Skip to comments.Gobekli Tepe: The World’s First Temple? ( massive carved stones about 11,000 years old )
Posted on 11/11/2008 5:08:14 PM PST by Ernest_at_the_Beach
Six miles from Urfa, an ancient city in southeastern Turkey, Klaus Schmidt has made one of the most startling archaeological discoveries of our time: massive carved stones about 11,000 years old, crafted and arranged by prehistoric people who had not yet developed metal tools or even pottery. The megaliths predate Stonehenge by some 6,000 years. The place is called Gobekli Tepe, and Schmidt, a German archaeologist who has been working here more than a decade, is convinced it's the site of the world's oldest temple.
(Excerpt) Read more at smithsonianmag.com ...
ARRRgh!... Now i have to flush my eyes with acid to rid myself of that horrible image. Where did you find that? under the 11,000 yr. old city you’re talking about?
Were Cavemen Painting For Their Gods?
The Telegraph (UK) | 2-23-2005
Posted on 03/06/2005 3:20:58 PM PST by blam
Macro-Etymology: Paleosigns [writing 20,000 years ago?]
Macro-Etymology Website | prior to May 20, 2005 | the webmasters thereof
Posted on 05/19/2005 11:00:18 PM PDT by SunkenCiv
Blow them up! They’re unIslamic!
Heh heh heh...
The objective of this paper is to generate the interest of the home baker in the use of cereal grain flours other than common wheat. Presently Kamut and spelt flours are readily available. Triticale flour availability is limited, and the authors are still pursuing agronomic and quality evaluations of einkorn and emmer PI accessions from the USDA-ARS National Small Grain Germplasm Research Facility (NSGGRF), Aberdeen, Idaho.Table 1). In cereal crops the head (inflorescence) if unbranched is called a spike. The spike consists of flowers (spikelets) arranged on the rachis (which is an extension of the stem). The flowers (spikelets) arise from nodes along the rachis which are called rachilla. The spikelet is enclosed by bracts, the glumes, or chaff. The kernels within the spikelet as enclosed in bracts, the lemma, and palea. As an example, kernels of free threshing wheats thresh free of the bracts; barley threshes free of the glumes, while lemma and palea make up the hull of the kernel; einkorn, emmer, and spelt thresh with the complete spikelet intact. A classification and description of Triticum sp. is outlined by Briggle and Reitz (1963). The wild and cultivated einkorn are differentiated by the brittleness of the rachis. The rachis of wild einkorn is brittle and the spikelets readily disarticulate when mature, whereas the rachis of cultivated einkorn is less fragile and remains intact until thrashed.
Einkorn along with emmer and spelt are often referred to as "the covered wheats," since the kernels do not thresh free of the glumes or the lemma and palea when harvested (Fig. 1). In contrast to the free threshing wheats, the spikes of einkorn disarticulate at threshing (the seed head breaks apart into intact spikelets). The spikes disarticulate with the rachilla apex attached to the base of the spikelet. Einkorn has long narrow glumes which are awned. Cultivated einkorn generally has one kernel per spikelet.
Einkorn became widely distributed throughout the Near East, Transcaucasia, the Mediterranean region, southwestern Europe, and the Balkans, and was one of the first cereals cultivated for food.
Harlan (1981), cites information suggesting that wild einkorn grain was harvested in the late Paleolithic and early Mesolithic Ages, 16,000-15,000 BC. Confirmed finds of wild grain remains have been dated to the early Neolithic (Stone Age) 10,000 BC. (Helmqvist 1955; Zohary and Hopf 1993). Cultivated einkorn continued to be a popular cultivated crop during the Neolithic and early Bronze Age 10,000-4,000 BC giving way to emmer by the mid-Bronze Age. Einkorn cultivation continued to be popular in isolated regions from the Bronze Age into the early 20th century. Today, einkorn production is limited to small isolated regions within France, India, Italy, Turkey, and Yugoslavia (Harlan 1981; Perrino and Hammer 1982).Table 2). The protein content of einkorn when threshed in the hull varied from 10% to 26% higher, and the grain from 50% to 75% higher than the protein content (12.5% to 13.5%) of the hard red wheats. Agronomic production practices for spring grains would be applicable to einkorn, which has a tendency to mature later than spring wheat. Einkorn may be most suitable for cropping in lower moisture environments similar to the northern Great Plains area of Montana. The einkorn accessions tested had only moderate straw strength, averaged 109 cm in height, and would be susceptible to lodging in high moisture environments. The susceptibility to diseases is unknown and may be expressed in high moisture environments. Table 1. The genomic constitution AA of emmer is thought to be derived from T. monococcum. Various sources of the BB genome have been suggested, T. speltoides, T. searsii, and T. tripsacoides (Morris and Sears 1967; Kimber and Sears 1987). Emmers are predominantly awned with spikelets consisting of two well developed kernels. Emmer glumes are long and narrow with sharp beaks.
The use of emmer as a cereal food is considered to be contemporary with that of einkorn. Similar to einkorn, the earliest civilizations initially consumed emmer as a porridge prior to developing the process of bread making.
Remnants of wild emmer in early civilization sites date to the late Paleolithic Age 17,000 BC (Zohary and Hopf 1993). Cultivated emmer emerged as the predominant wheat along with barley as the principal cereals utilized by civilizations in the late Mesolithic, and early Neolithic Ages 10,000 BC (Helmqvist 1955; Harlan 1981; Zohary and Hopf 1993). Cultivated emmer dispersion and use by early civilizations greatly exceeded that of einkorn. Due to the addition of the BB genome cultivated emmer could be grown in a wider range of environments including regions having high growing season temperatures. Cultivated emmer became the dominant wheat throughout the Near and Far East, Europe, and Northern Africa from the Neolithic (Stone Age) through the Bronze Age 10,000-4,000 BC. Emmer utilization continued through the Bronze Age 4,000-1,000 BC, during which the naked wheats, primarily the tetraploid species slowly displaced emmer. However, emmer continued to be popular in isolated regions such as south central Russia into the early 1900s. Presently emmer remains an important crop in Ethiopia and a minor crop in India and Italy (Harlan 1981; Perrino and Hammer 1982).
We owe these people Big Time.....Man cannot live without Bread.
We could, but the pbj would get all over our hands.
Back to the BB Game.
Did we plough up the Garden of Eden?
First Post | October 17, 2006
Posted on 10/17/2006 6:10:35 AM PDT by NYer
Is this the world’s oldest statue? [Anatolia, Gobekli Tepe]
The First Post | November 24, 2006 | Sean Thomas
Posted on 11/26/2007 9:01:06 AM PST by SunkenCiv
Turkish Site A Neolithic ‘Supernova’
Washington Times | 4-21-2008 | Nicholas Birch
Posted on 04/21/2008 3:24:52 PM PDT by blam
Mysterious Neolithic People Made Optical Art
Discovery News | September 22, 2008 | Rossella Lorenzi
Posted on 09/25/2008 5:39:23 PM PDT by SunkenCiv
Italian Archaeologist: Anatolia - Home To First Civilization On Earth
Beku Today | 6-20-2003
Posted on 06/22/2003 9:14:54 AM PDT by blam
Ancient Stamp Dating To 5,000 BC Unearthed In Harran (Turkey)
Turkish Daily News | 10-16-2006
Posted on 10/16/2006 6:02:09 PM PDT by blam
The map and pictures are at the website.
....it’s only a model.............
12,000 years ago the Arabian/Persian Gulf was dry land. Up until 7,500 years ago the present day Black Sea was called the old Euxine Lake (the ancients referred to what we call the Black Sea as the new Euxine Sea after the isthmus collapsed and sea water flooded into the old lake’s basin).
The shoreline of India at one time extended out 33 kilometers further than it does today. There are flooded cities offshore, some with pyramids.
Marine archeology in India is progressing nicely though you will never hear about it from western archeologists. There is passionate disagreement between European and Indian archeology over how long humans have had established civilisations. The Indians insist it goes back hundreds of thousands of years.
I simply pointed out that we have nothing before the 2nd century BCE that
“specifically” pinpoints Ur of the Chaldees’ location, and that the late 1st
century BCE is the earliest attested statement that Abraham was not of
Chaldea, but of Damascus, Syria. Now of course, this statement by Nicholas
the historian does nothing to support the notion that Abraham was originally
from Urfa (or another nearby unknown UR), in Northern Mesopotamia.
You cannot point to a text and show me where it is “specifically stated”
that Abraham was from UR (Urfa) of Northern Mesopotamia. I have that
advantage over you with the statements made in Judith 5:5-9.
All you can do is “hypothesize,” and, as you know, hypotheses are “a dime a
dozen” in biblical studies without “hard facts” to back them up.
I am aware of all the arguments for the northern UR, but I have never seen
an ancient text (1st century CE or earlier), cited, which stated or implied
Ur lay in Northern Mesopotamia.
Even Josephus, acknowledges what Judith 5:5-9, and Eupolemus (ca. 150 BCE)
state about Chaldea being Abraham’s home:
“Now Abraham had two brethren, Nahor and Haran; of these Haran left a son,
Lot; as also Sarai and Milcha his daughters, AND DIED AMONG THE CHALDEANS,
IN A CITY OF THE CHALDEANS, CALLED UR; and his monument is shown to this
day...Now Terah hating Chaldea, on account of his mourning for Haran, they
all removed to Haran of Mesopotamia, where Terah died...”(Josephus,
Antiquities of the Jews, 1.6.5.)
I note that Josephus seems to believe that a monument of some sort was
erected to Haran’s memory and that this monument still existed in Josephus’
day. When we look at the statements by Judith 5:5-9 and Eupoleumus, both
stating Abraham was of Chaldea, there evidently existed in Josephus’ day a
Chaldean city called Ur. Tell Mugheir/Muqayyar (ancient Uru/Uriwa) did exist
in Josephus’ day, in Chaldea, so it is the most likely candidate (despite
the still later Talmud opting for Uruk/Warka, LXX Orech, Genesis’ “Erech”).
Josephus’ work was written in Greek, surely, he would not deceive his
Greek-reading audience with statements that Urfa of northern Mesopotamia is
in Chaldea ?
The evidence is quite clear, despite its being “late”, from the 2nd century
BCE to the 1st century BCE, Chaldea (Babylonia) is “specifically” stated and
presented as Abraham’s birth-place.
I will say this much about Urfa, the natives point to a shallow pool with
sacred fish, and they call it the “Lake of Abraham”. It is my
nderstanding -correct me if I am wrong- that pools with sacred fish were
generally dedicated to the Fish-goddess Atargatis (known to the Greeks of
Syria as early as the 4th century BCE). I know of nothing in early biblical
literature, identifying sacred fish with Abraham (of course the fish was
later identified with Christ, as ICHTHYS, who in turn had associations with
Abraham in the New Testament).
“Atargatis...whose usual name among Greeks and Romans was “the Syrian
Goddess” (Syria Dea, Dea Syria)...At Ascalon, Atargatis was represented as
half woman, half fish. Fish and doves were sacred to her...” (p.199,
“Atargatis,” Simon Hornblower & Antony Spawforth, Eds., The Oxford Classical
Dictionary, 3rd edition, Oxford University Press, 1996)
“Fish, Sacred. Fish, hard to classify biologically and inhabitants of the
alien world of water, had a considerable role in ancient religion...They
were kept in sanctuaries, and sometimes used to provide oracles (as at Sura
in Lycia). The most famous fish observances were connected with the Syrian
cult of Atargatis (Xen. An.1.4.9; Lucian, Syr.D.), which spread to other
areas (Syll.997 is a set of regulations for the care of the fish of this
cult at Smyrna); the priests ate the fish, which were prohibited to other
worshippers.” (p.599, “Fish, Sacred,” Hornblower & Spawforth)
My best guess, and it is only a guess, is that Urfa’s sacred fish were
originally sacred to Atargatis, “Dea Syria,” and perhaps, after Christianity
arose in this area, Christ as ICHTHYS, the fish, led to an association later
with Abraham ? If this supposition has any validity, then Urfa’s association
with Abraham via its sacred fish, is after Christianity arose in that area.
This would make for a much later “Northern” UR claim than the Chaldean UR of
Judith, Eupolemus, and Josephus.
All the best,
Walter Reinhold Warttig Mattfeld
Walldorf by Heidelberg
"Is it safe?"
I’ll get ya back: Can you imagine what that women smells like?
I still can't believe they blew up those huge thousand year old Buddha’s.
Just now got around to reading this. Fascinating stuff and thanks a million.
Excellent work. And I envy you. Oh! To be able to visit the Cornmarket during the upcoming season.
Yes, exactly so, well put. Mellaart has had at least three episodes of being a fantasy merchant, which means most of his real work, such as the Catal Huyuk dig almost 50 years ago, didn’t make the mainstream until recent years (there’s a new dig there going on, started up about ten years ago). I think there’s a big fat momma statue of the neolithic that he dug up there, which has made it into art history books (I’ve seen it in a textbook from a friend’s art-schooled daughter).
Well, this topic would be the place for it. ;’)
...when danger reared it’s ugly head, he bravely turned his tail and fled...
“One word. Plastic.”
I Must get a copy....
I grew up in the wheat State,...plowed, planted and harvested the grain...and I am still fascinated by it.
Hays is the heart of the imported hard Red Winter wheat ....brought over by immigrants from Russia via Germany in the mid 1800's....
Children in Russia hand-picked the first seeds of this famous winter wheat for Kansas. They belonged to Mennonite Colonies preparing to emigrate from the steppes to the America prairies. A peace-loving sect, originally from Holland, the Mennonites had gone to the Crimea from Prussia in 1790 when Catherine the Great offered free lands, military exemption and religious freedom. They prospered until these privileges were threatened in 1871. Three years later they emigrated to Kansas, where the Santa Fe R.R. offered thousands of acres on good terms in McPherson, Harvey, Marion & Reno counties, and where the legislature passed a bill which exempted religious objectors from military service. Within a month after landing in New York the Mennonites planted the red~gold grains their children had selected. The harvest was the first of the great crops of hard Turkey Red and its derivatives that have made Kansas the Granary of the Nation.
I dumped mine along with a ton of other books I had in my library when I had to sell my home and move back to Philly. No space to set up a library area.
From the old to the new world. And what a blessing it has been over time. Wheat surely is among the best grain sources based on it’s food value.
Interesting history of how these particular strains of wheat had entered the American heartland.
Mellaart’s book has a (probably b&w) pic of this: