Posted on 07/28/2009 5:29:21 AM PDT by reaganaut1
That is what Obama has!
Right now I am looking at my son’s Certificate of Live Birth issued by the state of SC. It is half of the size of what Obama has, but had 10 times the information. Including Doctors name and signature, Registrars name and signature at the time of birth, mine and my husbands state of birth and the date it was filed by the registrar.
I have also just recently looked at Certificate of Live birth of a friend of mine while we were getting papers together for her passport. She is 50+ yrs. old. Hers was actually handwritten, but it had the same information as my sons, mine does too and I am 46 and was born in NY. Just last year I needed a replacement and it was just like my kids. Plus I signed the BC’s of all three of my kids.
You have two documents. THey both certify, they both provide certification. You are right that certification is a process and a certificate is a document. But what your bureaucrats call the process of certification is carried out how?
By providing a second, different document. Both documents are certificates. Both documents certify. Both documents provide certification.
The bureaucrats have decreed that the one document, which they call a certificate, certifies x and y and z. They also decree that document 2 (certificate 2) should not be called “a certificate” but a “certification.”
They are illiterate. And their stupid illiteracy produces confusion. If they just used clearly distinct words to label document/certificate 1 and document/certificate 2, things would be clearer.
Linguistically speaking, there is no difference between a certificate which certifies and produces certification and a certification which takes place by means of a certificate.
The bureaucrats won’t call the second certificate a certificate but will call it a document.
If you can’t see that the distinction they make between certificate and certification is entirely artificial and created by them, I’m sorry.
They could avoid all this by using clearly distinct words for the levels of certification provided by the two distinct documents/certificates.
But they don’t. And you’ve drunk their lilnguistic koolaid.
The only comparison I’m making is the money spent. If spending a lot of money to defend yourself makes you guilty then Palin would be guilty. We don’t think she is (at least not on all of it). I don’t think the money spent is relevant.
Ah, so it’s a made up number based on assumptions. I suspect Obama is loving the birthers. They actually succeed in making the Dems look reasonable by comparison.
Assuming it take five years to become a U.S. citizen, and assuming he moved to the U.S. in 1824, William Arthur probably wasn’t a naturalized U.S. citizen by the time Chester was born in 1829.
ex animo
davidfarrar
But it does make a difference if one example (Palin) HAS to defend herself against an ethics complaint, while the other example (Obama) could make the suit go away by complying with the request.
You can live in Ohio but have your wedding in Hawaii. You’d still put your wedding announcement in the local paper in Ohio.
There is no quid pro quo in the statement.
Discrediting Republicans doesn’t make Dems look “reasonable” when a 2004 quote from Barack Obama on Air America is surfacing. One in which he decryies the size of the document, the rush to implement it, and the lack of debate that the party in power is willing to give it. He’s been exposed a naked hypocrite. Everything they campaigned on “new tone”, “transparency”, and “an end to the culture of corruption” has been shown to be a LIE.
John McCain
What's being certified here are the facts of a particular birth. The parents and doctor actually do most of the certification. The facts which they certified were recorded on a typed birth certificate.
A certificate shows what has been certified by those qualified to certify the facts. The old birth certificate showed what had been certified 48 years ago for Obama.
No one today who wasn't there can certify what happened 48 years ago. They can do one of two things:
1. Certify that they are providing a true copy of an original birth certificate from 48 years ago. No process involved, just copying a source document.
2. Certify that they have examined available records and reproduced the 48 year old information on a new print out. The are certifying, 48 years later, that they have examined available records and transposed it via computer to a new printout, certifying that the information gathered is correct. They went through some certification process 48 years later to verify the information presented on a new document.
There's a difference. Sorry you can't see it. The two should have different designations.
Nothing that I've read on this subject in the last 8 months (which is quite a lot) supports your contention. In fact, there are volumes of well-sourced documentary evidence on this website that utterly refutes what you just stated.
And such is not the case between Barack Obama's Certification of Live Birth, and his actual long form Certificate of Live Birth, which is supposedly on file for him in the state of Hawaii.
Of course the two should have different designations. My point was that “certificate” and “certification” cannot intelligently be the two designating terms. Bureaucrat fiat may try to make these two words work as “different designations,” but they only will “mean differently” if someone like you writes a dozen paragraphs explain why identical terms actually mean different things.
Wouldn’t it be easier to use terms that really are different? Neither you nor the bureaucrats would have to write these long explanations.
But that would be simple. And bureaucrat and simple don’t mix. They are both different terms AND very different realities.
There you have it. Someone here calculated how many thousands of hours and how many hundred of people transposing info from the original long form to the digital short form. The number was astronomical. This was as recent as within a week, but I don't remember who it was. Of course, as everyone knows, mistakes are always made when transcribing. There must be a back up of the original to clear up any future questions. There is no way the original was ever destroyed. Stored in another place and not easily gotten to, but not destroyed.
So how would the announcement be any kind of proof that he was born in Hawaii?
I remember when I went to college and lived in two cities. One was home and one was where I went to school during the semester.
Momma was a globetrotter. Momma was a rolling stone, wherever she laid her hat was her home. It’s one reason that Barry eventually moved in with Grandma in Hawaii.
No, we conservatives think Juan McWhacked is a RINO = Pub in name one = Democrat.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.