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Vanishing England
Townhall.com ^ | Cal Thomas

Posted on 08/28/2007 4:19:23 AM PDT by Kaslin

"There'll Always Be an England" - popular World War II song

BELFAST, NORTHERN IRELAND - Perhaps there will not always be an England. An exodus unprecedented in modern times, coupled with a record influx of foreigners, is threatening to erode the character of the land of William Shakespeare and overpowering monarchs, a land that served as the cradle for much of American thought, law and culture.

The figures, making headlines in London newspapers, tell only part of the story. Between June 2005 and June 2006 nearly 200,000 British citizens chose to leave the country for a new life elsewhere. During the same period, at least 574,000 immigrants came to Britain. This number does not include the people who broke the law to get there, or the thousands unknown to the government. Britain's Office of National Statistics reports that middle-class Britons are beginning to move out of towns in southern England that have become home to large numbers of immigrants, thereby altering the character of neighborhoods that have remained unchanged for generations.

Britons give many reasons for leaving, but their stories share one commonality: life in Britain has become unbearable for them. They fear lawlessness and the threat of more terrorism from a growing Muslim population and the loss of a sense of Britishness, exacerbated by the growing refusal of public schools to teach the history and culture of the nation to the next generation. What it means to be British has been watered down in a plague of political correctness that has swept the country faster than hoof-and-mouth disease. Officials say they do not wish to "offend" others.

Hundreds of thousands of asylum seekers are about to be granted "amnesty" to stay in Britain. The government's approach is similar to that pursued by President Bush, who failed to win congressional approval for his amnesty plan. In Britain it appears likely to succeed. Migrants will be granted immediate access to many benefits, including top priority for council housing. Taxpayers will foot the bill.

The Shadow Home Secretary, David Davis, called the policy a "stealth amnesty." Again, in a comment reminiscent of the debate in America, Sir Andrew Green, chairman of Migrationwatch UK, said: "This is yet another example of the Alice in Wonderland world of human rights. If you break British law for long enough, you acquire rights not penalties."

British media have carried stories about an Italian immigrant who murdered a schoolteacher and was sentenced to life in prison. He is about to be released after serving just 12 years. The government wants to deport him to Italy, but a combination of British human rights legislation and European Union law are making it impossible to do so. This does not bode well for deporting Islamic terrorists who call for the overthrow of the government and incite young people to acts of violence.

Abraham Lincoln said no nation can exist half slave and half free. Neither can a nation be sustained if it allows conditions that result in mass emigration, while importing huge numbers of foreigners who come from backgrounds that do not practice assimilation or tolerance of other beliefs. When one factors in the high number of abortions (one in five pregnancies are aborted in England and Wales), the high birth rates of immigrants (15 times those of white Britons), it doesn't take a population expert to predict that the days of the England we have known may be numbered. The problem for Britain and the United States isn't just the change in demographics. It is the reluctance of both countries to inculcate the beliefs, history and, yes, religious ideals, which made our nations so successful that others wanted to come and be a part of them. The difference between many of the current immigrants and those of the past is that the previous ones wanted to become fully American or fully British. The current ones, in too many cases, would destroy what makes our countries unique. And the "leaders" of Britain and America refuse to stop it.

The greater tragedy is that the people of Britain have little say in any of this, so they are taking the road of last resort. They are leaving.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; Foreign Affairs; United Kingdom
KEYWORDS:
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1 posted on 08/28/2007 4:19:23 AM PDT by Kaslin
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To: Lil'freeper

Ping


2 posted on 08/28/2007 4:20:44 AM PDT by big'ol_freeper ("Those who hammer their guns into plows will plow for those who do not." ~ Thomas Jefferson)
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To: Kaslin

Reading Roy Jenkins excellent biography of Churchill, you have to wonder if Cal doesn’t have a point.


3 posted on 08/28/2007 4:21:03 AM PDT by Senator Goldwater
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To: Senator Goldwater

I think he does


4 posted on 08/28/2007 4:25:46 AM PDT by Kaslin (The Surge is working and the li(e)berals know it)
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To: Kaslin

"The Last of England" - Ford Madox Brown, 1855

5 posted on 08/28/2007 4:26:36 AM PDT by AnAmericanMother ((Ministrix of Ye Chase, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary (recess appointment)))
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To: Kaslin

“And the “leaders” of Britain and America refuse to stop it.”

And we voters and non-voters are allowing this to happen.


6 posted on 08/28/2007 4:27:34 AM PDT by caver (Yes, I did crawl out of a hole in the ground.)
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To: Kaslin
Between June 2005 and June 2006 nearly 200,000 British citizens chose to leave the country for a new life elsewhere.

Yo, Elizabeth, whadda think of that?

7 posted on 08/28/2007 4:30:58 AM PDT by mtbopfuyn (I think the border is kind of an artificial barrier - San Antonio councilwoman Patti Radle)
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To: UKrepublican

ping


8 posted on 08/28/2007 4:32:24 AM PDT by Eepsy (The object of opening the mind, as of opening the mouth, is to shut it again on something solid.)
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To: Kaslin

Yawn!

We keep getting this same story recycled over and over. Half the number quoted who are leaving are not British, they are foreign nationals who have lived in Britain for 3 years or more and are going home. Of the remainder who choose to move abroad, two thirds return within three years and the rest are largely retirees. . . . .

The UK is still 92.9% white anglo saxon celtic christian so compared to most countries we still have a long way to go before we disappear completely. ;-)


9 posted on 08/28/2007 4:32:37 AM PDT by britemp
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Comment #10 Removed by Moderator

To: britemp

bttt


11 posted on 08/28/2007 4:40:56 AM PDT by Guenevere (Duncan Hunter...President '08)
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To: Kaslin

Where’s that picture of Prince Charles in Muslim attire rubbing prayer beads?


12 posted on 08/28/2007 4:42:12 AM PDT by poobear (Pure democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what's for dinner. God save the Republic!)
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To: Kaslin

And the worst thing is the tea bags - the biggest threat to the Empire since Ghandi.


13 posted on 08/28/2007 4:44:27 AM PDT by Daveinyork
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To: britemp

It’s good to know. It seems like Freeper would be more suspicious of the MSM but like most people, jump on things that fit in their already formed beliefs.


14 posted on 08/28/2007 4:47:20 AM PDT by tiki
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To: britemp
Are you saying then, that you have no immigration problems in Britain? Are you saying that immigrants who are arriving are assimilating and becoming British? I will grant you that a majority of Brits are white, however, to call them Christian is a bit of a stretch, isn't it? I would be curious as to how many below the age of forty consider themselves practicing Christians.

Please don't think me smug, britemp, because I know that we have very similar problems here, and very few are willing to even acknowledge them, much less do anything to prevent our own suicide.

15 posted on 08/28/2007 4:52:17 AM PDT by Tully Pettigrew 1
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To: arbooz

Did I force you to read the editorial?


16 posted on 08/28/2007 5:03:17 AM PDT by Kaslin (The Surge is working and the li(e)berals know it)
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To: UKrepublican
Ping - call out the guard - lol!
17 posted on 08/28/2007 5:06:54 AM PDT by Caipirabob (Communists... Socialists... Democrats...Traitors... Who can tell the difference?)
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To: britemp
The UK is still 92.9% white anglo saxon celtic christian

And yet, if you believe the media and the alarmists, half the population are unwashed immigrants. Which is it?

18 posted on 08/28/2007 5:07:34 AM PDT by CholeraJoe ("Is the lion burning?")
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To: CholeraJoe

Depends where in Britain you live. There are large immigrant areas but there are also areas where you could go days without saying a black or Asian face.


19 posted on 08/28/2007 5:11:39 AM PDT by snugs ((An English Cheney Chick - Big Time))
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To: Kaslin

Scary, really scary. We’re next if we don’t stop illegals and the ever increasing legal immigration and asylum programs.


20 posted on 08/28/2007 5:14:58 AM PDT by W04Man (I'm Now With Fred http://Vets4Fred.net)
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To: britemp
The UK is still 92.9% white anglo saxon celtic christian

Only one in ten Britons actually attend church or worship services anymore.

Secularism is the "faith" of most of the UK, and of Europe.

The churches are deserted.

The mosques, on the other hand, are full.

21 posted on 08/28/2007 5:19:29 AM PDT by SkyPilot
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To: CholeraJoe

Read “Londonistan” by Melanie Phillips. Although Muslims are still a minority, the British govt and culture are caving in to the “demands” of multiculturalism and destroying British culture, which virtually no longer exists.


22 posted on 08/28/2007 5:22:05 AM PDT by Regina (regina)
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To: britemp; snugs
My ancestors came from all the countries on those British Isles. It frightens me that Britain is changing so much. I remember Enoch Powell’s admonitions forty years ago. Many considered him a racist, but he appears to have been right in his predictions.
23 posted on 08/28/2007 5:22:49 AM PDT by GeorgefromGeorgia
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To: Kaslin

http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/2342

See link for links in story

The Price of Immigration
From the desk of The Brussels Journal on Wed, 2007-08-22 16:33
A quote from The Daily Mail, 22 August 2007

Benefit claims by Eastern Europeans [in Britain] have almost trebled in the past year, official figures show. The cost of the payouts - to almost 112,000 migrants - is put at £125million a year. The Home Office figures mean that one in six of an estimated 683,000 Eastern European incomers is living off the state to some extent. A year ago, only 42,620 were claiming benefits. [...]

Once a migrant has been working here for 12 months, they are entitled to the same level of support as any British citizen. Many Poles are drawn by generous handouts for parents who, in some cases, can claim benefits for children who remain in their homeland.

A quote from The Daily Telegraph, 22 August 2007

In the second quarter of this year, the number of asylum applicants removed because they were not considered legitimate refugees declined by more than a third compared to the same period last year. There were 3,280 deported compared with 5,260 in the same period last year - and many of those went voluntarily with financial help.

It means that a ‘’priority’’ Government target to remove more failed asylum seekers than there are new applicants has been missed. The Home Office blamed the fall on the diversion of officials to the deportation of foreign criminals rather than would-be refugees.

However, recent figures showed that just one fifth of the 1,000 foreign national prisoners who were released without being considered for deportation have been thrown out of the country.

A quote from the leader of The Times, 22 August 2007

Only last month Gordon Brown insisted that all foreign criminals “will be deported”. Yet under EU law, the Government has known for three years that it has no such powers. [...] As the Home Office solicitor complained at the hearing, so long as the criminal has lived in this country for five years or more – whether or not at Her Majesty’s Pleasure – Britain “could never deport a lifer who had been released from prison and was an EU citizen”.


24 posted on 08/28/2007 5:28:58 AM PDT by pacelvi (In general, Democrats are the only real reason to vote for Republicans. - Thomas Sowell)
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To: Kaslin

http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/2269

Bye Bye Britain: The Natives Are Fleeing
From the desk of The Brussels Journal on Fri, 2007-07-27 16:44
A quote from Press Dispensary, 25 July 2007

Increasing numbers of people are taking the decision to move overseas as a result of the UK’s current immigration policy, according to www.globalvisas.com, a specialist immigration consultancy that provides immigration advice and visa services. As numbers of immigrants to the UK from the new European Union Accession states continue to grow, more and more people in the UK are choosing to take their experience and skills overseas.

Director Liam Clifford says: “Since January 2007, we have recorded an 80% rise in British nationals applying to move overseas. As this rise continues, so does the number of enquiries we receive from people asking for help in migrating to a new country. In recent months, we have received as many as 4,000 requests in a single week from people who have had enough of Britain and want to get out.” He adds: “Ironically, the main reason for these people leaving the UK is the over-stretching of services caused by inbound immigration to the UK. We are aware of the issue of so-called ‘white flight’ from certain inner city areas to the suburbs but now people are increasingly seeking a better standard of living offered by other countries.”

The consultancy caters for immigrants to the UK as well as British people who wish to emigrate to the USA, Australia, New Zealand, Canada or South Africa. After more than 12 years in its field, the company has recorded an increase in the number of non-EU and low skilled EU A8 citizens coming to the UK over recent years, and is now seeing a dramatic increase in British people applying to leave the UK.


25 posted on 08/28/2007 5:33:12 AM PDT by pacelvi (In general, Democrats are the only real reason to vote for Republicans. - Thomas Sowell)
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To: Kaslin

“Results, presented in a table that accompanies this report, suggests that the twenty six urban authority areas concerned, ranging in population from 100,000 to over 7 million, will all have minority native-British populations by 2036.”
http://www.bnp.org.uk/landandpeople/censusweek.htm


26 posted on 08/28/2007 5:33:42 AM PDT by anglian
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To: Kaslin

http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/1647

Bye Bye Britain
From the desk of The Brussels Journal on Mon, 2006-11-13 14:41

A quote from Roy Liddle in The Spectator, 11 November 2006

Apparently almost a million British citizens have left the country since 2000, to live somewhere else. Last year, according to the Office for National Statistics, 380,000 people left Britain, of whom about 200,000 were British citizens. At the same time, though, 565,000 immigrants arrived in Britain, the overwhelming majority from […] [Muslim] Pakistan and Bangladesh.

These facts were reported as if they were entirely unrelated. Nobody dared to venture that there was perhaps a very direct and causal relationship […] Even for our most free-thinking and dependable think-tank, Civitas, this was a bridge too far. Its spokesman, Robert Whelan, ventured that perhaps the parlous state of the [national] health service [NHS] was to blame for the exodus. You know, I suspect the majority of those who left had next to no contact with the NHS; they are, in the main, pre-middle-aged and healthy. No, it seems patently clear to me that an important reason […] that so many Brits are getting the hell out is that they think there are too many non-European foreigners here […]


27 posted on 08/28/2007 5:33:48 AM PDT by pacelvi (In general, Democrats are the only real reason to vote for Republicans. - Thomas Sowell)
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Racial segregation is woven into the fabric of British public services. Indeed, under the latest race relations legislation, all public authorities have a statutory duty to promote cultural diversity. So inner city local councils and hospitals in urban areas now print all their public documentation in ethnic minority languages, including Kosovan, Hindi, Greek, Swahili, and Turkish, while many provide extensive interpreting services. One doctor who works in east London told me of her outrage at being sent to take a course in Bengali so she could communicate more effectively with her patients.

Bilingualism is common in urban schools, given that almost 12 percent of children have a first language other than English. London is now the most linguistically diverse city in the world, with more than 300 languages spoken by pupils, ranging from Punjabi and Nigerian Yoruba to Polish and Tamil. In addition, the government now provides funds to Muslims to set up their own schools, in which there is a predominantly Islamic ethos, imams are involved in teaching, and Arabic is learned for the study of the Koran. At present there are just five such Muslim state schools, but the government has announced plans to take the number to 150, a move that smacks of appeasement towards Islamic separatism. The police have also been infected with this spirit. In recruitment in London, there is an open bias towards applicants who speak "a community language." And in the Midlands city of Nottingham, the July bombings prompted the chief constable to order his officers to wear green ribbons "to show their solidarity with the Muslim community."

The BBC, the main state broadcaster, has its own Asian network providing news and features inside the U.K. in Urdu, Bengali, Punjabi, and Gujarati. There are now more than 140 housing associations in England catering to ethnic minorities; one of them, the Aashyana in Bristol, provides special apartments for Muslims with the toilets facing away from Mecca. continued...

Dis-United Kingdom (Multiculturalism isn't working)

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1532936/posts

ALSO

UK: 'We have let in too many immigrants'

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1850455/posts

28 posted on 08/28/2007 5:37:22 AM PDT by anglian
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To: tiki

‘It seems like Freeper would be more suspicious of the MSM but like most people, jump on things that fit in their already formed beliefs.’

I learnt long ago not to form my opinions of America and her people from the media. Sadly there are many Freepers who are all too happy to believe the MSM about Britain if it fits their preconceptions.


29 posted on 08/28/2007 5:41:45 AM PDT by britemp
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To: SkyPilot
Secularism is the "faith" of most of the UK, and of Europe.

America is only 10 to 25 years behind Europe in this regard. Studies by George Barna and others indicate that the level of Christian belief among American teenagers and young adults, even those from evangelical backgrounds, is abysmally low. Unless there is a turnaround, in 30 years, the "big box" churches in the suburbs of Southern, Midwestern, and Western cities will be used by Hispanic congregations, if they are even kept in religious use. They are hardly the historical and architectural peers of the ancient churches and cathedrals of Europe, or even the 100-150 year old mainline churches in the old Great Lakes and East Coast cities, but the big boxes will be as empty as the older facilities are now. God help us.

30 posted on 08/28/2007 5:43:26 AM PDT by Wallace T.
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To: Wallace T.
pro-Caliphate demostration in the terrorist enclaves of Judea:



Free Version:

http://answering-islam.org/Authors/JR/Future/index.htm

Source

The Army Of Black Flags

The Mahdi’s ascendancy to power is said to be preceded by an army from the east who will be carrying black flags or banners of war.  Sheikh Kabbani states:

Hadith indicate that black flags coming from the area of Khorasan will signify the appearance of the Mahdi is nigh.  Khorasan is in todays Iran, and some scholars have said that this hadith means when the black flags appear from Central Asia, i.e. in the direction of Khorasan, then the appearance of the Mahdi is imminent. 17

Another tradition states that:

The Messenger of Allah said: The black banners will come from the East and their hearts will be as firm as iron.  Whoever hears of them should join them and give allegiance, even if it means crawling across snow. 18

In Islam there are two flags.  One is white and one is black.  Written across both flags in Arabic are the words, “There is no God but Allah and Muhammad is his Messenger”.  The white flag is called Al-Liwaa and serves as the sign for the leader of the Muslim army and is the flag of the Islamic State.  The black flag is called Ar-Raya and is used by the Muslim army. It is also called the flag of jihad, and is carried into battle.  One flag is governmental and the other is a military flag. 19 When Muhammad returned to his home city of Mecca after being exiled for eight years, he returned as a conqueror.  With him were ten thousand Muslim soldiers.  They carried with them black flags.  On the flags was one word written in Arabic: punishment. 20 

I was once talking to a group of young Muslim men and asking them some questions.  I asked them if the obvious superior militaries of America and Israel compared to the militaries of any Islamic nations were a source of difficulty for many Muslims.  One of these men then became very angry at my question and snapped out, “You Americans and Zionists better get ready, because the black flags are coming!”  At the time, I had no idea what he was talking about.  Later I learned the meaning. 



31 posted on 08/28/2007 5:49:09 AM PDT by pacelvi (In general, Democrats are the only real reason to vote for Republicans. - Thomas Sowell)
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To: SkyPilot
The majority of Britons who do attend Church are woman, and even then only 3% go to church regularly.

surprisingly the influx of Polish immigrants (I’ve read polish plumber jokes all over the net) that influx has pushed Roman Catholicism to the #2 largest congregation in the UK.

IMO, the trouble in the UK is a combination of little good job prospects for “Jon Average” coupled with influxes that will take even the low paying jobs, along with the general hopelessness that Socialism brings, as well as a decline in educational Nationalism.

When I say nationalism, that is to say “Historically Accurate and Positive Views of country X in history being taught to the youths”

That and to be honest about it, Euros are generally much more cynical then Americans, the UK is no exception. For the new arrivals though, the UK seems like paradise comparatively speaking, economic opportunities, free public schools, straight forward business practices (your uncle doesn’t have to be on the city council for business permit to be issued). As well as extensive welfare coverage being provided, Health care, housing, a check a month, compared to say Pakistan, well there is no comparison.

32 posted on 08/28/2007 5:54:36 AM PDT by padre35 (Conservative in Exile.)
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To: Tully Pettigrew 1

‘Are you saying then, that you have no immigration problems in Britain?’

No. We have reducing levels of muslim immigration and a huge increase in Polish immigration - the opposite of US immigration.

‘I will grant you that a majority of Brits are white, however, to call them Christian is a bit of a stretch, isn’t it? I would be curious as to how many below the age of forty consider themselves practicing Christians.’

According to a recent BBC News 24 poll 67% consider themselves to be Christians though only 17% regularly attend church. 85% said Britain must continue to be a Christian society. Nearly half of those who said they were atheists still wanted Britain to remain a christian society. It is foolish to confuse church attendance with faith.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/4434096.stm

America is a secular country, Britain is a Christian country. America has separated church and state, Britain has not. Our head of state is also the head of our official church. Your President is secular. We have ‘Lords Spiritual’ who sit in government and vote on legislation from the church’s point of view. Two thirds of British schools are state-funded christian faith schools. Americans may go to church more, but that doesn’t make you a more Christian country.

‘Please don’t think me smug, britemp, because I know that we have very similar problems here, and very few are willing to even acknowledge them, much less do anything to prevent our own suicide.’

I don’t - I appreciate your perspective, but the views of Britain given abroad by the MSM are highly misleading. For example, having read the media would most Americans believe that Britain has fewer total muslims than America has african-american converts to islam or that Britain has admitted fewer muslim immigrants since 1950 than the US has since 1995?

Reports of the death of Britain are somewht premature and invariably politically motivated by the same type of people who cannot wait to see the end of America too.


33 posted on 08/28/2007 6:00:28 AM PDT by britemp
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To: Wallace T.

‘America is only 10 to 25 years behind Europe in this regard.’

Really? I can see five European countries who attend church more than America?

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/rel_chu_att-religion-church-attendance


34 posted on 08/28/2007 6:04:29 AM PDT by britemp
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To: britemp
"opinion"

After visiting Britain last year for three weeks with my English born and raised wife, my opinion would be that it has hardly turned into Hyderabad or Nairobi. But I did notice that many of the restaurants in London we ate at were run by east Europeans. And we noticed that many of the people behind the counters in convenience stores were from Asia. But we didn't see crowds of Koran-waving fanatics with blood-dripping scimitars.

One brother-in-law also pointed out on a long trip from Norwich to Aberdeen that a group of workers picking veggies in a field were most likely all from eastern Europe. But overall, after visiting England and Scotland, it didn't look to me that Britain was in near danger of becoming another Pakistan or some other mideast country. Even in London most of the people we saw in four days appeared to be, like my in-laws, average white Brits.

35 posted on 08/28/2007 6:05:02 AM PDT by driftless2
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To: padre35

‘The majority of Britons who do attend Church are woman, and even then only 3% go to church regularly.’

Do you have any facts to back up that absurd claim? According to the World Values Survey shown on the well-respected Nationmaster.com, 27% of Britons attend church at least once a week.

http://www.nationmaster.com/graph/rel_chu_att-religion-church-attendance

‘That and to be honest about it, Euros are generally much more cynical then Americans, the UK is no exception.’

One mans cynicism is another man realism! :-)


36 posted on 08/28/2007 6:11:25 AM PDT by britemp
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To: driftless2

I think your observations are farily accurate - of every 100 people you encountered 93 of them would be white anglo-saxon celtic Brits and less then three muslims.

Of course there are pockets of racial density, just like when I lived in America and visited New Orleans for the first time, I was amazed that nearly everyone in the whole city seemed to be black!

Your post post neatly exemplifies the difference between actual experience and MSM spin. Hope you enjoyed your trip! :)


37 posted on 08/28/2007 6:17:37 AM PDT by britemp
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To: Kaslin
Britons Quit Country In Record Numbers
38 posted on 08/28/2007 6:24:11 AM PDT by blam (Secure the border and enforce the law)
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To: Kaslin

the high birth rates of immigrants (15 times those of white Britons)

___________

What is the correct number here? Because this isn’t.

Mrs VS


39 posted on 08/28/2007 6:25:02 AM PDT by VeritatisSplendor
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To: britemp
"The UK is still 92.9% white anglo saxon celtic christian so compared to most countries we still have a long way to go before we disappear completely. ;-)"

Sorry, britemp, but, as much as I'd like your statement above to be true, I find it very difficult to believe. I lived in Britain back in the 80s up to the mid-90s and, even then, it seemed like white Anglo-Saxon/Celts were a minority. Though I don't believe that white Anglo-Saxon/Celts actually are a minority yet, a 92% majority seems like a grossly inaccurate statistic.

Of course, I realize that London (where I lived mostly) is not representative of Britain as a whole, but I have friends and relatives in other parts of Britain, and I have been to, and am familiar with, most other areas of Britain, as well.

Just out of curiosity...Where do you live? And would you mind posting where the statistics came from, as well?

Thanks.

P.S. Please have a PG Tip for me ;-)

40 posted on 08/28/2007 6:26:44 AM PDT by NH Liberty ("For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus..." [1 Timothy 2:5])
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To: britemp
"the trip"

loved the trip. The only bad thing that happened was losing my glasses at Stonehenge. You might be interested to know that in the States a number of people have taken it upon themselves to duplicate Stonehenge in some fashion. In western Nebraska near Scottsbluff my wife and I visited Carhenge where the creator piled a bunch of wrecked autos on top of each other in the exact same dimensions as Stonehenge. There are other re-creations throughout the U.S., but the English original is still the best.

41 posted on 08/28/2007 6:31:40 AM PDT by driftless2
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To: britemp

Well...if things don’t work out and you’d care for a warmer climate, you’re welcome here in the Missouri Ozarks. Taxes and cost of living are low, fish and game are plentiful and we speak nearly the same language.


42 posted on 08/28/2007 6:32:32 AM PDT by Eric in the Ozarks (Go Hawks !)
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To: britemp

The UK seems to be awashin Knights...Jedi Knights that is:

“About sixteen per cent of the UK population stated that they had no religion. This category included agnostics, atheists, heathens and those who wrote Jedi Knight.”3 “At the time the Census was carried out, there was an internet campaign that encouraged people to answer the religion question “Jedi Knight”. The number of people who stated Jedi was 390,000 (0.7 per cent of the population).”4 An urban myth developed and some people believed that this many votes would make Jedi an official religion, however this is not true.

“Just over 390,000 of the 52,000,000 people in England and Wales wrote in ‘Jedi’ on their census form. The ‘Jedi’ response was most popular in Brighton and Hove, with 2.6 per cent of Census respondents quoting it, followed by Oxford (2.0 per cent), Wandsworth (1.9), Cambridge (1.9), Southampton (1.8) and Lambeth (1.8).

So it would seem that “confirmation” has been traded for “padwan” in the UK......

Church attendance:

National Attendance
1979 12% [17] -0.20/year
1989 10% [17] -0.28/year
1998 07.5% [13, 14] -0.17/year
2005 06.3% [13]

http://www.vexen.co.uk/UK/religion.html

Now before the idea that low church attendance is the be all and end all of societal problems be advanced, it should be noted that Socialization of the UK, along with a “Top down” sort of outlook are just as important factors IMO.

For me, there is not much difference in welfare and everyman for themselves in the course of a nation’s decline socially if not economically, a country can be prosperous but souless easily. And that loss of “centre” is what leads to the idea that the UK is drowning in immigrants.

And one man’s cynicism is another man’s realism is a great example of cynicism, with no dominant view point, that is very true, when “Work hard and follow the rules and you and your family will do fine” starts to not work, then cynicism will follow.

The UK remains very prosperous on paper, why isn’t it felt throughout the region? Spoiled citizens or actual lack of a chance to “make it” even if they aren’t a PhD?


43 posted on 08/28/2007 6:32:44 AM PDT by padre35 (Conservative in Exile.)
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To: pacelvi

Chesterton, “The Flag of the World;”

http://www.leaderu.com/cyber/books/orthodoxy/ch5.html


44 posted on 08/28/2007 6:32:45 AM PDT by Greg F (Duncan Hunter is a good man.)
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To: Kaslin

bump


45 posted on 08/28/2007 6:33:49 AM PDT by VOA
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To: Daveinyork
And the worst thing is the tea bags - the biggest threat to the Empire since Ghandi.

Oh fiddle-faddle! If Britain had been an empire in fact as well as in name, then Ghandi would never have been a threat in either. Ah,well, I suspect that's the price you pay for being known as a good loser.

46 posted on 08/28/2007 6:34:52 AM PDT by yankeedame ("Oh, I can take it but I'd much rather dish it out.")
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To: Kaslin
Abraham Lincoln said no nation can exist half slave and half free.

So he set the slaves free in the Southern half and left the others to rot in the North half.

47 posted on 08/28/2007 6:35:20 AM PDT by sam_paine (X .................................)
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To: Kaslin
There will be a point when the Brits return to sanity. These things are cyclical and generational. The generation that comes of age has questions about who it is and what its national heritage is. The British have a rich history and have contributed more than any other nation to civilization and the world’s growth and prosperity. The spectre of “colonialism” or “post-colonialism” won’t blight the British conscience for much longer.
48 posted on 08/28/2007 6:48:31 AM PDT by GBA ( God Bless America!)
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To: britemp
I must question some of the numbers in this chart. First off, Nigeria is 50% Muslim, making a church attendance figure of 89% rather unrealistic, unless mosque attendance is counted. Ireland's numbers look excessively high as well. While high church attendance numbers may have been characteristic of traditionally Catholic Ireland until about 40 years ago, the effects of secularism, liberal theology in the Catholic Church, and recent immigration from other countries (presently one out of ten residents of Ireland is of foreign origin) make the claim of 84% church attendance very suspect, certainly on a weekly basis. OTOH, the statistic for 2% church attendance in Russia seems low. This number may be based on a citation from the Russian Interior Ministry, which I found in Wikipedia, that said weekly church attendance is less than 2%. Even if his number on weekly attendance is accurate, the other statistics, including the one for the United States, may be based on monthly attendance.

Within the United States, there are wide variances in church attendance, with the figures in the Pacific Northwest and the northern Rocky Mountain states (excluding Utah) and the New England states being quite low, vs. much higher figures in the South and the Plains states. Dallas and Nashville are far different than Seattle or Boston, as Poland and rural Ireland are from Moscow, Berlin, or London. Furthermore, of the largest Western European nations listed (Germany is oddly absent from the list) in the EU, only Italy has a church attendance rate (45%) comparable to that of the United States. Look at France (21%), Britain (27%), and Spain (25%), and you can determine that the EU average is considerably below that of the US.

49 posted on 08/28/2007 7:13:38 AM PDT by Wallace T.
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To: Tribune7; SoCalPol; Lil'freeper; mrsmel; wideawake; chasio649; expatpat; HanneyBean; goose; ...

Ping


50 posted on 08/28/2007 7:22:35 AM PDT by UKrepublican
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