Skip to comments.Omaha Mall Shooting .. Vanity Post
Posted on 12/06/2007 7:02:50 AM PST by CometBaby
As some of you know, I am from Omaha. Just my opinion, for what its worth, but Im watching the reports on TV and Radio, both locally (here in Omaha) and nationally and Im getting ticked off .. I have to speak out.
I've been listening to people who knew this kid, on a local radio station, talking about threats he has made. There was one classmate who claims he threatened to kill her and burn down her house. Then there are the friends from his clique who are defending him. One even supposedly threatened to kill another student who was talking about what a horrible person he was to do such a thing.
I am sick and tired of being told about how shocked the people who knew him were (that he would do such a thing). In spite of knowing hed been in trouble with the law, was suicidal, depressed, emotionally disturbed, and had ideas of killing people.
The lady (he lived in her house) knew he had just dropped out of school, was emotionally unstable, diagnosed depressed, suicidal, just lost his girlfriend 2 weeks ago, just got fired from his pathetic job, that he felt he was nothing but a worthless piece of shit and didn't want to be a burden to anyone, anymore. This kid was probably exhibiting all of the classic signs of a time bomb, waiting to go off. And to top it off, he was supposedly playing with guns the night before the killing spree!!
OF COURSE NOBODY EVER SAW IT COMING !!!!!
I can already feel the Brady minions coming out of the woodwork to grab up the SKSs because nobody recognized this blatant danger to our community. And one other thing .. an SKS is NOT a high powered rifle!
Next, we are going to see signs all over the Malls saying not to bring in weapons. And how long before some nutcase announces that these poor victims deserved this, for wasting gas driving to the Mall (celebrating the HATED Christmas season, no less) in the first place! Who could have imagined it would ever come to this?
Makes you think its a real good idea to just shop online .. no hassles, no taxes and you dont have to take your life into your hands! Thanks for letting me vent a bit.
Still being reported as “an AK-47 assault rifle” on Fox.
They CAN be dangerous. If you don’t acknowledge the obvious, you are living in denial. If you are living in denial, then SURPRISES will continually happen. Either you are aware/ ‘wise as a serpent, gentle as a dove’/ or you PRETEND that no one would ever do something bad. It’s really just binary.
I hate malls too. I make a plan, go to one store, exit. They suck the breath right out of you. And the PEOPLE just schlub along, walking slowly, no passing lanes, kids out of control. And then I start thinking — ‘yegad, these people VOTE.’ Online shopping suits me just fine.
The magazine on an SKS holds ten rounds.
If the magazine is modified to a banana clip, it holds 30 rounds.
One trigger pull, one round at a time.
I thnk the banana clip makes the weapon look like a machine gun. So if it looks like a machine gun, and fires bullets, it has to be a machine gun assult rifle /sarc
I’m with you. The signs were there. But if you are feeling sorry for a victim and want to be FRIENDS, you will not act like an adult. I’m glad she had to deal with the bodies — it was a real consequence of her (non)actions.
You are wrong. A law was broken. He was a felon in possession of a firearm. And it was a stolen firearm.
But you miss the point entirely. Even if the police did not do one thing .. I would have done what I could. I don't care if ten people behave irresponsibly ..so long as I do the right thing. Now do you get it?
No, it hasn't happened. I am projecting. But this happened here in Omaha .. its very real to me, so I am venting a lot of frustration.
Hindsight is easy. I don’t believe it’s likely that you can surmise what you “would have done” “if you had been there”.
What you said........I agree.
“I noticed Fox had the shooters picture on their chiron this morning. A little thumbnail image right above the time on the lower right-hand part of the screen. Disgusting.”
My wife had FNC on last night and Greta VS was asking why someone would do this. The answer of course was to get publicity, notariety, celebrity, etc from the MEDIA. They will show his picture, make his name a household word, pictures of him will be pasted all over the news looking like a male model. THE MEDIA RESPONSE IS WHY THEY DO IT.
John Lott wrote a piece on this today......
Our local news site says security cameras showed he had it concealed balled up under his clothing.
I stand corrected then.
On an unrelated note, I will never own a hybrid. From now on, I will refer to hybrids as "assault vehicles". I am awaiting a great small diesel that is approved by the emissions nazis. One like most of Europe already has.
hey, where can i get one of those for my house? ;)
Here's one for your school, too.......
“Don’t forget, he even showed her the SKS the night before. Did it elicite any reactions of concern? Nope.”
My jaw dropped when I’d heard that...what the hell was she thinking when she saw it?? Apparently nothing. Just unbelievable.
There is always a lot of conflicting information to sort through after something as horrible as this happens. The Trolley Square shooting was mentioned, said the shooter was shot by police. I had read here repeatedly that it was an off-duty policeman who happened to be carrying and having dinner with his wife. So I go to look up a credible source, and cbs (thinking most libs would accept that) says it wasn't clear who shot him, words to that effect. But I don't have time to rehash all that and what is the point other than lives were saved imo in that incident because that guy was there. So I decided to stay out of that.
That is bothering me a lot. I expect a lot more to come out about that. Reading here she was a nurse! Was there a father in that home? She seems to have thought she was doing a good thing by taking the kid in. I have seen that, too, and then things went bad.
My teenage son brought a gun home years ago now from a friend's house and his sisters narced him off (they did the right thing imo). I got the gun and took it back to the parents and gave my son a good tongue lashing for that. I don't believe anything ever came of it, but my fingerprints would have been on that gun. My big mistake was that I should have taken it to the police, maybe instinctively I was afraid my son would have gotten in trouble, probably could have, but I didn't think about it consciously then. I was angry that the father was so loose with his guns, letting a jr high kid get access to them. I was also angry that my son took up with a kid like that; he wasn't one of his regular friends.
How do you keep firearms away from kids? Realistically? My son had a Mormon friend who came from what I considered a good, responsible family, still do. The father was an avid hunter and had his guns displayed in a glass gun cabinet in the living room. Any of their kids or friends could have easily gotten those, fortunately didn't. I'm still not anti-gun, just want only emotionally stable, responsible people to have them.
Why don't they have metal detectors at the malls? They do last I knew at the main place I buy groceries and another supermarket in a fringe part of town, couldn't miss them, had to walk through a metal hoop every time you entered the store. I don't know how well they work, but that made me feel a little safer, although I don't spook that easily, and it could give you a false sense of security.
If some disturbed individual is determined enough, they are going to find a way to carry out their sick plans one way or another.
Friends have reported he was scoping out the Malls. He had been to several with the though of locating the best position to fire from. Apparently he decided on Von Maur in Westroads, because there was a rail where he could stand behind and it was near the elevator. Also, there was a very large open area where there would be plenty of people to shoot at.
In addition Westroads is the largest Mall in Nebraska, and in Omaha there would be a lot of local media and TV stations to cover it. He was looking for attention. This was all premeditated. All planned. It had nothing to do with any previous incident at Westroads. He picked Westroads because it served his purposes.
It's actually very easy. I would not allow a 19 year old, depressed, suicidal, mentally ill boy .. who had been convicted of a felony and known to make death threats, to bring an AK-47 into my house.
Is there something wrong with that logic? Just what is it about that statement, that you find so hard to believe? What would you have done?
I agree, that would be ideal. How does a free society go about doing that and remain free? I mean free, not the condition we're currently living in.
I'm at a loss.
“”Why don’t they have metal detectors at the malls? They do last I knew at the main place I buy groceries and another supermarket in a fringe part of town, couldn’t miss them, had to walk through a metal hoop every time you entered the store. I don’t know how well they work, but that made me feel a little safer, although I don’t spook that easily, and it could give you a false sense of security.””
How could you get the shopping carts past these devices w/o setting off the alarm every time one went by??
Thanks, didn't think of it that way. Stores at the malls have alarms for that, and now that you mention it, I *think* I have heard them going off in my supermarket. What triggers them? The shopping carts would be a big issue. Even though they are stored in the vestibule or outside, you have to grab one and go through into the store and wheel the cart out again.
I agree, that would be ideal. How does a free society go about doing that and remain free? I mean free, not the condition we're currently living in.
We have lost so many of our freedoms incrementally. How free are we when every day we have to worry about thugs (if we let ourselves)? Not just us, our loved ones. Now we have time bombs taking out innocent people in public places. I think it started about the 60's with that Texas Tower incident. I remember then talk about "copycats". These reports plant seeds in the minds of the unstable, a few of which will act out much later. Should we stop reporting them? I don't think so. I like to know the name and family background of the perp. Having said that, once it is known, start referring to "the killer" like one poster said. This kid's photo was splashed on the front page of our local paper website. Just what he wanted.
I can't just shake my head. We have got to find some answers. A start would be prosecuting adults who don't properly secure their firearms even if common sense tells us they will get one another way. I can't imagine a kid in my generation doing something like that, so I grew up with people just stashing them somewhere. Usually that was ok. Kids were told by their parents not to mess with them. Then my husband's 9-year-old cousin got shot and killed playing at some neighbor's. I was taught how to shoot from a young age, had my cap guns, clearly knew the difference, etc. I never knew where our family guns were stored as a child! Now even kids have foiled home invaders because they knew where the gun was and how to load and use it. Or at least tried. I don't recommend that either, but if push comes to shove, I would be glad if one of mine saved the rest of the family that way.
At least if a sicko kid gets a gun on the streets, parents/adults wouldn't be culpable, as I now believe they should if they are careless. I would cut a little slack for people who have to carry in their line of work, come home tired, and tragedy. But maybe habitually locking it up first thing, like a practice exercise, every time, would help prevent some of the latter.
I don't necessarily think a lot of security guards are necessarily that stable either, especially the younger ones, unless they pass a psychological test and have police accredited training.
Once you start brainstorming, you can come up with so many different scenarios, it does make it complicated.
I don't and I won't. Bad people and crazy people are out there. I am not one of them. I will carry and be prepared until the day I die.
And the day I die will be either by motorcycle or old age. I will not die at the hand of a bad or crazy person. I refuse to submit to them.
I believe you. You have made your point. I don’t know what I would have done.
That is hard to answer. Personally, no and it doesn't make me feel safer, maybe if I flew a lot which I don't, would hate that dang 2-hour early arrival at the airport and the sometimes indignities of that. But when I have to think about family members who work at the mall, work at convenience stores, fly frequently, I don't know yet because I haven't thought it through and hate to give an off-the-cuff answer.
I don't even like all the cameras, but I've grown so used to them, I never even think about it any more. How bad is that?
And the one time I needed them, by the time the police got on it, they had overwritten the tape which they did every two weeks. Ticked me off, not so much at the police because they had higher-priority crimes to deal with than my purse which was stolen due to my own carelessness, but I had good clues in fraudulent checks, the payee, because some kind soul found my checkbook with tissues still in, clearly two were not my handwriting. How dumb is that on the part of the culprit? Anyway, there were several places where you would put the same abbreviation as the payee; I happened to patronize one of them myself (a chain of gas stations locally). I almost pleaded for help to try to figure out at which one the check had been cashed to help the police. No one cared. Until the check was returned with a stop pay and I get a notification. I explained the situation, gave them the police report # to get me off the hook, and apologized, said I guessed they'd just have to write it off or maybe my banking ins covered it. That's when I found out they had overwritten the tape already.
But when there has been a serious crime, that is one of the ways the police solve it, seize the tape, may have to get a court order if not voluntarily surrendered, even from places where the crime didn't occur, trying to track the prior activities of the perp. I've got mixed feelings about the ethics of that, but naturally I'm glad if they get someone really bad off the streets (hah, not for long usually).
I got some of my things back including my driver's license which saved me that hassle. I asked couldn't they do a finger print check on that? The answer was no which I didn't understand.
I hate it all what has become of my country, hate those tags on clothing (never shoplifted in my life), all the encumbrances we are now subjected to because there are so many bad people out there. Growing up, I was FREE and SAFE from all of that. The WORST that happened was if I went into a store (usually upscale) just to look when I was a teenager, I knew I was being watched. I didn't like the feeling.
One funny thing happened though. I ran in my usual store and didn't want to bother to get a cart, always pick up a few more things than I'd planned, anyway, stuffed several cans of cat food in my coat pocket, finished my rounds, felt somebody "heavy" behind me, followed me up to the checkout, I plopped all the stuff on the conveyer, dug all the cans out of my pocket and added them, I never saw the guy, but felt him make a quick exit :-). So I have to be careful about that because I suppose they can get you before you get to the checkout if you do something suspicious like that.
When something really bad happened several years ago, my life was in jeopardy, that and my whole family. I had to stay in hotels and slept in my car for several nights running until they got enough evidence and found him. The FIRST thing I did was pick up the phone and call a neighbor across the street and ask if he still had his gun and could he please be ready to come help me out if this guy shows up because we all know that even with quick response time, it is never quick enough assuming some other things criminals could do I'd rather not mention.
Of late, I have felt a need to be able to own a gun. It curtails my freedom going out places I won't go alone now but would if I could carry. Also, I'd feel safer in my own home.
But who said life was fair?
That’ll have them shakin’ in their boots.
Jon Gutmacher’s book discusses it on pages 131 and 132. Armed trespass is a felony, but only if you were warned that you were trespassing and refused to leave. Since a mall or any business with an open door is inviting the public to come in, ideally to buy something, they have to tell you to get out before you can be a trespasser. There is a charge for the posession of the concealed weapon in spite of the sign, but several deputies in the area assure me that it is a civil offense - money but no criminal record.
That’s unless they actually tell you to leave and you refuse to do so within a reasonable time. Then you’re screwed.
It’s actually the NRA’s definition. Rimfire is rimfire, high power is everything else.
They’re ranting and raving at: http://www.topix.net/forum/city/omaha-ne/TPGG9CHKHM16HL4T5
“Armed trespass is a felony, but only if you were warned that you were trespassing and refused to leave. Since a mall or any business with an open door is inviting the public to come in, ideally to buy something, they have to tell you to get out before you can be a trespasser. There is a charge for the posession of the concealed weapon in spite of the sign, but several deputies in the area assure me that it is a civil offense - money but no criminal record.”
Thats pretty much what I’ve heard. However the few times I go to the malls around here I have not see a sign.
I disagree with the poster who said it’s not high powered. The 7.62 round is a big round. But it definitely isn’t an assault rifle. Did the one he used have a hi-cap mag?
“Realistically, what can be done?”
The only thing that can be done is for more people to love Jesus and fear God.
The sks and Ak-47 works until it’s completely destroyed.
“Your point is valid for all churches.”
Hold on a second. That guy would have been filled with 40 and 45 caliber lead in any Independent Baptist church in the country. One such church I went to took a CC class as a church activity.
widespread and common CCW’s can at least serve to give potential killers pause and realize that there’s a possibility that all his victims may not just lay down like sheep.
his intent was to kill and be killed - widespread ccws would have done zilch to protect anyone from this. at best, it would have reduced the body count (which is not a bad thing).
knowledge of widespread ccws will only deter those who don’t want to die themselves, and it seems most of the ‘disturbed’ individuals want to die.
I have a bit of an issue with the stepdad, to be honest. he certainly knew how crazed the kid was, but did not think to lock up his guns? That’s negligence from where I sit.
In the firearms community, 7.62x39 is considered an intermediate cartridge of a little more than half the ft-lbs (~1800) of a high-powered cartridge, and about twice the ft-lbs of a .45 pistol round. Physically, it's significantly smaller in length than the Russian high-powered round 7.62x54R, which if I remember correctly hits with about 2900 ft-lbs, on par with an American 30.06 or .308.
Still makes people just as dead though.
“I have a bit of an issue with the stepdad, to be honest. he certainly knew how crazed the kid was, but did not think to lock up his guns? Thats negligence from where I sit.”
I don’t think that’s the problem either. The “kid” (who was actually a man) needed Jesus.
I keep calling him a kid too but I think that’s one of the problems too.
You’re right that more CC’s wouldn’t have helped much. Our country needs more Jesus and less Humanism and to stop drugging up our kids.
Sounds like the Russians make a rugged rifle. But I would think that any rifle or gun should have been a red flag to Kovac.
Except that violates the terms of your CCW permit.
The chief of the PD there reported Robby was a felon. This and the fact that he also made credible threats to kill his mother sounds like the basis for that, since he was locked up in a mental institution for that kind of thing. It's a juvy, so hte records are probably sealed.
"an SKS is NOT a high powered rifle!"
Yes, it is. It's in the class of rifles that would be used in the high power comp at Camp Perry, which would include AR15s and M1As in 223 and 308 respectively.
Excellent! You get a gold star! :)
Because the mall management doesn't want people to stop coming?
My big mistake was that I should have taken it to the police
Well that makes sense. Your son steals something and rather than return it to the owner you'd give it to the police so that the owner doesn't get it back. Tell me would you also have turned your son over to the police for prosecution for felony theft by taking? I'm truly glad I don't know you or your larcenous offspring.
“Hold on a second. That guy would have been filled with 40 and 45 caliber lead in any Independent Baptist church in the country.”
My point was that its not only liberal churches that are soft. America has many very soft targets.
It never occurred to me that he may have stolen it. They were jr high kids. I will ask him about that. The story at the time was the kid gave it to him. I returned it to the owners. Would I have turned my son into the police? Probably not because I didn't want him to have it on his record and ruin his life, and it didn't occur to me at the time anyway. Doesn't matter now because he can't own one anyway due to domestic disputes w/ex wife when she was the one to pull knives on him, deliberately ran into a telephone pole, her dad is a detective and got them out of that, etc. She finally had to spend some time in jail for assault of somebody else. He is 34 now and makes a six figure income, has been a good son, came over late last night to snowblow my sidewalks.
Another mistake by picking the wrong woman, broke his heart. He is stuck with mega child support for his son by her, she is going to ask for a modification because his income keeps increasing and lives with her boyfriend off the money she gets from him although I think he does work. The other father pays $30 a week when he can. How would you like to live with that? He pays faithfully, and we didn't get any child support after the first couple years from his own dad.
No, you wouldn't want to know us. For sure. You can thank God in your prayers that you don't know trash like us.
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