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Vatican insiders declare the Pope a 'disaster'
The Telegraph ^ | 3/19/2009 | Nick Squires in Rome

Posted on 03/19/2009 5:06:17 PM PDT by bruinbirdman

Pope Benedict's repeated gaffes and the Vatican's inability to manage his message in the internet era are threatening to undermine his papacy, Vatican insiders have said.

The Holy See is struggling to contain international anger over the Pope's claim on his first official visit to Africa that Aids "cannot be overcome through the distribution of condoms, which even aggravates the problems".

The Pope's remarks about condoms, and a recent furore over his lifting of the 20-year excommunication of a British bishop who has questioned the Holocaust, has left him looking isolated and out of touch, prompting calls for a radical shake-up of the way the Holy See delivers its message.

The Pope is isolated and fails to adequately consult his advisers, said a Vatican source with 20 years' knowledge of the Holy See.

Another Vatican insider described Pope Benedict's four-year-old papacy as "a disaster", recalling the pontiff's previous inflammatory remarks on Islam and homosexuality.

"He's out of touch with the real world," the Italian insider said. "On the condom issue, for example, there are priests and bishops in Africa who accept that condoms are a key part of the fight against Aids, and yet the pope adheres to this very conservative line that they encourage promiscuity. The Vatican is far removed from the reality on the ground."

The Vatican's traditional culture of secrecy has made it ill-equipped to communicate its message in the internet age.

The Holy See claimed that the Pope had no idea that British bishop Richard Williamson had denied the extent of the Holocaust, but critics have pointed out that a simple Google search would have uncovered the maverick's anti-Semitic views.

"Until recently the Vatican was secretive and their way of controlling the message of the Church was to release information slowly and highly

(Excerpt) Read more at telegraph.co.uk ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: africa; bxvi; catholic; catholicbashing; hitpiece; popebenedict; unnamedsources; vatican
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1 posted on 03/19/2009 5:06:18 PM PDT by bruinbirdman
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To: NYer

“insider” ping


2 posted on 03/19/2009 5:07:49 PM PDT by Gene Eric
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To: bruinbirdman

Oh PULEAZE!! The Pope is FABULOUS!! He’s NOT a politician.


3 posted on 03/19/2009 5:09:18 PM PDT by Ann Archy (Abortion....the Human Sacrifice to the god of Convenience.)
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To: bruinbirdman

Oh, BROTHER.


4 posted on 03/19/2009 5:09:44 PM PDT by workerbee (If you vote for Democrats, you are engaging in UnAmerican Activity.)
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To: bruinbirdman
"cannot be overcome through the distribution of condoms, which even aggravates the problems".

It is a scientific fact that the AIDs virus is so small it can easily move through the wall of a condom.

5 posted on 03/19/2009 5:09:48 PM PDT by Balding_Eagle (If Liberals would pay their taxes, there would be no deficit..)
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To: bruinbirdman

Maybe the Pope should hire David Axelrod and do a “Hopey Changey” campaign... /s


6 posted on 03/19/2009 5:11:58 PM PDT by LibFreeOrDie (Obama promised a gold mine, but he will give us the shaft.)
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To: bruinbirdman

Bring it.

Israel, we got your back
Papa Benedict, we got your back
Sarah, we got your back
Glenn, we got your back
Gov Sanford, we got your back
Rush, we got your back
Ann, we got your back
Michelle, we got your back
Laura, we got your back
Allen West, we got your back

Any other conservative true leaders who want to stand up and grow a set, BRING IT ! WE GOT YOUR BACK!!!!!!!!!!


7 posted on 03/19/2009 5:12:36 PM PDT by wombtotomb
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To: bruinbirdman

abstinence is guaranteed. whats so hard to understand about that.


8 posted on 03/19/2009 5:13:19 PM PDT by iskra123
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To: Balding_Eagle
"It is a scientific fact that the AIDs virus is so small it can easily move through the wall of a condom."

That is absolute unequivocal rubbish. An animal skin condom perhaps, but absolutely not a latex condom.

As for this Pope, he's certainly no John Paul, but everyone knew that going in. He's effective enough.

9 posted on 03/19/2009 5:14:43 PM PDT by Big_Monkey
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To: bruinbirdman; Quix; narses; SunkenCiv

Isn’t it theorized from Nostradamus to Edgar Cayce that the world will end after the pope is somehow removed from power?

Don’t get me wrong, I am not a subscriber to the prophecies of either, it just came to mind.


10 posted on 03/19/2009 5:14:57 PM PDT by Perdogg (The difference between Madoff and the US Congress is about a trillion dollars)
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To: bruinbirdman

The next pope is the anti-christ...or is the the false prophet? the current pope is supposed to serve a very short term(relative to the past popes).

This is from memory. Anyone able to back this up with a link of some kind? I have no idea where to look. My memory is too foggy.


11 posted on 03/19/2009 5:14:57 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: Ann Archy

Thank you! I’m not Catholic, but I will take up for the Pope. He is being slammed for having the courage to speak the truth!


12 posted on 03/19/2009 5:15:31 PM PDT by fishergirl (My warrior, my soldier, my hero - my son. God bless our troops!)
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To: bruinbirdman

Vatican incider knowitallll.
13 posted on 03/19/2009 5:15:31 PM PDT by Leo Carpathian (fffffFRrrreeeeepppeeee-ssed!)
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To: bruinbirdman

Exactly, what or who is a “vatican insider”? The Pope is a “disaster” based on the comments of an unknown “vatican insider”? Geez.


14 posted on 03/19/2009 5:15:55 PM PDT by vortigern (Watch this: http://youtube.com/watch?v=ZxBX8sz3tO8)
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To: bruinbirdman

“He’s out of touch with the real world,”

I certainly hope so.


15 posted on 03/19/2009 5:17:21 PM PDT by John W
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To: fishergirl
Sadly.....ANYONE and EVERYONE that speak the TRUTH is VILLIFIED!!!

Up is down....good is bad...black is white!

16 posted on 03/19/2009 5:17:23 PM PDT by Ann Archy (Abortion....the Human Sacrifice to the god of Convenience.)
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To: vortigern

Exactly. This reminds me of a joke- Why will someone believe you if you tell them there are 4 billion stars in the sky, but have to touch to see if you tell them the paint is wet.

Morons


17 posted on 03/19/2009 5:17:31 PM PDT by wombtotomb
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To: Perdogg
"Isn’t it theorized from Nostradamus to Edgar Cayce that the world will end after the pope is somehow removed from power?"

Somehow, I don't picture The Pope sitting at a keyboard blogging.

That could only mean?

yitbos

18 posted on 03/19/2009 5:18:20 PM PDT by bruinbirdman ("Those who control language control minds.")
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To: vortigern
Exactly, what or who is a “vatican insider”?

The Vatican's newest theologian keeps to the shadows.

19 posted on 03/19/2009 5:19:20 PM PDT by workerbee (If you vote for Democrats, you are engaging in UnAmerican Activity.)
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To: LibFreeOrDie
Maybe the Pope should hire David Axelrod and do a “Hopey Changey” campaign... /s

Maybe the Pope should do what a real leader would do and go on Jay Leno. /heavy sarcasm
20 posted on 03/19/2009 5:20:21 PM PDT by Ticonderoga34 (A Community Organizer is the 21st century version of a Ward Heeler.)
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To: bruinbirdman
The Telegraph is very anti catholic and I wouldn't believe a word that they say. They are like the media here only asking questions of enamoured Nobama people what their thoughts are on our newest messiah. They search these people out and only give their own spin.
Abstinence makes solid homes, happier children and less to no AIDS
21 posted on 03/19/2009 5:21:02 PM PDT by mckenzie7 ( mohammed = 666)
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To: mamelukesabre
The next pope is the anti-christ...or is the the false prophet?

No. According to prophecy, Pope BXVI will flee Rome and die in exile. A pretender will claim the papal throne and many will accept him as pope but he will not be a valid pope. The Church will be without a pope for a period anywhere from 2-4 years. The Church and the world will undergo a severe chastisement where 3/4 of the population dies. The remaining bishops will gather to elect a valid pope, our last, who will rule about 40 years until antichrist appears. Then it's game over.

What we are about to undergo is a severe chastisement in the end times, but it is not THE end of time.

22 posted on 03/19/2009 5:22:06 PM PDT by Canticle_of_Deborah (The government turns every contingency into an excuse for enhancing power in itself. - John Adams)
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To: bruinbirdman

Wow, what a pile of feces.


23 posted on 03/19/2009 5:25:27 PM PDT by Luke21
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To: bruinbirdman

lemme guess...an”insider”...sounds like an American propagandist trying to lick somebody’s boots in the Obama administration....


24 posted on 03/19/2009 5:25:27 PM PDT by mo
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To: bruinbirdman

Judas could have provided similar quotes about Jesus.


25 posted on 03/19/2009 5:25:52 PM PDT by Raycpa
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To: bruinbirdman

The Pope needs a Teleprompter named TOTV


26 posted on 03/19/2009 5:27:30 PM PDT by omega4179 (Look out below! Thanks Obamanomics.)
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To: bruinbirdman
The Pope is isolated and fails to adequately consult his advisers

The pope knows exactly what he is doing. He makes great decisions. He is awesome.

27 posted on 03/19/2009 5:27:51 PM PDT by GinaLolaB (=^..^=)
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To: bruinbirdman
The Pope is isolated and fails to adequately consult his advisers, said a Vatican source with 20 years' knowledge of the Holy See

Well, since the Almighty is supposed to guide the heart of the Pope, either this "unnamed source" doesn't believe in the word of God, or he doesn't believe that the Pope is guided by God. Either way, he's apparently demonstrating that he doesn't believe at all in the Papal tradition... rather curious for one supposedly in the Vatican for 20+ years.

(I smell a reporter with a penchant for creating quotes.)

28 posted on 03/19/2009 5:29:46 PM PDT by Teacher317
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“Vatican insiders” are akin to career State Department bureaucrats.


29 posted on 03/19/2009 5:30:33 PM PDT by A.A. Cunningham
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To: Ann Archy

Pope Benedict is causing angst among the “politically correct” Vatican politicians, not among the Faithful. He speaks from his heart and his huge intellect.

These ‘insiders’ remind me of people who worked in the Bush White House and then turned on him.


30 posted on 03/19/2009 5:30:36 PM PDT by maica (Barack Obama is a Communist Party Project.)
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To: bruinbirdman

LOL! “Vatican insiders”, huh? Are they kind of like the ‘sources close to the Administration’ who kept giving negative info to the MSM about President Bush?


31 posted on 03/19/2009 5:31:01 PM PDT by SuziQ
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To: Canticle_of_Deborah

Reminds me of that Fatima prophecy about the Holy Father being attacked by a primitive army...which no longer seems so impossible :(


32 posted on 03/19/2009 5:31:32 PM PDT by Graymatter (Don't enable destroyers. File for chapter 44 -- barackruptcy.)
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To: maica

right.....God knows who they are.


33 posted on 03/19/2009 5:32:35 PM PDT by Ann Archy (Abortion....the Human Sacrifice to the god of Convenience.)
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To: bruinbirdman

I’d say the moronic insiders are full of crap


34 posted on 03/19/2009 5:34:05 PM PDT by pissant (THE Conservative party: www.falconparty.com)
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To: LibFreeOrDie

Maybe the Pope should hire David Axelrod to do a “Hopey/Popey/Changey campaign. There fixed it.


35 posted on 03/19/2009 5:34:11 PM PDT by LottieDah (If only those who speak so eloquently on the rights of animals would do so on behalf the unborn)
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To: mamelukesabre

I think you are trying to recall St. Malachy.


36 posted on 03/19/2009 5:34:49 PM PDT by Dutch Boy
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To: workerbee

I can think of a few Catholics who should get the boot..we can start with Kennedy, Princess Pelosi, Kerry...just to get things rolling...


37 posted on 03/19/2009 5:37:29 PM PDT by celtic gal (I think the democRATs should change their logo from a jackass to a RAT with a long tail.)
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To: bruinbirdman

Well, dang he’s right! He said, “Aids cannot be overcome through the distribution of condoms, which even aggravates the problems.” True.


38 posted on 03/19/2009 5:37:39 PM PDT by bvw
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To: bruinbirdman
"He's out of touch with the real world,"

No. He is the Holy Father and the leader of my Church.

39 posted on 03/19/2009 5:37:51 PM PDT by Volunteer (Though I know that the hypnotized never lie, do ya? - The Who)
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To: mo

I’m sure it’s a real liberal....probably part of the lavender mafia.


40 posted on 03/19/2009 5:40:08 PM PDT by CASchack
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To: Perdogg; mamelukesabre

St. Malachy, (d. 1148) Irish Bishop and Seer, produced an accurate list of future popes which began with Pope Celestine II in the year 1143. His list consists of a single line which gives a clue to the characteristics of each pope. From this list of 112 popes there are to be just 2 more after Pope John Paul II who passed away on 2 April 2005. His predictions regarding the popes have been for the most part pretty accurate regarding the identifying characteristics that each line reveals. St. Malachy doesn’t give any predictions or information about what happens after the last pope. According to some other seers, we will have arrived at the end times.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prophecy_of_the_Popes

And...

Prophecy of St. Nilus concerning 20th Century

Catholic Encyclopedia - St Nilus (d. circa 430 AD)
Many, many years ago... St. Nilus

After the year 1900, toward the middle of the 20th century, the people of that time will become unrecognizable. When the time for the Advent of the Antichrist approaches, people’s minds will grow cloudy from carnal passions, and dishonor and lawlessness will grow stronger. Then the world will become unrecognizable. People’s appearances will change, and it will be impossible to distinguish men from women due to their shamelessness in dress and style of hair. These people will be cruel and will be like wild animals because of the temptations of the Antichrist. There will be no respect for parents and elders, love will disappear, and Christian pastors, bishops, and priests will become vain men, completely failing to distinguish the right-hand way from the left. At that time the morals and traditions of Christians and of the Church will change. People will abandon modesty, and dissipation will reign. Falsehood and greed will attain great proportions, and woe to those who pile up treasures. Lust, adultery, homosexuality, secret deeds and murder will rule in society. At that future time, due to the power of such great crimes and licentiousness, people will be deprived of the grace of the Holy Spirit, which they received in Holy Baptism and equally of remorse. The Churches of God will be deprived of God-fearing and pious pastors, and woe to the Christians remaining in the world at that time; they will completely lose their faith because they will lack the opportunity of seeing the light of knowledge from anyone at all. Then they will separate themselves out of the world in holy refuges in search of lightening their spiritual sufferings, but everywhere they will meet obstacles and constraints. And all this will result from the fact that the Antichrist wants to be Lord over everything and become the ruler of the whole universe, and he will produce miracles and fantastic signs. He will also give depraved wisdom to an unhappy man so that he will discover a way by which one man can carry on a conversation with another from one end of the earth to the other. At that time men will also fly through the air like birds and descend to the bottom of the sea like fish. And when they have achieved all this, these unhappy people will spend their lives in comfort without knowing, poor souls, that it is deceit of the Antichrist. And, the impious one! — he will so complete science with vanity that it will go off the right path and lead people to lose faith in the existence of God in three hypostases. Then the All-good God will see the downfall of the human race and will shorten the days for the sake of those few who are being saved, because the enemy wants to lead even the chosen into temptation, if that is possible... then the sword of chastisement will suddenly appear and kill the perverter and his servants.

Pretty amazing the prediction considering when it was made.


41 posted on 03/19/2009 5:45:02 PM PDT by DB
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To: bruinbirdman

Vatican insiders? Who? Ron Howard and Dan Brown?

Might as well been them, this is b.s. of the stinkiest like fresh on my shoe kind.


42 posted on 03/19/2009 5:45:40 PM PDT by SaintDismas
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To: bruinbirdman

and yet the pope adheres to this very conservative line
********

All you needed to read is this line.

The Pope angers cafeteria Catholics.


43 posted on 03/19/2009 5:46:21 PM PDT by Finalapproach29er (Democrats still want to get Pres. Bush and/or VP Cheney; there might be show trials in 2009.)
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To: Teacher317
rather curious for one supposedly in the Vatican for 20+ years.

Actually the story read: "a Vatican source with 20 years' knowledge of the Holy See." I think your guess of a reporter could be right. There are some who have covered the place for that long. Or it could just be a liberal Catholic who has been a Vatican watcher for that long, and has his knickers in a twist, because Pope Benedict is SO effective.

44 posted on 03/19/2009 5:47:18 PM PDT by SuziQ
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To: Volunteer
"He's out of touch with the real world"...

Thank God for it!

45 posted on 03/19/2009 5:49:05 PM PDT by Albion Wilde ("Praise and worship" is my alternate lifestyle.)
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To: bruinbirdman
The Holy See is struggling to contain international anger over the Pope's claim on his first official visit to Africa that Aids "cannot be overcome through the distribution of condoms, which even aggravates the problems".

what a load of crap!!!! Thi shas been the consistent message of the Holy See since AIDS started. It's also true.

46 posted on 03/19/2009 5:52:54 PM PDT by pgkdan ( I miss Ronald Reagan!)
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To: bruinbirdman

Shades of “Father Elijah!”


47 posted on 03/19/2009 5:56:06 PM PDT by OpusatFR (We can give up any pretense of having a government for and by the people after Coronation Day.)
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To: bruinbirdman
The Holy See is struggling to contain international anger over the Pope's claim on his first official visit to Africa that Aids "cannot be overcome through the distribution of condoms, which even aggravates the problems".

Hmmmm. The UN has been distributing condoms in Africa like they were leaves falling from trees for 20 years and the AIDS rate has only gone up. So perhaps the issue of promiscuity and the common practice of anal sex with prostitutes (which many women fall into as a second job) is the problem and not the lack of condoms.

The truth is often unkind.

48 posted on 03/19/2009 5:57:00 PM PDT by SampleMan (Socialism and Liberty are mutually exclusive.)
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To: Big_Monkey
That is absolute unequivocal rubbish. An animal skin condom perhaps, but absolutely not a latex condom.

What's the breakage rate on condoms? Multiply that by the frequency of sex and you soon find yourself having unprotected sex.

Where have condoms been shown to reduce AIDS? Certainly not in Africa.

49 posted on 03/19/2009 5:59:55 PM PDT by SampleMan (Socialism and Liberty are mutually exclusive.)
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To: Big_Monkey

Much as I love John Paul II, I’m glad there will be no Koran-kissing by this Pope.


50 posted on 03/19/2009 6:03:27 PM PDT by karnage
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