Skip to comments.Children Stealing Gold in Beijing
Posted on 08/17/2008 10:11:47 AM PDT by AJKauf
Chinese coaches tried to hide the ages of the girls with enough makeup to shame a drag queen, but no amount of lipstick and eyeliner can hide the fact that the American gymnasts have curves and breasts and the Chinese ones dont. On average, the girls on the Chinese team are 3.5 inches shorter and 30 pounds lighter than their American counterparts....
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I thought it was T.O.
I’m not sure how that condition affects muscle growth, so I don’t know if it would be beneficial or not.
Would it affect teeth? I don’t know.
But we also have the issue where the Chinese themselves have reported their ages in old articles as being younger than they reported for the olympics.
We also have the issue of the first chinese floor routine.
That was not the performance of a 16 yr. old who had years of dance training.
you are not talking to an idiot, I was a gymnastics judge.
It doesn’t matter what country you are talking about - that was a PITIFUL routine performed by a CHILD who had very little dance training.
Judges are supposed to deduct EVERY TIME a gymnast WALKS around the floor.
She did it repeatedly.
Gymnasts at the very beginning level of gymnastics do not make that mistake.
That this was supposed to be an olympic level performance is laughable.
“Our concepts of grace and dance just didnt exist there.”
You are full of it.
I have seen many beautiful chinese floor routines.
No point in blaming the babes, they have no choice.
China has long been guilty of stealing the innovations, the patents, the creations of others’.
No one should be surprised that they were incapable of hiding their low character.
I think we are actually agreeing on the subject. Our girls, even underdeveloped, look older than the Chinese girls. They might be, but I hesitate to say for sure the Chinese cheated because Asians tend to be smaller and most times look younger. I did notice that the Chinese girls looked more childish in their facial features than our girls did. The Chinese girls did not look like teenagers. The only sure way to know would be to test them and that’s not going to happen.
Are people still wasting time arguing about the age issue?
We already know the age cannot be verified by looks alone. Personally, pratically all the gymnasts look under-nurished and much younger than a typical 16-year-old or whatever their stated age.
What is needed is a system that can correctly verify the age of all the gymnasts or get rid of the age requirement.
“It doesnt matter what country you are talking about - that was a PITIFUL routine performed by a CHILD who had very little dance training.”
That just shows that she had very little dance training.
“Gymnasts at the very beginning level of gymnastics do not make that mistake.”
Then this would not distinguish between a Chinese 13-year-old and a Chinese 16-year-old, as it is certain that neither would be a novice. Most likely she was not trained in this because this was not part of her training, which in some cases is probably skewed in ways that are not typical of American/European practice.
“You are full of it.
I have seen many beautiful chinese floor routines.”
And I am sure you have also seen many beautiful floor routines by girls who are underage for Olympic competition. Having a lousy routine doesn’t seem to imply age.
I have seen plenty of traditional Chinese dance, and it has little relation to the rather athletic and physical activity that we are used to, either as a social practice or a performing art.
Understood. I was just hijacking your post since you mentioned the training undies.
But in response to what you meant, there’s not going to be any protest because three days after the closing ceremonies nobody will be able to *find* any of these girls unless the Chinese want to produce them. Unless they actually fingerprint and DNA test them during the competition nobody’s going to know who or what.
One girl, during an interview said when she has downtime she still goes to the gym and “plays” with her friends.
do you know teenagers who describe how they “play”?
As I understand it (and, not being a Mandarin speaker, I probably have it wrong) that could be just a linguistic difference between Mandarin and English. Adult Chinese refer to hangin' out with their friends as "playing".
” but I hesitate to say for sure the Chinese cheated because Asians tend to be smaller and most times look younger.”
“Then this would not distinguish between a Chinese 13-year-old and a Chinese 16-year-old, as it is certain that neither would be a novice.”
Who said she was 13?
She didn’t even look 12.
She didn’t even look 11.
Oh - that’s right.
She must be a “freak of nature” who wasn’t properly trained in dance.
“That just shows that she had very little dance training.”
The only way you are going to manage to make it to the olympics on floor with “very little dance training” in China would be due to your young age.
What are you saying?
That the chinese FAILED to properly train a 16 year old gymnast properly in dance even though they planned on sticking her out there on floor?
“Most likely she was not trained in this because this was not part of her training, which in some cases is probably skewed in ways that are not typical of American/European practice.”
not part of her training?
Are you serious?
” Having a lousy routine doesnt seem to imply age.”
When you are talking about the olympics from a dominating gymnastics program - yes that’s exactly what this implies.
I find it almost insulting to the chinese that you are suggesting they don’t know how to properly train a 16 yr. old floor competitor.
You are saying they don’t even know enough to say the alleged 16 yr. old “hey - quit taking those walking steps!”
that they surely would have read about in their rules manuals detailing execution deductions.
“And I am sure you have also seen many beautiful floor routines by girls who are underage for Olympic competition. Having a lousy routine doesnt seem to imply age.”
Sure - but that isn’t the point I was addressing.
You are making the ridiculous claim that the chinese don’t have the concept of grace and beauty that westerners do.
This is an insult to the chinese.
They have managed perfectly well in the past to put up beautiful, artistic, and (dare-I-say?) MATURE floor routines in the past.
When exactly did they forget about this concept of grace I wonder?
“I have seen plenty of traditional Chinese dance, and it has little relation to the rather athletic and physical activity that we are used to, either as a social practice or a performing art.”
The last chinese floor routine contained dance based on chinese culture.
She did a very good job.
I am going to assume traditional chinese dance does not involve plodding around on flat feet, with the arms hanging while staring at the floor?
I don’t know how I messed the format up when I put that picture in. It didn’t look like that when I previewed it. Sorry
It doesn’t affect muscles or teeth as far as adversely. From what I have read and what the doctors have told me, there is nothing bad about it but short stature and probably delayed puberty and delayed adult teeth. And that is only from the body thinking it’s younger. But delayed puberty is a good thing because the longer she goes without puberty, the taller she will grow.
They did a bone age scan and her bones “think” she is right at 4 years old. It’s the same condition as Tom Thumb and he didn’t have any troubles except being obese for his height later in life. And that can happen no matter what your height.
They have offered her to have human growth hormone therapy, but her dad and I declined. There seems to be lots of risks involved with that and it’s also painful muscles injections daily.
We have just accepted her as a little person and love her as she is. It wasn’t until this year that we even thought of it benefiting her in anything, but we aren’t ready to push for Olympics, haha. She just takes gymnastics in a local class with girls her age. When reading about this, I wouldn’t put it past them to either cheat and claim a higher age for their gymnasts, or that they have chemically altered the pituatary gland to delay growth.
no one is responding to the tooth issue here. That would seem to be the most obvious no-brainer, and detractors of the under-age suspicion are ignoring it.
Perhaps you are not away of the changes made to the code of points in the last few years.
Due to the structuring of scoring and the way technical difficulty points are awarded, gymnasts are packing in as many tumbling passes as possible into a routine to increase "A" scores, leaving very little time for non-technical artistic elements which do not contribute to the score. There is very little artistry in either Johnson's or Izbasa's floor routines. Complain about the lack of dance all you want, but everyone is guilty of it and it is because of the way the scoring no works.
Second, American judges routinely overscore everyone at U.S. nationals because quite frankly, they aren't very critical. They consistently overlook minor errors such as cowboyed legs or failure to make a complete turn in the popa 1/2 or switch 1/2 or the tour jette full that the international judges will deduct on.
China has disgraced itself. This and the cheating judges in the women’s gymnastics Sunday, denying Alicia Sacramone her bronze medal. The gentlest thing I can say about it is China makes me puke.
“Perhaps you are not away of the changes made to the code of points in the last few years.”
I am more than aware of the changes.
A balance check is still a balance check.
A fall is still a fall.
A broken connection is still a broken connection.
And with the new code - the old deductions are greater than they were in the past.
I am not complaining about “lack of dance”
I am complaining about WALKING AROUND when every walking step is a deduction even at the beginner levels.
Drooping arms, sloppy jumps, head down, eyes on the floor.
“no one is responding to the tooth issue here.”
So I’ve noticed.
“Second, American judges routinely overscore everyone at U.S. nationals because quite frankly, they aren’t very critical. They consistently overlook minor errors such as cowboyed legs or failure to make a complete turn in the popa 1/2 or switch 1/2 or the tour jette full that the international judges will deduct on.”
It is not an issue of whether scores or too high or too low, it is an issue whether or not scores are consistent.
The execution deductions are not consistent.
And now tonight it happens again - the chinese vault was low, she piked it down into the ground and then landed on her hands and knees.
The execution deductions did not reflect those mistakes.
As I write - beam has not happened yet.
Let’s see if the judges remember from one routine to the next what a balance check is and what a broken connection is.
That photo is from the June 2008 Vogue Teen shoot, making it 3-4 months old...
I await your apology for your mistake and your accusation.
They may be young but they have out preformed the US gymnastics team.
We could kick but with our tiny girls!
Yes, and as I’ve posted MANY TIMES in this thread, I do not dispute that. What I DO object to is how this thread started, that you can tell their age by their looks. Simply put, that’s flat out wrong.
Other information shows their ages to be too young; go after them for that. But to make comments about “well they look so young!” is bogus and ignoring reality, and very disappointing.
I thought conservatives would look at the facts and the content, not the shininess of the package. Apparently many FReepers will make a decision based strictly on looks and stick to it as long as possible...
HA!!!!! FReepers making decisions based on looks alone... seen any guilty/not guilty threads. Drives me nuts, :-).
But, I do agree with some of the comments regarding the young ladies teeth. They do appear to still be “baby” teeth, much smaller than what a 16 yo should have.
Nice try troll, nowhere does it claim that photo was taken that date, or any date. Go find one of her in diapers, why don’t you? If it is in a recent article, you are all set!
I asked a couple local Chinese that saw the Olympics what they thought about the girls’ ages. None of them thought the girls were 16.
This idea that Americans only think these girls are under 16 because they can’t judge the face of Asians is pure drivel, no Chinese honestly think they’re 16 either.
China is hold to the premise of Most Gold medals means superpower status.
China PAID the IOC fair and square.
Just like japan bought nagano games.
Just like salt lake was rife with bribes.
Your ignorance has shown to be complete. Apparently you can’t click a link and look at the reference on the photo itself to confirm it was taken for that article (June 2008).
Speaks volumes of your intellectual and moral capacity...
Piss off twit, do what I said and go post a current shot side by side.............otherwise you are full of caca.
Others were right, you are just a troll for the chicoms..........
Says the man who simply cannot accept the fact he has been proven wrong. I guess you do not understand how the Internet works, or how to follow links. So here are a few photos for your education:
Shawn Johnson at the JUNE 2008 Teen Vogue Photo Shoot
Shawn Johnson at the 2008 Nationals
Shawn Johnson at the 2008 Olympic Trials
Shawn Johnson - on the left end - with the US National Gymnastics team
All of these - and many more - can be found at Shawn Johnson's official website.
So you still going to claim I made the photo up? Are you that small and insecure of a person that you cannot admit a factual, well-proven error in judgment?
I thought FReepers were a higher class of people... Pride before the fall, I surmise!
their center(s) of gravity change as they get into puberty, so it throws off all the routines .. there was a lot of discussion about that with Michelle Kwan/Tara Lipinski and its affect on figure skating, similar to gymnastics.