Posted on 01/15/2007 1:45:53 PM PST by naturalman1975
Dana Gioia is a poet, former Vice President of General Foods, and apparently, a Republican.
Appointed NEA Chairman by Bush in February, 2003.
As he sees it, the problem with modern poetry is academe.
http://www.danagioia.net/essays/ecpm.htm
From "Can Poetry Matter?":
"Decades of public and private funding have created a large professional class for the production and reception of new poetry comprising legions of teachers, graduate students, editors, publishers, and administrators. Based mostly in universities, these groups have gradually become the primary audience for contemporary verse. Consequently, the energy of American poetry, which was once directed outward, is now increasingly focused inward."
A story I've told before. When I was at school, one of my teachers - a man I really greatly respected as a man - was heavily involved in the anti-Vietnam War movement. He opposed conscription very strongly, participated in all the rallies, and in our senior classes where were supposed to discuss issues, he presented the anti-war view, which as the son of a man killed in Vietnam, I often wound up opposing.
In my last year of school, I was seriously considering joining the armed forces, and I sought out a bunch of the men I admired for their opinions - including him. I went to him thinking he'd give me the arguments against joining and I wanted to hear them.
He surprised me. He told me the military was a good career, that he thought I'd do well in it and it'd be good for me. I expressed surprise that he said that.
And he sat me down and told me that as a teacher his number one priority in life was to teach his students to think for themselves. To look at the issues and let their own beliefs and their own conscience take them to what they decided was right. He would always be open about his own beliefs - he wouldn't hide them, because he felt a man should stand up for what he believed. But while he was naturally delighted when a student decided on their own that they agreed with him, he would be an absolutely lousy teacher if all his students came to that conclusion. What he wanted for us to agree with his positions - but for us to be capable of holding our own views with the same passion and strength of belief that he had about his.
Today I am a teacher - after over twenty years in the military - and I try to live up to that man every day I teach.
My students are going to think for themselves - and I want them to - even when I think they are wrong. I want them to be wrong because that is what THEY have decided for themselves, not right because I told them what to think.
And my contempt for people who try to impose their political views on kids knows no bounds.
Ezra Pound?
I suppose it's fair to pick on an English teacher like that!
Robert Frost?
If you stopped after Ayn Rand, you still haven't read a single modern conservative writer.
There's a big difference between conservatives and Fascists.
Yes indeed..But Pound wasn't always a fascist. He was a cultural conservative before he went nuts. He was kinda like Jefferson in his notions of merited natural elite and the rise of Poet-King.
Pound and I share southern Idaho as a birthplace and those of independent mind will find much that's worthwhile in his work. But his reputation carries much negative political baggage. I'm guilty of unfairly labeling him but it's almost dangerous these days to admit you've read him, especially in a discussion about "conservative" poets.
Ayn Rand was my first, not my last.
I take the old maxim of not confusing the artist with his art very seriously. Pound is superb poet and the Pisan Cantos are among his best work. It was Pound at his best artistically and worst politically. Pound's problem was he was too damn crazy to distinguish between artistic freedom and treason.
I have known bright people who won't read Whitman because they discovered he was homosexual or others who wouldn't read Eliot because the was an antisemite. A ridiculous notion. It's like judging a singer by her breasts.
Ayn Rand was no conservative
As for not confusing artists with their art, I draw the line at Barbra Streisand, Susan Sarandon and a few others...but you were talking about real artists, weren't you?
I have also been fortunate in hearing/seeing Pearl Buck, Carl Sandburg, Randall Jarrell, Eudora Welty, and James Dickey speak and read from their works.
Ayn Rand was no conservative? Really. Are you one of those who equate Christianity with conservatism?
Well...I don't consider acting to be an art as such. More of a craft. I consider scriptwriting, cinematography,and directing an art though. Hell,,, who knows for sure what art is anymore than defining beauty?
All classification is a dicey business when you get down to it. I call Pound a conservative ( or was for a significant part of his life) while you're concerned that the label has Current political implications. My criteria may not meet your criteria. We may even disagree on the meaning of Pound's fascism. Pound's fascism may well have been of the opera bouffe variety. Mussolini light. Most artists politics left or right tend to be expressed in what I consider to be goofy ways. Picasso is a good example. The world's richest communist artist. While being an avowed Marxist he cranked out the product and was rigorous about guarding his property rights. Pablo was also notoriously stingy when it came to duty to the Comintern. No doodles for the dialectic. ( Damn I like that...I just made that up...whaddya think?) I happen to think Ayn Rand stinks as a writer. A terrific message badly written. What Rand needed was a hard bitten, no bullshit editor who didn't give a damn what her message was as long as she said it well.
The purpose of art is not to advance policy any more than policy should advance art. Even when they are used to exploit each other I evaluate the art independant of the policy.
I happened to be in the British Museum and saw the Elgin Marbles. Magificent. But as I saw them I had the distinct feeling I had seen this before. What was it?... a propaganda film. A Three dimensional propaganda film in the technology of the time.. This is Athens. And this is what we believe. It was a propaganda film in marble. Beautiful. But the politics are seperate from the art. Just like Leni Riefenstahl and TRIUMPH OF WILL.
Do I care what Pounds politics were?...No. Neruda?...Nah...Graham Greene?...No. It is just an artifact of their life. Their art is more important than their politics. After all they were artists not politicians.
The last thing that liberals want in schooling are views that oppose the ones they favor.
I have an idea for saving poetry.
Give great poems to film directors and let them visualize the poet's work.
Imagine what Spielberg could have done with Death of A Ball Turret Gunner. A 90 second film of images words and sounds.
What scares me here is we are talking about substituting an approved conservative canon and dismissing an approved liberal canon. The sole critieria is the political bonafides of the artist not his /her skill as an artist. The ultimate notion in political correctness. If suddenly we discovered that Michelangelo wrote a vicious screed about opposing capitalism do we break out the rollers and paint over the Sistine Chapel?
Diego Rivera was about as commie as they get...but the sumbitch could paint. Holbein was a raving antisemite but he too could paint.
Who the hell suggested that except you? I'm doing nothing of the sort. I want a teaching environment that doesn't impose any sort of political slant on the subject being taught.
We're complaining that no conservative poetic voices are allowed in today's lock-step liberal canon. I said that for conservatives to claim Pound would invite Leftists to lump all conservatives into the Fascist trope that's been created for him. That's just the reality of the times: propaganda and spin as a substitute for substantive political (or educational) discourse. I think it would be great if Pound were included in the canon -- objectively! You've gone very far afield from anything I actually wrote or hinted at.
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