How Many Government Employees Are There?

Census Bureau Data | Self

[fruser1]

Given all the talk of wanting a smaller government, I figured I'd look up how many government employees there are. I found this info rather easily but thought it was worth passing on.

These numbers are from 2008 data. The addition and percentages I performed myself:

Number of Full-Time Federal Employees - 2,518,101 Part-Time - 250,785 Full-Time State - 3,818,577 Part-Time - 1,451,002 Full-Time Local - 11,039,250 Part-Time - 3,383,976

TOTAL - 22,461,691

2008 US Population (est) - 304,059,724

% of Gov't employees - 7.38%

Inverse - 13.536

So this means that there's a government employee for every 13.5 people in the country.

Below are links to where I got this data. You can check out your own state-specific numbers there if you want.

http://www.census.gov/govs/apes/ http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/00000.html

For State and Local data, I looked at the "US Summary Table" which explicitly lists full-time and part-time categories separately. For the Fed data, I had to subtract "full-time" from the "total" to get number of part-time employees above, as that table did not explicitly list the number of part-time employees.

[Red Badger]

About twice as much as there needs to be...............

[Jerrybob]

What I want to know is — all the departments — Education, Labor, Interior — there are so many — how many in each department and what do all these people DO ALL DAY!!?!?!?!?!? That’s the real question.

[updatedscreenname]

The real secret is the number of contractors which could easily double your number.

[Sacajaweau]

They just told me that the Poist Office has less mail to deliver...and it’s been that way....but “0” layoffs to date.

[Hardastarboard]

Some lying scumbag from the government workers’ union wrote a letter to the WSJ a couple of weeks ago saying that the number of full time Federal government employees is the same as it was in Kennedy’s era (1.6 million if memory serves correctly). It was an obvious lie, but the WSJ published it anyway.

[bigredkitty1]

Too d@mn many.

[GladesGuru]

My gag reflex is overstimulated.

[Phlap]

The scientific term is T.N.C. aka Too Numerous to Count. lol

[Scotsman will be Free]

Just at the federal level did the charts indicate how many, if any, were military. I remember when clintoon cut the military he claimed credit for reducing federal employment.

[webschooner]

Enough to start a medium-sized country somewhere

... actually, that’s a good idea ... they can all leave and start their own country.

[concerned about politics]

So this means that there's a government employee for every 13.5 people in the country.

OMG. That's oppressive, not to mention mega wasteful.
Our government needs a serious overhaul. Cut it by at least 90%.

This number needs to get around. People will be shocked to hear it (as much as I am right now).

[Eric in the Ozarks]

And there never will be any. No matter how little the USPO does, it will continue to be an arm of the Democrat party.

[sodpoodle]

How does the 13.5% compare to private employment? And does that include military personnel?

Bearing in mind that of the 300million people - a high percentage are dependent children and retired seniors.

[Lokibob]

OK, 13 work for me:
3 in department of defense
.25 of a marine
.25 of a coastguardsman naa, I live in Utah, scratch the coastie.
Prob one teacher
how about 1 VA worker.
I will take 25% of 1 police man (small rural town, that includes the sheriff too. reluctantly I will take 1/10% of the DMV folks.

This could be interesting....

.....Bob

[Pan_Yan]

So this means that there's a government employee for every 13.5 people in the country.

Now get fancy. What percentage of working Americans is that? Does that drop your number to 6 for every government employee? 7? And the average American makes less than the average government worker if you factor for benefits and retirement. That should skew the number more.

[Presbyterian Reporter]

TOTAL - 22,461,691

2008 US Population (est) - 304,059,724

---

A key statistic is the number of government workers divided by total workers.

That number is probably getting close to 20%

[Ikemeister]

Bingo! Having been a former bureaucrat, I can tell you that the trend has been to expand the shadow workforce. The number of contractors working side by side with federal employees...doing the same work, has exploded.

[Texas resident]

Recently stories have come out about how govt employees make more on average than the average private sector person. We pay their salary, but also their bennies, their retirement pensions and a whole lot of other stuff they can work in from their buds in congress. And we are having to keep our budgets on the positive side while funding their existance. Ozero is on a huge hiring binge and all those fedgov employees suck more and more cash out of our lives. Then they are going to raise taxes on us to fund the new hires. Maybe this is obama’s army he spoke of. Thousands of federal employees that he can use for his own purposes.
Just thinking.

[KrisKrinkle]

“Just at the federal level did the charts indicate how many, if any, were military.”

723,385 for Nat Defense/International Relations, if that helps you.

[PeteB570]

Not counting the military the largest employer in the county is - the county.

The school system alone has close to 7,000 workers - one for every 7.4 students.

[Scotsman will be Free]

Thanks.

[bvw]

Those studies show that government workers earn 150% more than equivalent term and skill positions in the private sector. But that way understates the difference in earnings.

I do not think that those studies include the factor of job risk. Most people in private sector jobs get laid off or fired — downsized — every so often. No so with FedGov.

I’d guesstimate that were that job risk to be factored in we’re looking at 300%.

[drpix]

"...there's a government employee for every 13.5 people in the country"

Amazing! Can some one tell me what justifies that many?

And then also tell me why the Census must hire 1.2 million ADDITIONAL government employees - to count an estimated 310 million people? Approximately 1 census worker to count each 258 people! Over the course of many months! Do they each count a couple a day and then go home?

[all the best]

Yeah, but who would pay them for producing nothing?

[muawiyah]

USPS has held its workforce fairly steady for the last 40 years. Mail volumes have increased about 40 times in that period.

This was done by mechanizing, automating and roboticizing the way mail is handled.

Although there are hundreds of thousands of employees there, each is just a cog in a vast machine that becomes "more machine" and "less human" every year. The human beings continue to be vital to the machine but eventually that will come to an end.

It is conceivable that within 50 years the only employee will be the Postmaster General.

[USS Alaska]

Approximately 1 census worker to count each 258 people! Over the course of many months! Do they each count a couple a day and then go home?

Not even close.

They census "workers" only go out to the places where the forms are not mailed in.

In reality, what percentage will that be, 10-15%.

So these "workers" will have to contact 25-30 families over the course of six months, about one a week.

What a backbreaking job that has to be.

[muawiyah]

The answer is the census work is done by a large number of part time workers. They do not put in in 8 hour days for 5 days a week. Some do, but the overwhelming majority don't. It's more like 4 hours today, 0 hours tomorrow, and maybe 0 hours the day after that ~ and sometimes there are breaks for weeks.

It depends on how many part timers they've got, and where the work takes place.

[bwc2221]

These numbers are particularly meaningful considering Friday's USA Today article which stated that the average federal worker makes 20% more than his private sector counterpart and that federal employee benefits cost 4 times those in the private sector.

[muawiyah]

You'll have to show us the details of the studies. I seriously doubt government attorneys earn 1.5 times as much as their private sector counterparts.

Government engineers don't either.

You match job for job with the same skillsets and experience, the studies show the opposite.

Now, let's match CRIMINAL RECORDS. Your typical civil servant, e.g. a postal worker or one of the drones at Department of Defense (that's at the federal level eh) do not have CRIMINAL RECORDS!

Show me how Seven Eleven or AAA Refuse could run a business if they demanded that no one have a CRIMINAL RECORD.

Hey, even General Motors hires convicted felons!

The US government doesn't.

[bvw]

You are in la-la land on this matter — YOU look up the studies. Also, you are mistaken about the felony class.

Does “SEIU” give you a clue?

[muawiyah]

I posted concerning the federal government. SEIU could very well have all sorts of convicted felons in their mebership, but the federal government (in USPS and DOD, the two agencies I named) does not hire convicted felons.

Now, where are your studies that show that federal employees make more, doing the same job, than private sector employees.

[webschooner]

I know I know, that is the problem, but I consider that THEIR problem. I just want them to go away.

Maybe they can enslave the local 4-legged critters in their new far far away paradise. :)

[bvw]

Sorry, I’m no longer helping the lazy.

[tx_eggman]

Do these numbers include contractors?

Here in Houston there are more contractors doing work for/at NASA than there are actual federal employees.

If not, the picture is WAY worse than these numbers paint it.

[drpix]

Even part time, how many hours does it take 1.2 million to count only a small portion of 310 million - since (as USS Alaska pointed out) the Census only sends out "workers" to families that did not answer and mail back their Census forms?

If that small portion is 10-15%, or 31-46 million, that comes to 26-39 people to count for each "worker." Subtracting even 50% of the Census staff for "management" and "support" staff and that's still 52-78 people to count for each actual Census counter!

AMAZING!

[muawiyah]

A lot of it has to do with statistical validation. Plus, mistakes are made filling out the forms and corrections acquired.

Once you take even the smallest part of this process out of the hands of the computers and the mail delivery service, that part is going to take far more time and effort.

[muawiyah]

You didn’t even name the studies. (What I’m hoping for here is that you’ll refer to a rather famous private company in the field of comparing jobs that’s otherwise managed by classical Marxists).

[backhoe]

‘Way too many...

[dfwgator]

With the taxes we pay, trust me, we are ALL working for the government.

[rcrngroup]

These numbers are from 2008 data. The addition and percentages I performed myself: Number of Full-Time Federal Employees - 2,518,101 Part-Time - 250,785 Full-Time State - 3,818,577 Part-Time - 1,451,002 Full-Time Local - 11,039,250 Part-Time - 3,383,976 TOTAL - 22,461,691 2008 US Population (est) - 304,059,724 % of Gov't employees - 7.38% Inverse - 13.536 So this means that there's a government employee for every 13.5 people in the country.

Government (Federal, state & local) needs to be cut by 50% IMMEDIATELY and then another 50% next year. This should apply to cutting gubmint employees as well as spending. Cut it to the bone!!!

[mad_as_he$$]

It has expanded dramatically since 2008.

[FrogMom]

Xlinton swelled the ranks of contractors to “shrink the fedgov”, too.

Please be careful when painting with a very broad brush. FrogDad is a full-time Civil Servant working in the DoD. He works his butt off.

Admittedly, the “Civil Servants” to be vilified are legion, but some are necessary. FrogDad teaches new soldiers, sailors, and marines the military job he did for 24 years. It's a job that must be done and who is better qualified?

Yes, there should be layoffs at the PO. Yes, there should be layoffs in the great buddy pool hired in DC. Yes, about 25 of Mrs. BO’s “personal assistants” should be fired.

Also, there should be no unionization of fed workers allowed. It's already hard to fire the SOBs, being unionized makes it nearly impossible.

[drpix]

Juggle the 1.2 million “workers” any way you want, with even 50% devoted to support staff, with any number of validations and re-validations, corrections and re-corrections, with any ratio of full-timers and part-timers, with any ratio public mail form compliance and non-compliance. In a day of computer automation, how does it take 1.2 million to count 310 million without intolerable levels of “feather-bedding” and no show jobs?

[Texas resident]

Your right on the govt attorneys and engineers. But have you ever seen the immense size of the Dept of Education or the Dept of Ag or the Dept of Transportation buildings in DC? They are some of the most massive buildings in the city and you can bet every office is full. What they hell do we need more and more taxpayer funded doo gooders telling the states how to educate their kids and how to grow their crops?

[Nervous Tick]

>> what do all these people DO ALL DAY!!?!?!?!?!?

They SPEND YOUR MONEY.

Think of them as family that moved in to mooch off of you.

[muawiyah]

The Ag building looks more capacious than it is.

There are several complexes in DC built BEFORE AIR CONDITIONING. They have high ceilings, large windows, and all offices open along large, high hallways.

The USPS headquarters at L'Enfant Plaza has more employees in it than the 4 story Ag building on Independence ~ and that has to do with the impact air conditioning has on space requirements.

The greater number of federal workers in the Department of Agriculture work in field offices all over the country ~ mostly in small towns and rural areas. That's why you have no idea how many there really are.

Given that agriculture is a major American business employing millions of people (directly, or in food processing, sales, services, transport, etc.) the number of folks employed in USDA is, in fact, NOT excessive.

[ml/nj]

I've been doing some work on this. I'm not done yet but I thought I'd add my partial work to this thread.

The graph below shows the the number of full-time-equivalent employees by state expressed as a percentage of the population since 1952. I derived this from Commerce Dept data. Data before 1952 are much harder to come by. I once started looking for data for NJ and my recollection is that the numbers I found were down around one percent back in the early 20th century.

Since it's not easy to tell, I would point out that the states with the highest 2007 percentages are DC, and Alaska. The lowest are Hawaii and Nevada.

[Note: that the site where this chart is hosted will be closing down soon.] ML/NJ

[fruser1]

The tables do not include military. These would be civilian employees. Oddly enough, though, I see the Coast Guard is included in these totals, under the Department of Homeland Security.

[fruser1]

The number only includes employees, not contractors. These would be folks getting W-2’s from Uncle Sam, not a private company.