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Of Tea and Party
vanity | today | wgflyer

Posted on 09/19/2010 8:23:52 AM PDT by wgflyer

Of Tea and Party

For quite some time now I have been clamoring for a third party which could replace the GOP with real conservative thinking, and conservative policy. I looked at the Libertarians, and the the Constitution party, both of which have their pros and cons, but could not find a good solid replacement along the lines I sought.

Meanwhile, the GOP ceded more and more of its moral integrity to the Left, stuffing itself with pork and growing ever more self important, completely forgetting the people it purported to represent. Of late, Republican constituents have even become annoying to Republican incumbents. The annoyance is very obvious. They want to keep their cushy jobs, and continue to live large on the taxpayers’ dole.

So up came the tea parties, all around the nation. Their prominence in politics of late has scared the hell out of both Democrats and Republicans, threatening to upset the wagon and turn them out into the street, where there may be some tar and feathers waiting.

And the tea parties were mocked, insulted, whined about all over the established political landscape, but they rise anyway because the damage now is just too great. Some house cleaning is in order. Finally, Americans are moving, and I love them for it.

But I see, also, the GOP trying to gather the various tea party groups into their sphere of influence. Like the nobody who tries to stand for a clandestine photo beside a famous actor, these fools sidle in and try to blend. Huckabee, Romney, Juliani, Gingrich, Santorum...the list is endless. Old hat Republicans who see the wave and want to ride it back into prominence. To whatever degree that the tea party movement accepts these people as spokesmen I fear for them. The tea party movement must remain aloof from incumbents, ex incumbents, and old hat pundits and instead replace those incumbents and individuals in the GOP hierarchy with grass roots conservatives willing to dismantle the Federal Government back to its rightful size and duties as laid out by the Constitution.

But the one thing I fear more than anything is that the tea parties will actually become the Tea Party. Once they become a bona fide political party they will begin the slide back to the current state of the Democrats and Republicans. They will begin to fill their ranks with candidates with stars in their eyes, “leaders” with careers on their minds and political ambitions that preclude actual representation of the people who elect them.

No. The tea parties must never become the Tea Party. They must remain a loose collection of very passionate regional grass roots conservatives led by their own local firebrands and churches, and generating a constant stream of new conservative candidates to cycle through both Federal and State GOP positions for short durations and return to their private sector existence. The tea parties should occupy and police the GOP, but should not BE the GOP.

With the tea party movement we have clarity. Conservatism is defined for all to see, finally, and people like it. The two party aparats are likewise clearly exposed for what they are, and can not defend themselves with any logic or consistency of thought. The only defense, in both parties, is vitriol and bile. (Witness Karl Rove’s nastiness towards the winning tea party backed candidate in Delaware).

If the tea parties ever become the Tea Party, they will lose everything they are now gaining, and more.


TOPICS: Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: teaparty

1 posted on 09/19/2010 8:23:54 AM PDT by wgflyer
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To: wgflyer
Our best hope is that the Tea Party movement will transform the GOP to its conservative roots and draw in all of those millions disaffected by the insider/extablishment GOP go along to get along attitude that the Tea Party movement is dismantling.


TEA PARTY TIME IN AMERICA

2 posted on 09/19/2010 8:27:57 AM PDT by Jeff Head (Liberty is not free. Never has been, never will be. (www.dragonsfuryseries.com))
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To: wgflyer
Pure idiocy. Third party movement merely split the vote and hand victory to the political ideology they oppose. There has not been 1 successful third party in US History.

NO, the GOP did NOT start as a “third party” it took over what was left of the Whig party. It replaced a failed 2nd party. If you cannot get enough Conservative/Libertarians organized to take back the GOP from the RINO, you are NEVER going to do the much harder work of organizing a viable third party.

3 posted on 09/19/2010 8:29:20 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (The problem with Socialism is eventually you run out of other people's money. Lady Thatcher)
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To: wgflyer

Hooboy! Good ol Mitt was the FIRST to jump on the bandwagon of Tea Party Momentum.

Beware of Mitt the chameleon. Hucka boob too.

I can’t find the picture of the shape shifter wearing his plaid shirt with the sleeves rolled up from the last campaign.

These RINOS have to go!


4 posted on 09/19/2010 8:32:00 AM PDT by mylife (Opinions $1 Halfbaked 50c)
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To: Jeff Head

Be “The Party Of Know”


5 posted on 09/19/2010 8:33:26 AM PDT by mylife (Opinions $1 Halfbaked 50c)
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To: MNJohnnie

Karl? is that you?


6 posted on 09/19/2010 8:36:40 AM PDT by mylife (Opinions $1 Halfbaked 50c)
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To: wgflyer

How’s that “astroturf” gonna feel on Nancy’s backside when she’s voted out of the Speakership in January??


7 posted on 09/19/2010 8:37:23 AM PDT by DTogo (High time to bring back the Sons of Liberty !!)
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To: mylife

Exactly.

Good morning, Sir!


8 posted on 09/19/2010 8:39:26 AM PDT by wgflyer (Liberalism is to society what HIV is to the immune system.)
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To: wgflyer
For quite some time now I have been clamoring for a third party which could replace the GOP with real conservative thinking, and conservative policy.

To Hell with that.

The GOP is ours now.

Let the RINOs form their own "moderate" third party, or go join the Democrats where they belong.

I'm looking at you, John McCain and Mitt Romney.

9 posted on 09/19/2010 8:40:56 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum ("The only stable state is one in which all men are equal before the law." -- Aristotle)
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To: wgflyer
I see you are up early and rabble rousing ☺
10 posted on 09/19/2010 8:41:52 AM PDT by mylife (Opinions $1 Halfbaked 50c)
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To: DTogo

Rugburns! I hope.


11 posted on 09/19/2010 8:42:13 AM PDT by wgflyer (Liberalism is to society what HIV is to the immune system.)
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To: wgflyer

Well said


12 posted on 09/19/2010 8:44:13 AM PDT by Lloyd227 (Class of 1998 (let's all help the Team McCain spider monkeys decide how to moderate))
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To: MNJohnnie

You are right—we need real reform—a reform party—a 3rd choice. None of this old saw of Wasted votes or giving votes to the other guy—If we thought that way we would still have Federalists and Whigs around. The Republicans were a 3rd Party once and hated too. The way I see it there is only two outcomes for the Tea Party movement.
1. Take over the GOP and expel the RINOs—make it a reform party dedicated to really clean the swamp of corruption.
2. Start a real 3rd party by taking over an existing one or doing a new 3rd Party.
Let the Hucklefaces and Mitts do what they will. We need reform. I suggest Palin’s Pitchforks to clean the stables of corruption. I fear if the Tea Parties fail because then
the only choice will be rebellion and a drastic change into something very different from the America I grew up in.
Lots of people would die and the USA may break into four or five warring states. Lets see how Red China Runs the world for a while.


13 posted on 09/19/2010 8:44:56 AM PDT by Forward the Light Brigade (Into the Jaws of H*ll)
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To: wgflyer

I must say, I made the mistake of backing Perot way back when, and they ended up portraying him as a kook.

They are trying to do the same thing with the tea party.

But this Is different.
The fires are not being put out by the MSM.
They are burning brighter.
Now is the time to move.

This aint going to be pretty.


14 posted on 09/19/2010 8:48:40 AM PDT by mylife (Opinions $1 Halfbaked 50c)
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To: Forward the Light Brigade

“Start a real 3rd party by taking over an existing one”

I think that is the most viable option.
And WE ARE DOING IT.

Not only that but we are subverting the DEM Party and picking up bluedogs along the way.


15 posted on 09/19/2010 8:51:05 AM PDT by mylife (Opinions $1 Halfbaked 50c)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

“Let the RINOs form their own “moderate” third party, or go join the Democrats where they belong.”

You’re right. That’s what I hoped to convey.

“The GOP is ours now. “

Not yet. But I hope it isn’t far off.


16 posted on 09/19/2010 8:53:36 AM PDT by wgflyer (Liberalism is to society what HIV is to the immune system.)
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To: wgflyer
The Tea PArty is not a party it is a Caucus..
AND it s GROWING.... growing .... growing..

Could be parties are becoming OBSOLETE......

17 posted on 09/19/2010 8:53:46 AM PDT by hosepipe (This propaganda has been edited to include some fully orbed hyperbole....)
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To: MNJohnnie
The mistake is to connect or confuse [perpetual] incumbency and ideology/philosopy.

Both are problems to be dealt with. Comfortable incumbents suboordinate philosophy.

The Tea Party movement is best for raising awareness and challenging incumbency. The less-organized the better.

At this point, the incumbent party (D and R) needs to be culled, period. They work together.

Until people learn to form coalitions (of specific issues) and agree to return to Constitution, separation of powers, and other liberty-centric conventions we will continue to see the assault on freedom.

18 posted on 09/19/2010 8:55:45 AM PDT by sayfer bullets ("...and if it stops moving, subsidize it." - RR)
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To: mylife

This is the best plan. But the tea party groups need to remain local grass root entities aloof from Party.


19 posted on 09/19/2010 8:56:48 AM PDT by wgflyer (Liberalism is to society what HIV is to the immune system.)
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To: mylife

The tradition Democrats will see it our way. But this must be a reform party to really change things—not just give lip service. Kick out the lobbyists and special interests! Toss them in prison as they bridests they are.


20 posted on 09/19/2010 8:56:58 AM PDT by Forward the Light Brigade (Into the Jaws of H*ll)
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To: mylife

The tradition Democrats will see it our way. But this must be a reform party to really change things—not just give lip service. Kick out the lobbyists and special interests! Toss them in prison as they bridests they are.


21 posted on 09/19/2010 8:56:58 AM PDT by Forward the Light Brigade (Into the Jaws of H*ll)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

“Let the RINOs form their own “moderate” third party, or go join the Democrats where they belong.”

The RINOS are like the loyalists, playing both sides of the fence while licking the boots of King George.

They are loyal only to their masters.


22 posted on 09/19/2010 8:57:26 AM PDT by mylife (Opinions $1 Halfbaked 50c)
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To: Forward the Light Brigade
. The Republicans were a 3rd Party

No there were not. They took over the Whig party. They were never a third party.

23 posted on 09/19/2010 8:58:39 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (The problem with Socialism is eventually you run out of other people's money. Lady Thatcher)
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To: mylife
Obama is that you? Nothing could be better calculated to reelect O them to manufacture a third party Perot type candidate to split the vote in 2012.

Did you learn nothing from 1992 and 1996?

24 posted on 09/19/2010 9:00:04 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (The problem with Socialism is eventually you run out of other people's money. Lady Thatcher)
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To: mylife

Nice emotion base slogans. Slogans are not facts. Try living in the world of facts, not emotion.


25 posted on 09/19/2010 9:00:54 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (The problem with Socialism is eventually you run out of other people's money. Lady Thatcher)
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To: Lloyd227

So you too learned nothing from the 1992 and 1996 elections.

You are the best allies 0 could hope for.


26 posted on 09/19/2010 9:01:45 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (The problem with Socialism is eventually you run out of other people's money. Lady Thatcher)
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To: wgflyer
You’re right. That’s what I hoped to convey.

I knew you did. I was just restating it in another manner for emphasis, the way we were taught in expository writing class.

: ^ ]

27 posted on 09/19/2010 9:06:10 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum ("The only stable state is one in which all men are equal before the law." -- Aristotle)
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To: MNJohnnie

F u


28 posted on 09/19/2010 9:07:35 AM PDT by Lloyd227 (Class of 1998 (let's all help the Team McCain spider monkeys decide how to moderate))
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To: MNJohnnie

You’re slipping, MNJohnnie. It ain’t the “team” we’re cheering, it’s the Constitution. To the extent that the “team” supports it, we support the “team.” To the extent that they do not, neither do we. This applies to both Republicans and Democrats, as well as to any successful successor to either one, should any arise. Enough is enough.


29 posted on 09/19/2010 9:08:42 AM PDT by RegulatorCountry
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To: wgflyer
I have been clamoring for a third party which could replace the GOP with real conservative thinking,

I'm glad you got over that little brain-bump.

The GOP establishment really love for conservatives to leave the party and go start yet another "third" party. There are already over fifty "third" parties, and none of them have accomplished diddley-squat, or ever will.

When people resign the Republican Party, they eliminate themselves from primary voting in many states. They eliminate themselves from party decisions at the precinct, county, state, and national levels.

Then they are stuck with a choice of
1) a RINO chosen by the party RINOs, who are mostly former Democrats,
2) the Democrat candidate, selected by the communist wing of the Democrat party,
3) or one of the "third" party candidates, none of whom can consistently get more than 2% of the vote anywhere.

30 posted on 09/19/2010 9:08:45 AM PDT by meadsjn (Sarah 2012, or sooner)
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To: wgflyer

There is the rub.
We have to stay grass roots, but that hinders organization.

The tea party has been tremendously successful in all its rabble and tenacity.

I have been critical of Sarah Palin in the past but I love this woman’s spirit, and she has struck a chord with the American people with her “I WILL NOT BACK DOWN ATTITUDE”


31 posted on 09/19/2010 9:15:19 AM PDT by mylife (Opinions $1 Halfbaked 50c)
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To: meadsjn

Wise words. Well said.


32 posted on 09/19/2010 9:16:47 AM PDT by wgflyer (Liberalism is to society what HIV is to the immune system.)
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To: MNJohnnie

Lemme see...

Nope, I don’t have an ice cream so i must not be obama LoL.


33 posted on 09/19/2010 9:17:06 AM PDT by mylife (Opinions $1 Halfbaked 50c)
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To: mylife

I’m not sure being separate grass roots entities hinders organization so much these days. The internet and talk radio are links enough to bind the various local entities to a clear and common purpose. They don’t need a national hierarchy so long as they passionately believe as they do. And if they lose that passion, organization won’t help.

the “I WILL NOT BACK DOWN ATTITUDE” is all they need. Bless them.


34 posted on 09/19/2010 9:23:15 AM PDT by wgflyer (Liberalism is to society what HIV is to the immune system.)
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To: RegulatorCountry
For quite some time now I have been clamoring for a third party which could replace the GOP with real conservative thinking, and conservative policy.

That was the point I was addressing. I am not asking you to "cheer for the team" but to not commit political suicide the way too many reform movements have in US history. The way forward is to avoid factionzalise the movement into it's own "team".

35 posted on 09/19/2010 9:27:19 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (The problem with Socialism is eventually you run out of other people's money. Lady Thatcher)
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To: E. Pluribus Unum

Thanks.

“expository writing class”

Cool.


36 posted on 09/19/2010 9:29:05 AM PDT by wgflyer (Liberalism is to society what HIV is to the immune system.)
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To: MNJohnnie
I suppose that response may have been to abrupt for you to understand. Your sanctimonious insult didn't deserve much more, but perhaps this tiny explanation...

There is a lot more in that article than simply the thoughts of a third party, although that seems to be the only detail you managed to absorb.

Fact is, the THREAT of a third party is a necessary tool to help bring the GOP "moderates" and RINO's in line. Like you, I don't personally believe it can be done but the GOP will change or they'll never again have a majority after this round. Like hundreds of thousands of other Americans, I will never again vote for the lesser of two evils and I will never vote for a man like John McCain, Mitt Romney, Mike Huckabee or dozens of other "compromisers" who've been so prevalent in the GOP of late.

So the fact is, the GOP can either adopt the principles of sound government or be relegated to continual second class (third party?). I can foresee a time with the Republican Party actually IS the third party of they don't get on board. And yes, I learned a lot from 1992 and 1994 (and 1980, 1988, 1990, and 2008)

Don't run another RINO unless you want to see your voters bolt. That's the fact of the matter.

And don't assume you're the only one on here with half a brain. It's rather unbecoming.

37 posted on 09/19/2010 9:30:35 AM PDT by Lloyd227 (Class of 1998 (let's all help the Team McCain spider monkeys decide how to moderate))
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To: mylife
For quite some time now I have been clamoring for a third party which could replace the GOP with real conservative thinking, and conservative policy. I looked at the Libertarians, and the the Constitution party, both of which have their pros and cons, but could not find a good solid replacement along the lines I sought.

Factionaling the movement into just another one of the "teams" to cheer for would be utterly suicidal politically. That is the lesson of third party movements in US history. It does nothing but split the reform movement into competing factions and ensure the dominance of their political foes. Those who fail to learn the lessons of history and doomed to repeat them to paraphrase Santana.

38 posted on 09/19/2010 9:31:45 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (The problem with Socialism is eventually you run out of other people's money. Lady Thatcher)
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To: MNJohnnie

I’m sorry that line got you so fired up, but if you read down further you might find that I was supporting a tea party commandeering of the GOP, not a 3rd party, which was the wider thought of the article. I think most in this thread agree with you that 3rd parties aren’t really the answer.


39 posted on 09/19/2010 9:32:42 AM PDT by wgflyer (Liberalism is to society what HIV is to the immune system.)
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To: wgflyer
I have been clamoring for a third party which could replace the GOP with real conservative thinking, and conservative policy.


40 posted on 09/19/2010 9:33:10 AM PDT by EternalVigilance (If liberalism was really popular, politicians wouldn't all be pretending to be conservative.)
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To: MNJohnnie

The upcoming “Republican tsunami” is made up almost entirely of the Tea Party. The GOP is poised for huge wins in November, true enough, but you might notice that a lot of these incoming Republicans are new faces, not the usual pack of old RINOs.

You don’t suppose the Tea Party has been running candidates under the GOP banner, do ya?

Smaller government, lower taxes, more personal liberty — gee, the Republicans sure sound a lot like those crazy Tea Party radicals!

Oh ... wait ...


41 posted on 09/19/2010 10:57:56 AM PDT by DNME (With the sound of distant drums ... something wicked this way comes.)
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To: wgflyer

I really do think the internet has changed things.

I used to be the crazy bastard that yelled at the TV when lies where spoken.

Now people hear me.

Now people get their news through the internet, they blog and converse.

In the olden days they could be isolated By the MSM AND PAINTED.

That just isnt true anymore.
FR is a prime example. Dan Rather will attest to that.


42 posted on 09/19/2010 11:12:40 AM PDT by mylife (Opinions $1 Halfbaked 50c)
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To: mylife
I really do think the internet has changed things.

It will have a greater impact on humankind than did the invention of the printing press 500 years ago.

43 posted on 09/19/2010 11:16:44 AM PDT by abb ("What ISN'T in the news is often more important than what IS." Ed Biersmith, 1942 -)
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To: abb

I agree, If we can keep it free.


44 posted on 09/19/2010 11:23:40 AM PDT by mylife (Opinions $1 Halfbaked 50c)
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To: MNJohnnie

Look at the election of 1860— they didn’t get a majority— if the Democrats hadn’t been split—there Civil War might have been avoided.


45 posted on 09/19/2010 2:10:00 PM PDT by Forward the Light Brigade (Into the Jaws of H*ll)
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