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Poor New Yorkers getting paid for good behavior
Associated Press ^ | April 21, 2009 | Sara Kugler

Posted on 04/24/2009 9:19:22 AM PDT by reaganaut1

The city's experimental anti-poverty program that pays poor New Yorkers for good behavior like seeing the doctor and attending parent-teacher conferences handed out an average of $3,000 per family in its first year.

Mayor Michael Bloomberg's administration said it is too early to know whether it is a useful tool to fight poverty. Officials say it will take five years for a full evaluation of the program, which is the first of its kind in the nation.

But a report released Tuesday by the mayor's Center for Economic Opportunity did contain some preliminary data. It said 80 percent of the 2,400 participating families are described as "fully engaged" in the program, while 16 percent are "less engaged" and four percent have not completed any of the activities.

The program pays poor families rewards, known as conditional cash transfers, for completing tasks like seeing a doctor ($200), attending parent-teacher conferences ($25) or getting health insurance ($40).

The concept was modeled after similar efforts in other countries, including Mexico, Turkey and Brazil.

"We're trying conditional cash transfers in a very different setting, to find out if they work in urban America," Bloomberg said. "Will they succeed? We'll find out -- that will take time. Has it been controversial? Sure, but so is every policy that breaks new ground."

In New York City, the experiment is privately funded; the city handed out a total of $6.6 million in the program's first year, from September 2007 to August 2008. A control group of 2,400 families are also being monitored for five years but are not receiving payments.

[T]he participating families in New York have household incomes at or below 130 percent of the federal poverty level; in 2007, when families began receiving rewards, that was equal to $22,301 for a family of three.

(Excerpt) Read more at businessweek.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events; US: New York
KEYWORDS: bloomberg; entitlements; handouts; insanity; moreforthepoor; nyc; welfare
I would be ok with conditioning current welfare benefits on recipients meeting their responsibilities, but I don't want extra money (soon to come from taxpayers) showered on people just for doing what most taxpayers do on their own.
1 posted on 04/24/2009 9:19:22 AM PDT by reaganaut1
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To: reaganaut1

If you pay people to be poor, there will always be poor people


2 posted on 04/24/2009 9:21:56 AM PDT by GeronL (TYRANNY SENTINEL. http://tyrannysentinel.blogspot.com LIBERTY FICTION at libertyfic.proboards.com)
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To: reaganaut1

no wonder these cities and states have money problems...


3 posted on 04/24/2009 9:22:21 AM PDT by tatsinfla
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To: reaganaut1

Great! Now let’s start paying them for flushing the toilet and washing their hands after they use the restroom.


4 posted on 04/24/2009 9:22:37 AM PDT by goodwithagun (My gun has killed less people than Ted Kennedy's car.)
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To: reaganaut1
... average of $3,000 per family ... 2,400 participating families
$7,200,000
5 posted on 04/24/2009 9:22:38 AM PDT by eastsider
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To: reaganaut1
"Bloomberg's administration said it is too early to know whether (giving people free money) is a useful tool to fight poverty."

And the definition of insanity is.....

6 posted on 04/24/2009 9:22:43 AM PDT by ChicagahAl (Don't blame me. I voted for Sarah.)
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To: reaganaut1
The city's experimental anti-poverty program that pays poor New Yorkers for good behavior like seeing the doctor and attending parent-teacher conferences handed out an average of $3,000 per family in its first year.

As Chris Rock said, "As a parent, you're SUPPOSED to do that!"

7 posted on 04/24/2009 9:22:58 AM PDT by buccaneer81 (Bob Taft has soiled the family name for the next century.)
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To: reaganaut1

We are a single income family - by choice - so I can stay home with the kids. However, things would be a bit easier if I got paid for being a responsible adult & parent. *Sigh*


8 posted on 04/24/2009 9:25:16 AM PDT by ninergold3 ("Has it ever occurred to you that nothing occurs to God?" -Mark Lowry)
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To: reaganaut1

Training people to be sheep, to be dependent on the government, and to be poor always.


9 posted on 04/24/2009 9:27:35 AM PDT by Leftism is Mentally Deranged (Liberal Laws Reflect the Advanced State of Decomposition of the Liberal Mind)
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To: goodwithagun

“Now let’s start paying them for flushing the toilet and washing their hands after they use the restroom.”

I think that’s part of Obama’s reelction strategy.


10 posted on 04/24/2009 9:28:02 AM PDT by Red in Blue PA (If guns cause crime, then all of mine are defective.)
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To: reaganaut1

Wouldn’t it be cheaper to just deduct money for bad behavior from their benefits? If a conference missed...25 dollar rent the next month from free housing. I guess perks are nice though. Too bad everyone gets them but the working class.


11 posted on 04/24/2009 9:28:49 AM PDT by CindyDawg
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To: Red in Blue PA

Wrong..that will be playing them $3000 to vote the straight dem ticket...


12 posted on 04/24/2009 9:29:54 AM PDT by ken5050 (Obama wants a 900% tax on Aspirin. Why, you ask? It's white, and it works...)
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To: reaganaut1

Reminds me of the chapter from Rush’s book about Mayor Dinkins, “Now We Thank People for Obeying the Law.”


13 posted on 04/24/2009 9:29:56 AM PDT by dfwgator (1996 2006 2008 - Good Things Come in Threes)
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To: reaganaut1
While these type things seem instinctive to conservatives, they are alien to people that have only known dysfunctional upbringings.

This is a problem with the conservative message in that it amounts to preaching to the choir. With 40 percent of childbirths now being out of wedlock, the situation for conservatives and the nation at large will only grow bleaker unless conservative messages are changed to better address current realities.

For people that never knew a two parent family or even a nuclear family, conservatives need to develop some "helping hand" quasi-welfare-socialist programs designed to steer people already on the wrong side of the tracks toward a better way of living.

14 posted on 04/24/2009 9:32:11 AM PDT by fso301
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To: reaganaut1
True. This is insanity.

FMCDH(BITS)

15 posted on 04/24/2009 9:34:11 AM PDT by nothingnew (I fear for my Republic due to marxist influence in our government. Open eyes/see)
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To: fso301
For people that never knew a two parent family or even a nuclear family, conservatives need to develop some "helping hand" quasi-welfare-socialist programs designed to steer people already on the wrong side of the tracks toward a better way of living.

I could do a lot of work with unwed mothers, I could help them get their start. (With apologies to Steve Martin)

16 posted on 04/24/2009 9:35:50 AM PDT by dfwgator (1996 2006 2008 - Good Things Come in Threes)
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To: CindyDawg

stop making sense.


17 posted on 04/24/2009 9:36:49 AM PDT by WOBBLY BOB (ACORN:American Corruption for Obama Right Now)
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To: reaganaut1

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opportunity_NYC


18 posted on 04/24/2009 9:36:59 AM PDT by happinesswithoutpeace (You are receiving this broadcast as a dream)
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To: fso301

As long as this is privately funded,,I have no complaint, but in reality is the charity receiving money from the Govt to perform charity?
The demographics are killing us. More kids born to single parents..fewer parents with education and skills raising kids. More people with the knowledge and motivation to get money for nothing.
The only cure may be a generation of real poverty...a real depression. Looks like that is coming again in the UK.


19 posted on 04/24/2009 9:38:37 AM PDT by Oldexpat
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To: reaganaut1

@ss-wiping-state alert.


20 posted on 04/24/2009 9:40:34 AM PDT by the invisib1e hand
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To: reaganaut1

Bloomberg at his best.


21 posted on 04/24/2009 9:43:16 AM PDT by b4its2late (Ignorance allows liberalism to prosper.)
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To: Oldexpat
As long as this is privately funded,,I have no complaint, but in reality is the charity receiving money from the Govt to perform charity?

Don't know. The article only said private money was being used for the program. For all I know, Mayor Bloomberg may be fronting his personal money for the program. Seven million would be pocket change for him.

The demographics are killing us. More kids born to single parents..fewer parents with education and skills raising kids. More people with the knowledge and motivation to get money for nothing.

Same problem in the US. We have no more than 10 years to do something substantive about it.

The only cure may be a generation of real poverty...a real depression. Looks like that is coming again in the UK.

If we're lucky.

22 posted on 04/24/2009 9:45:04 AM PDT by fso301
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To: b4its2late
Bloomberg at his best.

But what do the Taxpayers get for this? What good does it do other than to keep folks on the Dole?

23 posted on 04/24/2009 9:45:44 AM PDT by sr4402
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To: fso301

yeah my helping hand is one that says get a job you slob and no more free food and housing, that is incentive for most people to work, when they have an empty feeling in their stomach, they will work. the old and disabled eccepted.

maybe all welfare should be like this. privately funded, and dependant on behavoir.


24 posted on 04/24/2009 9:49:01 AM PDT by dhm914
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To: reaganaut1

Talk about a nanny-state. Does the mayor give these 18 to 80 year old “children” a pat on the head, some milk and cookies, and a loving “good boy/girl” with their cash?


25 posted on 04/24/2009 9:55:31 AM PDT by Above My Pay Grade
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To: fso301

Looks like some Soros money as well 0_0

http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/013/824jrzop.asp


26 posted on 04/24/2009 10:05:13 AM PDT by happinesswithoutpeace (You are receiving this broadcast as a dream)
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To: sr4402

Zip, Zero, Nada.


27 posted on 04/24/2009 10:05:19 AM PDT by b4its2late (Ignorance allows liberalism to prosper.)
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To: fso301; Oldexpat

Currently these are privately-funded pilot plans, but I read in an earlier NYT article that the goal is to expand the programs that “work” using tax money.


28 posted on 04/24/2009 10:08:42 AM PDT by reaganaut1
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To: fso301

I am working with a committee to look at jail recidivism in our county. In a poll taken over a 24 hour period of time, 98 prisoners represented more than 500 past stints in jail. Many were substance abusers and almost all had histories of relatives who also served time in jail or prison.

Many of these are also in the same families that social service and welfare serves. A large number when tested, have a functional equivalent of a fifth grade education, even though they may have graduated from high school.

Increasingly, our county money is going to provide legally required mental health treatment in the jail.

How is government going to turn this around? How is government and the community going to keep another generation from following this path? We have learned from the past that ignoring the problem only makes it grow in size and severity. The resources these families take to deal with bad behaviors and the violence that slops over into criminal activity has become a serious problem impacting our ability to serve the general public with services such as libraries.

We are trying to cobble together an in-jail individual needs assessment and school to provide classes in parenting, anger management, managing money, life skills etc. (These will be through mini contracts with non-profits or local schools that already do this.) Then have each inmate have a plan to continue with non-profit or faith based programs in literacy, GED or college tech., sober living, etc. upon release. We will also have former inmates who have successfully re-entered act as mentors.

We will track to see if this intervention has an impact. The punative approach is not working. We have a six month waiting list to get into our jail to serve sentences and a lot of early releases. We also have a violence level for cases such as assault, which are greater than L.A. (We are a small rural county.)


29 posted on 04/24/2009 10:23:40 AM PDT by marsh2
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To: reaganaut1

These are the same people who don’t pay taxes and who qualify for Earned Income Credit, so they’re already getting “free” money from the government.


30 posted on 04/24/2009 11:15:53 AM PDT by Hoffer Rand (There ARE two Americas: "God's children" and the tax payers)
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To: dhm914
yeah my helping hand is one that says get a job you slob and no more free food and housing, that is incentive for most people to work, when they have an empty feeling in their stomach, they will work. the old and disabled eccepted.

maybe all welfare should be like this. privately funded, and dependant on behavoir.

That's fine in a environment where a person at least spent formative years exposed to principles of responsible living.

In can also work well in an environment where such behavior is the exception rather than the norm.

For those who didn't grow up with such examples or, who are in environments surrounded by lousy examples, the bootstraps approach doesn't work well as such have paths of crime and delinquency that seem far easier and more natural to them.

31 posted on 04/24/2009 11:23:12 AM PDT by fso301
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