq is by American public opinion.

Militarily, it's a huge victory.

We hold the vast majority of the territory.

We kill more of them than they kill of us.

We win every battle.

The *only* victory the enemy has is folks like on here saying, "Oh, this is so hard we can't even say we're winning".

90 posted on 11/02/2006 9:23:53 AM PST by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: edsheppa
Our enemy this time has several powerful weapons on their side not available to the Germans and Japanese, weapons of proven effectiveness.

They sure do: ABC, CBS, NBC, CNN, Washington Post, New York Times ...

91 posted on 11/02/2006 9:24:51 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilisation is aborting, buggering, and contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: NYleatherneck
The problem that people are having with you, is that you have taken all of the pain, loss, fear, chaos, death, noise, smell, loneliness, and any number of other things that occur in combat, and called it a cake walk.

Right -- they don't understand the first thing about war, or about warriors.

The soldiers and their families *want* to hear it's been a cakewalk. They *want* to hear we've been winning big.

But the "politically correct" movement has so taken over people's minds that we can't even understand what 'victory' is all about, or why it's a good thing.

92 posted on 11/02/2006 9:26:40 AM PST by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: NYleatherneck
You finally get to the point.

If you want to do something really constructive, you might suggest a different term than "cakewalk" that doesn't offend you.

93 posted on 11/02/2006 9:27:13 AM PST by ArrogantBustard (Western Civilisation is aborting, buggering, and contracepting itself out of existence.)
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To: Dominic Harr
It's a bridgehead against the terrorists. A 'target of opportunity'. We picked the time and place for the battle, chose ground we want to fight on.

We took the battle *to* the enemy, and have now not been attacked on our soil in years.

The Iraq war is a cause celeb for the terrorists. They all want to go fight there. This is a *brilliant* and successful strategy.

This I agree with.. Cake walk is a bit much. But in principle I agree that we are not "losing"..

94 posted on 11/02/2006 9:27:22 AM PST by Experiment 6-2-6 (Admn Mods: tiny, malicious things that glare and gibber from dark corners.They have pins and dolls..)
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To: Chief_Joe
There are many different ways of measuring success.

Not militarily, no.

Success means killing the enemy, holding territory, winning battles.

The rest is all politics.

95 posted on 11/02/2006 9:27:58 AM PST by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: Dominic Harr

thanks for having the candor to reply honestly......I think you might want to consider rucking up and seeing for yourself whether or not Iraq is a cake walk...


96 posted on 11/02/2006 9:28:06 AM PST by nicko (CW3 (ret.) CPT, you need to just unass the AO; I know what I'm doing- Major, you're on your own.)
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To: Dominic Harr

I know what you are saying, but to use the term "Cake Walk" is a mistake.

I think it is clearly true to say that the duration, letahlity,intensity and ferocity of combat action in other major wars is a "generally" greater in many cases, but...that doesn't mean combat in Iraq is a "Cake Walk".

I think the warfare in Fallujah is proof of that.

I don't think many would argue that your basic premise is false, but your rhetoric is flawed. My advice is to cut your losses to make your point, change the phrase to reflect it. Whatever it is in the Middle East, for everyone, "Cake Walk" it ain't...loaded for bear with complete body armor in 120 degrees, even to the point of wearing gloves, patrolling down a street of concrete and rammed earth dwellings that might erupt any second can't be a "Cake Walk" even to the troops who served in Bougainville, The Hurtgen Forest, Iwo Jima or Bastogne, even if those guys would have traded places in an instant if they could.


97 posted on 11/02/2006 9:29:18 AM PST by rlmorel (The US Media...Where you get Million Dollar Words From people with a Ten Cent Fart for a brain.)
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To: Experiment 6-2-6
Cake walk is a bit much.

So I gather, but that amazes me.

"Ma'am, your son died fighting the enemy. But we defeated the enemy in a cake-walk."

How, in God's name, is that in any way an insult???

98 posted on 11/02/2006 9:30:15 AM PST by Dominic Harr (Conservative: The "ant", to a liberal's "grasshopper".)
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To: ArrogantBustard

Sometimes I just take a while to get there. U no us Marines rnt thet smrt...

Semper Fi,
NYleatherneck


99 posted on 11/02/2006 9:30:16 AM PST by NYleatherneck (It ain't a World War until the French surrender.)
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To: Dominic Harr
We are about to exceed the number of combat deaths in the Iraq war that during WWII were lost in the U.S. in training accidents in one plane, the B-24.
100 posted on 11/02/2006 9:31:27 AM PST by Plutarch
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