Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Patients suing province over wait times (Canadians flee to US for care)
Toronto Star ^ | Sep 06, 2007 | Tanya Talaga

Posted on 09/06/2007 4:22:29 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember

Two Ontario patients who had brain tumours removed in the United States because they say they couldn't get quick treatment here are suing the provincial government over what they claim are unjustly long wait times for medical care.

Lindsay McCreith, 66, of Newmarket and Shona Holmes, 43, of Waterdown filed a joint statement of claim yesterday against the province of Ontario. Both say their health suffered because they are denied the right to access care outside of Ontario's "government-run monopolistic" health-care system. They want to be able to buy private health insurance.

Ontario's "monopoly" over essential health services and its delay in providing the services have left both patients to "endure significant financial, emotional and physical hardship to access such services in the United States," states the claim .

The accusations made in the statement of claim have not been proven in court.

Holmes began losing her vision in March 2005, she told a press conference at Queen's Park yesterday. An MRI in May 2005 revealed a tumour in her brain. Her family doctor couldn't expedite appointments booked with specialists for July 19 and Sept. 19, 2005. As the tumour pressed on her optic nerves, her vision deteriorated. Afraid to wait any longer, she went to the Mayo Clinic in Scottsdale, Ariz.

Within a week she met three specialists and was told she had a fluid-filled sac growing near her pituitary gland at the base of her brain. They urged her to have it taken out immediately. She went home with the hopes of quickly removing what is known as a Rathke's cleft cyst.

Unable to get surgery fast, she returned to Arizona and had the mass removed on Aug. 1, 2005. Her vision was restored in 10 days. The Holmes family is now in debt $95,000 because of medical costs.

"My husband has taken a second full-time job. We've re-mortgaged our home. It has to be known. People can't go through this," said Holmes, a family mediator. "I was very fortunate to save my eyesight but the cost and the battle has been devastating."

David Spencer, a spokesperson for Health Minister George Smitherman, said the minister can say little as this matter is before the courts.

"We understand there is a statement of claim being put forward. It's our intention to be there to vigorously defend the public health system."

The Canadian Constitution Foundation, a non-profit group, is backing the legal action by McCreith and Holmes.

The CCF has dubbed the lawsuit the "Ontario Chaoulli." Dr. Jacques Chaoulli went to court in Quebec on behalf of his patient George Zeliotis, who suffered acute pain while waiting for a hip replacement. In June 2005, the Supreme Court of Canada handed down a decision in favour of Chaoulli by striking down Quebec's ban on private health insurance.

Many felt the decision would open the door to increased access to private health-care in Quebec, but that has yet to happen.

Holmes' experience was similar to that of Lindsay McCreith, a retired auto collision repair shop owner. According to the statement of claim, McCreith suddenly experienced seizures on Jan. 2, 2006. After waiting seven hours in a Newmarket emergency ward, he was examined by an internist. A computed tomography or CT scan showed a large wedge-shaped brain tumour. He was discharged from hospital four days later with a diagnosis of stroke and a prescription for anti-seizure medication.

Worried the tumour might be cancerous, McCreith and his family wanted an MRI. He was given an appointment date four months later. McCreith went to the U.S. and paid $494.67 (U.S.) for an MRI. Armed with the scan, he saw his Ontario family doctor, who referred McCreith to a neurologist. He was examined on Feb. 8, 2006. He was referred to a neurosurgeon but would have to wait three months.

Unhappy with this, he returned to Buffalo. In early March, during a biopsy, the tumour was found to be malignant and surgically removed. He paid $27,650 for his consultation, biopsy and surgery in Buffalo and OHIP has refused to reimburse him because he failed to seek pre-approval for the expense, the claim notes.


TOPICS: Canada; Extended News; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: canada; healthcare; socializedmedicine
I have no doubt that the Ontario system would have murdered these two patients by neglect and queue (outrageous waiting lists).

Where will these poor Canadians go if Hillary and the democrats carry out their carefully crafted plans to seize and destroy the US health delivery system? H*ll, where will WE go?

1 posted on 09/06/2007 4:22:32 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember

but.... ours is so bad! M. Moore Said so! < / SARC


2 posted on 09/06/2007 4:26:03 PM PDT by SandRat (Duty, Honor, Country. What else needs to be said?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember
Apparently Jeanne Sather hasn't heard about this sort of thing.
3 posted on 09/06/2007 4:27:56 PM PDT by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember

I smell an opportunity for me to open a hospital in a nice Caribbean location...or perhaps in the Bahamas...it’s only 46 miles from la Florida at its closest...


4 posted on 09/06/2007 4:30:17 PM PDT by stefanbatory
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: SandRat

Canadian quadruplets were born recently in tiny Great Falls, Montana, hundreds of miles from their home... because there is no adequate fully functioning premature baby care, even in a wealthy province like Alberta. Four babies at once was far more than Canada could cope with.


5 posted on 09/06/2007 4:30:50 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember (The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember

Best example of Hillarycare I can think of


6 posted on 09/06/2007 4:31:53 PM PDT by Leatherneck_MT (A nation of sheep will beget a government of wolves.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: DuncanWaring

Sather is an agenda driven drama queen. I hope she gets exactly what she is asking for.


7 posted on 09/06/2007 4:32:36 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember (The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Leatherneck_MT

Socialism...The low road to communism...


8 posted on 09/06/2007 4:33:22 PM PDT by Issaquahking (Duncan Hunter for President!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember
The hallmark of socialized medicine is rationing.

The extremely ill are supposed to die to save money.

9 posted on 09/06/2007 4:33:34 PM PDT by TASMANIANRED (Taz Struck By Lightning Faces Battery Charge)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: stefanbatory

You might do well!


10 posted on 09/06/2007 4:33:44 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember (The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember

......He paid $27,650 for his consultation, biopsy and surgery.....

Silly man. He could have entered illegally and got it done for free.


11 posted on 09/06/2007 4:34:14 PM PDT by bert (K.E. N.P. +12 . Hillary's color is yellow.....how appropriate)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Leatherneck_MT

The hypocrisy of Hillary is that she would never for one microsecond subject herself or Chelsea personally to what she has planned for you and your loved ones.


12 posted on 09/06/2007 4:35:39 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember (The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: TASMANIANRED
You are 100% correct.

They even have a name for it in Canada and the UK: "Euthanasia by queue"

Coming soon to a neighborhood near you!

13 posted on 09/06/2007 4:39:46 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember (The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember

Hillary is truly evil.


14 posted on 09/06/2007 4:41:26 PM PDT by darkangel82 (Socialism is NOT an American value.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: bert
Silly man. He could have entered illegally and got it done for free.

Maybe not. EMTALA requires ERs to stabilize only (for free).

15 posted on 09/06/2007 4:41:29 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember (The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember

Hillary will take care of this as soon as he’s elected.


16 posted on 09/06/2007 4:42:56 PM PDT by Drango (A liberal's compassion is limited only by the size of someone else's wallet.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: darkangel82

Hillary is a power-mad, massive bribe-taking totalitarian who beieves that she can ride health care into office.


17 posted on 09/06/2007 4:43:18 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember (The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: Drango

The Clinton Library has (illegally) sealed all records of Hillary’s 1993 Health Care Task Force.


18 posted on 09/06/2007 4:44:48 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember (The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember
This may be a naive question, but why can’t the market solve this problem? What prevents Canadians from traveling from Quebec to the U.S. and buying insurance there, insurance that they could then use if and when they have a illness that their public health system can’t treat?
19 posted on 09/06/2007 4:47:14 PM PDT by xenophiles
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember

Would be ironic, wouldn’t it?


20 posted on 09/06/2007 4:47:36 PM PDT by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: AdmSmith; Berosus; Convert from ECUSA; dervish; Ernest_at_the_Beach; Fred Nerks; KlueLass; ...
Ping!
21 posted on 09/06/2007 4:48:31 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (Profile updated Wednesday, August 29, 2007. https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember

We will go to India. It has state of the art facilities, western-trained doctors, and very low costs.


22 posted on 09/06/2007 4:55:19 PM PDT by p. henry
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: xenophiles

The Quebec native SHOULD buy US insurance!


23 posted on 09/06/2007 5:01:59 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember (The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember

And this is the crap hillary and her fiends are trying to shuv down our throats! If she’s such an advocate go to Canada the system is already set up. But my guess is they want this because all the other money pits like social security and medicare are about all dried up thnaks to these crooks and they need a new money pit to suck from! dispicable humans!


24 posted on 09/06/2007 5:53:20 PM PDT by ronnie raygun (I'd rather be hunting with dick than driving with ted)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember

When it costs nothing it is often worth exactly that.


25 posted on 09/06/2007 5:56:56 PM PDT by jimfree (Freep and ye shall find.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: ronnie raygun

I had to go to the Social Security office today to get my pay records corrected. Utter incompetence and teh waiting room was filled with youthful parasistes and recent “immigrants”, for their bogus disabilities, seeking a free ride for the rest of their blood-sucking lives.

All democrats 100%.


26 posted on 09/06/2007 6:27:59 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember (The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: jimfree

‘If you think healthcare is expensive now, wait until it is free.”

PJ O’Rourke


27 posted on 09/06/2007 6:29:00 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember (The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember

That is a disgrace.


28 posted on 09/06/2007 6:29:30 PM PDT by darkangel82 (Socialism is NOT an American value.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: darkangel82

And I gave up due to the endless wait. I had to get back to work.

A taste of health care waits under democrat party plans.


29 posted on 09/06/2007 6:33:14 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember (The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember

Your tagline applies 100% here.


30 posted on 09/06/2007 6:34:46 PM PDT by darkangel82 (Socialism is NOT an American value.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember

Thank you for posting this!!


31 posted on 09/06/2007 6:43:27 PM PDT by syriacus (If the US troops had remained in S. Korea in 1949, there would have been no Korean War (1950-53))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: TASMANIANRED
The hallmark of socialized medicine is rationing.

And when you wait in line for bread, and toilet paper becomes a luxury, you have achieved communism!

32 posted on 09/06/2007 6:47:31 PM PDT by Grizzled Bear ("Does not play well with others.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: Grizzled Bear

I believe that is correct..

However you must save your spuds to make vodka in the bath tub.


33 posted on 09/06/2007 6:50:11 PM PDT by TASMANIANRED (Taz Struck By Lightning Faces Battery Charge)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 32 | View Replies]

To: p. henry
We will go to India. It has state of the art facilities, western-trained doctors, and very low costs.

Was the Airline that sacrificed a goat to the god of the air based in India?

Just asking.

34 posted on 09/06/2007 6:51:15 PM PDT by Grizzled Bear ("Does not play well with others.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember

there’s a mistaken belief among some individuals that a government-controlled health care system will

provide to individuals all of their wants.

and it’s not true.

what happens is that some government bureaucrat is forced to parcel out services

to save money the government cannot afford.


35 posted on 09/06/2007 6:53:15 PM PDT by ken21
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: ken21
there’s a mistaken belief among some individuals that a government-controlled health care system will provide to individuals all of their wants. and it’s not true. what happens is that some government bureaucrat is forced to parcel out services to save money the government cannot afford.

Bingo! What the sheeple don't realized is that outrageous waiting lists, euthanasia, and neglect ARE the very basis of socialized medicine, Nothing could be more anti-consumer or anti-human.

36 posted on 09/06/2007 6:57:50 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember (The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: Grizzled Bear
Was the Airline that sacrificed a goat to the god of the air based in India?

Nope. That was in Nepal!

37 posted on 09/06/2007 8:35:24 PM PDT by Tamar1973 (Riding the Korean Wave, one BYJ movie at a time! (http://www.byj.co.kr))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember

bookmark


38 posted on 09/06/2007 8:39:39 PM PDT by traviskicks (http://www.neoperspectives.com/Ron_Paul_2008.htm)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember

I was attracted to this article because yesterday the physician’s assistant at the village clinic here diagnosed a sore on my face which hasn’t healed for two months as possible skin cancer. I got into the clinic the same day that I called. The visit was quick and professional. The physician’s assistant told me I needed to get to a dermatologist for a biopsy. Yes, I had to deal with the arcane rules of my insurance company, but the personnel there were polite and helpful. Within 25 minutes I had completed my work with the insurance company and set up an appointment for the biopsy within the next three weeks.

I’m sure if my concern was life-threatening I could have gotten in much sooner. However, it’s just a little zit-sized sore that doesn’t heal. Even though the dermatologist is in one of most remote places in North America, apparently he has on site the most up-to-date equipment to deal with my problem.

As I was working through this little problem I wondered what would have happened in a government-run system. I don’t think it would have been as pleasant and quick. I’m sure that there are other people out there with negative experiences - as my father used to say, sh** happens. This time, things went smooth as silk. The difference here is that I was in control of my health care. I don’t like the idea of being a pawn in a bureaucratic system (and as a teacher, let me tell you those systems don’t accomplish much well).


39 posted on 09/06/2007 9:18:12 PM PDT by redpoll (redpoll)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember
"have no doubt that the Ontario system would have murdered these two patients by neglect and queue (outrageous waiting lists)."

It happens right across Canada every day. People even die from an infected tooth in Canada because dental care is not covered at all by Canada's so called "free" health care system. Nor are drugs, medical devices such as oxygen concentrators, prosthetics's, wheelchairs.

Where will Canadians go if Clinto-care becomes the USA standard? Where some go already, Israel, Paki-stan, Japan, and places in Europe where money talks.

40 posted on 09/06/2007 10:30:56 PM PDT by Nathan Zachary
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember
Any Canadian working person with a half decent job bringing in the average $60k salary would rather pay for private insurance. It's cheaper by far than Canada's "free" system, which doesn't even provide all the services one might need.

Making that average salary, it costs over $20k per year, taken off your salary in taxes.
In the USA, half that will buy you a top rate plan, plus you'll have 10k to drop into a 401k for your future needs, which once built up, can serve as your own insurance plan by the time you reach retirement age.

If only American's calling for such a disastrous thing called universdal health care, would stop and think.

Sure, there are many things wrong with our system. But they can be fixed, it can be made much cheaper while maintaining top level service. The will to do that is not there however, because too many politicians, Democrats included and probably more so, are bought by those who don't want it fixed.

41 posted on 09/06/2007 10:42:27 PM PDT by Nathan Zachary
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: redpoll

I can tell you what would happen if you case was in Canada.

First, you’d make an appointment with your family doctor (if you had one) and wait about a month or so for that.
Then he’d send you to a specialist (dermatologist) which could take up to a year, who would then schedule you to have a biopsy, another 3-6 month wait, which because it’s on your face would be done by a cosmetic surgeon.

Sometimes if you have a good doc, he’ll skip the dermatologist and just send you to the cosmetic surgeon to have it removed regardless, just to be on the safe side.

You can’t in most cases simply walk into a specialists office such as a dermatologist without first seeing the family physician, usually a GP. They are the front line docs who send you to the specialist you need and the situation calls for.


42 posted on 09/06/2007 11:00:18 PM PDT by Nathan Zachary
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 39 | View Replies]

To: Nathan Zachary

Post 41: Outstanding analysis!


43 posted on 09/07/2007 12:14:54 AM PDT by FormerACLUmember (The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: FormerACLUmember

bttt


44 posted on 09/07/2007 6:02:44 AM PDT by FormerACLUmember (The ideal tyranny is that which is ignorantly self-administered by its victims.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 43 | View Replies]

To: Nathan Zachary

>>I can tell you what would happen if you case was in Canada.<<

Thanks for giving me the run-down here about the Canadian system. I figured it would be long waits and official rules, but I didn’t think it would be that onerous. Wow.

Interestingly, or maybe, predictably, the dermatologists that I’m going to see in Anchorage are all Canadians. At least, I presume they are, since they are all certified by the both the American and Canadian medical organizations for dermatologists... and they all have names like “Jayne” and “Thompson.” I’m sure that physicians flee the Canadian system in the same manner as the patients.

Thanks again.


45 posted on 09/07/2007 9:04:22 AM PDT by redpoll (redpoll)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: Nathan Zachary

I was in Quebec last weekend. Most people I talked to were extremely snide about the health care system there. Then, I ran into the anomaly. I was talking to an 18 year old who was recently diagnosed with a rare syndrome. She was glowing about the system there. How did that happen? Just curious and I will fight not to have Hillary care!


46 posted on 09/07/2007 4:29:00 PM PDT by abner (I have no tagline, therefore no identity.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson