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Big Wind from Texas
FastCompany ^ | 7/14/08 | Kermit Pattison

Posted on 07/14/2008 3:18:25 PM PDT by twntaipan

Quick! What state symbolizes the old petroleum economy? Texas, of course. Now, what state leads the way towards a future of clean, renewable wind energy? Texas again! By early 2008, Texas had installed more than 5,300 megawatts of wind production -- more than twice second place state California -- and had another 2,000 megawatts under production. Why in the name of Sam Houston is the state of Spindletop messing with wind?

(Excerpt) Read more at fastcompany.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; News/Current Events; US: Texas
KEYWORDS: alternative; banglist; energy; texas; wind
Excellent interview with Jerry Patterson, Commissioner of the Texas General Land Office. Manages to poke Teddy Kennedy and the tree-huggers right in the eye!
1 posted on 07/14/2008 3:18:25 PM PDT by twntaipan
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To: twntaipan

Why in the name of Sam Houston is the state of Spindletop messing with wind?
__________________________________________________________

We’ve harnessed the power of politics... ;^)


2 posted on 07/14/2008 3:20:19 PM PDT by El Laton Caliente (NRA Member & www.Gunsnet.net Moderator)
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To: twntaipan
From the article:

Q: Do the bird people appreciate your sense of humor?

A: I talked the Audubon Society and told them, "Don't worry about this, after several generations we'll have smarter birds." They did not think that was funny. The other thing I told them was wind farms in the Gulf of Mexico would be the first line of defense against avian flu. These people have no sense of humor. You can't break the ice with them.

3 posted on 07/14/2008 3:23:31 PM PDT by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: twntaipan

-—interesting shot of him with what Washington, D.C. Mayor would probably call an “automatic assault revolving pistol”—pinged banglist—


4 posted on 07/14/2008 3:25:52 PM PDT by rellimpank (--don't believe anything the MSM tells you about firearms or explosives--NRA Benefactor)
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To: twntaipan

Yeah and I think we put all of them on I10, east of El Paso.


5 posted on 07/14/2008 3:25:54 PM PDT by CindyDawg
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To: DuncanWaring
"The early technology turbine blades that turned faster, at Altamont Pass, killed a lot of birds. And we have a different attitude here. People here are concerned about bird kills because they want to shoot the birds, not have them have them killed in a turbine."
6 posted on 07/14/2008 3:28:26 PM PDT by TheDon
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To: CindyDawg

They are a site to see out there (not much else to see actually). My nephew said he saw one north of San Antonio the other day—off of 281.


7 posted on 07/14/2008 3:30:19 PM PDT by twntaipan (NOBAMA! Say No to B.O.!)
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To: TheDon

Patterson’s irreverence toward political correctness was refreshing.


8 posted on 07/14/2008 3:31:23 PM PDT by twntaipan (NOBAMA! Say No to B.O.!)
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To: twntaipan
Funny guy. He has to be a freeper. Can yall imagine the energy these things could produce from a hurricane ...as a Friend pointed out though...as long as they don't come flying in’)
9 posted on 07/14/2008 3:33:27 PM PDT by CindyDawg
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To: twntaipan

My imagination can kick into hyper drive and I can visualize Indians on the mesas and wagons along the canyons. These wing mills are spooky. They look like from a distance something waving it’s arms’)


10 posted on 07/14/2008 3:37:29 PM PDT by CindyDawg
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To: DuncanWaring

Here’s another great line from him...

“People here are concerned about bird kills because they want to shoot the birds, not have them killed in a turbine.”

Anyway to get him to run for president?


11 posted on 07/14/2008 3:38:20 PM PDT by aquila48
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To: twntaipan
not much else to see actually...

Not hardly, you have to go farther west towards El Paso where you'll see mesa tops covered in the damned turbines. PC power is not the answer, DRILL HERE, DRILL NOW is the only way to boost supplies and send our enemy a message of self-reliance and a threat to vaporize them if need be.

What is funny, as the post points out, is the birds whacked by the rotors and don't kid yourself, there are lots of them. There are some good reliable studies done on numbers, they tried hiding that at first but truth always surfaces.

Nevertheless, I couldn't care less, seems the enviros pick and choose their standards with the shifting winds (pun intended), they'll gleefully send someone to jail for killing some protected bird but their precious wind generators can whack them by the thousands (cumulatively speaking) and nary a word. Amazing.

No oil field of any size has killed more wildlife than these monsters. I used to patrol those oil patches for that very thing from the 70s through the 80s in S. Texas. The Drillers were some darn decent, hard working folks, I'm for giving them more work! Whiners move aside!

12 posted on 07/14/2008 3:42:26 PM PDT by brushcop (We remember SSG Harrison Brown, PVT Andrew Simmons B CO 2/69 3ID KIA Iraq OIF IV)
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To: twntaipan
Here's some more info on wind turbines.
13 posted on 07/14/2008 3:43:33 PM PDT by rabidralph (Dems now have Oil Derangement Syndrome)
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To: brushcop
Maybe if we decorated them...red, white and blue with a lone star on the biggest...blue bells...armadillos...jalapenos....on the others. We could charge tourists to drive through our petrified forest :’)
14 posted on 07/14/2008 3:50:41 PM PDT by CindyDawg
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To: DuncanWaring
We rarely hear of the downsides to so-called "clean" energy. If you or I shot a bald eagle we would serve hard time in state prison. When a 100' windmill kills one . . .
15 posted on 07/14/2008 3:51:15 PM PDT by Jacquerie (Any conservative who sits out the election will be an accomplice to the criminal Obama regime.)
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To: brushcop

well can’t we do both? The thing about the birds...I hear you...it isn’t right. We should have someone out there picking them up and putting them on ice. It’s shameful to waste food.


16 posted on 07/14/2008 3:52:16 PM PDT by CindyDawg
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To: Jacquerie
Seriously...we figured out how to reduce them from being electrocuted. There should be a way to get them to fly around or higher. The same people that gripe about the birds would probably gripe about the view but if we colored them so birds could see them, maybe that would help.
17 posted on 07/14/2008 3:55:41 PM PDT by CindyDawg
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To: twntaipan

One big problems looms with wind-energy here in Texas: No way to get the power from the turbines to the grid. If I understand correctly, it will cost 8 billion to build infrastructure to handle wind energy to grid. Taxpayers will foot the bill.


18 posted on 07/14/2008 3:59:22 PM PDT by devane617 (we are so screwed)
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To: twntaipan
Must read!

From the article:
You were the author of the Texas concealed handgun legislation. Is it true you carry a gun in your cowboy boot?
Yes.
Does that help break the ice with the Audubon people?
I guess as long as I don't have it loaded with birdshot they're ok with it.

19 posted on 07/14/2008 4:16:37 PM PDT by smokingfrog
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To: devane617
One big problems looms with wind-energy here in Texas: No way to get the power from the turbines to the grid. If I understand correctly, it will cost 8 billion to build infrastructure to handle wind energy to grid. Taxpayers will foot the bill.

I have seen estimates of 3 to 9 billion. The proponents bury the details of transmission capacity and reliability. Wind power has major problems for power generation on hot summer afternoons in Texas, precisely when the power is needed. Without subsidies and mandates, I doubt that this amount of wind power would be built. There will be a need for large amounts of gas turbines as backups. With the high price of natural gas, electric rates in Texas will substantially increase.

20 posted on 07/14/2008 4:23:27 PM PDT by businessprofessor
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To: CindyDawg
"There should be a way to get them to fly around or higher.

A cheap and technology easy way is to surround the blades, like a standing room fan, with a wire cage clamshell...

Whoops! Maybe I should have patented that idea before I posted this!

21 posted on 07/14/2008 4:27:33 PM PDT by JDoutrider (Obama= Not Hope & Change! He brings Hype & Chains!)
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To: All

Or, if people could afford, purchase their own wind turbine and get their own power. Of course they’ll probably still need to be on the grid, especially on days where the air is still.

But, a lower electric bill is probably tempting to plenty of people.

(Don’t hold your breath waiting for Al Gore or John Edwards to install these on their land)


22 posted on 07/14/2008 4:31:52 PM PDT by wastedyears (Show me your precious darlings, and I will crush them all)
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To: businessprofessor
"With the high price of natural gas, electric rates in Texas will substantially increase."

WOW ! Any Texans or Oklahomans have any interest in Nat Gas Professor???? /sarc

In the interest of disclosure, chk and ep holder here...

23 posted on 07/14/2008 4:36:46 PM PDT by litehaus (A memory tooooo long)
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To: litehaus
WOW ! Any Texans or Oklahomans have any interest in Nat Gas Professor???? /sarc In the interest of disclosure, chk and ep holder here...

Can you explain your comments? Who is a Natural Gas Professor? What is an chk and ep holder?

I am not sure if your are disputing my assertion that large windfarms require substantial power backup, typically gas turbines. Gas turbines are not very efficient compared to other electrical energy generation options. The high cost of natural gas makes gas turbines even less attractive.

24 posted on 07/14/2008 4:57:16 PM PDT by businessprofessor
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To: JDoutrider

The enviromemtalist would love that:’)


25 posted on 07/14/2008 4:57:56 PM PDT by CindyDawg
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To: wastedyears
It's not that far out there. If individuals had wind mills they wouldn't need them so large. It would free up a lot of gas for the military and transport. If we could figure out how to get them connected they could even charge the car batteries. Place then where the antenna used to go before digital.
26 posted on 07/14/2008 5:02:50 PM PDT by CindyDawg
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To: businessprofessor

I tend to agree with you. T Boone Pickens is making a big splash, and burying the devilish details. His promos on TV are down-right convincing. The sad part is, he has the money to run a propaganda campaign, while the opposition flounders. Oh, and by the way, T Boone stands to make BILLIONS from his wind farms.


27 posted on 07/14/2008 5:03:15 PM PDT by devane617 (we are so screwed)
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To: litehaus

what did you try to say?


28 posted on 07/14/2008 5:05:23 PM PDT by devane617 (we are so screwed)
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To: businessprofessor
Without subsidies and mandates, I doubt that this amount of wind power would be built.

Which would also explain why billionaire TBone Pickens is running ads on conservative talk radio warning against our dependence on oil and advocating wind and solar power.........

Yo, Tbone, how much you got invested in this crap and how much do you expect to profit from the govt. in subsidies if your commercials are successful?

The man didn't become a billionaire because of stupidity..........

Wow, his commercial just aired on FOX again as I am typing.......

29 posted on 07/14/2008 5:13:20 PM PDT by Hot Tabasco
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To: businessprofessor

It already has. I pay $.16/KWH now in our “hearalded” de-regulated state.


30 posted on 07/14/2008 5:13:57 PM PDT by biff
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To: CindyDawg
It’s shameful to waste food.

LOL!! Well sure, we can have supplimentary power, but let's quit the stupidity of fining and jailing Joe Sixpack for killing a protected species and then turn our heads to thousands being whacked by PC methods. Let's build nuclear. My God, we've had nuclear warships for decades, our sailors work on them day in and day out, they're NOT dropping dead of cancer by the shipload, so what's the problem??

The lie that we're also told is that wind generators have a "small footprint". BS! stick several hundred on a mesa connected by service/maintenance roads, power grid hookups and that takes up a huge area, but that's okay, it's just "ugly" desert anyway, who cares? I have an idea, let's put them offshore Mass.

But gee, then again, we've created another industry (wind turbines), the plastics folks are making a ton manufacturing the machine, LOTS of plastics, hmmmmmm, bring to mind something?? Why yes, BIG OIL products.

The problem is the Gaia worshippers, that's what and why? Why have we rolled over to these "environmentalists"? Environmentalist my a**! An environmentalist for the most part are little old ladies in tennis shoes, burnt out hippies and fellow travelers that subscribe to the Sierra Club, National Wildlife Federation, Green Peace and their ilk. Dig deep enough (and not so deep) and you'll find that their innards are very red.

The REAL environmentalists are rancher and farmers of this nation, that's who the real ones are and thank God for them, for their willingness to just keep plugging through the fog producing life-saving food products. But you see my point. First of all, DRILL HERE, DRILL NOW! Build nuclear, heck, let's do things that have a mega-return not only in real energy but in PSYCHOLOGICAL power too, to our enemy.

31 posted on 07/14/2008 6:29:44 PM PDT by brushcop (We remember SSG Harrison Brown, PVT Andrew Simmons B CO 2/69 3ID KIA Iraq OIF IV)
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To: brushcop

Yeah...whatever makes “juice” We have seen what can happen when we put all our eggs in one basket. As for as the “not my back yard “folks...I got cyber slapped hard the other night when I suggested states keep their own oil. If Teds people don’t want to be part of the solution then I don’t believe we should have to clutter our landscape for energy for them. The little Red Hen policy.


32 posted on 07/14/2008 6:44:15 PM PDT by CindyDawg
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To: CindyDawg

Now I like that retort CindyDawg, makes sense to me. I don’t see any problem a’tall about keepin’ our own stuff! Must be some thin skinned folks around...


33 posted on 07/14/2008 7:00:19 PM PDT by brushcop (We remember SSG Harrison Brown, PVT Andrew Simmons B CO 2/69 3ID KIA Iraq OIF IV)
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To: businessprofessor
Gas turbines are not very efficient compared to other electrical energy generation options.

Actually, combined cycle gas turbine/steam generator plants (the exhaust from the turbine is used to operate a boiler for a steam turbine generator) are very efficient, but with today's natural gas prices, they are still several times more expensive to operate than a typical coal-fired generating unit despite greater efficiency.

34 posted on 07/14/2008 7:05:23 PM PDT by meyer (Government is the problem, not the solution.)
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To: Hot Tabasco
Which would also explain why billionaire TBone Pickens is running ads on conservative talk radio warning against our dependence on oil and advocating wind and solar power.........

Just a guess here, but I'd bet TBone's portfolio is heavy on wind generation investments, and very light on coal investments.

Myself, I'm about ready to start looking for a coal-burning stove for winter heat. Now that the environazis have made burning coal unfashionable in the electric utility industry (even though it still provides the majority of our nation's electricity), I want to burn my own. Just to tick them off.

35 posted on 07/14/2008 7:09:41 PM PDT by meyer (Government is the problem, not the solution.)
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To: CindyDawg
Place then where the antenna used to go before digital.

On top of the television set? :-)

Actually, I still have a set of "rabbit ears" - makes a great FM antenna.

36 posted on 07/14/2008 7:12:21 PM PDT by meyer (Government is the problem, not the solution.)
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To: meyer
I remember those. My dad used to wrap then in foil and make my sister and I hold them while...I think it was Bonanza...was on. I meant the antenna pole on the side of the house though’)
37 posted on 07/14/2008 7:22:24 PM PDT by CindyDawg
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To: CindyDawg
I figured you'd meant the antenna pole. I grew up in the city so we didn't need a huge antenna (unless we wanted to pick up the Browns home games from Toledo). We had the rabbit ears on top of the set, and I still use a set for my FM reception. Nothing elaborate - just the simple ones without the dials, knobs, and all that.

I can picture your Dad watching Bonanza while you and your sister hold the antenna. "A little to the left, CindyDawg - Hoss is a little blurry". The foil likely didn't help any.

38 posted on 07/14/2008 7:31:46 PM PDT by meyer (Government is the problem, not the solution.)
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To: meyer
So my gasoline powered SUV is going to magically run on wind power now! sweete /s off.

seriously using wind power to split water into hydrogen would be cool but even at the cheapest one could buy bulk wind power at 5 cents a kwh it takes 65 kwhs to make and compress a kg or h2 gas. So 5 times 65 is $3.25 just in electricity to make the h2 and compress it. transportation, marketing, retail mark up, you get the picture. The only hydrogen that makes economic sence is nuclear hydrogen buss bar rates for nuclear power can be as cheap as 1.5 cents a kwh off peak. Thats only 97 cents in electricty to get a kg of hydrogen. On a side note one Kg of H2 is equal on a BTU to BTU basis for gasoline.

http://www.evnut.com/docs/acp_fc_pollution.pdf page 5 for the KWh per Kg ref. This PDF makes a strong point for plug in hybrids though. even at retail rates of .13c a kwh a plug in with 10 kwh of bat storage which gives a 40 mile range would eliminate 50+% of all gasoline miles driven in this country. look up the NHTSB figures for average daily commutes full on 50% are less than 40 miles per day. Think about a buck thirty for your daily commute instead of $8 =( 40 miles / 19.5 MPG in my SUV * $3.90 per gallon E10 here in the Big D.) the plug in is 8 times cheaper per mile than my gasoline suv i know i know im not counting depreciation of the 10 kwh bat pack. Well Altair Nanotechnologies has large format lithium packs that can go 15000 100% DOD cycles and still hold 80% of there capacity. 15000 times 40 miles is 600000 miles so these lithium packs would be lifetime packs for a plug in EV. Phoenix motors is using them for there SUV electric vehicle they are going to put a bumper to bumper 15year-150k warrantee.

39 posted on 07/17/2008 9:30:44 PM PDT by JDinAustin (Austinite in the Big D)
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To: twntaipan

Patterson is a great example of a public servant!


40 posted on 07/17/2008 9:35:59 PM PDT by Southack (Media Bias means that Castro won't be punished for Cuban war crimes against Black Angolans in Africa)
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To: twntaipan

Want it to fly?

All it takes is 100K sent to RINO Rick, your good to go.


41 posted on 07/20/2008 4:35:23 PM PDT by hadaclueonce (shoot low, they are riding Shetlands..)
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