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No small plan: Public boarding schools for Chicago (Students to stay overnight)
The Chicago Tribune ^ | March 14, 2008 | Carlos Sadovi and Stephanie Banchero

Posted on 03/14/2008 7:12:51 AM PDT by raybbr

Public boarding schools where homeless children and those from troubled homes could find the safety and stability to learn are being pursued by Chicago Public Schools officials.

Under the plan, still in the nascent stages, the first pilot residential program could open as soon as fall 2009. District officials hope to launch as many as six such schools in the following years, including at least one that would operate as a year-round school.

The proposal puts Chicago at the forefront of urban school reform, as cities struggle to raise the academic achievement of students hampered by dysfunctional homes and other obstacles outside school.

Some districts, including Chicago, have looked for solutions from small schools to single-sex campuses. But residential schools are a bolder -- and far more expensive -- proposition. Long an option for the affluent, boarding schools are virtually unheard of for the disadvantaged.

Chicago Public Schools chief Arne Duncan said he does not want to be in the "parenting" business, but he worries that some homes and some neighborhoods are unsafe, making education an afterthought.

"Some children should not go home at night; some of them we need 24-7," he told the Tribune. "We want to serve children who are really not getting enough structure at home. There's a certain point where dad is in jail or has disappeared and mom is on crack ... where there isn't a stable grandmother, that child is being raised by the streets."

(Excerpt) Read more at chicagotribune.com ...


TOPICS: Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: chicago; school; schools
"All of these settings could allow students to go home on weekends, or stay at the facility 24 hours a day, seven days a week."

Think of that? They will ALLOW children to go home....

1 posted on 03/14/2008 7:12:51 AM PDT by raybbr
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To: P8ri0

I put that article you linked to in a thread.


2 posted on 03/14/2008 7:13:40 AM PDT by raybbr (You think it's bad now - wait till the anchor babies start to vote!)
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To: raybbr
Think of that? They will ALLOW children to go home....

Well, public schools are becoming nothing but junior penitentiaries anyway - this just makes it official.

3 posted on 03/14/2008 7:18:45 AM PDT by Mr. Jeeves ("Wise men don't need to debate; men who need to debate are not wise." -- Tao Te Ching)
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To: raybbr

Orphanages make a comeback as well they should. Parents are on drugs sleeping with multiple partners abdicating on thier obligations to their kids left and left, what other choice is there?


4 posted on 03/14/2008 7:20:58 AM PDT by yldstrk (My heros have always been cowboys--Reagan and Bush)
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To: raybbr
"There's a certain point where dad is in jail or has disappeared and mom is on crack ... where there isn't a stable grandmother, that child is being raised by the streets."

And creating a Public boarding school system where the taxpayers will pay for the full-time educating, feeding, clothing, housing and medical care of these children will a) solve the problem or b) expand the problem?

5 posted on 03/14/2008 7:21:22 AM PDT by robertpaulsen
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To: yldstrk
Good point, and my first thought when I read this.

If "dad is in jail or has disappeared and mom is on crack", these kids ARE orphans.

6 posted on 03/14/2008 7:23:39 AM PDT by robertpaulsen
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To: raybbr

We need to avoid a ‘knee-jerk’ reaction here. There are other things to consider.

First, it is probably true that the kids will be better educated by eliminating some of the dysfunctional aspects of their home lives.

Second, this is represents a profound and fundametal shift in thinking that the kids will do better if left at home. This argument is used to justify all sorts of welfare for the parents since cutting off welfare benefits would harm the children. That argument goes away.

Third, it takes away one of the principle defenses of the education community that they cannot be blamed for the lack of scholastic progress resulting from the dysfunctional families.

But, OTOH, I’m sure some will see this as a threat to the education of all children and not just those mentioned in the article.


7 posted on 03/14/2008 7:23:57 AM PDT by DugwayDuke (A true patriot will do anything to keep a Democrat out of the White House.)
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To: raybbr; eyespysomething

The state owns you and yours. Get used to it.

Nothing, including and especially your children, can be removed from the influence of the state.

The state owns your paycheck. The state owns your property. The state owns the food you buy at the grocery store. The state owns your car. The state owns your job. The state owns your health.

You’re just paying rent.


8 posted on 03/14/2008 7:25:55 AM PDT by SittinYonder (Ic ■Št gehate, ■Št ic heonon nelle fleon fotes trym, ac wille fur­or gan)
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To: raybbr

Pedophiles and pervert teachers having access to children in school sleepovers. Fabulous.


9 posted on 03/14/2008 7:27:23 AM PDT by Lizavetta
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To: raybbr

What’s next..Libensborn??


10 posted on 03/14/2008 7:29:09 AM PDT by Don Corleone (Leave the gun..take the cannoli)
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To: yldstrk
Actually, I know of conservative black families who send their kids to Ghana for high school or even junior high. Most of the schools there are run by religious orders. For about $1200, the family gets room, board and a decent education for their kid.

They also keep them away from the drug, hip-hop and gang-banger culture so prevalent in most U.S. urban public schools.

Throw in the cost of a round-trip air fare, and these parents are spending less than $2000 per year per kid. I suspect the Chicago Public Schools are spending ten times that amount for a defective product.

11 posted on 03/14/2008 7:29:29 AM PDT by Vigilanteman ((Are there any men left in Washington? Or are there only cowards? Ahmad Shah Massoud))
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To: DugwayDuke
We need to avoid a ‘knee-jerk’ reaction here.

Every government program grows by necessity. Already out there are those who believe that the state can do a better job of raising all children than can the parents.

This is a precursor to state-owned children farms where all children will be submitted by force of law.

Call it 'knee-jerk' if you like, but history has proved that there are no 'knee-jerk' reactions to new government programs ... there are just those who see the immediate implications and there are those who see the ultimate and logical conclusion.

12 posted on 03/14/2008 7:30:06 AM PDT by SittinYonder (Ic ■Št gehate, ■Št ic heonon nelle fleon fotes trym, ac wille fur­or gan)
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To: SittinYonder

“This is a precursor to state-owned children farms where all children will be submitted by force of law.”

The only way that could happen is after a complete and total abridgement of the Constitution. If that happens, these ‘farms’ might seem rather innoculous. After all, you’ll already be on another ‘educational farm’ especially tailored to your needs and you’ll be pre-occupied with other concerns rather than worrying about things like this.


13 posted on 03/14/2008 7:37:29 AM PDT by DugwayDuke (A true patriot will do anything to keep a Democrat out of the White House.)
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To: DugwayDuke

A complete and total abridgement of our Constitution is well-underway. Our Founding Fathers would be shocked at what we tolerate in our nation: gun control, income taxes, federal spending in almost every arena, judicial activism and on and on and on...


14 posted on 03/14/2008 7:44:14 AM PDT by Arkansas Toothpick
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To: raybbr

It may seem drastic and I suppose it could be abused, but this is the only way to break the cycle of poverty and ignorance in inner cities.


15 posted on 03/14/2008 7:52:33 AM PDT by BfloGuy (It is not from the benevolence of the butcher, the brewer, or the baker, that we can expect . . .)
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To: BfloGuy
It may seem drastic and I suppose it could be abused, but this is the only way to break the cycle of poverty and ignorance in inner cities.

Explain how puting children in the care of the state helps them out of poverty? I am at a loss to see it.

16 posted on 03/14/2008 7:54:21 AM PDT by raybbr (You think it's bad now - wait till the anchor babies start to vote!)
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To: DugwayDuke
All well reasoned responses. Just like the proposal they don't address the rood cause - lack of responsibility from the parental units. That must be addressed before any program can claim success in dealing with this issue.
17 posted on 03/14/2008 7:56:05 AM PDT by raybbr (You think it's bad now - wait till the anchor babies start to vote!)
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To: Arkansas Toothpick

“A complete and total abridgement of our Constitution is well-underway.”

You’ll feel much better about that when your new prescriptions kick in.


18 posted on 03/14/2008 7:56:15 AM PDT by DugwayDuke (A true patriot will do anything to keep a Democrat out of the White House.)
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To: raybbr

These boarding schools seem to be a way of adressing those root causes, ie, dysfunctional families. I’m just not sure that those proposing these schools fully grasp the implications on the welfare system, etc.

Back in the days of my youth, when Mommy was a drug addicted prostitute, she wasn’t given welfare. She was allowed to go her own way and her children became wards of the state in strictly run orphanages where they were clothed, fed, properly educated, and installed with a spirit of discipline. These boarding schools are nothing more than the state orphanage revisited.


19 posted on 03/14/2008 8:01:12 AM PDT by DugwayDuke (A true patriot will do anything to keep a Democrat out of the White House.)
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To: DugwayDuke
These boarding schools are nothing more than the state orphanage revisited.

The old orphanages were run by nuns or people that cared genuinely about the future of these children. Can that be said about any govt. social worker today?

The orphanages existed at a time when society looked at the deadbeat parents with a kernel of truth. Now, every excuse is made for them and the children seem to be allowed to manipulate and game the system due to fears of racism, bigotry and political correctness.

How would this school, run by the same people that brought us the failing school, fare any better.

How would it NOT end up looking like a mini prison with gangs and political correctness disallowing true discipline?

20 posted on 03/14/2008 8:08:53 AM PDT by raybbr (You think it's bad now - wait till the anchor babies start to vote!)
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To: Vigilanteman
Yep. Many schools in the Caribbean are the same way. You don't see any gangster looking kids loitering in front like you do here.

I don't know where this gang culture came from in the US.

21 posted on 03/14/2008 8:46:38 AM PDT by varyouga ("Rove is some mysterious God of politics & mind control" - DU 10-24-06)
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To: DugwayDuke
The only way that could happen is after a complete and total abridgement of the Constitution.

What do you think the tax code is?

22 posted on 03/14/2008 1:31:52 PM PDT by SittinYonder (Ic ■Št gehate, ■Št ic heonon nelle fleon fotes trym, ac wille fur­or gan)
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To: SittinYonder

If you think the US Tax Code is unConstitutional, feel free to refuse to pay your taxes. Let me know how that turns out.


23 posted on 03/14/2008 1:37:04 PM PDT by DugwayDuke (A true patriot will do anything to keep a Democrat out of the White House.)
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To: DugwayDuke

“The only way that could happen is after a complete and total abridgement of the Constitution. “

The compulsory school laws are unconstitutional.

There is NO provision for the education of children, that is unenumerated and therefore reverts back to the people. The feds and the states schooling laws are unconstitutional.

And just WHERE does that shadow come from that allows for abortion? Hmm? Killing babies is constitutional, really?


24 posted on 03/14/2008 1:45:33 PM PDT by TruthConquers (Delendae sunt publici scholae)
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To: metmom

The slippery slope moves on. Ping!


25 posted on 03/14/2008 1:46:33 PM PDT by TruthConquers (Delendae sunt publici scholae)
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To: Gabz; SoftballMominVA; abclily; aberaussie; albertp; AliVeritas; AnAmericanMother; andie74; ...

Public Education Ping

This list is for intellectual discussion of articles and issues related to public education (including charter schools) from the preschool to university level. Items more appropriately placed on the “Naughty Teacher” list, “Another reason to Homeschool” list, or of a general public-school-bashing nature will not be pinged.

If you would like to be on or off this list, please ping Amelia, Gabz, or SoftballMominVa

26 posted on 03/14/2008 6:36:22 PM PDT by Amelia (Cynicism ON)
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To: raybbr

Remind me again of who’s going to oversee this and protect all those kids from the sexual predators who are going to be applying for those jobs.


27 posted on 03/14/2008 7:00:39 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: raybbr

This will be just like JD. The meanest, toughest among them will rise to the top and terrorize the rest. It’ll be no different than being in jail.

Animal Farm.


28 posted on 03/14/2008 7:01:44 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: yldstrk

Exactly my thought, that these are just modern day orphanages.


29 posted on 03/14/2008 7:02:46 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: DugwayDuke

It IS unConstitutional, but that never let the IRS get in its way of collecting money.


30 posted on 03/14/2008 7:06:47 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: DaveLoneRanger; 2Jedismom; aberaussie; Aggie Mama; agrace; Antoninus; arbooz; bboop; bill1952; ...

FYI. This isn’t exactly a reason to homeschool so I’m not pinging the list in the typical way, but this is an interesting development concerning public schools that could have far reaching consequences. I thought it is something you all should be aware of.


31 posted on 03/14/2008 7:09:52 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: Aaron0617
Chicago FR just adding a little background. So far this school year 18 Chicago Public School students have been killed.


We have teen boys raping 14y/o girls who for some reason stray alone in parks at 12:30am
Teen held in sexual assault


Teens brutally killed an placed in garbage cans
Body Found In Trash Identified As 15-Year-Old

This is a little outside the box thinking.

32 posted on 03/14/2008 7:11:20 PM PDT by Aaron0617
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To: Gabz

Do you think this might be of interest to the Nanny State ping list?

Right now this concept is for kids with virtually no parents, and it sounds all benign and good, but the potential exists for all kinds of abuse of the system as the definition of inadequate parents expands.

What next? You don’t like how they discipline? Your religion isn’t approved of? Any other thing they can can get your kids on?


33 posted on 03/14/2008 7:13:20 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: metmom
Right now this concept is for kids with virtually no parents, and it sounds all benign and good, but the potential exists for all kinds of abuse of the system as the definition of inadequate parents expands.

I have often thought that we have two choices for inner city kids. 1) Accept poor performance because home is too chaotic or 2)Get those kids out of their homes.

I honestly never thought it would come to that. I assumed more and more interventions would be offered to families and we would continue generation after generation to accept failure.

Is this closer to the "old days", before we did everything we could to keep families together? Foster care and group homes are notorious for bullies and uncaring adults.

I think I'd rather accept failure. The idea of this gives me a sick feeling in my stomach.

34 posted on 03/14/2008 7:30:44 PM PDT by Dianna
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To: Aaron0617; metmom
I agree that the potential for abuse is there, but I also agree with Aaron that for some of these students, it can't get a lot worse.

The United States in general, and American education in particular, seems to have a history of pendulum swings---we never seem able to stop at a "happy medium" or realize that the optimum lies somewhere in between the two extremes.

This might be, as some posters have pointed out, a swing back toward orphanages.

35 posted on 03/14/2008 7:36:18 PM PDT by Amelia (Cynicism ON)
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To: Amelia
I agree that the potential for abuse is there, but I also agree with Aaron that for some of these students, it can't get a lot worse.

I'm with you on that. I've seen welfare cases that aren't as bad as what they're talking about, and I think even THOSE kids would have been better off in an orphanage.

It's the long range potential for abuse of the system that concerns me. Right now, saving kids from crack addict parents is not a bad reason. Saving them from Christian parents because the though police don't like what they're being taught, that scares me. This sort of thing happened in the Soviet Union. It's not out of the realm of possibility.

36 posted on 03/14/2008 7:43:16 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: metmom

This is a tough call. If the home is so dysfunctional, there could be a case for this. But the potential for abuse is there, too.

For those in their teens in that situation, maybe enrollment in a vocational school would be a better idea.


37 posted on 03/14/2008 8:16:25 PM PDT by Clintonfatigued (Those in the national Republican leaderhip do the work of three men- Moe, Larry, and Curly.)
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To: raybbr

Can anyone here spell *t*e*a*c*h*e*r***s*e*x***a*b*u*s*e*?

Government boarding schools? Sounds to me like a pedophile and homosexual “Magnet” School!


38 posted on 03/14/2008 8:28:40 PM PDT by wintertime (Good ideas win! Why? Because people are not stupid.)
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To: DugwayDuke; raybbr

I’m not a fan of Newt Gingrich, but remember when he was ridiculed for his idea of orphanages in the 1990’s? I’ve always believed orphanages were a better option than the foster care system where orphans are divided up and shifted from family to family.

However, Gingrich was pushing for a return to privately-run orphanages (I believe). Hillary Clinton had the idea of government-run boarding schools. Two very different ideas.

DugwayDuke’s argument is a good one. Here’s the problem: This orphanage would be government-operated, like Clinton’s idea. That means:

(1) The government would be policing itself. Expect coverups.

(2) The state could end up inventing more and more reasons to place more and more children into orphanages.

I’d rather orphanages were run privately with the state acting as watchdog. So, I hope they instead decide to create incentives for private charities or churches to open “boarding schools for low-income students” where needed. Parents should not be required to send their children to them; rather, they’d have the option to place their children into these schools willingly. And, most importantly, parents/guardians should be granted access to their children at all times and be permitted to remove them immediately without notice.


39 posted on 03/14/2008 9:04:39 PM PDT by Tired of Taxes (Dad, I will always think of you.)
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To: robertpaulsen

My same thought - it’s basically a state-run orphanage. Not necessarily a new concept, and it is needed for SOME few children; but the idea of the state as “foster parent” is chilling on so many levels...

My greatest fear would be that parents simply abandon their children on the doorstep of the school - or that other families may have their children unwillingly forced into these 24-7 institutions by the state.

It would be far better for abandoned children to be in loving families, rather than warehoused in orphanages. But there are so few families who are fostering nowadays, thanks to red tape and regulations. How very sad that this is even being considered... and how frightening for those who fear losing even more parental rights!


40 posted on 03/15/2008 1:12:39 AM PDT by dandelion
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To: DugwayDuke
How many drugs does it take to make you feel good about it? And why would you want to feel good about losing your Constitutional rights?
41 posted on 03/15/2008 1:42:05 AM PDT by LilAngel (FReeping on a cell phone is like making Christmas dinner in an Easy Bake Oven)
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To: dandelion; Tired of Taxes; Clintonfatigued; raybbr
It would be far better for abandoned children to be in loving families, rather than warehoused in orphanages. But there are so few families who are fostering nowadays, thanks to red tape and regulations. How very sad that this is even being considered... and how frightening for those who fear losing even more parental rights!

My mother's cousins were raised at The Bethesda Home for Boys because their father died when they were young and their mother was unable to provide for them and didn't want them on the streets. They turned into fine, upstanding citizens and held good jobs in their communities as adults.

There's the potential for abuse in any situation. Some children are abused and killed by parents and stepparents. Other children are abused and killed in foster care.

I don't know that broad-brush characterizations are helpful, and there are certainly some children I've seen that I thought would be better off in different situations -- but as others have pointed out, exactly who gets to make that determination?

42 posted on 03/15/2008 7:15:02 AM PDT by Amelia (Cynicism ON)
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To: raybbr

“boarding schools are virtually unheard of for the disadvantaged.”
Incorrect the DAR has provided schools, both day and boarding, for underprivaledged since the early days of the 20th century. Good citizenship and love of country are foundations of a DAR school. Maybe the Chicago school board should look at the DAR model.

From the DAR website...
Since 1903, the Society has been helping children in remote mountain areas receive an education. The DAR supports two schools in the Appalachian region- Kate Duncan Smith DAR School, Alabama, and Tamassee DAR School, South Carolina.

Kate Duncan Smith (KDS), founded on Gunter Mountain by the Alabama DAR in 1924, is a day school, kindergarten through 12th grade, serving an area of 100 square miles. Enrollment averages 1,300 students yearly. Special emphasis is placed on responsible citizen-ship, academic achievement, and horticultural and computer skills. Preparation for college and vocational training are important parts of the curriculum.

Tamassee, founded by South Carolina DAR in 1919, gives deserving boys and girls a home, a school, and a chance in life. A faith in God and the principles of citizenship and patriotism remain the foundation of the school. Grades kindergarten through 5th are on campus.Studies are continued at Tamassee-Salem High School for grades 6-12. There are approximately 45 boarding students and 450 day students. A pre-school center for children fills a community need. Both schools are accredited by the Southern Association of Colleges and Schools.

The following schools are on the Approved Schools list:

Berry College, Georgia was founded in 1902 to provide high school education to rural youth and became the first approved DAR school in 1904. It was developed into a college in 1926, and today, it is one of the outstanding comprehensive colleges in the South, with fully accredited art, science and professional programs as well as specialized graduate programs in education and business administration.

Crossnore School, Inc., North Carolina was founded in the early 1900s to give the children from the mountains and foothills of North Carolina a home while attending public schools in Avery County. The school also provides day care services for local children.

Hillside School, Inc., Massachusetts was founded in 1901 as a rural home for boys who were orphaned or otherwise without a home or family. It now provides a structural and supportive environment for students with learning problems. Its program stresses reading, writing, math, science, literature, social studies, fine arts, and industrial arts.

Hindman Settlement School, Kentucky was founded in 1902 to provide an educational opportunity for the youth of the mountains. Its major educational emphasis today is its work with students with dyslexic characteristics. This is the only program of its type within 200 miles.It also offers an Adult Basic Education/GED Program.

Each of these schools is given financial assistance by DAR members, including scholarships, material donations, and genuine personal interest. Over $1 million is given annually by the DAR to support these schools.

The DAR, through its American Indians Committee, assists in the education of Indian youth through scholarships and support of Bacone College, Muskogee, Oklahoma, the oldest continuing institution of higher learning in Oklahoma, and Chemawa Indian School in Salem, Oregon.

Good citizenship and love of country are taught at all of these schools.


43 posted on 03/15/2008 8:21:16 AM PDT by kalee (The offenses we give, we write in the dust; Those we take, we write in marble. JHuett)
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