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Top Scientists Ask Medical Journal Science To Retract Original AIDS Papers
Rethinking AIDS ^ | December 9, 2008

Posted on 12/10/2008 8:33:43 AM PST by GodGunsGuts

Top Scientists Ask Medical Journal Science To Retract Original AIDS Papers

SAN FRANCISCO (Rethinking AIDS) Dec. 9, 2008—The international nonprofit scientific organization Rethinking AIDS gave its full support today to 37 senior researchers, medical doctors and legal professionals who are requesting that the medical journal Science withdraw four seminal papers on HIV authored by Dr. Robert Gallo—papers widely touted as proof that HIV is the "probable cause of AIDS." An online posting of the letter can be found here.

"With new findings that undermine the scientific integrity and veracity of Gallo's four papers, the entire basis of the theory that HIV causes AIDS may now be questioned," says Rethinking AIDS president David Crowe.

The letter to the journal comes at a time when the microbiology world is abuzz about Gallo's omission from the 2008 Nobel Prize in medicine for the discovery of HIV, contrary to an international agreement that the two teams should share credit. French scientists Drs. Luc Montagnier and Francoise Barré-Sinoussi are instead to be given the award, a decision that also implicitly questions the scientific integrity of Gallo's claim of the discovery. Montagnier, however, admitted on camera more than a decade ago that his experiments did not purify any virus.

The four papers were originally published on May 4, 1984, a few days after a press conference by Gallo announcing he had discovered the "probable cause of AIDS." Now, a British investigative journalist has shown that Gallo's claim was based on last-minute alterations to documents that make false claims about the results of his lab work and research experiments. The letter to Science sent by the 37 experts on Monday, Dec. 1, 2008, includes a copy of Gallo’s handwritten changes to the article, a letter from an electron microscopy expert indicating that Gallo’s samples did not contain any virus, and a letter from Gallo to a researcher verifying that HIV could not be purified directly from human materials.

The investigative conclusion prompting the letter to Science was made by journalist Janine Roberts, author of Fear of the Invisible, a book that examines the origin of several disease theories. "I was shocked when I read the original draft of the key scientific paper now widely cited as proving HIV causes AIDS," says Roberts. "Gallo's handwritten last-minute changes had reversed what the scientists in his lab had originally concluded. This demonstrates a stunning disregard for the scientific process and a very disturbing breach of public trust."

It is clear that the seminal research published on HIV contained unjustified claims and alterations. In 1993, governmental investigators determined Gallo had so poorly recorded his key and much-cited experiment that it was impossible to repeat and verify it.

In the early 1990s, several highly critical reports on the research underlying Gallo's papers were produced as a result of governmental inquiries working under the supervision of scientists nominated by the National Academy of Sciences and the Institute of Medicine. The Office of Research Integrity (ORI) of the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services concluded that the lead paper of the four was "fraught with false and erroneous statements" and that the “ORI believes that the careless and unacceptable keeping of research records . . . reflects irresponsible laboratory management that has permanently impaired the ability to retrace the important steps taken." Further, a Congressional Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations produced a staff report on the papers, containing scathing criticisms of their integrity.

Rethinking AIDS — an international group of more than 2,600 scientists, doctors, journalists, health advocates and others — offers several eminent medical and scientific experts to comment on this and other AIDS issues currently in the news:

Etienne de Harven, M.D.* Professor Emeritus, University of Toronto Saint Cézaire, France Member and professor in cell biology, Sloan Kettering Institute, New York, 1956-1981. Isolated and obtained the first electron microscopic studies of the murine Friend leukemia virus, and retroviral budding. Frequent critic of the "isolation" of HIV, and past president of Rethinking AIDS. Dr. de Harven can comment on the science of retrovirus isolation.

Janine Roberts Investigative Reporter Bristol, U.K. jan@fearoftheinvisible.com Author, Fear of the Invisible, a recent book exposing the fraud in the drafting of one of the original 1984 Science articles by Robert Gallo. Web site: www.fearoftheinvisible.com

Media Contacts:

David Crowe* President, Rethinking AIDS Calgary, Alberta, Canada (Mountain time zone) 1-403-289-6609 (office) 1-403-861-2225 (mobile) david.crowe@aras.ab.ca

Elizabeth Ely Public Relations Chairperson Rethinking AIDS Brooklyn, N.Y., U.S. (Eastern time zone) 1-718-704-9672 (mobile) publicrelations@rethinkingaids.com

*Rethinking AIDS board member.

Rethinking AIDS: The Group for the Scientific Reappraisal of the HIV/AIDS Hypothesis ("RA" or "the Group") was formed in 1991 to express the concerns of a growing number of renowned scientists and medical doctors about HIV research and the resulting human rights abuses. In 1995, by a letter published in Science, the Group called for a thorough reappraisal of the existing evidence for and against the HIV/AIDS hypothesis and recommended that critical epidemiological studies be undertaken.

Among RA's founders and key members are University of Toronto professor emeritus and former cancer researcher Dr. Etienne de Harven; Harvard microbiologist Dr. Charles Thomas; 1993 Nobel laureate for chemistry Dr. Kary Mullis; Nature/Biotechnology co-founder Dr. Harvey Bialy; University of California at Berkeley molecular biologist Dr. Peter Duesberg and the late Yale mathematician Dr. Serge Lang, both members of the National Academy of Sciences; physicist Eleni Papadopulos-Eleopulos of the Royal Perth Hospital in Australia; and Glasgow University professor emeritus of public health and World Health Organization consultant Dr. Gordon Stewart.


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: aids; peerreview; peterduesberg; rethinkingaids; robertgallo
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LETTER FROM RETHINKING AIDS SCIENTISTS CALLING FOR THE JOURNAL SCIENCE TO RETRACT ROBERT GALLO'S ORIGINAL PAPERS DECLARING HIV THE CAUSE OF AIDS:

Science/AAAS 1200 New York Avenue NW Washington, DC, 20005 +1-202-326-6400

December 1, 2008

To: Bruce Alberts, Editor in Chief, Science:

cc: Alan Lechner, CEO, AAAS

On May 4, 1984 your journal published four papers by a group led by Dr. Robert Gallo. We are writing to express our serious concerns with regard to the integrity and veracity of the lead paper among these four of which Dr. Mikulas Popovic is the lead author.[1] The other three are also of concern because they rely upon the conclusions of the lead paper.[2][3][4]

In the early 1990s, several highly critical reports on the research underlying these papers were produced as a result of governmental inquiries working under the supervision of scientists nominated by the National Academy of Sciences and the Institute of Medicine. The Office of Research Integrity of the US Department of Health and Human Services concluded that the lead paper was “fraught with false and erroneous statements,” and that the “ORI believes that the careless and unacceptable keeping of research records...reflects irresponsible laboratory management that has permanently impaired the ability to retrace the important steps taken.”[5] Further, a Congressional Subcommittee on Oversight and Investigations led by US Representative John D. Dingell of Michigan produced a staff report on the papers which contains scathing criticisms of their integrity.[6]

Despite the publically available record of challenges to their veracity, these papers have remained uncorrected and continue to be part of the scientific record.

What prompts our communication today is the recent revelation of an astonishing number of previously unreported deletions and unjustified alterations made by Gallo to the lead paper. There are several documents originating from Gallo's laboratory that, while available for some time, have only recently been fully analyzed. These include a draft of the lead paper typewritten by Popovic which contains handwritten changes made to it by Gallo.[7] This draft was the key evidence used in the above described inquiries to establish that Gallo had concealed his laboratory's use of a cell culture sample (known as LAV) which it received from the Institut Pasteur.

These earlier inquiries verified that the typed manuscript draft was produced by Popovic who had carried out the recorded experiment while his laboratory chief, Gallo, was in Europe and that, upon his return, Gallo changed the document by hand a few days before it was submitted to Science on March 30, 1984. According to the ORI investigation, “Dr. Gallo systematically rewrote the manuscript for what would become a renowned LTCB [Gallo's laboratory at the National Cancer Institute] paper.”[5]

This document provided the important evidence that established the basis for awarding Dr. Luc Montagnier and Dr. Francoise Barré-Sinoussi the 2008 Nobel Prize in Medicine for the discovery of the AIDS virus by proving it was their samples of LAV that Popovic used in his key experiment. The draft reveals that Popovic had forthrightly admitted using the French samples of LAV renamed as Gallo’s virus, HTLV-III, and that Gallo had deleted this admission, concealing their use of LAV. However, it has not been previously reported that on page three of this same document Gallo had also deleted Popovic's unambiguous statement that, "Despite intensive research efforts, the causative agent of AIDS has not yet been identified,” replacing it in the published paper with a statement that said practically the opposite, namely, “That a retrovirus of the HTLV family might be an etiologic agent of AIDS was suggested by the findings.”

It is clear that the rest of Popovic's typed paper is entirely consistent with his statement that the cause of AIDS had not been found, despite his use of the French LAV. Popovic’s final conclusion was that the culture he produced “provides the possibility” for detailed studies. He claimed to have achieved nothing more. At no point in his paper did Popovic attempt to prove that any virus caused AIDS, and it is evident that Gallo concealed these key elements in Popovic’s experimental findings.

It is astonishing now to discover these unreported changes to such a seminal document. We can only assume that Gallo’s alterations of Popovic’s conclusions were not highlighted by earlier inquiries because the focus at the time was on establishing that the sample used by Gallo's lab came from Montagnier and was not independently collected by Gallo. In fact, the only attention paid to the deletions made by Gallo pertains to his effort to hide the identity of the sample. The questions of whether Gallo and Popovic’s research proved that LAV or any other virus was the cause of AIDS were clearly not considered.

Related to these questions are other long overlooked documents that merit your attention. One of these is a letter from Dr. Matthew A. Gonda, then Head of the Electron Microscopy Laboratory at the National Cancer Institute, which is addressed to Popovic, copied to Gallo and dated just four days prior to Gallo’s submission to Science.[8] In this letter, Gonda remarks on samples he had been sent for imaging because “Dr Gallo wanted these micrographs for publication because they contain HTLV.” He states, “I do not believe any of the particles photographed are of HTLV-I, II or III.” According to Gonda, one sample contained cellular debris, while another had no particles near the size of a retrovirus. Despite Gonda’s clearly worded statement, Science published on May 4, 1984 papers attributed to Gallo et al with micrographs attributed to Gonda and described unequivocally as HTLV-III.

In another letter by Gallo, dated one day before he submitted his papers to Science, Gallo states, “It’s extremely rare to find fresh cells [from AIDS patients] expressing the virus... cell culture seems to be necessary to induce virus,” a statement which raises the possibility he was working with a laboratory artifact. [9]

Included here are copies of these documents and links to the same. The very serious flaws they reveal in the preparation of the lead paper published in your journal in 1984 prompts our request that this paper be withdrawn. It appears that key experimental findings have been concealed. We further request that the three associated papers published on the same date also be withdrawn as they depend on the accuracy of this paper.

For the scientific record to be reliable, it is vital that papers shown to be flawed, or falsified be retracted. Because a very public record now exists showing that the Gallo papers drew unjustified conclusions, their withdrawal from Science is all the more important to maintain integrity. Future researchers must also understand they cannot rely on the 1984 Gallo papers for statements about HIV and AIDS, and all authors of papers that previously relied on this set of four papers should have the opportunity to consider whether their own conclusions are weakened by these revelations.

Respectfully,

Mohammed A. Al-Bayati, PhD, DABT, DABVT. Toxicologist & Pathologist, Toxi-Health International, Dixon, CA.

David A. Ballok, PhD, Department of Surgery, Division of Neurosurgery and Neurosciences, McMaster University, Canada.

Henry H. Bauer, PhD, Dean Emeritus of Arts & Sciences, Professor Emeritus of Chemistry & Science Studies, Virginia Polytechnic Institute & State University.

André-Pierre Benguerel, PhD, Professor Emeritus, University of British Columbia, Vancouver, Canada. Terry Bennett, MD, MPH.

Harvey Bialy, PhD, founding scientific editor of Nature Biotechnology, author of Oncogenes, Aneuploidy and AIDS: A Scientific Life & Times of Peter H. Duesberg.

Christopher Black, Barrister, International Criminal Lawyer, Lead Counsel, Rwanda War Crimes Tribunal. Kelly Brennan-Jones, PhD, Associate Professor of Psychology, SUNY Brockport, New York, USA. Darin Brown, PhD, Mathematics.

Gordon Burns, PhD, Professor of Cancer Research, The University of Newcastle, Australia.

Jennifer L. Craig, BSN, MA, PhD.

Etienne de Harven, MD, Professor Emeritus, University of Toronto. Signature available on request.

Andrea G. Drusini, MD, PhD, Medical Anthropologist, Professor of Anthropology, Department of Medico-Diagnostic Sciences and Special Therapies, University of Padova, Italy.

Charles Geshekter, PhD, Professor Emeritus of History, Chair, History of Science Section, AAAS/Pacific Division (1990-95). California State University, Chico. Signature available on request.

Roberto Giraldo, MD, Specialist in internal medicine, infectious and tropical diseases. Member of the Department of Integral Psychosomatic Medicine, International Society of Analytical Trilogy, São Paulo, Brazil. Signature available on request.

Pablo L. E. Idahosa, PhD, Professor, Social Science Program Director, African Studies Graduate Program, International Development Studies Founders College, York University, Canada. Signature available on request. Matt Irwin, MD, MSW, Private practice, Alexandria, Virginia.

Joel M. Kauffman, Professor of Chemistry Emeritus, University of the Sciences in Philadelphia, Medical Writer.

Claus Koehnlein, MD, Specialist in internal medicine, Dept. of Oncology, Univ. of Kiel, Germany (1983 -1993). Since 1993, in private practice increasingly treating HIV-positive people who decline antiviral drugs. Member of South Africa Presidential AIDS Advisory Panel.

Hans J. Kugler,PhD, President, International Academy of Anti-Aging Medicine.

Helen Lauer, PhD, Associate Professor, Philosophy Department Head, University of Ghana.

Herbert G. Lebherz, PhD, Professor of Chemistry and Biochemistry (Emeritus). San Diego State University, USA.

Stoffer Loman, BSc, MSc, PhD.

Ahmed Makata, Dip (clin medicine–TZ), MD (USSR), certificate (Tropical pathology–Japan), PhD (Path–Japan), DFM (Path–RCPA– Australia), Forensic Consultant, Histopathologist, Head of Forensic Unit, Ministry of Health, Tanzania. Signature available on request.

Andrew Maniotis, PhD, University of Illinois at Chicago. Signature available on request.

Jonas Moses, PhD, PA, Former US Army clinician (in Ophthalmology), cancer biologist in the Dept. of Pathology, Univ. of Illinois – Chicago (2002-2007), and consulting cell and tissue engineer.

Paul Olisa Adaka Ojeih, PhD, MD, Medical Director, Iris Medical Foundation, Lagos, Nigeria.

Nikitah Okembe-RA Imani, Associate Professor of Sociology and African Studies, James Madison University. Signature available on request.

Philippe Packard, PhD, MPH. Signature available on request.

David Rasnick, PhD, Biochemist, Protease Inhibitor Developer, Chief Scientific Officer, Chromosome Diagnostics, LLC.

Prof. Dr. med. Jochen Schaefer, Director, International Institute for Theoretical Cardiology, Kiel, Germany.

Hugo Stenström, MD, Senior interventional radiologist, Department of Radiology, Linkoping University Hospital, Sweden.

Gordon T. Stewart, MD. Emeritus Professor of Public Health, University of Glasgow, and consultant physician (epidemiology and preventive medicine), NHS, UK. Former consultant to New York City, WHO and to other health authorities in Europe, North America, Africa and Asia on AIDS and related matters. Emeritus Fellow, Infectious Diseases Society of America and former member of the editorial board of the Journal of Infectious Diseases. Signature available on request.

Roberto P. Stock, PhD. Research Scientist Instituto de Biotecnologia – UNAM, Mexico.

Jean Umber, Professeur agrégé (Organic Chemistry), Académie de Nancy-Metz, Lorraine, France.

Rudolf Werner, Professor, Dept. of Biochemistry & Molecular Biology Univ. of Miami School of Medicine.

Chun Xu, MD, PhD, VP Global Clinical Services, Venturepharm Lab. Beijing, China.

1 posted on 12/10/2008 8:33:43 AM PST by GodGunsGuts
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To: Stentor; Marty; Fractal Trader; metmom; John Valentine; editor-surveyor; Mr Ramsbotham; Chode; ...

If you agree that the following needs to be investigated and exposed, please consider joining the RETHINKING AIDS PING LIST.

AIDS is the biggest public health scam in medical history. Like global warming, AIDS is being used to push a powerful leftist political agenda. For over two decades the Public Health Establishment has used your tax dollars and the full power of the federal government to wage a massive propaganda (and intimidation) campaign designed to:

(A) prevent the American public from hearing the scientific evidence that suggests HIV may not cause AIDS
(B) scare the public into thinking "we are all at risk"
(C) coverup the extreme toxicity of AIDS chemotherapy drugs (which are not just used on "fast-track" gays and junkies, but also given to pregnant mothers, infants, and children)
(D)
use this fear to push a leftist social agenda that includes socialized medicine, and the promotion of homosexuality and explicit sex "education" to tender-aged school children
(E)
use their "public health mandate" to bypass the authority of parents and local school boards who object to their social engineering schemes
(F) create a massive federal bureaucracy encouraging the use of addictive drugs, to include prescription heroine
(G) use threats and intimidation to silence dissenting scientists and to keep the press from covering the debate
(H) and finally, to use AIDS as a model to push similar social agendas with respect to future epidemics.

Every single point above can be documented on my profile page.

If you would like to be added to the RETHINKING AIDS PING LIST drop me a FReepmail.


2 posted on 12/10/2008 8:35:14 AM PST by GodGunsGuts
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To: GodGunsGuts

OK, HIV doesn’t = AIDS.

SO, does this mean smoking causes AIDS? Drinking apple juice? Thailand?


3 posted on 12/10/2008 8:37:38 AM PST by ASOC (This space could be employed, if I could only get a bailout...)
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To: GodGunsGuts
(F) create a massive federal bureaucracy encouraging the use of addictive drugs, to include prescription heroine .

heroine

Function:
noun
Etymology:
Latin heroina, from Greek hērōinē, feminine of hērōs
Date:
1609
1 a: a mythological or legendary woman having the qualities of a hero b: a woman admired and emulated for her achievements and qualities2 a: the principal female character in a literary or dramatic work b: the central female figure in an event or period

 

Hmm...

4 posted on 12/10/2008 8:39:10 AM PST by MyTwoCopperCoins
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To: ASOC
SO, does this mean smoking causes AIDS? Drinking apple juice? Thailand?

I'm guessing Thailand.

5 posted on 12/10/2008 8:40:18 AM PST by Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus (Nihil utile nisi quod honestum - Marcus Tullius Cicero)
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To: DaveLoneRanger; editor-surveyor; betty boop; Alamo-Girl; MrB; GourmetDan; Fichori; ...

Thought you guys might be interested in the following. If you think you might be interested in being added to my (infrequent) Rethinking AIDS ping list, see reply #2.


6 posted on 12/10/2008 8:43:10 AM PST by GodGunsGuts
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To: GodGunsGuts

Thanks for the ping!


7 posted on 12/10/2008 8:43:40 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: ASOC
THAILAND?
8 posted on 12/10/2008 8:44:00 AM PST by null and void (Hey 0bama? There will be a pop quiz every day for the next four years...miss a question, people die.)
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To: ASOC

See my profile page.


9 posted on 12/10/2008 8:44:09 AM PST by GodGunsGuts
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To: Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus

It’s fer sure that gay sex has nothing to do with AIDS.


10 posted on 12/10/2008 8:44:21 AM PST by js1138
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To: GodGunsGuts; metmom; Dr. Eckleburg
lol. Scientists are always honest and never lie, even when the Nobel Prize is at stake
11 posted on 12/10/2008 8:44:35 AM PST by 1000 silverlings (Everything that deceives also enchants: Plato)
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To: GodGunsGuts
37 senior researchers, medical doctors and legal professionals

OBVIOUSLY they are just trailer park hillbillies....

/do I need it?

12 posted on 12/10/2008 8:44:49 AM PST by Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus (Nihil utile nisi quod honestum - Marcus Tullius Cicero)
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To: MyTwoCopperCoins

Ooops...I can’t believe I didn’t catch that! Thanks for pointing that out—GGG


13 posted on 12/10/2008 8:46:25 AM PST by GodGunsGuts
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To: GodGunsGuts

Bump!


14 posted on 12/10/2008 8:46:34 AM PST by editor-surveyor (Obama - not just an empty suit - - A Suit Bomb invading the White House)
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To: GodGunsGuts

Gays don’t want to admit HIV causes AIDS because that would mean their own irresponsible actions are the cause for their disease.


15 posted on 12/10/2008 8:47:06 AM PST by antiRepublicrat
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To: GodGunsGuts

Put me on the list, please. FINALLY, Jad Adams and Dr. Peter Duesberg, who exposed this lie in 1996, are exhonerated!


16 posted on 12/10/2008 8:49:08 AM PST by TCH (Another redneck clinging to guns and religion)
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To: TCH

Your on the list. Welcome aboard!!!


17 posted on 12/10/2008 8:50:08 AM PST by GodGunsGuts
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To: GodGunsGuts

And these are the kind of scientists that Gore wants us to trust about Gorbal Warming.


18 posted on 12/10/2008 8:51:55 AM PST by fella (.He that followeth after vain persons shall have poverty enough." Pv.28:19')
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To: antiRepublicrat

See my profile page. There is most certainly something that gays don’t want to admit about their lifestyle, but it has nothing to do with HIV.


19 posted on 12/10/2008 8:52:21 AM PST by GodGunsGuts
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To: GodGunsGuts

I don’t get it, they’re saying it’s not a virus?


20 posted on 12/10/2008 8:52:49 AM PST by Scythian
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To: Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus

lol. Knuckle-dragging, bible thumping, gun clinging, luddites all, no doubt


21 posted on 12/10/2008 8:55:23 AM PST by 1000 silverlings (Everything that deceives also enchants: Plato)
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To: fella

==And these are the kind of scientists that Gore wants us to trust about Gorbal Warming.

Actually, the vast majority of Rethinking AIDS scientists think Al Gore’s Global Warming crusade is just as fraudulant and politically driven as AIDS “science.” See my profile page for more. If you would like to join my Rethinking AIDS pings list, feel free to drop me a FReepmail.


22 posted on 12/10/2008 8:55:37 AM PST by GodGunsGuts
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To: GodGunsGuts

How many years have I been been posting the HIV/AIDS Homo scam? It’s amazing. Absolute nonsense. Gallo should have been arrested!


23 posted on 12/10/2008 8:56:48 AM PST by Doc Savage ("Are you saying Jesus can't hit a curve ball? - Harris to Cerrano - Major League)
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To: Scythian

No, one of GGG’s pet issues is that he thinks HIV isn’t the cause of AIDS. Researchers have known HIV is the cause of AIDS for 20 years or so.


24 posted on 12/10/2008 8:56:58 AM PST by mysterio
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To: Scythian

That’s correct. They say AIDS is caused by something else. For layman’s versions of what they are talking about, see the Policy Review, National Review, American Spectator, Reason Magazine, and Rethinking AIDS articles on my profile page. There are some excellent videos there as well. If you want scientific papers, FReepmail me and I’ll send you some links.


25 posted on 12/10/2008 8:57:45 AM PST by GodGunsGuts
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To: Doc Savage

You will get no argument from me!


26 posted on 12/10/2008 8:59:36 AM PST by GodGunsGuts
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To: Spaulding

Oops. Forgot to ping you to this one!


27 posted on 12/10/2008 9:00:42 AM PST by GodGunsGuts
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To: GodGunsGuts
They say AIDS is caused by something else.

AIDS is caused by insufficient federal funding, didn't you know?

[/SARCASM]

28 posted on 12/10/2008 9:02:16 AM PST by 50sDad (-/\/\/\- Obama's coming; be a Resistor!)
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To: 1000 silverlings

Yeah... just ask AL GORE!


29 posted on 12/10/2008 9:04:44 AM PST by TCH (Another redneck clinging to guns and religion)
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To: GodGunsGuts
Please put me on your ping list.

I read the Duesberg book in the early 90s

shalom b'SHEM Yah'shua HaMashiach Adonai

30 posted on 12/10/2008 9:05:31 AM PST by Uri’el-2012 (Psalm 78:35 And they remembered that God was their ROCK, And the Most High God their Redeemer.)
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To: null and void

Hint - Thailand has a “sex trade” noted for a very hagh rate of STD.

Who knew?


31 posted on 12/10/2008 9:05:35 AM PST by ASOC (This space could be employed, if I could only get a bailout...)
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To: 50sDad

LOL. Check out my profile page. You definitely have the right frame of mind to be on my Rethinking AIDS ping list!


32 posted on 12/10/2008 9:06:12 AM PST by GodGunsGuts
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To: XeniaSt

You’re on...and welcome aboard!


33 posted on 12/10/2008 9:07:13 AM PST by GodGunsGuts
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To: Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus

LOL...thanks for chiming in :o)


34 posted on 12/10/2008 9:08:41 AM PST by GodGunsGuts
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To: GodGunsGuts
Sorry, can't be correct.

You see, there's a consensus. Scientific democracy demands that HIV does cause AIDS.

35 posted on 12/10/2008 9:09:34 AM PST by TChris (So many useful idiots...)
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To: ASOC

I knew, and I’ve never been to Thailand.


36 posted on 12/10/2008 9:11:11 AM PST by null and void (Hey 0bama? There will be a pop quiz every day for the next four years...miss a question, people die.)
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To: ASOC
SO, does this mean smoking causes AIDS? Drinking apple juice? Thailand?

Need you even ask? It's Bush's fault!

37 posted on 12/10/2008 9:11:39 AM PST by Jibaholic ("Those people who are not ruled by God will be ruled by tyrants." --William Penn)
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To: GodGunsGuts

Dr. Duesberg. Please call your office.


38 posted on 12/10/2008 9:11:50 AM PST by tang-soo (Prophecy of the Seventy Weeks - Read Daniel Chapter 9)
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To: TChris

See my profile page. If you agree that what is contained there needs to be investigated and exposed, please consider joining my (infrequent) Rethinking AIDS ping list. All the best—GGG


39 posted on 12/10/2008 9:11:50 AM PST by GodGunsGuts
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To: mysterio
Researchers have known HIV is the cause of AIDS for 20 years or so.

Researchers have also known for quite a while that light is a gas that propagates through the aether, too.

40 posted on 12/10/2008 9:12:51 AM PST by Titus Quinctius Cincinnatus (Nihil utile nisi quod honestum - Marcus Tullius Cicero)
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To: Scythian

AIDS is a COLLECTION of opportunistic DISEASES, which attack the body AFTER the immune system, has been rendered ineffective by a repeated exposure to those multiple infections typical to and acquired from homosexual sex.

When you play in a sewer, you get sick.

HIV is a harmless “piggyback” virus. There exist people with full blown AIDS who have no trace of HIV; and other people, who although their blood is loaded with HIV cells for decades, they never develop AIDS. Dr. Peter Duesberg showed that human white blood cells thrive in a Petri dish loaded with the HIV virus. The HIV-AIDS connection is completely political, driven by the corruption of the research establishment, whose ethics have been destroyed through their addiction to federal funding.


41 posted on 12/10/2008 9:17:44 AM PST by TCH (Another redneck clinging to guns and religion)
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To: ASOC

AIDS is over-diagnosed, especially in the third world countries where simple ailments like pneumonia and malaria are life-threatening to those who are mal-nourished, under-developed and lack access to proper hydration.

Urban cases represent years of severe self-abuse through drugs, STDs and injury.

This is less important than the fact that a lie is willingly perpetuated to gain and retain funding for a political movement in the name of scientific inquiry.


42 posted on 12/10/2008 9:21:10 AM PST by Old Professer (The critic writes with rapier pen, dips it twice, then writes again.)
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To: GodGunsGuts

So what is the cause of AIDS?? Habitual feces consumption?


43 posted on 12/10/2008 9:24:44 AM PST by Neoliberalnot ((Hallmarks of Liberalism: Ingratitude and Envy))
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To: Scythian

They are saying there was never proof that it was the virus blamed and it still is not fully explained.

A consensus of error, if you will.


44 posted on 12/10/2008 9:26:34 AM PST by Old Professer (The critic writes with rapier pen, dips it twice, then writes again.)
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To: Neoliberalnot

LOL. No, but said discusting behaviors can lead to many other nasty diseases. For laman’s versions of what these scientists say causes AIDS, see my profile page. Pay particular attention to the Conservative Press section of my profile page. If, after reading up on the subject, you would like to be added to the Rethinking AIDS ping list, drop me a FReepmail. All the best—GGG


45 posted on 12/10/2008 9:27:22 AM PST by GodGunsGuts
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To: mysterio

Not so, they have just accepted the notion as it is very lucrative to do so and very costly to disagree.


46 posted on 12/10/2008 9:28:40 AM PST by Old Professer (The critic writes with rapier pen, dips it twice, then writes again.)
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To: GodGunsGuts
"Among RA's founders and key members are.......University of California at Berkeley molecular biologist Dr. Peter Duesberg...."

Duesberg exonerates himself!!!!!!!

(Imagine that. Yea, that'll work)

Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

47 posted on 12/10/2008 9:35:21 AM PST by DoctorMichael (Creationists on the internet: The Ignorant, amplifying the Stupid.)
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To: TCH
AIDS is a COLLECTION of opportunistic DISEASES, which attack the body AFTER the immune system, has been rendered ineffective by a repeated exposure to those multiple infections typical to and acquired from homosexual sex.

So, how do you explain the astronomical death-rates of HIV-infected hemophiliacs who got the virus from tained blood, then later died of AIDS? How about children born infected with HIV who later die of the same AIDS-related diseases?

There exist people with full blown AIDS who have no trace of HIV

There are people out there who have immune-system disorders who fall prey to the same types of diseases as AIDS-sufferers. But, the existence of other immune-system diseases is not an argument against HIV causing AIDS.

and other people, who although their blood is loaded with HIV cells for decades, they never develop AIDS

Sure. So what? You will always find people with immunities to certain illnesses. Also, our modern regimes of ant-virals give people with HIV the ability to fight the illness.

48 posted on 12/10/2008 9:35:42 AM PST by Citizen Blade (What would Ronald Reagan do?)
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To: GodGunsGuts

If HIV causes AIDS, then how is Magic Johnson still alive?


49 posted on 12/10/2008 9:36:49 AM PST by Homer1
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To: GodGunsGuts

I don’t have a problem with HIV not being the cause, but as I recall, every positive case of AIDS is also positive for the virus. Is there a new virus? Regardless, deviant sexual behavior has led to a host of infectious disease problems. “Gays” are the #1 vector for the spread of diseases among humans and many foreign nations want rid of this public health threat, but not the US. Male homosexuals have the highest incidence of HIV/AIDS, syphilis, drug-resistant gonorrhea, entamoeba histolytica, chlamydia, herpes simplex II, Chancroid, Drug Resistant TB, Hepatitis A, Hepatitis B, Hepatitis non A & B, just to name a few. The press of course never discusses the CDC facts, but if you want to look for yourself the information is in the scientific literature. More than any other segment of society, the homosexuals are costing us billions in medical care. This is the outrage that gets ignored—hey, we have smokers to blame for bad habits.


50 posted on 12/10/2008 9:43:48 AM PST by Neoliberalnot ((Hallmarks of Liberalism: Ingratitude and Envy))
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