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Michigan House Passes Ban On Smoking In Bars, Restaurants
ClickonDetroit ^ | December 6, 2007 | AP

Posted on 12/06/2007 5:29:42 AM PST by ShadowDancer

Michigan House Passes Ban On Smoking In Bars, Restaurants

POSTED: 7:47 am EST December 6, 2007
UPDATED: 8:10 am EST December 6, 2007

Smoking in Michigan workplaces, including bars and restaurants, would be banned under legislation passed by the Democratic-led state House.

The vote is a victory for supporters, who have been pushing the measure for a decade.

But it may not get very far in the Senate because majority Republicans oppose it.

Backers say a majority of state residents want a broad workplace smoking ban, and point to the harmful effects of secondhand smoke on employees and patrons.

Opponents say smoking is legal and government shouldn't interfere with the rights of private property owners.

Casinos, horse tracks, bingo halls, cigar bars and smoke shops would be exempt from the smoking ban.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events; US: Michigan
KEYWORDS: hooray; nannystate; pufflist; tobaccocausescancer
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To: Snoopers-868th

And if it’s not stopped now, it will only get worse.


51 posted on 12/06/2007 7:03:38 AM PST by GOP_Lady
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To: ShadowDancer

Good. Good riddance to smokers!


52 posted on 12/06/2007 7:03:57 AM PST by College Repub
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To: gracesdad

Good for them, that shows the system is working properly.

Back in 2001 and 2002 when we were fighting the smoker ban in Delaware one of the most vocal opponents of it was the owner of a bar that had gone non-smoking, he was rightly concerned that the state was taking away the market niche he had created for himself.


53 posted on 12/06/2007 7:04:03 AM PST by Gabz (Don't tell my mom I'm a lobbyist, she thinks I'm a piano player in a whorehouse)
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To: Gabz

Good to see all these “conservatives” praise the nanny state, isn’t it? Woo-Hoo!! More laws, Yayyy!!! We pwn ur biz, woot!!

Conservatism is all but dead and people wonder why.


54 posted on 12/06/2007 7:04:10 AM PST by L98Fiero (A fool who'll waste his life, God rest his guts.)
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To: GOP_Lady
At least Michigan seems not to be that draconian about it.

Not YET.......If you recall, it all started back in the 70's when airlines started putting the smokers in the back of the planes....

55 posted on 12/06/2007 7:04:47 AM PST by Hot Tabasco (Visions of sugarplums dancing in your head are probably caused by bad drugs.....)
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To: ShadowDancer
Why should anyone be exempt, namely casinos? Anyone know how that happened? Everyone is equal, but some are more equal than others? -- George Orwell, Animal Farm
56 posted on 12/06/2007 7:06:04 AM PST by FrdmLvr
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To: HoosierHawk

But, fat people and drunks have a disease that they can’t help. Just ask the Surgeon General. It is only the smokers that have a lifestyle CHOICE. I don’t think they have any right to collect SS disability based on their addiction. Ain’t that a laugh./s


57 posted on 12/06/2007 7:06:40 AM PST by Snoopers-868th
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To: College Repub

And when all of the smokers decide to stop smoking you will be beggig for them to come back because the government will then have its hand in your pocket to make up the tax shortfall.

Be careful what you wish for.


58 posted on 12/06/2007 7:06:41 AM PST by Gabz (Don't tell my mom I'm a lobbyist, she thinks I'm a piano player in a whorehouse)
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To: Brilliant
Exactly!

There is a pub in my husband's small town in Wisconsin that has banned smoking. Right across the street there is another pub which allows smoking. Both establishments do very well. And they did it without the State holding their hand. Imagine that!
59 posted on 12/06/2007 7:11:31 AM PST by stentorian conservative ("I don't have to hire a consultant to develop a conservative image, I am a conservative." -D Hunter)
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To: GOP_Lady

I walked out of my dentist office because I refused to fill out the medical form, which I had filled out annually asking me if I smoked, how much, if I had diabeties, blah blah. I also refused to allow them to take my blood pressure. IT IS NOT THEIR JOB. I was required to sign attesting to my current medications. NONE OF THEIR BUSINESS. What were they gonna do—not clean my teeth? I have no heart problem that should be their only concern and I was not having extractions that could cause them to want more information.

Then I went to an optometrist (not and opthomologist) and was again asked to complete the same questions. NONE OF THEIR BUSINESS. Were they not going to give me glasses or what?

This is totally out of hand and I refuse to comply. I may end up pulling my own teeth and living with my vision as it is today.


60 posted on 12/06/2007 7:11:38 AM PST by Snoopers-868th
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To: HoosierHawk

Well, it really doesn’t make sense to HAVE bars does it? I don’t care what they say, somebody had to drive to get to that bar, and I think we all know there aren’t that many designated drivers out there.


61 posted on 12/06/2007 7:14:50 AM PST by ichabod1 ("Self defense is not only our right, it is our duty." President Ronald Reagan)
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To: Swordfished

LOL.


62 posted on 12/06/2007 7:15:29 AM PST by GOP_Lady
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To: ShadowDancer

P1ss on the left.


63 posted on 12/06/2007 7:16:48 AM PST by rbosque ("To educate a person in mind and not in morals is to educate a menace to society." - Teddy Roosevelt)
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To: ichabod1

Exactly.


64 posted on 12/06/2007 7:20:34 AM PST by HoosierHawk
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To: Snoopers-868th

I have had similar experiences.

The best was a Friday night 2 years ago when my husband brought me to the emergency room with a broken ankle. The admitting person was asking me questions and I looked at her dumbfounded when she asked if I smoked. What does smoking have to do with a broken ankle?


65 posted on 12/06/2007 7:21:38 AM PST by Gabz (Don't tell my mom I'm a lobbyist, she thinks I'm a piano player in a whorehouse)
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To: Gabz

Good morning dear, Gabz! Enjoy a nanny-state-free day (as much as you can these days). :-)


66 posted on 12/06/2007 7:26:39 AM PST by GOP_Lady
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To: ShadowDancer
If tobacco is as horrible as they say, let's ban it. Remove the tax dollars from government, and let the black market have the money. And adding tobacco to the failed war on some drugs should just about cause the whole farce to collapse.

Then we can unleash government on the nannies themselves, most of whom are overweight food addicts. Won't that be a hoot?
67 posted on 12/06/2007 7:31:55 AM PST by mysterio
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To: GOP_Lady

Good morning!!!

Today is an easy one to enjoy as a nanny-state-free day -— I’m not going anywhere!!!!


68 posted on 12/06/2007 7:33:24 AM PST by Gabz (Don't tell my mom I'm a lobbyist, she thinks I'm a piano player in a whorehouse)
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To: Philly Nomad

Not to mention save on the dry cleaning bills.

Almost all the restaurants in my town have gone smoke free and have noticed an increase in business. It’s a delight.


69 posted on 12/06/2007 7:35:50 AM PST by Rita Hayworth (Vote for a guy who had 399 House Bank overdrafts totaling $129,000? Yeah right!!)
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To: Gabz
What does smoking have to do with a broken ankle?

As we both know, if you had died due to maybe bleeding or something else, your death certificate surely would read it was caused because of smoking. LOL

I have been told that all these forms are something called "informed consent." Informed of what? Furthermore, since HIPPA and computers in every damn office why is it necessary to complete what you have previously provided? I truly am sick of every clerk in my town having knowledge of my medical history. IT IS JUST NOT THEIR BUSINESS.

The dentist told me it was for my own good. I told him it was to protect him from liability. And I had done that. I wrote across the form in the dentist office "no changes, see previous form" and signed and dated it--still not good enough. He came right out of the back room to convince me I should do this. Well, I chose freedom and told him so. Well, when I arrive at an emergency someone will treat me (even if I have a heart condition) and someone may even give them the information they so desperately believe they need--but not I. Understand that I am not out of the area I live. I have never used another hospital or Dr. (they have the records) look it up if it is so damn important. LOL

70 posted on 12/06/2007 7:38:52 AM PST by Snoopers-868th
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To: Snoopers-868th

I like your attitude!!!


71 posted on 12/06/2007 7:43:08 AM PST by Gabz (Don't tell my mom I'm a lobbyist, she thinks I'm a piano player in a whorehouse)
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To: HoosierHawk
Like take away those drinks they enjoy so much more now without the smoke

Isn't it crazy? They ban smoking from the bar because second hand smoke could possibly harm your health, but go ahead and keep drinking and destroy your liver and hey, when you are through drinking go jump in your car and see if you can run down a few folks on your way home and you can prevent them from having to die a slow death due to the evil second hand smoke.

Seriously, you are right, they won't stop with smoking because the majority of people that are pushing this through never even go to the bars in the first place, so they will be happy to start in on the drinking folk as soon as they have carried their smoking crusade as far as they can take it.

72 posted on 12/06/2007 7:43:48 AM PST by Elyse (I refuse to feed the crocodile.)
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To: Philly Nomad; Gabz

This will not stop with draconian smoking bans - get ready for the Big “D” Draconian Bans.
http://www.startribune.com/opinion/commentary/12132066.html

Quote:”Minnesota’s antismoking ordinance allows people to go to bars and restaurants and avoid smoke, because tobacco smoke is a proven killer. Yet because we still allow recreational wood burning in the city, where homes are close together on small lots, it has become a serious livability problem. All citizens are forced to breathe outdoor air that smells of smoke in many neighborhoods, night and day, in all seasons.”
~snip~
Quote:”Wood smoke comprises fine particulates, many of which are carcinogenic, such as benzene, toluene, formaldehyde and polyaromatic hydrocarbons. It is far more concentrated than cigarette smoke and travels much farther, spreading soot and fine particulates directly into our air and our lungs. It also invades our water and food supply with persistent organic compounds that do not break down but remain for years, causing a host of health problems in frogs, bluegills and mammals — including humans.”

Are you ready for this Nomad?

Gabz, thanks for the ping


73 posted on 12/06/2007 7:44:49 AM PST by libertarian27 (Land of the Fee, Home of the Shamed)
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To: Gabz
This is not the thread to put this I suppose but I would rather post it than do a private message.

My husband's mother is 87. She had the forms to fill out AGAIN. My husband said every single question could be answered "old age" and who cares what date, year this woman had babies or gall blatter surgery. I laughed because it is absolutely true. Are they gonna let her die over some form her eyes can't even see to fill out anymore?

74 posted on 12/06/2007 7:45:50 AM PST by Snoopers-868th
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To: Snoopers-868th
I walked out of my dentist office because I refused to fill out the medical form, which I had filled out annually asking me if I smoked, how much, if I had diabeties, blah blah. I also refused to allow them to take my blood pressure. IT IS NOT THEIR JOB. I was required to sign attesting to my current medications. NONE OF THEIR BUSINESS. What were they gonna do—not clean my teeth? I have no heart problem that should be their only concern and I was not having extractions that could cause them to want more information. Then I went to an optometrist (not and opthomologist) and was again asked to complete the same questions. NONE OF THEIR BUSINESS. Were they not going to give me glasses or what? This is totally out of hand and I refuse to comply. I may end up pulling my own teeth and living with my vision as it is today.

That'll show'em, you blind toothless fool.

75 posted on 12/06/2007 7:46:42 AM PST by Rita Hayworth (Vote for a guy who had 399 House Bank overdrafts totaling $129,000? Yeah right!!)
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To: Gabz
"Tell that to my friends in Delaware who lost their jobs after the smoking ban, or the ones that owned bars.......oh wait, a lot of those bars no longer exist. "

Yup.. AND the cooks in Vegas who lost their jobs when all the small restaurant and bar types places had to close their food service down to keep allowing smoking.

(in Vegas you can smoke if its ONLY a bar and does not serve food so many many cooks were laid off and bars now serve booze only.)

People think these things are "great" until it bites them in the behind.

76 posted on 12/06/2007 7:49:55 AM PST by eXe (Si vis pacem, para bellum)
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To: Gabz

While it may not seem necessary to you, someone attempting to heal your bones certainly wants to know if you smoke.

http://orthopedics.about.com/cs/brokenbones/a/smokingbones.htm

Smoking has a documented detrimental effect on the rate at which your bones (and skin) heal. Chances are the nurse didn’t care if you told her or not. You won’t get your follow up in the ER, but it is important for the doctor to decide when to schedule follow up appointments and your final cast removal.


77 posted on 12/06/2007 7:50:02 AM PST by Vorleen
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To: Elyse
as they have carried their smoking crusade as far as they can take it.

And that would be when there are few revenues to cover government's bills and they need more of that green stuff to create programs these nanny's want but want someone else to pay for. Eventually, it will get them too. I just wish it was sooner rather than later but it will not fall on deaf ears because as conservatives we know the real problem and will step up to help them in their quest.

78 posted on 12/06/2007 7:51:00 AM PST by Snoopers-868th
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To: Rita Hayworth

Dear nanny sheeple:

Oh, nevermind.


79 posted on 12/06/2007 7:53:05 AM PST by Snoopers-868th
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To: Rita Hayworth
Not to mention save on the dry cleaning bills. Almost all the restaurants in my town have gone smoke free and have noticed an increase in business. It’s a delight.

But, it sounds like some dry cleaners are going to go out of business.

80 posted on 12/06/2007 7:56:14 AM PST by Elyse (I refuse to feed the crocodile.)
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To: Snoopers-868th

And it will only get worse with Hillerycare..........


81 posted on 12/06/2007 7:56:45 AM PST by Gabz (Don't tell my mom I'm a lobbyist, she thinks I'm a piano player in a whorehouse)
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To: eXe
People think these things are "great" until it bites them in the behind.

Tell me about it.

82 posted on 12/06/2007 7:58:07 AM PST by Gabz (Don't tell my mom I'm a lobbyist, she thinks I'm a piano player in a whorehouse)
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To: Gabz

I forsee more people taking a stand and refusing which will throw their preventive statistics out the window. People will wait for emergencies. I know I will.


83 posted on 12/06/2007 7:59:31 AM PST by Snoopers-868th
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To: ShadowDancer

Many bars will institute a one time five dollar lifetime membership to skirt similar laws. Here in KC back in the 30s for a bar to be open on Sunday they had to serve food. So each table had a sandwich in the center that no one was allowed to touch. People will do whatever they have to to get around such laws.


84 posted on 12/06/2007 8:01:45 AM PST by Leg Olam (“If I had to live my life over again, I'd be a plumber.” ~ Albert Einstein)
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To: Vorleen

Smoking has a documented detrimental effect on the rate SOME people heal.

The operative word here is some. Statistically it is true, but in real life the opposite is just as true.

BTW - the stitches came out earlier and the cast came off earlier than was originally estimated. Additionally I came out of the anesthesia following my surgery far sooner, and without any ill effects, than was expected and instead of having to spend the night in the hospital I was home in my own house less than 12 hours after surgery.


85 posted on 12/06/2007 8:02:38 AM PST by Gabz (Don't tell my mom I'm a lobbyist, she thinks I'm a piano player in a whorehouse)
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To: PBRSTREETGANG

Wow, that must have been frightening, sitting there waiting for that coiled creature to strike at any moment.


86 posted on 12/06/2007 8:02:50 AM PST by Old Professer (The critic writes with rapier pen, dips it twice, and writes again.)
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To: Philly Nomad

Smoking bans cause alcoholism?


87 posted on 12/06/2007 8:04:51 AM PST by Old Professer (The critic writes with rapier pen, dips it twice, and writes again.)
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To: Gabz

Read his post #6; you may be arguing with a born-again drinker.


88 posted on 12/06/2007 8:08:29 AM PST by Old Professer (The critic writes with rapier pen, dips it twice, and writes again.)
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To: Old Professer
Wow, that must have been frightening, sitting there waiting for that coiled creature to strike at any moment.

Huh?

89 posted on 12/06/2007 8:09:16 AM PST by PBRSTREETGANG
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To: Snoopers-868th
Check out this thread:

Charbroilers in eateries face controls

90 posted on 12/06/2007 8:12:34 AM PST by Gabz (Don't tell my mom I'm a lobbyist, she thinks I'm a piano player in a whorehouse)
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To: Old Professer

Oh, I saw it...........

I like your take on it :)


91 posted on 12/06/2007 8:13:09 AM PST by Gabz (Don't tell my mom I'm a lobbyist, she thinks I'm a piano player in a whorehouse)
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To: Gabz

I had seen this. The environmentalists seem to have gotten the nod so hold on for a whole lot of this type of crap. When will they outlaw cars altogether or cows because they fart or it is inhumane to kill them for food? This will be just another way to tax us. I personally love charbroiled beef spread thick with butter, side of mashed potatoes, gravy if I can get it and a nice big glass of raw milk. I also love deep-fried chicken fried in lard. Also, I am skinny and healthy and in my 60’s. How can that be? Surely, if I don’t eat this stuff I will live forever!

Side issue: Don’t you think it is strange timing the S. Ct. is taking on the gun law?


92 posted on 12/06/2007 8:25:22 AM PST by Snoopers-868th
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To: Rita Hayworth

Ain’t anonymity fun?


93 posted on 12/06/2007 8:26:38 AM PST by Old Professer (The critic writes with rapier pen, dips it twice, and writes again.)
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To: College Repub
Good. Good riddance to smokers!

Are you without vice?

94 posted on 12/06/2007 8:28:35 AM PST by A_Tradition_Continues (No Longer white...I'm Caucasion-American...Please make note)
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To: Snoopers-868th

There absolutely HAS to be gravy with the mashed taters - it’s the law (at least in my house)..........

But I know what you’re saying and totally agree with you.

Yes, I do wonder on the timing of the gun law scrutiny.


95 posted on 12/06/2007 8:31:27 AM PST by Gabz (Don't tell my mom I'm a lobbyist, she thinks I'm a piano player in a whorehouse)
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To: A_Tradition_Continues; College Repub

ATC: If the screen name means anything this is a young punk who has been brainwashed by the liberals in his university or college and knows no better. I would say his college is for naught regarding our country’s future. They can’t help themselves and no not what they are doing. LOL


96 posted on 12/06/2007 8:31:59 AM PST by Snoopers-868th
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To: Elyse

Not as long as we have people who are too lazy or too proud to do their own wash.

Who wants to smell like perchloroethylene and acetone, anyway?


97 posted on 12/06/2007 8:32:07 AM PST by Old Professer (The critic writes with rapier pen, dips it twice, and writes again.)
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To: Vorleen

I don’t think a study of 54 patients is really conclusive of fact.


98 posted on 12/06/2007 8:33:59 AM PST by A_Tradition_Continues (No Longer white...I'm Caucasion-American...Please make note)
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To: Elyse

Not to mention this about the dangers of contact with dry cleaning solvents from sciencedirect.com:

Abstract
Trichloroethylene (TCE) and perchloroethylene (PERC), the most common alkenyl halides, have been extensively used in industry, and can cause skin damage. To evaluate their cytotoxic potential on skin, the effects of these agents on the normal human epidermal keratinocytes (NHEK) were investigated. Their action on cell viability, membrane integrity and lipid peroxidation (LPO) was assessed by neutral red uptake (NRU) assay, lactate dehydrogenase (LDH) release test and measurement of malondialdehyde (MDA) levels and superoxide dismutase (SOD) activity. In addition, the protective effect of antioxidatant vitamin E on the cytotoxicity was also studied. Incubation of NHEK with various concentrations (0.01–31.6 mM) of TCE or PERC caused a dose-dependent decrease in cell viability, with 80% reduction at 31.6 mM. NR50 values from the cytotoxicity assay was found to be 4.53 and 2.16 mM for TCE and PERC, respectively. A time- and concentration- dependent release of LDH were observed at 1, 2, 3, 4 h after cells were exposed to different doses of TCE or PERC. These agents also caused an increase of MDA, whilst an inhibition of SOD activity, in a concentration-dependent manner. Pre-treatment of the cells with vitamin E at 10–200 mM dose-dependently attenuated the cytotoxic effect of TCE or PERC. Pre-treatment with vitamin E also reversed subsequent TCE or PERC-induced release of LDH, elevation of lipid peroxidation and decline of anti-oxidant enzyme activities. These results suggest that TCE and PERC could induce cytotoxicity to NHEK associated with oxidative stress and antioxidatant vitamin E could effectively protect NHEK from TCE- or PERC-induced cytotoxicity, which may be associated to the superoxide scavenging effect and enhancement of anti-oxidant enzyme activities.


99 posted on 12/06/2007 8:35:58 AM PST by Old Professer (The critic writes with rapier pen, dips it twice, and writes again.)
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To: Rita Hayworth
Almost all the restaurants in my town have gone smoke free and have noticed an increase in business. It’s a delight.

If that is by their choice fine, but let the business owner make that choice. If it is a wise business choice smart restaurant and bar owners will make it. If not they will not.
100 posted on 12/06/2007 8:37:42 AM PST by John D
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