Posted on 01/12/2009 3:23:08 AM PST by pobeda1945
BEIJING, Jan. 12 (Xinhua) -- The "Mengshi (Warriors)" off-road military vehicle produced by Chinese automaker Dongfeng Motor surpasses U.S. Humvee in 12 out of 15 major battlefield performance indices, chief designer Huang Song has said.
Use by the Chinese military force has proven that "Mengshi" overtakes Humvee in 12 indices, including the loading capacity andoil consumption, and are well-matched with Humvee in three other indices, Huang was quoted as saying by Monday's Economic Information Daily, a Xinhua publication.
It took Dongfeng six years to develop the vehicle, which had undergone more than 200,000 hours of factory tests and more than 1.6 million kilometers of road tests before mass production.
The vehicle was formally equipped to the People's Liberation Army in 2007.
"Mengshi" has also passed various environmental and geological tests, including airdropping, high altitude and extreme heat and cold weather conditions.
With 75 patents, the 1.5-ton high mobility vehicle met all military requirements, said Huang.
It also won the first class award of national science and technology progress at the 2008 State Top Scientific and Technological Awarding Conference here last Friday.
This was the first such award won by the auto industry in 22 years.
Interesting that China didn’t post a photo of their vehicle with their article. The appearance of it must be top secret or something(??).
I hope its crash tests are better than the Chinese Chery car: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3F3nLj9ljWo
There is a pic at this link. It looks familiar somehow. Hmm.
http://eng.wcetv.com/1/2009/01/12/125s9381.htm
Indices aren't mentioned. :-\
Rear seat legroom, glove compartment capacity and ease of hubcap removal?
Dofeng Mengshi
No word on a civilian version for the Chinese and foreign export market.
"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus
Yet another Chinese clone! Wonder if that’ll end up on ebay?
"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus
Urban Gorilla: http://www.4x4bodies.com/ turns just about any SUV/pickup into a Hummer H1 clone in various configurations.
"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus
The article says it has 75 patents. Curious that the Chi-com copycats are suddenly concerned about patents.....
"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus
If I was not reading the story I’d have said “Hummer”.
For Glorious report of Better Chinese Humveeee...er Mengshi, we mean.
Better Chinese testing agents have found that glorious Chinese Humveeee...er Mengshi, we mean, out performs lowly and badly made U.S. vehicles.
Unbiased Chinese testing further confirms that glorious Chinese Humveeee...er Mengshi, we mean, will always be better than capitalist pig American vehicle.
Chinese testing was performed without telling testing agents that they would be imprisoned in a hole so dark that no light gets in nor were they threatened that their organs would be ripped from their still war bodies and sold on black market. Testing agents swore of their own free will that glorious Chinese Humveeee...er Mengshi, we mean, is best ever seen in whole of world.
We are just better. Face it pigs.
The HMMWV went into service in 1984. The Chinese are copying it 20 years later and this is somehow impressive?
They're trying to rehabilitate their image as an outlaw nation on the issue of intellectual properties. What they're doing is known as "patent breaking." Thomas Edison was a very prolific patent breaker. He carefully examined a competitor's patent application, helpfully published by the patent office years before the patent was granted, and developed a way to "work around" the patent with a similar device that would not infringe his competitor's patent. The Chinese are doing this.
Under international law, patents expire after 20 years. It means that if your company spent the millions of dollars to develop something like antilock brakes or GPS, and hundreds of thousands more to obtain worldwide patent rights, your market share and your employees' job security will only last 20 years before somebody in Malaysia can build it for 20 cents an hour. You can either lower your prices cheaper than theirs, or you can go back to the drawing board and develop something new.
I saw no evidence of it when we went to China for Nortel. They confiscated our RF test gear and we sat in a hotel room for almost three weeks waiting to get it back. They could have just as easily bought it on the open market and copied it. It was commonly available test gear, nothing secret. When we did get it back it was obvious it had been disassembled, inspected and reassembled, only nothing worked. Kinda reminds me of that Chinese crescent wrench I threw into some bushes on a site in Kentucky after it jammed at a most inopportune moment. It did look like a crescent wrench, though.....
Rear seat legroom, glove compartment capacity and ease of hubcap removal?
You weren't looking in the right place, the correct specs are:
Rear seat regroom
Grove compartment capacity
Ease of hubcap removar
> China is capable of producing high quality trucks. Its obviously a clone of the Humvee.
Quality trucks, quality tools, quality instrumentation... while the world has slept China has done exactly what Japan did. And it worked.
India is doing the same thing.
Here in NZ we have been getting Chinese and Indian manufactured goods at ridiculously cheap prices, ahead of most the rest of the world. To begin with, it was mostly junk. Then, mostly hi-quality knock-offs of Japanese or Korean goods. Now, Chinese branded goods and not so inexpensive anymore.
If America still wants to have a manufacturing capability they better watch out: after WW-II they stood alone in this field. Now, there is Japan, Germany, Korea, China, India, Russia...
I am going to let you in on a little secret...auto manufacturing is one of the most low tech manufacturing items available today. Anyone can be trained to work on an assembly line in less than 3 minutes. The reason the foreign companies have the advantage is they can fire the incompetent, and the lazy. Our auto companies do not have that luxury.......
It is a cracker box on a pickup or Surburban Frame. I have a Yukon XL 2500, that is far more comfortable, and stylish, and it has the same 4x4 running gear and ground clearance for half the money..................??????
“The “Mengshi (Warriors)” off-road military vehicle produced by Chinese automaker Dongfeng Motor surpasses U.S. Humvee in 12 out of 15 major battlefield performance indices, chief designer Huang Song has said.”
So - - - if you don’t believe the Chinese vehicle is better than the Humvee, just ask the designer of it. He’ll tell you.
So, what does your Gaelic tagline say? “All Ozzies are losers and traveling Poms? ??? ;-)
They do everything on the cheap. Look at it from their perspective. Why should they have to go out and buy it when these Nortel guys just delivered it to them free of charge?
I haven’t read all posts, but thought I’d mention that GM which manufactures Hummers is doing some manufacturing in China. I’m not sure what vehicles and what the arrangement is with China, but it appears on the surfaceChina has GM’s blueprints for the Hummer.
(grin!) It’s my family motto:
“I am the Chieftain of my Clan. I bow to nobody. Get out of my way.”
It may very well be true, but if it is true, building that vehicle in an American factory would cost significantly more than building a Humvee. It's not very hard to multiply all the dimensions by 1.1 or even 1.01, to get higher ground clearance and greater cargo capacity. Of course, they don't have to deal with such Congressionally imposed refinements as passenger restraint systems and emission controls ...
I’ll wait for consumer reports. They will prove that the japanese humvee is the smart choice.
I am and it's the up close and personal kind of perspective. I know the Chi-coms are copycats. I've seen it first hand, but you don't have to go to China to see that. I also know that they deserve every bit of the reputation they have for not honoring patents and intellectual property rights. This notion that they are suddenly worried about their reputation in this area is just more Chi-com propaganda, sorta like how they claim their knock off Humvee beats the original article in 12 out of 15 "tests".
Why should they have to go out and buy it when these Nortel guys just delivered it to them free of charge?
Professional ethics? Honoring the rule of international law? Honesty? Integrity?
> I am going to let you in on a little secret...auto manufacturing is one of the most low tech manufacturing items available today.
I suspect that if the Chinese aren’t using robots by now, they will be very soon.
I know, since the patent is expired, we can stop making our own hummers and start buying them from the chinee.
Maybe...just maybe...I buy one for about $1500 new. Secretly import it to the US. Glue an “H1” emblem on the side and sell it to some yuppie for $100,000. He could likely still get parts and service from the local GM dealer. They may not be able to tell, either...
I thought one of the reasons the foreigns are doing so well here was because they DO spend the money and time to thoroughly train the line workers, and not just on one station, but on many different ones so they can react to market and personnel changes. Not that being able to fire someone if it’s just not working out isn’t a huge competitive advantage.
Have you noticed how ironic it is that it’s almost impossible to fire someone for cause in America today, but firing them (laying them off) for NO cause is the easiest thing in the world.
Does any chinese have any integrity, honesty, and ethics, or is it just the government that is sneaky and inscrutable?
Mengshi must be chinese for Hummer.
And don't forget it's in that journalistic blowtorch The Economic Information Daily, (a Xinhua publication). Double plus good.
Obviously, I can't speak for the entire population. Some of the average folks we met were salt of the earth types and would literally give you the shirt off of their back if you needed it. This is way more than I can say for the Russians I worked with on another project. However, all of the "officials" we encountered in China seemed suspect of us and everything we brought with us. Some of that is a cultural thing, but I think most Americans would feel that they were treated, at best, rudely if they had gone through the same experiences we did with Chinese customs. I know several others who traveled to China to work on other projects and everyone pretty much came away with the same impression.
Yep either that's one of the three "indices" that didn't measure up or they just didn't do crash testing at all.
I'd bet huge money as well that there are no long-term reliability tests in that report.
No. NFW. Japan's intent has always been to make money by making quality products. The first couple of years were a little rough quality wise.
China's intent has always been to make money. Period. Reliability and quality are absolutely not in the mix. There are uncountable stories of Chinese counterfeiting, poor quality, thievery, and outright fraud every day. And there is no sign whatsoever that they have any intention to make a good product.
I've said it before and I'll say it again, the first thing a Chinese company does when they are given (or steal) a design for an electronic device (let's say it's a DVD player) is to sort the list of materials by price, then systematically try to eliminate parts one at a time to determine if the thing still runs without it. If it does, the part stays out. It's left for the customer to determine that that part was there to make sure that the thing still worked after a year as other parts "drifted" slightly away from their original operating characteristics.
If I recall correctly .. x42 signed a law regarding American patents.
What used to be a 99 year protection (I think) was changed to 18 months, or something like that.
China is only CYA'ing themselves to be (more) part of the American economy .. IMO.
It took them 6 years to take apart and reverse engineer a hummer?
A friend of mine has a patent on a taser like device he's trying to sell to the military. I recall him saying his patent was good for 20 years from the date of application. Not sure what x42 did regarding American patents, but I would imagine if he did do something and it involved the Chinese it was not in our best interest.....not to worry, though, I'm confident x42 would have profited handsomely from his efforts.....
A good friend was for a number of years with Army Intelligence and was in charge of analyzing captured Russian vehicles during the Cold War. While analyzing a captured Russian truck with his team it began to remind him of a GM truck that he had owned for many years. It needed a new head gasket so he sent a man down to the auto store and obtained the same one he had used in his GM truck. With some very minor adjustments it fit.
They have taken the HumVee and jumped it with a bunch of improvement patents. Unfortunately, the damage done by Robert Strange McNamara makes it more difficult for us to stay ahead in this game. The damage done to our patent system by Clinton and Gore as amplified under Bush has also put us at a great disadvantage.
It looks like they would not dare use the familiar vertical grill bars. GM wouldn’t like hat.
> China’s intent has always been to make money. Period. Reliability and quality are absolutely not in the mix.
Remember I said that here in NZ we get the Chinese and Indian stuff sooner than you get it in the US (good reasons for that: we are a small-yet-sophisticated test market)?
I think you are still seeing the “cheap phase” stuff, just like Japan had (and BTW it lasted from the close of WW-II until well into the 1960’s. When I was growing up people were still talking about “Jap Crap”)
I have a Chinese drill press in my garage. It is bolt-for-bolt identical to a Ryobi: the castings could have been made in the same moulds.
My drill press is red. The Ryobi is green. That is the only difference. Except the price, of course: I paid $200 less for my drill press than what the Ryobi would have cost.
I have a Dremel tool in front of me, made in China. Except it isn’t a Dremel tool, just a very good imitation. Very rugged. Cost me half what a Dremel would have cost.
I could walk thru my garage and come up with quite a few more examples. The Chinese still make lousy stainless steel and tool steel, but that will change soon.
There are uncountable stories of Chinese counterfeiting, poor quality, thievery, and outright fraud every day. And there is no sign whatsoever that they have any intention to make a good product.
Your story is not the first I’ve heard about the Chinese trying to reverse engineer everything they can get their hands on.
I also laughed about the wrench story. The thing is just like the Japanese tools were once crap the Chinese ones are becoming better and better. Especially since the west insists on giving them fully working factories to reverse engineer!
The article says it weighs 1.5 tons? Is it made of tin foil?
My Nissan Sentra weighs more than that.
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