Skip to comments.State science standards in election spotlight (ID/Creation Kansans need to vote!)
Posted on 08/18/2008 9:35:10 AM PDT by GodGunsGuts
With five seats on the State Board of Education up for grabs this year, education advocates say how children learn about evolution hangs in the balance -- and who voters choose could affect Kansas' national reputation.
A frequent flip-flop between moderate and conservative majorities on the 10-member board has resulted in the state changing its science standards four times in the past eight years.
Conservatives have pushed for standards casting doubt on evolution, and moderates have said intelligent design does not belong in the science classroom.
In 2007, a new 6-4 moderate majority removed standards that called evolution into question.
This year, none of the three moderates whose seats are up for election are running again. Only one of the two conservative incumbents is running for re-election...
(Excerpt) Read more at kansas.com ...
We don’t need an alternative theory to put in place of Darwin’s fairytale. For instance, if Darwin were to come up with a theory claiming that all computer keystrokes are random, it would not be necessary to come up with an alternative theory to prove him wrong. All I would have to do is falsify that all keystrokes are random.
Phillip Johnson, founder of the Discovery Institure, says there is no theory of Intelligent Design. Nor any research. Nor any proposals for research.
Which is why I keep asking what you will teach.
In other words, you want your religious beliefs taught as if they were science?
You should be aware by now that "intelligent design" is neither science nor a theory, and as such has no business being introduced into science classes as if it were either.
Why don't you admit it; you don't really care about science in the least; you just want your religious beliefs to replace science in those areas where the two conflict. That's what this whole battle is about.
Essentially, what this is all about is the fact that the parents in KS might have the nerve to vote to allow the teaching of creation and/or ID in the classroom and the elitist, liberals are having a meltdown that the parents whose own money is going to educate their own children might actually have a say in what is being taught in the school, and that it doesn't fit in with the leftist, liberal agenda.
Seems to me that there was something about taxation without representation mentioned some years ago.....
So, no doubt, as soon as the parents speak and say the *wrong* thing, the ACLU will be all over this like white on rice cramming down the throats of the kids and their parents through the abuse of litigation and the power of the judiciary, something that most people don't want.
The ignorant knuckle-draggers don't know what's best for them even if the liberal elitists do.
Imagine... parents having a say in their child's life. We can't have any of that, now can we. The horror. They might actually make the *wrong* decision.
So if there’s no intelligent design, then how do you believe that everything came into existence?
Isn’t the only option left that it *just happened*?
A fluke of *nature*?
What’s the *scientific* explanation for how everything got here, where it came from, how it organized itself? What’s the evidence that it’s a self-directed system?
Is it science like the abiogenesis theories? Or string theory and cosmology?
It assembled itself?
No, the battle is about whether parents have any say in the education of their children. They keep trying to allow creation and ID be addressed in the schools that their own tax money is funding to educate their own children and certain leftist elements are not allowing it. The leftist elements sue into about bankruptcy any district who dares to violate their ideologies.
Evolution alone is not being taught in public schools because it's the will of the public, but because the school districts are being cowed by the threat of lawsuits they can't afford. It's easier to capitulate to the threats from the minority leftists than bear the financial burden of the lawsuits.
If the general public did not want creation and/or ID taught in schools along with evolution, they would not keep voting in school boards who would allow it.
Directed evolution is an experimental method whereby Scientists use error prone PCR to generate novel proteins and test them for the desired properties. This is analogous to the epigenetic stress response whereby genes that promote mutation are up regulated and genes that repair mutation are down regulated.
Indeed it is trying to adapt by CHANGING its code. Selection is what makes it “know” once it has arrived at solution.
Epigenetics is not a magic code word that makes the random go away.
As I said above,
In other words, you want your religious beliefs taught as if they were science?
You aren't even trying to pretend ID is science any more.
It might be more correct to state that if God is in control, then the process only appears to be random.
What appears to be random to us, who are inside the system or who do not have the level of knowledge to detect that pattern yet, may not really be so.
We've been studying so little of our physical world for so short a time, that it would be well nigh impossible to make that statement with any degree of certainty.
We can't say for sure that any process is truly random unless we know all about it and can take all the factors acting upon that system into account.
We don't have anywhere near that level of knowledge yet.
Nope. Wrong interpretation.
Then everything in life only appears to be random and random is a meaningless word. I am not willing to go quite that far, but I do know that random doesn’t mean “not under the control of God”.
Maybe. But since we don't have the level of knowledge yet to determine that, that can't be said for sure. Maybe some things are truly random; maybe nothing is. We can't know that yet.
... and random is a meaningless word.
No. *random* is a good description for much of what we see. It conveys meaning that others understand what is meant, even if it's not entirely accurate. Kind of like *sunrise* and *sunset*.
I think most people would be happy just to see evolution taught in total.
Bring the kids attention to the philosophical backgrounds of the men who have advanced the theory. Show them all of the forgery, fabrications, miss-constructions and misinterpretations that has went down and still happens in the field.
The *keeping only “science” in the science classroom and that teaching anything but evo is teaching religion* argument is merely a smoke and mirrors used to deflect people’s attention away from the real issue that their right to have a say in their child’s education that is being paid for with their money is being taken away from them.
The thought control police are glad to be able to have an argument that people will buy without realizing what the true agenda is; that is, indoctrinating other parent’s children into a belief system that those parents object to.
The hardcore, atheistic, leftist goal is really to keep any mention of God out of the schools and if they can accomplish that using the ToE then they gladly will. I don’t believe for a minute that the ACLU really gives a rats a$$ whether or not the ToE is true, or science, or anything, except inasmuch as it’s a useful tool for them to use in their attempts to remove any mention of God from any where in public or private life. And sadly, many evos, who are giving the ACLU its backing, are the useful idiots the ACLU needs to accomplish their goal.
This is shown by the argument first that anything but evo should not be allowed in the science classroom. Then when the non-evo agrees that it should be taught in a philosophy class, and when someone actually goes and tries to do that, the leftist then proceeds to state that the philosophy and religious instruction classes that evos say creation and ID belong in, have no place in public schools because that’s endorsing religion; separation of *church* and state and all.
And the evos stand behind that as they did on the FR threads that were posted when some school tried that in CA.
Discuss them all you want! Talk about them on the sidewalk to anyone passing by. Discuss them over dinner at a restaurant. Explore them in church. Encourage your kids to set up after-school clubs to discuss them. Publish them in the newspaper. Promote them on one of the six religious channels I get with my satellite package. Heck, ring my doorbell and try to give me literature--I'll treat you politely and read it later.
You just don't get to use governmental authority, as embodied in a teacher or anyone else, to promote them. That's really all there is to it. I'm sorry if that makes you feel persecuted.
I think I asked you this before: the population of Dearborn, Michigan, is now about a third Arab. If it reaches 51%, and they vote to implement a madrassa-style curriculum in the public schools, will that be okay with you? Will you tell the Christians in the community that the Arab parents have a right to determine what's in their child's education that they're paying for, so tough?
just another do as I say, not as I do post.
While your side hijacks the courts to ram godless liberalism on society, Christians can’t so much as even fight back.
Your position is more than crystal clear!
As has been proven here...liberals rant that science isn’t consensus or opinion, yet it’s been proven beyond their illogic it often is precisely that.
Pluto is no longer a planet because some, not all astronomers say so.
Medications: don’t get me started on what doctors use at their disposal as to which medication is “best” for hypertension and other illness. Often it has ZERO to do with science, for instance cost, availability, etc.
Oh and my favorite, we’re to look at what godless liberals have done to:
education in general
and just somehow trust them to be objective!?
Oh and just IGNORE they’ve hijacked courts and govt to force their godless agenda on society, you’re supposed to just ignore that just like they do!
But yes, this argument from day one had almost nothing to do with science and everything to do with the godless liberals scared out of their minds that Christians might just wake up from this incessant abuse and understand that Christians have every bit as much right to science, school, EVERYTHING as much as any other group...
Who decided the godless ideology and agenda would take the lead in science, govt, law and so forth TO THE EXCLUSION of believers?
The answer is the bully ACLU and all the godless liberals that are ALLOWED to get away with it. PERIOD!
Christians to the Michael Newdow’s of the world...seriously, consider Cuba, the place fits you like a GLOVE! The climate, the godless fascism, the hypocrisy...it clearly would be paradise for you!
You’re still here?
You haven’t shown a soul why we should trust godless liberals to be objective about science when they’ve destroyed everything they’vs touched from education to juornalism to...well EVERYTHING!
Ummm noooo...I look at it as the failed godless liberal agenda has failed ALL citizens by forcing the homosexual agenda on the rest of us as if it’s normal, to global warming nonsense:
godless liberalism has failed science just as it has failed the rest of society!
Decent conservative people remember that when Christianity wasn’t attacked by lunatic fearful liberals, and the ACLU types weren’t suing Christians into silence, schools weren’t utterly failed, socializing centers.
The writing is on the wall and you’ll see alot more people waking up to it.
You had your chance for several decades and it was an ABYSMAL UTTER failure!
If science is so ‘objective’, why are you scared? We had the best scientific breakthroughs before whackjob godless liberals hijacked the legal system and the ACLU to attack God and remove CHRISTMAS from the school calendar!
Care to explain how removing Christmas from the calendar helps kids learn anything other than confusion?
This reminds me of hypocrats saying they support the troops by undermining their mission.
Godless liberals get real antsy when they’re invited to live in Cuba, while undermining our culture and doing all they can do to destroy America from within.
If your idea of America is associated with godless liberals running science, both science and America are MUCH worse off!
anything from a few paragraphs to a few pages explaining that the gaping holes in the clearly failed godless agenda are better explained by:
do you not have a dictionary or something?
FURTHERMORE, godless liberals do not define science! I don’t even think that needs to be put into the text, but it very much IS something godless liberals need to fully grasp, although no sane person is holding their breath!
I know you guys are really against intelligence being anywhere near the science curricluom, but why take such a concept to such fantastical leaps, or in your case depths, and actually incorporate such nonsense into your very own lifestyle?