Posted on 02/23/2007 7:45:02 AM PST by Alberta's Child
I guess the definition of RELEVANT facts are only those that make Rudy look good. All the others are irrelevant, even though they vastly outweigh the "relevant" ones.
Remeber - I qualified the statment with NOT ALL.
It's intriguing to me that the overwhelming majority of articles that have been cited by Giuliani's opponents on this thread are from snarky tabloid-style journals. They use extremely loaded language to criticise people, and they don't even pretend to attempt to show the other side of the story.
Entertainment? Sure.
Journalism? No.
Unfortunately, I believe that Giuliani and his friends deserve a fair shake, and I think the general public does, too. Fortunately for Rudy, the national media market is not New York's.
I'm sure Rudy was responsible for hiring hundreds, if not thousands, of people during his career as Mayor. Even President Bush, with huge resources to check out potential employees, ran into problems with the people he hired.
So unless a pattern of extremely poor judgement can be found, I don't think this is an issue. Anyone who hires huge numbers of people hires good people and bad. I do see Rudy as someone who makes quick judgments of people and elevates people quickly from low positions to high if they impress him with their ability. That's his management style, and the results speak for themselves.
I find it interesting that the press suffers from credentialism, the idea that someone with a college degree is always better than someone without. This seems to be their biggest complaint against many of his hires. Sometimes that's not true and someone street smart works out better.
Again, his results speak for themselves. Every administration has scandals and blow-ups. They are a part of life, like the weather. If the overall result is positive, I predict that what I'm heaing about today will be long forgotten by the general election if Rudy is nominated.
D
Bernard Kerik was Rudy Giuliani's chauffer and bodyguard while people like Bill Bratton, Jack Maple and John Timoney (and later Howard Safir) were the ones leading the NYPD's vaunted crime-fighting initiatives during Giuliani's first term in office.
Kerik, in fact, was named police commissioner in 2000 even though he didn't even have sufficient qualifications at the time to hold any rank in the NYPD higher than captain (this is why there was a lot of resentment of him among rank-and-file officers in the NYPD who knew damn well that he was nothing more than a well-connected hack).
So -- no, I'm still not impressed with him.
In some cases, yes.
In the case of the NYPD, a college degree was actually supposed to be a formal requirement for the job.
AMEN.
"How many of those guys made a point of campaigning with Bush in 2004?"
Sorry, I don't get it.
Let's say we have $x to fight crime.
We have two choices: We can put a fence on the border that prevents illegal aliens from coming in, or we can increase law enforcement for all criminals, regardless of whether they are illegal or not.
If the goal is to reduce crime, would the latter not be a great deal more effective? And doubly so with terrorism since when terrorists come in the first thing they do is contact their fellows. This is probably why we have not had a successful major attack here since 9/11.
There was a long article - I think it was in the City Journal but I'm not sure - that said immigraiton patterns are actually pretty similar to what they were in years past. People left Italy, for instance, because they were unable to make a living. They came here, and at first they stayed in exclusively Italian communities.
Then the next generation became more of an American generation, which is apparently happening; the story said that children of illegal immigrants are far more interested in English and fitting in than their parents.
Perhaps the biggest difference is that today it's easy and relatively affordable to keep contact with the old country and that makes it possible for loyalties to it to stay firm for longer.
It's probably better for the American economy to have these workers work here and buy stuff here than it would be for them to work in Mexico and buy stuff there. As I said, I worked for a company that might not have existed without illegal immigration and so perhaps I am biased in its favor.
Whose fault is the illegals' refusal to learn our language and adopt to our customs? The real problem is our own government, which cheerfully prints out election ballots in 14 different languages, lets you take your driving test in Spanish and so on. I don't think it should be doing those things, but it does. And of course private industry follows the lead of business and so we have Spanish language radio stations, TV and so on.
I think our laws that subsidize the policy of immigration without assimilation should change. We should not make it easy to vote unless you know enough English to read a ballot printed in English, for example.
And perhaps we need to figure out how to work out a cheaper medical care system too. Frankly, I don't just want that for illegals; I want it for myself, too. I paid (well, my insurance paid) almost $3,000 for a one day hospital visit where nothing was done but diagnostic tests! That is just plain unacceptable.
Bringing basic care to illegals and other people should not bankrupt our hospitals. Their problems seem like testimony to how bloated they are and how poorly they are run more than anything bad about illegals.
D
Way is it that almost everyone of this site who experienced the Giuliani mayoralty personally, supports him for President? What is one to think? On the one hand you post how you are a New Yorker and on the other hand so many of your posts about NYC and the Giuliani mayoralty are- to be kind- so full of errors.
Is it ignorance or something worse?
Why Giuliani appointed Kerik Police Concessioner? I'm impressed with those numbers. I also remember the stories of the violence in the jail system prior to Kerik.
Commissioner of NYC Department of Correction
Kerik served as Commissioner of the New York City Department of Correction, a position to which he was appointed on January 1, 1998. He previously served for three years as the Department of Correction's First Deputy Commissioner and, prior to that, as the agency's Executive Assistant to the Commissioner and Director of the Investigations Division. He is credited with dramatically improving the safety of the city's jail system, reducing inmate-on-inmate violence by 93% over a 5 year period, and staff use of force by 76%. His tenure was also marked by greatly improved agency efficiency, including a 44% reduction in agency overtime expenditures and a 31% reduction in staff sick leave. In 2000, his Total Efficiency Accountability Management System (T.E.A.M.S.) was a finalist for the prestigious Innovations in American Government Award sponsored by Harvard University's John F. Kennedy School of Government.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernard_Kerik
If you are correct and Giuliani surrounded himself with hacks, if he accomplished the NYC miracle on his own, he should be declared President by acclamation.
It seems to me that someone with a bit of a criminal mind might be best at catching criminals, and such a person is unlikely to have a degree.
I don't think such a requirement is such a great idea, in other words. It's not unreasonable to waive requirements if someone otherwise good comes to your attention.
It seems weird that so little attention is given to what happened when our pal Bernie was police commissioner. It seems like most of the bad news was after he left the job, which makes me think he was a good police commissioner, or perhaps him and Rudy worked more effectively as a team than he could without Rudy.
That certainly doesn't reflect negatively on Rudy.
D
So do you consider the Washington Post, Washington Times, Wall Street Journal and the New Your Times to be "snarky tabloids"? Just exactly who will you accept as "legitimate" journalism? You are in denial because you know that Giuliani Partners, Giuliani, Kerik and other employees are under scrutiny.
Men are judged by the company they keep. Giuliani will be judged from his tight relationship with Kerik. I think many people are going to wonder why Giuliani saw Homeland Security funds for New York City were appropriated to Giuliani Partners. That is a blatant conflict of interest. Where will that money trail lead?
I doubt that Giuliani Partners did anything wrong, but I don't doubt that they are under scrutiny, as they have been for the firm's entire life. You don't get much higher profile than that.
Why do you always mention articles from credible news sources, but don't provide links? One or two links would immensely bolster your case and take this from mud-slinging to legitimate discourse.
The world is waiting ...
D
All those other links carry the same information as the articles in other mainstream newspapers. I don't post from the others, but Google is your friend if you want to look for yourself. I'm sure you won't.
Mayor Rudy Giuliani on the campaign trail
The Hugh Hewitt Show
2-23-07 at 6:11 PM
http://hughhewitt.townhall.com/Transcript_Page.aspx?ContentGuid=946ea11b-064a-4272-90d2-1e2eda6678f4
(snip)
HH: Did you have a litmus test for those hundred?
RG: No. No, not a litmus test on a single issue, a philosophical test, meaning what I wanted to know was what’s their view of how you interpret the Constitution and laws? Are they…do the Constitution and laws exist as the thing from which you have to discern the meaning and the intent? Or are you going to superimpose your own social views? And I want, I like the first kind of judge, who is a judge who looks to the meaning of the Constitution, doesn’t try to create it.
HH: A pro-life voter looking at you, knowing that you’re pro-choice, but not concerned that presidents really matter so much in that, except as far as judges are concerned, what do you tell them about who you’re going to be putting on the federal bench?
RG: I’m going to say I’d put people like…I mean, the best way to do it is to just say I would, I could just have easily have appointed Sam Alito or Chief Justice Roberts as President Bush did, in fact. I’d have been pretty proud of myself if I had been smart enough to make that choice if I were the president.
HH: Do you expect justices like Roberts and Alito to come out of a Giuliani administration?
RG: I hope. I mean, that would be my goal. I mean, they’re sort of a very high standard, and so is Justices Scalia and Thomas. That would be the kind of judges I would look for, both in terms of their background and their integrity, but also the intellectual honesty with which they interpret the law.
(snip)
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