Skip to comments.Citizen exercises right to petition the government, agency initiates investigation into citizen
Posted on 02/04/2011 9:41:47 AM PST by Swanks
Kevin J. Lacy, a traffic engineer who works for NCDOT. When David N. Cox was exercising his right to petition the government, and submitted an 8 page document to support the North Raleigh Coalition of Homeowners' Associations case for more traffic lights to go with some new roadwork, Kevin Lacy whined to the NC Board of Examiners for Engineers and Surveyors to investigate David Cox.
Though Cox never claimed, nor has he been accused of claiming he is an engineer, Lacy thought the report "appears to be engineering-level work" by a non licensed person. So, in other words, the report was too good for a plain citizen to do, and for this he must be punished, apparently.
As a result of Lacy's petty jealousies, David Cox is being investigated, and his free speech is being trampled.
Kevin Lacy is what's wrong with the government on so many levels. He's a two-bit engineer, who seems to be enraged that ordinary citizens are challenging his work and conclusions. And the fact that they did it in a very well thought out, organized, and professional manner is outrageous to him. People with the brains of this dolt, should not be on the public payroll/dole.
Practice of engineering.
a. Any service or creative work, the adequate performance of which requires engineering education, training, and experience, in the application of special knowledge of the mathematical, physical, and engineering sciences to such services or creative work as consultation, investigation, evaluation, planning, and design of engineering works and systems, planning the use of land and water, engineering surveys, and the observation of construction for the purposes of assuring compliance with drawings and specifications, including the consultation, investigation, evaluation, planning, and design for either private or public use, in connection with any utilities, structures, buildings, machines, equipment, processes, work systems, projects, and industrial or consumer products or equipment of a mechanical, electrical, hydraulic, pneumatic or thermal nature, insofar as they involve safeguarding life, health or property, and including such other professional services as may be necessary to the planning, progress and completion of any engineering services.
A person shall be construed to practice or offer to practice engineering, within the meaning and intent of this Chapter, who practices any branch of the profession of engineering; or who, by verbal claim, sign, advertisement, letterhead, card, or in any other way represents the person to be a professional engineer, or through the use of some other title implies that the person is a professional engineer or that the person is licensed under this Chapter; or who holds the person out as able to perform, or who does perform any engineering service or work not exempted by this Chapter, or any other service designated by the practitioner which is recognized as engineering.
b. The term “practice of engineering” shall not be construed to permit the location, description, establishment or reestablishment of property lines or descriptions of land boundaries for conveyance. The term does not include the assessment of an underground storage tank required by applicable rules at closure or change in service unless there has been a discharge or release of the product from the tank.
I Think Kevin will have a hard time proving that “we need more stop light because of traffic here, here, and HERE” requires much more than Driver Ed. Good luck on your next job, Kev!
OH, and yes, they can take my title of Nuclear Engineer from my cold dead Naval Reactor Operator hands when I scram to the big Reactor in the sky!
Gad. The idiot thinks highly of himself, doesn’t he?
I worked with one person who was former enlisted Navy and serve a lot of time on nuke boats. No college degree. Still as knowledgable as most engineers, however. He’s currently on track to being on the plant management team of a major refinery.
I have hear that even though there are specialties on the boat, most everyone on the boat knows at least the basics from how to load and fire a torpedo to how to run a reactor. Everything except how to operate the radio (thank the Walker family for that one). Everyone I have worked with that was nuclear Navy was top notch.
It is absurd beyond words for Mr. Lacy to take the position that its okay for people to petition the government, but not for them to do it too well. Licensing professionals has nothing to do with the constitutional rights of citizens to make their feelings known.
“Yes, its good some are prosecuted and even wind up with jail time. Thats only some though.”
There is no perfect justice this side of Judgment Day. The pols who think they can do anything they want generally get axed eventually: sufficiently often to keep most of the rest twitchy, since “the guilty flee even when no one pursues them”.
“Whats bothersome is neither party learns anything. . . .
Seems a rather dull lot to me - a sort of dumb and dumber.”
So, one of the parties where you moved has learned something useful? Enjoy it while it lasts. Better a dumb politician, whether ‘normal’ or psychopathic.
It’s the smart psychopaths that are the greatest concern, though in this country they tend to gravitate into Wall Street and financial services rather than politics, and buy whatever politicians or regulators they need to achieve their purposes. If it’s clear that a smart psychopath has plowed their way to the top, best plan is to leave ASAP, whether it’s an enterprise or a country. The people who facilitate their rise, and then hang around, get the governance they deserve.
Did you take the PE exam in Controls? Or did you do EE? I’m asking because I got my degree in ChE, but I now work with DCS. I have my EIT, but I was hesitant to go for a PE in Chem E because I don’t use any of it in my current job.
Yep...you need to have a license to practice engineering, same as law, accounting, medicine. Most of the time the state boards for engineering do nothing. Since they almost never do their job, and basically never have, folks are surprised when they hear about engineering licensing.
Does it mean you know everything? No. An engineer is not supposed to practice outside of their experience and expertise.
It’s the way it is, for better or worse. My biggest beef with it is not the licensing practice itself - it’s easy, but the fact that you have to go through it in every state you wish to practice.
Theoretically, a Mexican Engineer can practice in every state in the US - because they have reciprocity by federal treaty under NAFTA, but an American has to jump through far more hoops.
Sounds like the State Engineer is using his position/connections in government to harass a guy who made him look bad. If the work was engineering-level and good, the State Engineer should have offered to stamp it and pass it on for consideration. That’s what any reasonable person would have done with a concerned citizen who knew what they were doing. Problem solved.
“I have my EIT, but I was hesitant to go for a PE in Chem E because I dont use any of it in my current job.”
Just take a refresher course and sit for the exam. It’s easy.
My license is EE. Not all states recognize the Controls discipline, two of which are New Jersey and Alaska. Since you are doing work with DCS’s, you are working with process controls, thus applicable to chemical engineering.
I have done process modeling, for the purpose of validating control schemes. When you look at the math involved, it is not much of a leap from being able to do an electrical circuit analysis to being able to do a heat and material balance. This is why everything is covered on the EIT. And when you look at control systems, it overlaps every other engineering discipline except for civil engineering.
“If the work was engineering-level and good, the State Engineer should have offered to stamp it and pass it on for consideration. Thats what any reasonable person would have done with a concerned citizen who knew what they were doing. Problem solved.”
I have incorporated numerous suggestions from designers, plant operators, and constructive crafts. Not blindly of course, each is evaluated for merit. There is nothing wrong with that. Yet there are those with professional licenses who look down at anyone working for them, or even clients, with disdain. It’s a really good way to lose clients, and I have seen it happen.
“Yet there are those with professional licenses who look down at anyone working for them, or even clients, with disdain. Its a really good way to lose clients, and I have seen it happen.”
Oh, I’ve seen it plenty of times myself. However, another aspect of licensing that hasn’t been discussed on this thread is liability. Someone has to be responsible - in fact (as I’m sure you know) the legal concept of “Responsible Charge” goes hand-in-hand with licensing.
If this individual’s suggestions create a traffic hazard, who is responsible?
I still maintain that the right way for this state engineer to handle this situation is to review, make any necessary changes, collaborate with the guy, and stamp the freaking plans. Everyone wins, and the engineer doesn’t look like a douche.