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Dramatic 911 call from right before shooting released (Audio at link)
KTRK ^
| 11/15/07
| KTRK
Posted on 11/16/2007 12:03:36 AM PST by tlb
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To: chuckles
but this could be bad because it was daylight and the cop told him not to go outside911 operators are not police.
21
posted on
11/16/2007 3:31:16 AM PST
by
from occupied ga
(Your most dangerous enemy is your own government, Benito Guilinni a short man in search of a balcony)
To: Thumper1960
Any burglar whod be brazen enough to act in his criminal manner in broad daylight More burgularies occur during the day than at night. (people away at work/school/etc.)
22
posted on
11/16/2007 3:34:25 AM PST
by
from occupied ga
(Your most dangerous enemy is your own government, Benito Guilinni a short man in search of a balcony)
To: austrian
I am happy when my neighbors watch out for my property, and I do the same for them. All the fault is on the burglars, they got what they asked for.
23
posted on
11/16/2007 3:38:14 AM PST
by
SWAMPSNIPER
(THE SECOND AMENDMENT, A MATTER OF FACT, NOT A MATTER OF OPINION)
To: FreedomCalls
I wish we could import that bit of law to NJ.
Garde la Foi, mes amis! Nous nous sommes les sauveurs de la République! Maintenant et Toujours!
(Keep the Faith, my friends! We are the saviors of the Republic! Now and Forever!)
LonePalm, le Républicain du verre cassé (The Broken Glass Republican)
24
posted on
11/16/2007 4:01:03 AM PST
by
LonePalm
(Commander and Chef)
To: FreedomCalls
I think you’re incorrect about being legally able to use deadly force to protect another’s property. The law you quoted requires that 9.41 be satisfied first, and 9.41 specifically states that you must either be in lawful possession of the property or you’ve just been unlawfully dispossessed of it. Either way, the biggest legal problem is going to be the fact that you’re only justified in using necessary force, and he’s on tape saying he’s going to go shoot first and ask questions later, and the guys were unarmed.
To: tlb
“It will be interesting to see how this plays out.”
I think you can safely assume that its not going to turn out well for Mr, Horn.
He did NOT have the rights of a homeowner in this case — it wasn’t his home.
You can argue that he DOES have the right to make a citizen’s arrest, based on general common law principles, but he has to stay carefully within the authority that the police have, otherwise he would be liable for false imprisonment and, here, for much worse.
26
posted on
11/16/2007 5:46:27 AM PST
by
WL-law
To: WL-law
Ah! This happened in Texas — I saw Pasadena and assumed California. Well, Horn’s chances just improved dramatically!!
27
posted on
11/16/2007 5:48:29 AM PST
by
WL-law
To: WL-law
I would LOVE to have this guy as a neighbor.
I’d buy him a CASE of double-ought buckshot, too!
Mebbie two cases.
To: from occupied ga
....."911 operators are not police.".....
They wear the uniform in many Texas cities. I don't personally know about Pasadena. I worked on the 911 equipment (Mars)for the phone company in many small towns in East Texas before I retired.
29
posted on
11/16/2007 6:10:47 AM PST
by
chuckles
To: tlb
Looks to me like he was desperately trying to get the cops to come out, at least to prevent him from shooting the guys, otherwise he'd have called them after the fact.
It's kinda like the story of the guy that calls the cops to report someone is burglarizing his workshop, and 15 minutes later (cops still not there) call and tells them "nevermind, just come pick up the bodies." They are there within a minute after that.
30
posted on
11/16/2007 6:33:26 AM PST
by
P8riot
(I carry a gun because I can't carry a cop.)
To: chuckles
They wear the uniform in many Texas citiesThat may be true in Texas. Not true here. Don't go to the police academy, aren't sworn etc.
31
posted on
11/16/2007 6:38:12 AM PST
by
from occupied ga
(Your most dangerous enemy is your own government, Benito Guilinni a short man in search of a balcony)
To: WL-law
He did NOT have the rights of a homeowner in this casedid you read post #6?
32
posted on
11/16/2007 6:40:11 AM PST
by
from occupied ga
(Your most dangerous enemy is your own government, Benito Guilinni a short man in search of a balcony)
To: Thumper1960
Any burglar whod be brazen enough to act in his criminal manner in broad daylight is one who hasnt any fear of repercussions.
Actually a lot of theft/burglary is committed in the daytime when people aren't home. A lot of burglars do not like breaking in to homes at night, for fear of confrontation, unless they are 100% absolutely sure that the homeowners are not there (as in they have knowledge that they've left on vacation or something).
There was an interesting study done on burglars a while back, and the reason why many chose burglary over other forms of theft such as holding up people or stores is that they wanted to avoid confrontation.
To: from occupied ga
This line of the law doesnt say it must be after dark -
(3) he reasonably believes that:
(A) the land or property cannot be protected or recovered by any other means; or
To: tlb
Police have not found the families of the dead men, who both are in their 30s. One had identification indicating he was from Puerto Rico, the other had documentation indicating he may have been from Puerto Rico, Colombia or the Dominican Republic, Capt. Corbett said.
Documented illegals?
35
posted on
11/16/2007 8:56:39 AM PST
by
SwinneySwitch
(US Constitution Article 4 Section 4..shall protect each of them against Invasion...domestic Violence)
To: beaversmom
Mr. Horn mentions that they were doing this in the broad daylight. Do you know how this affects it? The statute says "theft in the night" and lets "burglary" stand without qualifying it as being required to be at night. So perhaps, and IANAL, use of deadly force against burglary in the day could be defended under the statute.
36
posted on
11/16/2007 10:48:19 AM PST
by
FreedomCalls
(Texas: "We close at five.")
To: Syllojism
I think youre incorrect about being legally able to use deadly force to protect anothers property. The law you quoted requires that 9.41 be satisfied first, and 9.41 specifically states that you must either be in lawful possession of the property or youve just been unlawfully dispossessed of it. You don't think the neighbor was in lawful possession of the property in his house?
Either way, the biggest legal problem is going to be the fact that youre only justified in using necessary force, and hes on tape saying hes going to go shoot first and ask questions later, and the guys were unarmed.
The statute allows deadly force "to prevent the other who is fleeing immediately after committing burglary, robbery, aggravated robbery, or theft during the nighttime from escaping with the property."
37
posted on
11/16/2007 10:53:04 AM PST
by
FreedomCalls
(Texas: "We close at five.")
To: DaveLoneRanger
38
posted on
11/16/2007 2:59:37 PM PST
by
SwinneySwitch
(US Constitution Article 4 Section 4..shall protect each of them against Invasion...domestic Violence)
To: from occupied ga
From the looks of some of the 300 pounders, I don’t think they went to the academy either.
39
posted on
11/16/2007 4:38:28 PM PST
by
chuckles
To: SwinneySwitch
Documented illegals?
You are aware that Puerto Rico is a part of the USA, right? I'm not sure where you went to school and would not want to judge you, but trust me, Puerto Rico is a territory of the United States of America.
Now if you are implying that their documents were forged, then that's another story and I see what you are saying.
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