Do Southerners Have the Right to be Described as "Native Americans"?

10-7-2010 | comtedemaistre

[rhombus]

Hahaha, OK, I'll play. I went to school in the North (but have lived in both the North and the South). What they taught me in the North was that it was about both states rights and the inalienable rights where the founders stated: "We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

I don't know how anyone can say that the war was about anything but both. Either all men have rights or they don't and a state either has the ability to deny those rights to some men and not others or they do not.

[SeekAndFind]

Quote from the famous Baltimore Journalist, H.L. Mencken regarding the Gettysburg Address:

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“But let us not forget that it is poetry, not logic; beauty, not sense. Think of the argument in it. Put it into the cold words of everyday. The doctrine is simply this: that the Union soldiers who died at Gettysburg sacrificed their lives to the cause of self-determination— ‘that government of the people, by the people, for the people,’ should not perish from the earth. It is difficult to imagine anything more untrue.

“The Union soldiers in that battle actually fought against self-determination; it was the Confederates who fought for the right of their people to govern themselves. What was the practical effect of the battle of Gettysburg? What else than the destruction of the old sovereignty of the States, i.e., of the people of the States? The Confederates went into battle free; they came out with their freedom subject to the supervision and veto of the rest of the country—and for nearly twenty years that veto was so effective that they enjoyed scarcely more liberty, in the political sense, than so many convicts in the penitentiary.”

— Journalist H.L. Mencken, From “Five Men at Random,” “Prejudices: Third Series,” 1922, pp. 171-76: First printed, in part, in the “Smart Set,” May, 1920, p. 141

[Mr Ramsbotham]

If they keep it up, maybe they can qualify for reparations.

[SnakeDoctor]

I’m a Texan, not a Yankee.

I just think the whole debate comes from a faulty premise ... “indigenous” superiority. Who cares?

SnakeDoc

[Mr Ramsbotham]

Since we’re into Southerners vs Northerners, we might want to ask again -— was the civil war between the American North and South about slavery as the standard talking heads want us to believe, or was it about state rights and the right to self-determination?

If only we had some kind of documents from the time that listed the reasons why the various states seceded--only then could we answer that question. As it is, we can only speculate.

[Non-Sequitur]

Because Southerners are pioneers and not immigrants, they deserve to be described as "Native Americans". Southern culture and heritage, deserves as much respect as the Cherokee, Navajo, Comanche, Apache, and the Sioux cultures.

The term is 'Native Americans' not 'Native United Staters'. White Southerners track their beginnings back to Europe. They have no more right to use the term than any other people who originated in Europe, Asia, or Africa.

[hawgwalker]

I am a native American. The only difference is that my ancestors came here by boat rather than walking across ice.

[Hemingway's Ghost]

What's with all the juvenile posts about southern this and southern that lately? Are you fellows down there feeling unloved or something?

Did this little tome crack a "C" in the sixth grade essay contest?

Honestly, how stupid . . .

[native texan]

As a native American, are we entitled to the same benefits other native Americans have, such as having our own land, and not under the US laws? Humm...this may be pretty good.

[equalitybeforethelaw]

“Both. Northern opposition to the extension of slavery into the territories and newly formed states was regarded as interference with the southerners’ property rights and freedom of movement. But the media eliminate the part about state’s rights.”

One thingy the revisionists forget is that Northern opposition to the extension of slavery into western territories was based on the precept that the west should be for only the white man. Blacks were to be kept out and Indians either concentrated or killed. So who was the racist in 1860?

[SeekAndFind]

Abraham Lincoln Quote

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“I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in anyway the social and political equality of the white and black races - that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race. I say upon this occasion I do not perceive that because the white man is to have the superior position the negro should be denied everything.”

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Source: Fourth Debate with Stephen A. Douglas at Charleston, Illinois, September 18, 1858
(The Collected Works of Abraham Lincoln edited by Roy P. Basler, Volume III, pp. 145-146.)

http://quod.lib.umich.edu/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=lincoln;idno=lincoln3;rgn=div2;view=text;cc=lincoln;node=lincoln3%3A20.1

[Non-Sequitur]

Since we’re into Southerners vs Northerners, we might want to ask again -— was the civil war between the American North and South about slavery as the standard talking heads want us to believe, or was it about state rights and the right to self-determination?

A state's right and determination to do what?

[Izzy Dunne]

I am not a hillbilly, I’m an “Appalachian-American” !!

[Genoa]

True but it would be easier to pass antislavery law as more non slave states joined the union.

The ruling political and economic segment of the south objected to the very idea that "non-slave states" would join the union. Each new non-slave state (or territory) would mean that owners of slaves could not take up residence in that state unless they divested themselves of their slaves.

[Allegra]

My mother's family got to America in the 1600s. Dad's family got to the US in the 1800s.

So, yeah, I'm a native American.

I'm also a southerner....on both sides of the family. Mother's ancestors fought for the Confederacy in the Civil War.

[SeekAndFind]

RE: There you’ve started it!!!

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We don’t have to fight or quarrel over it. What’s done is done and we can’t undo what’s done.

But we can for the sake of educating ourselves, DISCUSS IT in a civil manner in order to avoid the mistakes of the past.

[Georgia Girl 2]

American by birth. Southern by the grace of God.

[ontap]

In the past it seems to descend into insulting posts!!

[Genoa]

A lot of it had to do with power. Northern political and economic interests, which differed in many respects from the corresponding interests in the South, didn’t want to see more and more slave states joining the union and adding to that bloc of votes in Congress.

[rhombus]

One thingy the revisionists forget is that Northern opposition to the extension of slavery into western territories was based on the precept that the west should be for only the white man. Blacks were to be kept out and Indians either concentrated or killed. So who was the racist in 1860? .

Wow, it was real nice of those Southerners to try and preserve slavery to help the poor black man out from those filthy Northern bigots. snicker ;-)