Skip to comments.When will Atlas shrug?
Posted on 03/15/2009 7:12:05 PM PDT by george76
What is the breaking point? Where will the resistance form? Heavy questions, but unavoidable in the current political climate. The productive members of society can only be pushed so far, some say.
What they envision is not defiance of law or a reversal of the election. It is people's growing disengagement from a new economic order that punishes effort and rewards envy the creepy future that Bill Ritter and Barack Obama intend for us.
Columnist Michelle Malkin calls that withdrawal "going Galt."
Malkin was the first speaker last weekend when several hundred Coloradans gathered for a free-market leadership conference in Colorado Springs. Her reference was to John Galt, the individualist hero of Ayn Rand's novel, "Atlas Shrugged." She told of seeing a placard at the protest rally for Obama's stimulus bill signing that warned: "Atlas will shrug."
So what, you ask. In human behavior, incentives matter. People are choosers, not automatons. Mess them over enough and they're out of here. All history proves it. "We pretend to work and they pretend to pay us." That bitter joke among Soviet factory drones sums up collectivism's ultimate failure wherever tried.
As ever more people ride in the wagon and fewer are left to pull it, there will come a breaking point. Crowding taxation onto the highest earners and debt onto our kids, as President Obama proposes, invites collapse.
Ignoring the constitution at will, as Gov. Bill Ritter and the spending lobby do, breeds contempt. Ruin must result.
Cold War victory taught us the power of ideas. The East crumbled when the West asserted the superiority of liberty, wakened by thinkers like F.A. Hayek with his expose of the road to serfdom and Frederic Bastiat with his ridicule of "everyone seeking to live at the expense of everyone else."
(Excerpt) Read more at denverpost.com ...
Existing businesses closing and new ones not opening.
For example, Cabellas was to open a new store in Denver.
The locals put up a fuss for years until approvals were finally given.
Now Cabellas is not going to build.
Thanks for the journey, george!
Yes, agree on the military stuff as well, on their website they kinda go off on them as not being concerned about the environment, but I know for a fact that most bases are kept pristine, so much so, that the land is coveted by developers, hunters, environmentalist, etc. Also,the Libertarians didn’t seem to have as much depth with respect to property rights, 2nd amendment, and anti-globalism...at least when compared to the Constitution Party. I have been talking to folks at the RNC as well, but they seem dazed and confused over there and its giving me an uneasy feeling. Thanks for your thoughts.
Good to hear from you.
I feel like we are slowly being boiled.. with no real escape.
I’m all for it, once we figure out what “it” is.
Yeah, Eddie did get screwed over, huh? Lifelong friend to Dagney and never made it to the gulch.
A man who hates the present set up and sees it as unworkable does not become our intellectual ally in any sense, by that fact alone. That fact is politically barren. It is dry tinder for demagogues, and not any basis of rational policy. By all means let's convince them. Don't pretend we already have, when all of this was plain as a pikestaff in November, and they still voted for the wrong people.
sorry, I have to pass.
It not a coincidence that most of their national leaders are nuttier than fruitcakes. - Their international policy is nuts.
Left the big time of letting people use my mind and creativity, closed my productive and (generally) highly profitable businesses and only took the occasional 'flunky' level jobs to learn stuff for my own education and skill learning.
Last year, for the first time since I was 12 years old, I made sure I had no legally taxable income.
All this started before
Mr. Thompson Obama was elected President.
I'm currently building my own self sufficient mini-Gulch.
Homey don't play dis no mo.
The end comes within hours after the next dollar of debt produces negative GDP. Exponential math, systemic failure.
Atlas doesn’t get to shrug. Atlas is going to have to fight. If Atlas believes anything else Atlas is engaging in wishful thinking.
The shrug must come first. It’s the fruits of the shrug which will push the leftist even further, to the tipping point for the rest of us. When the producers stop producing and consumers stop consuming, the leftist will become more desperate and more totalitarian. We can’t fix this mess until enough people realize the situation and collectively decide to do what is necessary.
Galt is the only way to kill the beast. I hope that's happening. It'll be a rough ride, but the rewards in the end will be worth it.
FReepers are the best!
Ditto. Too many people WANT everything without having to do something to earn it. In order for that to happen, there has to be slaves. Today, the U.S. tax payers are being used as slaves to the world and they're figuring it out.
“collectivism’s ultimate failure wherever tried”
those that think socialism has always failed don’t understand its purpose
Hopefully never. Despite her facile, repetitive writing style, Ayn Rand seems to be one of those authors that people discuss more than they read. Has the author read the book?
The result of Atlas Shrugging (or Going Galt, or however you want to put it) was that civilization collapsed and billions of people died. Rand never could align several of her issues, and as such, there’s a fair amount of incoherency in her books.
See, while Rand idolizes all the titans of industry (which she supposes must all think like her in the end), she depicts them as fatalist cowards. Rather than fight back and fend off the nanny-state, she depicts them as all retreating to a “Eureka”-like village, adopting the tactics of the labor movement she so abhors. They never do step back in when they declare, “see, you guys do need us!” (Although the book does include a 150-page rehash of all of its ideas, “This is John Galt.”) Instead, they watch billions of people die while they retreat to an existence closer to Rousseau’s ideal than Edison’s, Reagan’s or Locke’s. In some ways, it’s a fantastically better written companion piece to “The Turner Diaries.”
Eddie is the character which most exposes Rand’s confusion. While the “heroine” Dagny Taggart is going off exploring her sexuality with three different lovers, it’s Eddie, not Dagny, who literally keeps the trains running, demonstrating leadership, intelligence and creativity. Rand actually details his fantastic role in quite some detail. But because Eddie isn’t the ideologue that Dagny is, the reader never gets his point-of-view in the literary sense. At the end, he’s left outside the Eureka-like village.
To be used as a slave, or not to be used as a slave? That is the question.
You do know that the answer to that question was to die, don’t you?
Atlas has bills to pay and a family to feed. If he shrugs, they get evicted and/or starve.
One of the things I always noticed about Galt’s Gulch and Rand’s heroes - there are never any kids... Maybe they’re not allowed to be seen OR heard... or maybe she forgot completely about them.
Well, let's face it. Our options are limited. Either way, we lose. Think Joseph Stalin.
>>>>>>To be used as a slave, or not to be used as a slave? That is the question. <<<<<<
>>>>You do know that the answer to that question was to die, dont you?<<<<
>>Well, let's face it. Our options are limited. Either way, we lose. Think Joseph Stalin. <<
To accept death while there are still battles left to be fought is cowardice, so yes, I'll say it:
Ayn Rand is to capitalism what David Koresh was, at least in legend, to religion.
For those not familiar with what we’re discussing:
When I said, “You do know the answer to that question was to die, don’t you?” I was referring to Spartacus. Ayn Rand did not advocate suicide. However, I would suggest that for these industry titans to withdraw from the world and its implementation of their technology is analogous to suicide for those who struggled so hard to prosper.
Probably what will have more impact than Galt will be when the real producers realize and understand: The Pareto principle (also known as the 80-20 rule).
In some organizations and maybe society, the top 10 of producers may produce 90% of the results.
When Zer0’s ‘punish the so called rich bs’ starts to impact these people/high producers, they take steps to protect themselves and their families from being pillaged and raped to provide a lifestyle for the non producers.
There will be a double hit on these producers in states like California as they are taxed more and more to pay for the illegals in our society and the left wing drones.
We who have been pulling this welfare wagon full of lazy bums are fed up.
We are retiring, cutting back...as we can.
The final straw for many of us is when the lazy crooks complain that we are not pulling fast enough.
Now, they can try to pull their own wagon without us.
No worries...the graphic is signed. ;o)
Thank you for the link!
ah! a voice of reason
Thank you ...
The Republican conservative party has got to grow and change from being a bunch of old pale, white haired men that only allows a candidate to emerge and have a turn at being President ... only after he has paid his dues for years,... which has prov en to be as losing policy.
THEY MUST GO FORWARD WITH YOUNGER STRONG CANDIDATES WITH TRUE CONSERVATIVE BASIS. Otherwise we are whistling past the graveyard.
One thing the democrats do that works, is get behind who ever their candidate is and supports him. They will vote for a yellow dog ... truly, if he were their candidate.
“We cant fix this mess until enough people realize the situation and collectively decide to do what is necessary”
As long as everybody realizes that, even under the best of circumstances, ‘enough’ will never be ‘a lot’.
Interesting point.....not too often made.
It seems to me, after almost six decades as a voting-age adult and having been exposed to the theories, strategies, and tactics of Marx and all the subsequent deriviatives thereof, that the main purpose has always been the control of the mind, property, and souls of those they rule.
On this basis a case could be made that Marxism, Fabianism, Socialism, Nazism, Communism, Gramsci_ism, and a few others have always succeeded.
"Failure" is a legitimate attribute only if other sordid undesirable (from their point of view) attributes such as "freedom", "prosperity", "liberty", and "happiness" have to be included in the analysis.
The one that gets me is that they glorify natural athletes and those who have a gift for entertaining others. Nothing wrong with being born with those natural abilities and using them to make millions, but you'd better not be born with a brain for business and use it to make money, because that's just greedy. The hypocrisy is fascinating.
This is how a billion plus people will die from famine and disease. If the shipping business that ship food and supplies gets chopped down so drastically, there’s no way to ramp up quickly.
>> Galt et al didn’t just leave because they felt like it, and civilization was already collapsing when they left. <<
No, they did something to flee... but they did flee.
>> Galt, Reardon, Mulligan, and the like all left society as a means of fleeing the inevitable collapse of a runaway socialist civilization. <<
Inevitable? Well Galt certainly abandoned all hope, but that’s precisely what’s so damned contemptible about the story. It divides humankind into two camps: a tiny number of producers, and a preponderance of leeches. But what about people like Eddie? Eddie didn’t build the railroad like Dagny did; he stayed within the corporation he rose up through, and so seems to have discarded as useless. Is he? He kept the railroad running while Dagny was experimenting with multiple sexual dalliances, demonstrating leadership, courage, persistence, intelligence, loyalty, and creativity. Galt and Taggart didn’t believe in God, and neither did Rand. So when they perceived they were losing, they abandoned hope and assured the utter destruction of everything they had created. In the end, they were LOSERS because they had no source of hope, in either God nor the inherent nature of man to desire freedom. Through Taggart and Galt, Rand expressed her belief that man was content being a useless serf to a socialistic totalitarian nanny-state. And because of that belief, Taggart and Galt surrendered in the face of that nanny-state. Contrast their behavior, say, to Frodo Baggins’.
>> Have you read the book yourself? <<
That’s a fairly insulting question, because the implication is that I’m parroting someone else’s interpretation. Have you read anyone else make similar points to mine?
THANK YOU! I had gotten wrapped up in my own discussion on this thread, and was wondering if anyone else notices the prepostrous injustice Rand / Taggart / Galt serves to Eddie.
Classical Athens lasted about 170 years. This may be all that we can do as Americans before sinking into the mire of typical governmental tyranny that most of the world has faced since the Sumerians built their first city.
In a thousand years, someone might emerge with the Federalist Papers and the Constitution and wonder about us and examine what went wrong.
Well, no. That didn't happen in the book. One of our objectives in the FReeper Book Club's study of this beast is to attempt to figure out exactly what she did expect to happen. I'm not ruling that prediction out, in fact I think it entirely possible, but it didn't happen within the confines of the novel.
One difficulty with the thing is that Atlas doesn't actually shrug within it, he only begins to. Rand gives us one hopeful image at the end, covered wagons, but it is entirely unclear how, precisely, she expects a new society to coalesce around the precepts of Galt. A lot of utopian fiction - I include Karl Marx - suffers from that difficulty. There is a finely planned and executed sequence of destruction and fall, and then poof! - magic. Voila! The State withers away. Abracadabra! Laissez faire capitalism spreads throughout the land. Maybe so, maybe no, but I haven't seen either one yet.
The pertinence of Atlas Shrugged to the moment is, at least for me, in the mechanism of that decay and fall. In that I think she's disturbingly accurate. Why that is so is another question we'll be taking up. Anyone who wishes to discuss these things, please join us. Publius is keeping the ping list.
In a thousand years, someone might emerge with the Federalist Papers and the Constitution and wonder about us and examine what went wrong."
The thing that pisses me off the most is that:
After all, it is the elders amongst us that bear the responsibility (through inaction of many sorts) for what has happened. Therefore, it is the elders who should pay the price to reestablish the Constitutional republic.
(It would also solve all the major problems associated with Social Security and Medicare.)
A Tale of Two Novels: Ayn Rand’s Atlas Shrugged vs James Joyce’s Ulysses
source cannot be posted, see link in post below | August 8, 1998 | Harry Binswanger
Posted on 03/15/2009 2:06:16 PM PDT by Lorianne
Thank you ...
Yes, thank you my fine sir. We shall all hang together or hand separately. And Galt’s clutch does not exist. It never has, never will, and never could; except perhaps if Galt’s Clutch is a warm gun and freedom's greatest death wish. That is all.
We had Cabela’s ditch out in Indy also.
And that was after demanding (and receiving) incredible corporate welfare (aka free land and tax abatements) from the state and city (Greenwood).
I’m going to make one for myself:
See You At the Beach
Yes but there still is this huge learning curve as to HOW to go about this and it always turns into socialism one way or the other. Years of public schooling have fully disabled any time of individualistic thought processes.
What is the breaking point? Where will the resistance form?***
I don’t know, but if We The People ever do figure that one out it’s sure going to be H-E-L-L for our current commie oligarchy.