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Sen. Mike Enzi introduces bill to wipe out tobacco in America in a generation
Mike Enzi (R-Wyo) Senate.gov Page ^ | July 19, 2007 | Mike Enzi

Posted on 07/23/2007 2:27:03 PM PDT by Eric Blair 2084

Washington, D.C. - U.S. Senator Mike Enzi, R-Wyo, Ranking Member of the Senate Health, Education, Labor and Pensions (HELP) Committee, today introduced legislation to wipe out tobacco use in America through an innovative cap-and-trade program that will shrink the size of the tobacco market over the next 20 years.

“Tobacco kills. We need new ideas to get people to stop smoking, or better yet, never to start,” Enzi said. “That’s what my legislation does. My bill contains a novel cap-and-trade program that will guarantee that fewer people suffer the deadly consequences of smoking, while providing flexibility in how those reductions are achieved.”

“Cap-and-trade programs have a proven track record in the environmental arena, particularly in addressing acid rain. My tobacco plan is based on the successful program in the Clean Air Act Amendments of 1990. This system achieved the desired results faster and at lower cost than had been anticipated. The same can be done for tobacco,” Enzi said.

The cap-and-trade program will reduce the adverse health effects of tobacco use through reductions in the size of the US tobacco market to fewer than 2 percent of the population over 20 years. Tobacco manufacturers would be required to meet specific user level limits by specified deadlines and the plan would set up a market share allocation and transfer system in which allowances could be used, banked, traded, or sold freely on the open market.

The Enzi proposal, the “Help End Addiction to Lethal Tobacco Habits Act” (HEALTH Act), would also close loopholes in the law that tobacco companies have exploited and enjoyed for far too long. It would use proven approaches to help people stop using tobacco products and implement tried and true prevention programs.

“Some have suggested that FDA regulation of tobacco is the way toward safer tobacco products. But we know that there is no such thing as a safe cigarette,” Enzi said. “Proposals to have FDA regulate tobacco are a misguided attempt to force a deadly product into the regulatory structure developed for drugs and devices – products which DO have health benefits. The Democrat’s deadly scheme for tobacco would be very costly, and would not result in much of a health benefit. We can do better.”

The Help End Addiction to Lethal Tobacco Habits Act (HEALTH Act)

Title I: Raising the bar on our knowledge

· Removes an outdated provision that allows manufacturers to shield from the government which ingredients are in which tobacco products.

· Modernizes and standardizes testing methods for measuring and reporting nicotine, tar and carbon monoxide in cigarettes and smokeless tobacco.

· Strengthens warning labels on packages – changes to bold warnings with color graphics – a strategy that has been proven to work in the EU and Canada .

Title II: Determining who uses tobacco

· Consolidates multiple overlapping surveys on tobacco use to gather the necessary data to monitor the baseline and reductions under Title III.

Title III: Reducing the number of tobacco users

· Creates a cap-and-trade program to reduce the adverse health effects of tobacco use through reductions in annual size of the US tobacco market from 2006 levels.

· Requires compliance by tobacco manufacturers with specific user level limitations by specified deadlines.

· Sets up a market share allocation and transfer system. Allowances can be used, banked, traded, or sold freely on the open market.

· The number of allowances decreases each year, ultimately resulting in fewer than 2% of the population using tobacco, versus nearly 21% today – a 90% reduction.

Title IV: Increasing the tobacco excise tax

· Increases the tobacco excise tax based on the relative risk of products (see Title V for information on risk classification).

· Distributes the revenue as follows: 50% to Medicare, 25% to Medicaid, and 25% to tobacco control and prevention. This maintains the tight link between tobacco tax policy and tobacco health policy.

Title V: Encouraging tobacco control and prevention, and smoking cessation

· Establishes an FDA panel to classify tobacco products or groups of products by risk.

· Gives FDA explicit authority to ban nicotine.

· Creates a program of counter-advertising, conducted by HHS, and funded from the 25% for control and prevention in Title IV.

· Closes a loophole in Medicare and Medicaid to provide coverage for smoking cessation, regardless of whether the beneficiary has a diagnosed smoking-related illness.

· Enhances the Federal match under Medicaid for states that meet the CDC recommended levels of MSA funds spent on tobacco control and prevention.

What is “cap-and-trade”?

Cap and trade is an administrative approach used to control something, historically a pollutant, by providing economic incentives for achieving reductions in the emissions of that pollutant. Cap-and-trade programs have a proven track record in the environmental arena, the most dramatic success story being the control of acid rain in the 1990s. The Clean Air Act Amendments of 1990 instituted a system of allowances for emissions of sulfur and nitrogen oxides that could be used, banked, traded or sold freely on the open market. The number of allowances decreased each year. This system achieved the desired air quality improvements faster and at lower cost than had been anticipated.

In cap and trade programs, the government sets a limit or cap on the amount of a pollutant that can be emitted. The cap provides the standard by which progress is measured, and it creates an artificial scarcity. Companies or other groups that emit the pollutant are given allowances to emit a specific amount. The total amount of allowances is fixed and cannot exceed the cap, limiting total national emissions. The allowances then have value, due to the artificial scarcity created. The cap is lowered over time - aiming towards a national emissions reduction target.

Companies must hold a sufficient number of allowances to cover their emissions, or face heavy penalties. A source that reduces its emissions below its allowance level may sell the extra allowances to another source. A source that finds it more expensive to reduce emissions below allowable levels may buy (trade) allowances from another source. Buyers and sellers may “bank” any unused allowances for future use. This system reduces emissions at the lowest possible cost to society.

In some cap and trade systems, organizations which do not pollute may also buy allowances. For example, environmental groups could purchase and retire allowances to reduce emissions and raise the price of the remaining credits – the laws of supply and demand in action.

Cap and trade systems leverage the power of markets to deal with pollution. While the cap is set by a political process, individual companies are free to choose how, when or if they will reduce their emissions. Firms will choose the least-costly way to comply, creating incentives to reduce the cost of achieving a pollution reduction goal. Cap and trade systems are easier to enforce than traditional “command and control” bureaucratic approaches because the government overseeing the market does not need to regulate specific practices of each source.

Cap-and-trade systems guarantee reductions, and companies are given time and flexibility to meet the targets. Sources have flexibility to decide when, where and how to reduce emissions. Making the power of the market work to achieve our policy goals just makes sense.


TOPICS: Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events; US: Wyoming
KEYWORDS: 110th; enzi; govwatch; nannystate; pufflist
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To: Obie Wan

If smoking is satan,why is the government in partnership with tobacco companies instead of outlawing it? Could it be because they don’t want to share the profits with people in the black market?

DING, DING, DING!!!! WE HAVE A WINNER!!!!!!!!


51 posted on 07/23/2007 2:52:37 PM PDT by Eric Blair 2084 (Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms shouldn't be a federal agency...it should be a convenience store.)
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To: All

Not to worry, ultra-liberals (and beyond). Marijuana, crack, and “illegal” drugs are not included. They are PC.


52 posted on 07/23/2007 2:53:21 PM PDT by WilliamofCarmichael (If modern America's Man on Horseback is out there, Get on the damn horse already!)
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To: Iconoclast2

Not since Broke Back Mountain. Now, even the sheep are afraid.


53 posted on 07/23/2007 2:53:30 PM PDT by Steamburg (If we don't want our nation bad enough to protect it, it won't be ours long.)
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To: 31M20RedDevil
Might want to drop a line to the Sen from Wyoming asking what he's doing meddling in a LEGAL business which has been the mainstay of TN, VA, and other states...
54 posted on 07/23/2007 2:56:01 PM PDT by GoldCountryRedneck ("Flying is like Life: Know where you are, where you're going, and how to get there." - 'Ol Dad)
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To: Eric Blair 2084

Proof that NicoNazis come in both Ds and Rs.


55 posted on 07/23/2007 2:56:48 PM PDT by rottndog (Government is a necessary evil, but as with all evils, the less of it the better.)
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To: Reagan Man
So much for Sen Enzi`s lifetime ACU rating of 96. So much for conservatism.

I think there is more to this. Another "Republican", Mike Grosz, in the ND State legislature introduced a bill to ban tobacco completely. It was later learned that his motives were ingenious...expose the health groups in all their naked glory for the world to see.

Why not just ban tobacco completely? : This is a question that has been asked by FReepers with common sense. If it is so horrible and kills the consumer and everyone around them, how could the Gubmint continue to allow it? Everyone here knows the answer. In 2003, Rep. Michael Grosz, R-Grand Forks, a North Dakota Assemblyman introduced a bill to ban the sale of tobacco products in the state. Who showed up to speak against the proposal? Philip Morris? No. RJR? No. Convenience store owners? No. SheLion? No. Gabz? No. Me? No....The American Cancer Society, American Lung Association, and the North Dakato Medical Association!! Why? You guessed it...no tobacco = no money for them.

56 posted on 07/23/2007 2:59:21 PM PDT by Eric Blair 2084 (Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms shouldn't be a federal agency...it should be a convenience store.)
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To: Eric Blair 2084
introduced legislation to wipe out tobacco use in America

hamburgers next

57 posted on 07/23/2007 3:02:07 PM PDT by mjp (Live & let live. I don't want to live in Mexico, Marxico, or Muslimico. Statism & high taxes suck.)
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To: sionnsar
Since at least 20 signatories of the Constitution grew tobacco, I somehow suspect they would be highly displeased, even aside from philosophical/constitutional considerations.

As another poster noted: a black market will thrive.

These morons never learn that prohibition of popular substances, under whatever rubric, increases crime and doesn't begin to stop the behaviour ''prohibited''.

58 posted on 07/23/2007 3:03:29 PM PDT by SAJ
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To: gondramB

That’s what my husband is hoping for...it’ll be like Oklahoma when it was dry.

“They” came to your door and it cost no more.


59 posted on 07/23/2007 3:06:59 PM PDT by altura
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To: 31M20RedDevil
Thanks for the inside info. For some reason I thought tobacco was subsidized because I kind of remembered some controversy years ago about the Feds subsidizing it on one hand yet attacking the cigarette companies on the other.

Maybe in future I should do more detailed research before posting. (Naw, why spoil a post with something so mundane as facts? ;-)

60 posted on 07/23/2007 3:07:46 PM PDT by Brujo (Quod volunt, credunt.)
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To: AzaleaCity5691

Welfare State
New Orleans
Children as commodities

Lets change that in a generation


61 posted on 07/23/2007 3:09:00 PM PDT by revolted
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To: Eric Blair 2084

I have always thought the tobacco industry should pick just one state.... say New York, and refuse to sell tobacco in any form there. Just plain cut them off.

Then see how well the politicos like it... no cigarette taxes, all the border states raking in the taxes, and lots and lots and lots of addicts screaming at them day and night. (spoken as a former addict/ but still smoker’s rights advocate)


62 posted on 07/23/2007 3:10:37 PM PDT by Grammy (No matter the question, chocolate is the answer.)
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To: Eric Blair 2084; Just another Joe; CSM; lockjaw02; Publius6961; elkfersupper; nopardons; metesky; ..
Nanny State Ping

Gives FDA explicit authority to ban nicotine.

Ya gotta love these nanny-statists who have no idea what they are talking about.

Pray tell, how can the FDA ban a substance that is naturally occurring in nature?

Enzi doesn't have a snowball's chance - the Pharmaceutical companies will see to it that this goes NOWHERE.

Now to read the thread :)

63 posted on 07/23/2007 3:12:23 PM PDT by Gabz (Don't tell my mom I'm a lobbyist, she thinks I'm a piano player in a whorehouse)
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To: Eric Blair 2084

Cap and trade politicians; work about as well as trying it on volcanoes.


64 posted on 07/23/2007 3:13:47 PM PDT by Old Professer (The critic writes with rapier pen, dips it twice, and writes again.)
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To: 31M20RedDevil
Getting ready to cut another field this week-end

I am fascinated by tobacco crops... (sounds stupid I know) I've tried growing some and it's not like you can just throw in the ground and expect it to make a go, right? How long do you have to cure it before it's ready?

65 posted on 07/23/2007 3:13:51 PM PDT by LaineyDee (Don't mess with Texas wimmen!)
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To: Grammy
I have always thought the tobacco industry should pick just one state.... say New York, and refuse to sell tobacco in any form there. Just plain cut them off.

That is a brilliant idea.

66 posted on 07/23/2007 3:16:11 PM PDT by Eric Blair 2084 (Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms shouldn't be a federal agency...it should be a convenience store.)
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To: Brujo

Well actually there has always been the idea there
was a subsidy,because there was what was called a
price support program where if the tobacco didn`t
bring the support price it went into the gov warehouse
where it would later sell.

It`s my understanding it didn`t cost the taxpayer as
it was eventually sold at the price the gov paid.


67 posted on 07/23/2007 3:18:48 PM PDT by 31M20RedDevil (Fred Thompson for President)
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To: revolted

What the hell does New Orleans have to do with this. I really wish that damned hurricane had never happened, for one thing, it hurt alot of people I knew, and it gave people who had never been to this part of the world a reason in their own mind to justifying tearing it down to make themselves feel better.

You want to tear down New Orleans, fine, the minute they empty out San Francisco and Los Angeles for earthquake danger, Las Vegas and Phoenix because they could only exist with modern technology, St. Louis and Memphis because they are in the New Madrid Seismic Zone, Hawaii and Alaska because of the tsunami risk, Minnesota because of the bitter cold. When you convince people to leave all these places, then by all means, you’ll have a right to ask New Orleans to go away. However, if you’re not willing to see L.A and New York go by the wayside (incidentally, NYC is vulnerable to earthquakes and hurricanes), then don’t begin to talk about New Orleans.


68 posted on 07/23/2007 3:21:35 PM PDT by AzaleaCity5691
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To: Grammy; Eric Blair 2084
I have always thought the tobacco industry should pick just one state.... say New York, and refuse to sell tobacco in any form there. Just plain cut them off.

It can not be done because of the Master Settlement Agreement, at least not by the signatories to the MSA. Not until at least 2024 when the agreement expires.

69 posted on 07/23/2007 3:21:38 PM PDT by Gabz (Don't tell my mom I'm a lobbyist, she thinks I'm a piano player in a whorehouse)
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To: Eric Blair 2084

America’s two party system in 2007: Socialists and Socialist-lites


70 posted on 07/23/2007 3:23:09 PM PDT by OB1kNOb (Support Duncan Hunter for the 2008 GOP presidential nominee. He will build the fence!!)
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To: Eric Blair 2084

Another big government nanny state statist. LEAVE THE PEOPLE ALONE. This country is DEAD.


71 posted on 07/23/2007 3:26:01 PM PDT by therut
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To: Eric Blair 2084

>>>once the grant junkies see that the FDA would have the power to BAN NICOTINE from cigarettes

What will they do about tomatoes? Artichokes? Tobacco is not the only nightshade plant with nicotine.

So BAFT is going to monitor our gardens?


72 posted on 07/23/2007 3:27:27 PM PDT by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: Eric Blair 2084

Republicans will lose when they try to be democrats.

Hopefully, in his retirement from the US Senate, this bozo will be able to contemplate the notion of leaving other people alone.


73 posted on 07/23/2007 3:27:32 PM PDT by Popocatapetl
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To: Brujo
Hmm, wouldn't cutting off subsidies pretty much wipe out tobacco growing immediately?

Wouldn't the same all assault by the govt. on alcohol sales save more lives, prevent domestic violence, prevent vehicular homicides, reduce the risk of ............? You name it.

Alcohol consumption has killed more people, ruined more lives, destroyed more families, helped to contribute to spouse abuse, child abuse, and resulted in alcohol rage induced homicides than ten centuries of tobacco use will ever create.......

Unfortunately everybody (almost everybody) likes alcohol, tobacco users are the modern day Jews that need to be purged by the modern day nico-nazi's......

My anger grows!

74 posted on 07/23/2007 3:28:37 PM PDT by Hot Tabasco
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To: 31M20RedDevil
Hmm, maybe that's what I was thinking of. To an outsider such as myself, subsidy and price support programs look fairly similar.

I see what you're saying about cost, though. Assuming it gets sold at the supported price, the cost structure is certainly different than it would have been in a pure subsidy program.

75 posted on 07/23/2007 3:29:20 PM PDT by Brujo (Quod volunt, credunt.)
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To: Gabz

Now it makes sense. I fell asleep after reading the first 44 pages of the MSA agreement.


76 posted on 07/23/2007 3:29:41 PM PDT by Eric Blair 2084 (Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms shouldn't be a federal agency...it should be a convenience store.)
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To: Iconoclast2

Me too. My only guess is that this Enzi guy is in someone’s pocket.


77 posted on 07/23/2007 3:30:21 PM PDT by martywake (Carpe Jugulum... Seize the throat.)
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To: Popocatapetl

Like I said earlier, I really think Enzi is up to something more genius....namely exposing hypocritical anti-smoking groups who were on board with the Kennedy bill backed by Philip Morris.

Click on the link to Dr. Siegels blog. The whole thing is really quite fascinating/disgusting if you have the stomach for it.


78 posted on 07/23/2007 3:32:49 PM PDT by Eric Blair 2084 (Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms shouldn't be a federal agency...it should be a convenience store.)
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To: Eric Blair 2084

I started reading the first drafts of that bad boy back in the early 90s. Somewhere I still have a hard copy of it, not that I plan on looking for it anytime soon :)


79 posted on 07/23/2007 3:34:05 PM PDT by Gabz (Don't tell my mom I'm a lobbyist, she thinks I'm a piano player in a whorehouse)
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To: Iconoclast2
Foolish me. I thought there were real Republicans in Wyoming.

I'd argue there are.
80 posted on 07/23/2007 3:37:59 PM PDT by tfecw (It's for the children)
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To: Eric Blair 2084
Image hosted by Photobucket.com none of them have the BALLS to try and make it illegal... vermin.
81 posted on 07/23/2007 3:38:02 PM PDT by Chode (American Hedonist)
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To: Hot Tabasco
Umm, how is stopping a subsidy (which I've been informed actually is a price support program) an “assault by the govt.”? If anything, it's the government removing itself from interfering in a market.

As far as I can tell (totally anecdotal, of course), alcohol abuse does seem to cause more trouble in general than smoking cigarettes, but even there it's the abuse that causes the trouble, not (moderate) use.

I didn't call for and don't want anyone to be purged. I am just curious why a government that disparages the use of something (tobacco) would financially support its growth.

82 posted on 07/23/2007 3:39:13 PM PDT by Brujo (Quod volunt, credunt.)
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To: Mad_as_heck

Exactly, for the same reason Abraham Lincoln went to war: to keep southern tariff collections intact!


83 posted on 07/23/2007 3:46:24 PM PDT by Theodore R. ( Cowardice is still forever!)
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To: AzaleaCity5691

Only in that this city brought into world view the sad state of affairs brought on by the continuation of a dependancy of people on the government. I wasn’t implying to get rid of New Orleans.
I believe I mentioned the word

change

And really any large city has similar concerns.
It would just be nice to see that mind set of a welfare state changed over the next generation.

In other words, instead of trying to change cigarettes in a generation why not try to change something more important to the growth of our entire country.


84 posted on 07/23/2007 3:51:18 PM PDT by revolted
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To: Theodore R.
Exactly, for the same reason Abraham Lincoln went to war: to keep southern tariff collections intact!

That statement just went over the head of every public school educated adult who hasn't taken advanced U.S. History courses in college. The dumbed down version is that the Civil War was fought because of slavery.

85 posted on 07/23/2007 3:52:49 PM PDT by Eric Blair 2084 (Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms shouldn't be a federal agency...it should be a convenience store.)
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To: Eric Blair 2084
Wow, a Republican is doing this. Well, at least he isn't pushing for an outright ban like a Dim would, and there's a hint of the free market in his proposal.

So it's best to just support him because the Dem would certainly be far worse.

86 posted on 07/23/2007 3:55:29 PM PDT by Extremely Extreme Extremist
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To: Extremely Extreme Extremist

EEE, there is more to it. Read the alternative proposal supported by the health groups and MO.

Before we all dump on Enzi, I’m willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.


87 posted on 07/23/2007 3:58:55 PM PDT by Eric Blair 2084 (Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms shouldn't be a federal agency...it should be a convenience store.)
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To: mjp

Amen.. we tried to warn and warn that us smokers are just the start.. once they pull of a tobacco ban, you can bet that food and anything else the govt wants banned will be next.

Oh well.. when the day smoking makes me an outlaw, I stop caring.


88 posted on 07/23/2007 4:01:51 PM PDT by eXe (Si vis pacem, para bellum)
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To: Eric Blair 2084
Title IV: Increasing the tobacco excise tax

I don't know why these clymers bother with any other title, point, section, bullet, heading, whatever, in these proposals when the only thing they really want to do is raise taxes so they have more money to spend. And a conservative Republican no less!

89 posted on 07/23/2007 4:07:22 PM PDT by Dahoser (America's great untapped alternative energy source: The Founding Fathers spinning in their graves.)
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To: Eric Blair 2084
Thanks for the link.

Belter told the House that committee members were frustrated last week with the testimony from anti-tobacco groups that testified against the tobacco ban, including the North Dakota Medical Association, American Heart Association, American Cancer Society, American Lung Association, North Dakota Public Health Association and North Dakota Nurses Association.

The ban also could take away certain funding forthese groups for tobacco control programs. http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/news/827172/posts


90 posted on 07/23/2007 4:13:29 PM PDT by Zon (Honesty outlives the lie, spin and deception -- It always has -- It always will.)
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To: Extremely Extreme Extremist

PS: A liberal dim wouldn’t dare push for an outright ban on tobacco. Where else are they going to get the money to pay for their vision of a Socialist Utopia?


91 posted on 07/23/2007 4:35:27 PM PDT by Eric Blair 2084 (Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms shouldn't be a federal agency...it should be a convenience store.)
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To: Iconoclast2
Foolish me. I thought there were real Republicans in Wyoming.

Give it a chance to play out. When health groups don't support the quasi ban, the few people left who thinks this is about health or second hand smoke will get a bucket of cold water poured over their heads.

92 posted on 07/23/2007 4:48:11 PM PDT by Eric Blair 2084 (Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms shouldn't be a federal agency...it should be a convenience store.)
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To: rellimpank
--seriously, I thought this was an Onion or the AZConservative satire stuff, at first---

No, that would be something like this...

Man’s Impending Death To Be Caused By Second Hand Smoke

When I posted it on FR, some intelligent people thought it was real. Just proves that life imitates the onion.

93 posted on 07/23/2007 4:52:41 PM PDT by Eric Blair 2084 (Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms shouldn't be a federal agency...it should be a convenience store.)
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To: 31M20RedDevil
Need a customer, or maybe a bunch of customers.

Co-Ops, the wave of the future.

94 posted on 07/23/2007 4:59:19 PM PDT by Just another Joe (Warning: FReeping can be addictive and helpful to your mental health)
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To: lowbridge

I can’t believe you are familiar with Carrie Nation!!

I’m one of her last remaining blood relatives. Most of the stuff in the Carrie Nation museum in Kansas was donated by my Mom.

Interesting cat.


95 posted on 07/23/2007 5:02:49 PM PDT by RinaseaofDs
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To: Eric Blair 2084
Sen. Mike Enzi introduces bill to wipe out tobacco in America in a generation

Careful Senator. There;s PETA who think Beef should be gone in a generation too

And WHY is it ANY of the govt's business anyhow?

Big government Rino alert.
96 posted on 07/23/2007 5:18:54 PM PDT by RedMonqey ( The truth is never PC)
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To: Iconoclast2
Foolish me. I thought there were real Republicans in Wyoming.

Actually, what we're seeing is the "real" Republican, at least the 21st Century version. The ride is completely downhill from here on out. Blackbird.

97 posted on 07/23/2007 5:32:41 PM PDT by BlackbirdSST (I'm dug in, giving no more ground to the rino stampede. BB)
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To: Steamburg
It must be in the water in D.C.

I drank the water in and around DeeCee for 20+ years, it ain't the water. Blackbird.

98 posted on 07/23/2007 5:35:29 PM PDT by BlackbirdSST (I'm dug in, giving no more ground to the rino stampede. BB)
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To: Eric Blair 2084
You can get as much nicotine as you want, as long as you buy it from Pfizer or Merck in one of their NRT products.

...or tomatoes. Blackbird.

99 posted on 07/23/2007 5:39:23 PM PDT by BlackbirdSST (I'm dug in, giving no more ground to the rino stampede. BB)
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To: ElkGroveDan
Are you nuts! You can’t have that! The All Powerful Ones declared that’s bad for you, and since they’re going to eventually ram their health care down our throats, they’ll be able to dictate everything we do. How long until your club card at your market gets attached to your national health care? Penalties for those twinkies, not enough fruit - eat more vegetables else we’ll raise your premiums!
100 posted on 07/23/2007 5:40:02 PM PDT by kingu (No, I don't use sarcasm tags - it confuses people.)
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