Posted on 04/17/2007 7:01:30 AM PDT by areafiftyone
If you believe social and libertarian conservatives when they say they won't vote for Giuliani, and if you believe those votes will make the difference, they you are indeed participating in electing the dem by nominating a candidate that too many GOP voters can't support.
-—”On Friday, October 11, 1996, Mayor Rudolph Giuliani and the City of New York filed suit in U.S. District Court against the U.S. Government and the Attorney General over provisions in the welfare and immigration reform acts that obligate city officials to communicate information about undocumented immigrants with the INS. The suit asserts that the City is responsible for general public safety and public health, both of which could be compromised if one segment of society is dissuaded from sharing valuable information with or seeking needed assistance from city police or health workers. The suit claims that these provisions of the Welfare and immigration bills violate the Tenth Amendment and the “Guarantee Clause” (Article IV, section 4) of the U.S. Constitution. The City is asking the court to declare section 434 of the Welfare Reform Act and sections 642(a) and (b) of the immigration reform act unconstitutional and void.”-—
There was a second suit directly against Welfare reform filed by Rudy. I’ll send it to you as soon as I am able.
http://www.ncsl.org/statefed/ib961023.htm#giuliani
It’s very simple really, no need to calculate how many votes RG will receive from social Conservatives and Libertarians.
As a matter of fact, I haven’t seen Conservatives or Libertarians put up any candidates since RR. A few in the House and Senate, a few in each State House and Governorships, but not enough.
Obviously, we have very little influential media, since the liberal MSM has been in charge for 40 years. And we have recruited, funded, and elected very few candidates to our liking.
Not to mention the very little influence we have in culture and education.
We have an aversion to activism, and it shows.
If you're voting your own issues, I agree. If one is voting in the primaries based on electability, one does need to calculate how many votes RG will gain/lose from social and libertarian conservatives (and figure out where he will get the votes to make up for the loss of some in both GOP constituencies).
As a matter of fact, I haven’t seen Conservatives or Libertarians put up any candidates since RR. A few in the House and Senate, a few in each State House and Governorships, but not enough.
It doesn't have to be a candidate specifically put forth by social or libertarian conservatives -- it merely has to be one both can support. W. is an example of someone both groups could somewhat support, even with misgivings. I don't believe Giuliani is.
Obviously, we have very little influential media, since the liberal MSM has been in charge for 40 years. And we have recruited, funded, and elected very few candidates to our liking. Not to mention the very little influence we have in culture and education. We have an aversion to activism, and it shows.
That may be true. However, we do have more influence media-wise now than in any time since the 50s -- because at the very least we have alternative media (not to mention Fox, although that only helps us if we want to promote ourselves as the next claimant to Anna Nicole's baby).
I do think the MSM will savage Giuliani at least as aggressively as they would any more traditionally conservative candidate. They will trot out the Il Duce references from pre-9/11 and paint him as a complete fascist. This won't be helpful in trying to pick up independent-dem votes to make up for the lost votes from social and libertarian pubbies.
Sorry, one more comment -- your statement is incorrect.
If I stay home or vote third-party, Giuliani loses a vote that he may have assumed was his, and has to make up one vote elsewhere.
If I voted for Hillary or Obama (which I would never do), then Rudy loses a vote he assumed was his, plus his opponent gains one. In that case Giuliani has to make up two votes elsewhere.
Thanks very much for the link — I had heard about Giuliani’s flauting of federal immigration law, but had not heard about the opposition to federal welfare reform.
We are probably 30-35% of the population.
Can a strong Conservative make it in the general, and then once elected govern conservativley, I tend to think not, judging by our class of 94, who’s legislative goals were demagogued and most were defeated handily in 96.
American’s on the whole seem to favor becoming Europe at this point.
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