Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Russia could use force in Kosovo
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7258801.stm ^

Posted on 02/22/2008 5:57:24 AM PST by jhpigott

Russia's ambassador to Nato, Dmitry Rogozin, has warned that Russia could use military force if the Kosovo independence dispute escalates. "If the EU develops a unified position or if Nato exceeds its mandate set by the UN, then these organisations will be in conflict with the UN," he said.

In that case Russia would "proceed on the basis that in order to be respected we need to use brute force", he said.

Many EU members have recognised Kosovo, but several oppose recognition.

Russia, a permanent member of the UN Security Council, backs Serbia, which has condemned the independence declaration issued by the Kosovo parliament on 17 February.

On Tuesday members of the Serb minority in Kosovo attacked two border posts staffed by UN personnel and Kosovo police.

The violence led the Nato troops in Kosovo - known as K-For - to reinforce the border with Serbia.

Kosovo's majority ethnic Albanians are following a plan drawn up by UN special envoy Martti Ahtisaari for "supervised independence", which was rejected by Serbia.

The EU will soon deploy 2,000 officials to strengthen law and order in Kosovo, which has a population of about two million. Russia argues that the mission has no legal basis.


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Russia
KEYWORDS: eu; kosovo; nato; russianmilitary
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-100101-114 next last

1 posted on 02/22/2008 5:57:25 AM PST by jhpigott
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: jeffers; Dog; Cap Huff; 1COUNTER-MORTER-68; maquiladora

ping


2 posted on 02/22/2008 5:58:28 AM PST by jhpigott
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott

Russians shooting at Blue Helmets?

Get our guys out of there.


3 posted on 02/22/2008 5:58:33 AM PST by FreedomPoster (Guns themselves are fairly robust; their chief enemies are rust and politicians) (NRA)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott
Has the EU preemptively surrendered yet?
4 posted on 02/22/2008 5:58:59 AM PST by MNJohnnie (http://www.iraqvetsforcongress.com ---- Get involved, make a difference.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott

Great. Troops in Iraq, Afghanistan, Korea, and spread around the world in the Phillippines and like countries and Putin may just put troops into Serbia. What then?


5 posted on 02/22/2008 5:59:01 AM PST by Greg F (Do you want a guy named Hussein to fix your soul? Michelle Obama thinks you do.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott

Putin’s last gasp?


6 posted on 02/22/2008 6:00:22 AM PST by PurpleMan
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott
"Russia could use force in Kosovo"

I can't see it happening.

7 posted on 02/22/2008 6:01:41 AM PST by maquiladora
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: PurpleMan

Why are we backing the people there, who sided with Hitler in WWII?...


8 posted on 02/22/2008 6:02:02 AM PST by Cringing Negativism Network (Draft: Condoleezza Rice for Vice President!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott

Can’t blame Russia all that much. They don’t want a muslim state set up in their backyard. Nobody is talking about it but that’s where it stands.


9 posted on 02/22/2008 6:03:12 AM PST by RC2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott
WWWI started there. It is not worth one American live to defend the “independent” Kosovo.
10 posted on 02/22/2008 6:03:56 AM PST by 2banana (My common ground with terrorists - they want to die for islam and we want to kill them)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott
WWWI started there. It is not worth one American live to defend the “independent” Kosovo.
11 posted on 02/22/2008 6:03:56 AM PST by 2banana (My common ground with terrorists - they want to die for islam and we want to kill them)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott

Why do we want another muslim country? Is this more of Bush-the-wuss’ compassionate conservastism?


12 posted on 02/22/2008 6:04:09 AM PST by stevio (Crunchy Con - God, guns, guts, and organically grown crunchy nuts.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott

Russia knows if they mess with with the US they risk total annihilation.

If anything, they’re rational gamblers. They’re not about to throw it all away over some lousy Balkan family feud.


13 posted on 02/22/2008 6:04:31 AM PST by canuck_conservative
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: canuck_conservative
They’re not about to throw it all away over some lousy Balkan family feud.

Neither should we. Good luck to the EU.

14 posted on 02/22/2008 6:06:13 AM PST by AU72
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott
The EU will soon deploy 2,000 officials to strengthen law and order in Kosovo, which has a population of about two million. Russia argues that the mission has no legal basis.

How do these Euronuts recognize the State of Kosovo as a lawful sovereign entity and then deploy 2000 officials along with 15,000 troops within that nation's sovereign territory???

15 posted on 02/22/2008 6:06:47 AM PST by Uncle Chip (TRUTH : Ignore it. Deride it. Allegorize it. Interpret it. But you can't ESCAPE it.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Greg F
"Great. Troops in Iraq, Afghanistan, Korea, and spread around the world in the Phillippines and like countries and Putin may just put troops into Serbia. What then?"


Simple.

Bring all the troops home to stop the rioting over the bad economy, housing crisis, and the high cost of parking at the casinos in Vegas.

16 posted on 02/22/2008 6:07:29 AM PST by G.Mason (And what is intelligence if not the craft of out-thinking our adversaries?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: maquiladora

neither can I, he really has no way to get them there other than maybe an airlifted contingent. I don’t think the Ukranine is going to give em’ a free pass. Overland routes are not exactly in abundance.

However, I would not put it past Putin to rachet up the tension in Georgia


17 posted on 02/22/2008 6:07:41 AM PST by jhpigott
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott
Russia is too weak to take on NATO in a full-scale war.

They are bluffing and saber-rattling.

The Serbs have placed their hopes in a megaphone, not an ally.

The Russians lost 8,000 soldiers in 20 months in Chechnya fighting a population half the size and far less than half as well-equipped as Kosovo, with no support from NATO.

18 posted on 02/22/2008 6:07:54 AM PST by wideawake (Why is it that those who call themselves Constitutionalists know the least about the Constitution?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: stevio

Blame Bush First!


19 posted on 02/22/2008 6:08:10 AM PST by 1rudeboy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: Uncle Chip
... and then deploy 2000 officials along with 15,000 troops within that nation's sovereign territory???

Because they have that sovereign nation's permission, that's how.
20 posted on 02/22/2008 6:11:46 AM PST by canuck_conservative
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott
I'd like to know how their logistics would work. It's a "can't get there from here" place, now that the USSR no longer exists. They'd need the permission of more than a couple of nations to move the proper men and materials there.


21 posted on 02/22/2008 6:12:09 AM PST by edpc (Republican Attack Machine Field Service Technician)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: canuck_conservative

We would not wage nuclear war over Kosovo ... so there is really no annihilation risk here.

That said, Russia’s military options are limited. Putin could put in airborne troops pretty easily, but that’s about it ... and they would have no aircover as they have little basing options for their warplanes.

Now, Russian airborne troops on the Serb / Kosovo border would still freak out alot of Western politicians ... and may be enough to cause them to blink and back down, so who knows.

Russia does have some leverage, though, in it’s energy resources and what it supplies to Europe. We’ll see if that card gets brought up in the near term.


22 posted on 02/22/2008 6:14:50 AM PST by Mac94
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: 1rudeboy

You’re right, clinton was the one to start this. But he’s just keeping the tradition alive. Like he himself said; Bush, Clinton, Bush, Clinton.


23 posted on 02/22/2008 6:15:23 AM PST by stevio (Crunchy Con - God, guns, guts, and organically grown crunchy nuts.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: canuck_conservative
They’re not about to throw it all away over some lousy Balkan family feud.

They did in 1914, and that led to the fall of the Romanovs. Historically, the Russians have always supported the Serbs, much like we have with some of our past conquests.

I wouldn't look for direct intervention, but an insurgent campaign to disrupt Kosovo.

24 posted on 02/22/2008 6:16:53 AM PST by Pistolshot (Remember, no matter how bad your life is, someone is watching and enjoying your suffering.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 13 | View Replies]

To: wideawake

i agree, the risk of direct conflict is limited.

That being said, if Russia were going to fight a conventional war with NATO - this would be as good as it gets for them. This is their backyard and the logistics train would be much shorter for them, than us.

Putin does have some leverage here and could easily enough move some airborne troops into Serbia. I doubt he has the gumption to try to insert them directly into Pristina, although Yeltsin pulled that off back at the end of the Kosovo bombing campaign.


25 posted on 02/22/2008 6:24:12 AM PST by jhpigott
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: stevio

appeasing the beast makes it stronger ... I wish the next President would end the ramadamadingdong dinners immediately upon taking office.

I can assure you if I was President there would be none of this. There would be a yearly Christmas celebration and CAIR could take a long walk off a short pier.


26 posted on 02/22/2008 6:25:47 AM PST by F15Eagle (1Tim 1:4; Gal 1:6-10; 1Cor 2:2; Matthew 22:30; Mark 12:25; Luke 20:34-35; 2Thess 2:11; Jude 1:3)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: Cringing Negativism Network

Huh?

WWII? WWII? A little dated arguement
We’re allies w/ Japan, Germany and Italy

Even the Cold War.
We’re in NATO w/Bulgaria, Czech Rep, Estonia, Hungary, Latvia, Lithuania, Poland, Rumania, Slovakia & Slovenia.

Time to wake up an smell the history books.


27 posted on 02/22/2008 6:25:52 AM PST by PurpleMan
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: edpc

I guess that’s one advantage of a land-locked country.


28 posted on 02/22/2008 6:27:14 AM PST by randog (What the...?!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: edpc

Voyjvodina? (If I spelled that correctly ...) - never heard of it


29 posted on 02/22/2008 6:28:58 AM PST by F15Eagle (1Tim 1:4; Gal 1:6-10; 1Cor 2:2; Matthew 22:30; Mark 12:25; Luke 20:34-35; 2Thess 2:11; Jude 1:3)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: Pistolshot

The Russians are on the right side of this issue and President Bush is in the wrong.

Haven’t Clinton and Bush used our military to kill enough Serbs?
Haven’t we lost enough military troops fighting to set up hard core Islamic regimes?

Someone needs to protect the native Serbs left in Kosovo - the ones that haven’t been killed by the Albanian muslims yet.
Our president sure won’t lift a finger against the muslims to save the Serbs.

Why should we risk a major war when we created the mess and are backing the wrong side?
If Russia moves in to protect the Serbs we should wipe our hands of the mess we have made over the last 15 years and pull our people out.


30 posted on 02/22/2008 6:29:26 AM PST by Iron Munro (Suppose you were an idiot, and suppose you were a member of Congress; but I repeat myself.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott

Another UN success story.


31 posted on 02/22/2008 6:30:12 AM PST by Don Corleone (Leave the gun..take the cannoli)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott

Red Storm Rising, thanks to crude and gold.


32 posted on 02/22/2008 6:30:17 AM PST by montag813
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott

Ya know, as long as US troops ain’t in the way, I would kinda look forward to that...

And I HATE finding myself on Russian and Putin’s side...


33 posted on 02/22/2008 6:31:43 AM PST by Little Ray (So its McCain or Huckabee? Pass me the bloody KoolAid.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott

I still just can’t grasp what’s going on there. I can see why Kosovo would want to be independent. They’re in a region where the majority are of a different ethnicity and culture as their rulers. Makes some sense. It doesn’t mean we should support them but I can grasp that.
What I can’t grasp is, why all the protesting in Belgrade? Why are young men and women in their early 20’s burning cars and attacking our embassies?
Why so much hostility to Kosovo’s independence?
What do young college students in Belgrade have to lose?
Why would Russian risk international condemnation and further strain ties with western “friends” over this?

I see the protesters’ photos and they look like the same kids in the US who only care about porn and beer bongs. Maybe you’d get a couple who’d burn some SUV’s over Global Warming. But they wouldn’t care at all if South Carolina wanted to be independent.

I don’t believe it’s the Muslim thing. Although that would be important to me. I perceive the youngsters of Belgrade as being liberal minded, socialist, humanist, hedonists. Who would only jump into action if somebody wanted to take away their right to spit on Bibles. Am I wrong? Are they that ideological?


34 posted on 02/22/2008 6:34:08 AM PST by demshateGod (the GOP is dead to me)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott
How does our involvement fit into our national interest. Does Kosovo have any natural resources, industry or strategic value. My understanding is that they are a mooselimb country with little education and 60% unemployment. Are we that desperate to have another country/dependent to send billions of aid $'s to?

Can I declare myself a country and receive foreign aid from uncle sugar the Great Satan?

35 posted on 02/22/2008 6:35:37 AM PST by River_Wrangler (Nothing difficult is ever easy!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott
That being said, if Russia were going to fight a conventional war with NATO - this would be as good as it gets for them.

I agree. It would be their best shot at inflicting some damage before they inevitably had their asses handed to them.

The problem for Russia is that if their planes entered Kosovo airspace, NATO could obliterate them pretty handily - so Russia's best bet is to try and get as many Russian troops into Serbia as they could before Romania's government formally requested NATO aid for the violation of their airspace.

So Russia could deploy a bunch of their troops on the Serbia-Kosovo border, as you say.

If they invaded Kosovo at that point, NATO would make short work of them - and Russia would have real difficulty extracting their troops from Serbia after the failure of their little adventure.

What Russia sees here is a confluence of political and economic ($100 oil) events that can help them gain leverage with the EU.

Putin isn't stupid enough to initiate a war that would expose how weak Russia's military really is without gaining him any material advantage.

36 posted on 02/22/2008 6:37:19 AM PST by wideawake (Why is it that those who call themselves Constitutionalists know the least about the Constitution?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: demshateGod

Watch this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y7L05geznoI

This is going to spread everywhere.


37 posted on 02/22/2008 6:38:56 AM PST by the gillman@blacklagoon.com (And close the damned borders!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]

To: Mac94

Couldn’t they just fly troops into Serbia and when they get enough, invade? If Serbia wants Russia’s help wouldn’t they allow them to build up there? I mean, we didn’t just march into Iraq from San Diego. We flew them to Kuwait.


38 posted on 02/22/2008 6:39:09 AM PST by demshateGod (the GOP is dead to me)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: wideawake

China is backing Russia and Serbia.


39 posted on 02/22/2008 6:39:56 AM PST by the gillman@blacklagoon.com (And close the damned borders!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 36 | View Replies]

To: the gillman@blacklagoon.com
China is backing Russia and Serbia.

Of course.

However, China's logistiical problems in bringing force to bear in Kosovo dwarf Russia's.

If China really wanted to get involved in a global war and tried to deploy troops to Kosovo, NATO could erase any evidence that China's forces ever existed before they could get halfway to the Balkans.

40 posted on 02/22/2008 6:45:18 AM PST by wideawake (Why is it that those who call themselves Constitutionalists know the least about the Constitution?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 39 | View Replies]

To: demshateGod
Why so much hostility to Kosovo’s independence?

Fair question. Here's an analogy which I hope will help.

The year is 2020. The Aztlan Party in Texas want to leave the United States. They are supported by 80% of the population of Texas, who snuck over the border during the McCain years.

I would expect the rest of America to be livid, and I would President Jeb Bush to send the national guard in. And if the Chinese bombed the White House to stop them, citing fictional-but-widely-reported atrocities that were reported happening in Texas, where a civil war had been raging between the immigrants and some heavily armed FReepers - I'd expect the Americans would be even angrier.

Remember that Kosovo is only 80% Albanian because Hitler introduced them en masse during WWII. They don't belong there.

41 posted on 02/22/2008 6:47:57 AM PST by agere_contra
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]

To: wideawake

China, at this point has the trump card on the world, and is only getting stronger.


42 posted on 02/22/2008 6:49:51 AM PST by the gillman@blacklagoon.com (And close the damned borders!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: agere_contra
I would expect President Jeb Bush. Dumb keyboard.
43 posted on 02/22/2008 6:50:10 AM PST by agere_contra
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: maquiladora

I can (and they probably will)..


44 posted on 02/22/2008 6:52:28 AM PST by JSDude1 (http://www.wnd.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=56306 "MoveON McCain" To find McCain's Sorros)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: wideawake

agreed. Still wouldn’t be surprised if he mobilized a few airborne battallions and moved them into Serbia and then made a bunch of bluster, and try to force our hand in that manner.

Or, conceivably, he could move troops into Odessia after a independence declaration there. Gerogia would be a lot easier for him to move troops into then would Serbia

If Putin wants, he can create some headaches for us, its just a matter of how hard he wants to press this thing


45 posted on 02/22/2008 6:55:14 AM PST by jhpigott
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 36 | View Replies]

To: the gillman@blacklagoon.com
China, at this point has the trump card on the world, and is only getting stronger.

China's propaganda has been pretty effective, but China is much weaker and less consequential than many people imagine.

Its economy is almost entirely dependent upon the export market, its technology is wholly dependent on what it can steal, it has next to no natural resources, and it is in terrible demographic shape.

China is a power because of the sheer number of its citizens and for no other reason.

And those numbers are becoming a serious liability, since China has the oldest population in the developing world.

46 posted on 02/22/2008 6:56:07 AM PST by wideawake (Why is it that those who call themselves Constitutionalists know the least about the Constitution?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: Iron Munro
This area of the world has been a confluence of cultures forever. East meets west here, and the culture clash has led to so much bloodshed, it is difficult to see who is 'right' and who is 'wrong.

This area can go up in flames again, just like 1914. Nothing was resolved then, either.

47 posted on 02/22/2008 6:56:56 AM PST by Pistolshot (Remember, no matter how bad your life is, someone is watching and enjoying your suffering.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 30 | View Replies]

To: demshateGod

Airborne and light infantry, yes. Heavy stuff, though, usually goes via ship, and Serbia is land locked and we control the seas. Plus, there is the question of air cover. Russia could get a ferw planes into Serbia, but not like NATO could via the U.S. Navy and NATO airbases in Italy. So, their main military option would be light / airborne infantry with little air cover. That’s fine if the West blinks and doesn’t fight. These forces are okay against the KLA and such. But, if the west up’s the ante and stands it’s ground, Russia would be at a severe military disadvantage.


48 posted on 02/22/2008 6:58:06 AM PST by Mac94
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 38 | View Replies]

To: jhpigott

I agree with that analysis.


49 posted on 02/22/2008 7:01:22 AM PST by wideawake (Why is it that those who call themselves Constitutionalists know the least about the Constitution?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 45 | View Replies]

To: wideawake

I believe your assessment of China is a decade out of date.

And while their economy is dependent on exports, they are still a slave nation and in control. The rest of the world depends more on Chinese goods to keep them going than China does on exporting them.


50 posted on 02/22/2008 7:07:36 AM PST by the gillman@blacklagoon.com (And close the damned borders!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-100101-114 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson