Posted on 02/15/2011 1:23:29 PM PST by MindBender26
Edited on 02/15/2011 7:34:17 PM PST by Admin Moderator. [history]
Poor women living without a man in the house are common targets for “honor” killings. No one to protect them from the bloodlust of these savages.
Yes, it is a wholly horrible thing when one or more humans treat(s) another human so brutally (even if the human being attacked did something stupid). I now see better the nature of your visceral reaction. And it is rightly visceral: that a man (or men) can treat a woman in such a despicable manner is flat-out mind-numbingly wrong. Such crimes must be immediately condemned.
Through their actions these men have surrendered their claim on humanity. By behaving brutishly they have rendered themselves brutes. All sane people should react viscerally to what they did.
But after one reacts, then what?
And please don't conclude that because I ask this question that I have an answer. At least, any more of an answer than what I've written in earlier posts on this thread. That is, if you've managed to slog through my long-winded posts. Lord, can I blather on.
This is my reason why i dont think woman in the military should be on the front lines. Woman captured in combat would be subject to horrendous atrocities, more so than most men would. I dont think its sexist or masoginist at all to want to see no harm come to the opposite sex.
I'm right there with you, FRiend. It is not sexist or misogynist. Perhaps chivalrous, but even if so, that's not a bad thing.
Cheers.
I agree,..Lara Logan does not need to abused any further--even through careless words or cheat shots for a laugh. But that is always, sad to say, found posted on any site.
I add: From the Beck Show:
CLIP*- In the crush of the mob, she was separated from her crew. She was surrounded and suffered brutal and sustained sexual assault and beating before being saved by a group of women and an estimated 20 Egyptian soldiers.”
“She reconnected with her CBS team and returned to her hotel and returned to the United States on the first flight. She is currently in the hospital with no further comment.”
“Horrific,” Glenn said.
“Now, let’s tell the next part of the story that I got from Pat this morning that has to be included.”
Nir Rosen, a fellow at the NYU Center for Law and Security, said, “Lara Logan had to outdo Anderson [Cooper]” in regards to her attack and proceeded to give a halfhearted apology in which he called her “warmonger”.
What else do you expect from the left?
BREAKING: Nir Rosen has now tendered his resignation to NYU.
I'm not sure.
There sure seems to be a group of people who fail to realize that some things transcend politics and fall into simple matters of human decency.
While the same people might post outrage and invective against someone on the other side of the political spectrum for so much as wishing for such misery to befall a conservative, they readily jump in with the "she deserved it" crap here over an actual and horrific criminal act.
Hypocrisy isn't a worthwhile fashion accessory on either side of the aisle.
Glad to see you take this stand, too.
Well it must have been one hell of an assault to put you in a hospital for days
Agreed.
(quoting wardaddy) can they all be genuine? (end of wardady quote)
I'm not sure.
I don't think they are. I read the thread through. Some sections I read twice. I think some of the comments are outlandishly out of bounds precisely to make a point: namely, if this were a conservative mob/Tea Party gathering/etc., that CBS would not be sitting on the story. Instead, they'd be shouting this story from the roof tops 24/7. Some posts state this explicitly.
Is my read correct? Who knows. Perhaps some FReepers are indulging in unbecoming behavior. If this is true, it's sad, but there it is.
While the same people might post outrage and invective against someone on the other side of the political spectrum for so much as wishing for such misery to befall a conservative, they readily jump in with the "she deserved it" crap here over an actual and horrific criminal act.
Indeed. And why might that be? I'm serious. I really want your take on this. I'm not trying to bait you.
You see, earlier in the thread I said that I believe some of the Left's filth has rubbed off on us conservatives. That we've been lied about, slandered, smeared, and spit upon so long that some of us have, rightly or wrongly, descended to the same level. I can't help wonder if some of the unpleasant comments, if they were spoken in earnest, were motivated by a tit-for-tat attitude. Unbecoming? Yes. Surprising? Not really.
Wouldn't you agree that there are some adult-aged adolescents in this world? And that such individuals might be less able than you to withstand the Leftist onslaught of Saul Alinksy tactics, without themselves succumbing to indulging in similar behaviors?
Please don't misunderstand. I am not trying to shift blame to the Left for the actions of those individuals over which you felt disgust. Each of the people in the group of whom you speak is responsible for his or her own actions. Even if the Left has rubbed them so raw as to erase "simple matters of human decency" from their hearts, it is still each of them that chose to descend to that level.
Just as I chose to refrain from reflexively chiming in with the individuals who said Ms. Logan's assault transcends politics. She works for a Leftist organization, CBS. A Leftist organization so bound to its Politically Correct ideology--and so detached from reality--that it would send a petite, attractive, blond-haired Western woman into a crowd of aggrieved, agitated Middle-Eastern men with a security detail smaller than the 101st Airborne. In my opinion, that makes it political: a prime example of Leftist political stupidity.
On a human level, I hope and pray for her recovery. But on every other level I want to scream: "What the hell were all of you thinking????!!!!!" Including her. At least Katie Couric had the good sense to bail.
If you've read this far, then I thank you. I can be terribly long-winded. (Are your eyes bleeding yet?)
Cheers.
snicker.
I wish I were the POTUS right now cause I would invade that shithole with US Marines and tell our boys anyone who gets a confirmed kill of these rapists will win 5 Million Bucks!
This really pisses me off and if Obama don't at least make a strong public statement condemning these animals he should hide in shame till the end of his first and only term and then disappear from public life forever.
I hope everyone of these rapist thugs die a long and painful death, like thrown in prison and raped to death by some well-endowed he-man!
Get a clue, dumb See BS reporterette! You're lucky you're alive. What are you going to name your Egyptian “souvenir’ in 9 months? Doh!
Heck, they'd do it for free and do it efficiently. They were and are the world's best exterminators of evil men, that is until the Libs got a hold of the checkbook and slipped a some pansies and some pension waiting sellouts to muck up the Pentagon.
Good warriors still exist and are willing to do battle with such vile wickedness. They just need the governor taken off.
Post #413 to you. It appears your have a SN similar.
“From your handle, sounds as though you live in LA. If you are attacked at gunpoint, but because living in LA you cannot defend yourself with a gun and a concealed weapons permit, we could always say, “ah well, he had it coming for living there”. “
I’ve made plenty of bad decisions and paid a pretty heavy price most of the time. And yes I do live in LA. But the difference is that if I went down to south LA (gangland central) and hung out there on a Friday night in the hood and got robbed at gun point, beat up and shot what would people here on this board say? Probably something to the effect of “what the heck was that idiot thinking?”. There would not be much sympathy for me. Same with her, you don’t go down to the hood and not expect something bad to happen. That’s what she did and that’s what happens when you do that. So yes I see how it works, do you?
It happened Friday the 11th. Expect bad things to happen for westerners on the 11th of anything here on out.
Iranian revolution deposed the Shah February 11, 1979.
Egyptian revolution deposed Mubarek February 11, 2011.
Lara Logan’s rape was a planned celebration of Satanism as only muslims can celebrate him. This is the beginning of the end. It really looks like it this time.
Reminds me of the story of the British Officer learning about the Indian Suttee custom. His remark was to proffer a promise that any man guilty of participating in the ritual would be hung by the neck until dead, as is British custom.
Spain Train bombings occurred 3/11/04, 911 days after another 11 event. What was it called? Oh yeah. 9/11/01.
Yeah, a beating will do that. She may have been raped but that has not been claimed. There were so many cameras around it may have been captured on tape.
Only one things surprises me. They didn’t stone her to death for being raped.
This is the thing - the validity of your point.
Optimistic Freepers continue to express hope for America because of our historic national character. But the people of America have changed and out national character is no longer one of a moral, mannered, honorable, courteous God-fearing society that believes in hard work and the Golden Rule. Oh certainly many people still do.
But we are a completely different America than 50 years ago or 100 years ago. To save America from socialist tyranny and ongoing cultural decay, we need most Americans to be moral, religious and righteous. I don’t have a lot of faith that the current composition of apathetic, opportunistic takers on the dole are going to save America.
A nation is only as good as her people. Are we good anymore? I don’t know that we are. I really fear we are not, taking all of us together.
De Tocqueville’s quote applies here, “America is great because she is good. If America ceases to be good, America will cease to be great.”
We are rapidly heading this way. Maybe we will see a resurgence of “good” among the common people in society. I am not seeing it. I see only masses willing to surrender all freedom for cradle-to-grave entitlements and taking all they can in the meantime. Such a group will not save America.
I’m really depressed by this thought. Really saddened.
I agree.
We have to be realistic in dealing with other parts of the world. In much of the world, women are treated very differently than they are in more “civilized” dare I say, parts of the world.
And the other main point is that we were sending reporters into a mob; into a revolution in progress. Even some men reporters were roughed up and attacked in different ways.
Unfortunately, women are especially prone to sexual assaults, and in a mob situation in a place which has no real respect for women, she was in a very unsafe place.
Wasn’t Nicholas Kristof - the beatnik who never grew up - saying “We Are All Egyptians Now”?
I agree with you. I am more than embarrassed by some of my fellow FReepers. For goodness sake, can't people see that these assaults are really attacks on all of us Americans?
Bump dat, Lancey!
This is just a “different” kind of multiculturism.
As we all know, multi-cultism has failed.
I haven’t read the entire thread...and I don’t want to.
I want to thank you for the ping, wardaddy...and commend you and MB for your posts. I’m sure there are other gentlemen who agree with you...at least, I hope so.
There is a time and place where such vitriolic sentiments might well be justified for the irony of the situation, if nothing else, and almost all of us can be unsympathetically brutal in such instances (Darwin Awards, for instance).
However, there are times when even the assumption that the person was there of their own free will and knowing all of the risks does not tip the balance in favor of brutality. The events which have occurred so far outweigh any verbal trashing that to do so only makes those who do so seem cheap, as cheap as the littlest one in the gang kicking the victim the toughest have put down.
The blame belongs first and foremost with the perpetrators of the crime.
Had they not acted as they did, all else would be moot.
As for who misinformed whom or who made bad decisions, let the lady sort that out with her employers and those who may have informed her erroneously or with disregard for her safety. That is their matter to settle.
I can only offer my prayers, that, despite her politics, she heal as well and as quickly as possible from what must have been a very nasty experience.
Excellent post, SJ! Thank you for the ping, wardaddy!
Thank you, both, for being such caring, chivalrous men. It’s hard to believe that after the way men have been treated for over 30 years that we still have men such as yourselves.
One question I have, and I’m sure it’s been asked before, but.................where are the feminists? Do they believe that this kind of abuse come with the territory, and she should just “let it go”? I haven’t heard hide nor hair from them. Have either of you two?
Poor woman. I hope she’ll be okay.
I wonder who those filthy animals will be voting for.
(insert Anderson Cooper joke)
Good question, and no, I haven't heard a peep.
Interesting that those who push for combat roles for women won't stand up for the noncombatants (although in the war against radical Islam I'm not sure anyone is truly a noncombatant). You'd think they would be howling bloody blue murder.
I predict stockholm syndrome if she doesn’t open her eyes and turn more conservative. I wish I had 5 minutes with those savages. This crap is coming to the u.s. via the saudi funded madrahsas.
The “civilized world” needs to understand that's what the enemy is. Worse than the Nazis by far.
Gee, you almost never hear about this sort of thing happening at a Tea Party.
a thread that will live in infamy..at least to me
i’ve seen this stuff before here
probably boys frustrated at life and inexperienced or older jaded people
i’m saving it
when they pop up with their BS again..and they will...they even do it when kids do stupid stuff and get killed..heartless asshats
i’ll be here to remind them how funny they are-were
this is the purpose Clown Posse once served...for sad folks like that...not here
I like “old school”. ;o)
Old school is decent and caring. Plus, old school is the right order in this world.
Have you heard that men and women are different? lol
Hunters and gatherers vs nurturers...it’s the way things are meant to be.
However, that doesn’t mean that women can’t do many things that men can do, and still be nurturers. It doesn’t mean that men can’t do many things women do, and still be hunters and gatherers.
It means that you don’t put women in the midst of a bunch of Muslim men, who believe women to be chattel.
That’s just stupid.
I personally wouldn’t let some men I know nurse a sick person, either. lol
Ooooh...bumping that post!
When you have the chance to use some of the posts on this thread, please ping me.
I noticed that a looong time ago. (8^D)
However, that doesn’t mean that women can’t do many things that men can do, and still be nurturers. It doesn’t mean that men can’t do many things women do, and still be hunters and gatherers.
Agreed, and I have taught a number of my granddaughters to shoot and track game (and whatever else they need to). Part of real freedom lies in the lack of dependence on others to do the things you can, and being as capable as possible. It also serves as a guard against them getting saddled with a fellow who can't tie his own shoes.
It means that you don’t put women in the midst of a bunch of Muslim men, who believe women to be chattel.
I agree with that as well. Someone either underestimated the potential in the situation or sent someone in looking for another story. That goes beyond simply stupid.
“Agreed, and I have taught a number of my granddaughters to shoot and track game (and whatever else they need to).”
What a great grandpop you are! My grands have been shooting since before they were six years old, one of them since three. Your granddaughters have a leg up on them, though, because mine don’t track. But, when there’s a job that needs doin’...mine do it good. ;o)
“Part of real freedom lies in the lack of dependence on others to do the things you can, and being as capable as possible. It also serves as a guard against them getting saddled with a fellow who can’t tie his own shoes.”
You are absolutely right! No one should have to rely on anyone else for their well being.
“That goes beyond simply stupid.”
It’s not just simply stupid...it’s PC, which IMHO is the ultimate stupidity.
Only for the practitioners, ma'm. The proponents are diabolically attempting to destroy the ability of Americans to think and communicate ideas which might be damaging to their cause.
That isn't stupidity, it is war against Western Civilization and against intelligence itself.
Thank you for your kind words. Sorry it took so long to reply (I've got the flu).
Indeed, when a horrible thing like this assault occurs, the lack of perspective is stunning and sobering. For my part I earlier admitted that I didn't feel compelled to jump immediately to Ms. Logan's defense. I even said, "And yes, I know exactly what that says about me." Even now I still stand by that comment. But what I failed to mention earlier is that I'm not all that proud about this.
Off the cuff posts can be devastatingly revealing. Perhaps a mirror placed in front of the keyboard, or maybe a picture of some loved one(s) would help to "idiot-proof" responses.
One of the attributes of the written word is that, no pun intended, it reads differently than the spoken. Whether the "a**-hats" (your term, not mine) are hard-wired, stupid, or just plain oblivious of the way written comments read--and the permanence they have--I don't know. But I do know that despite my best efforts to edit my own comments before I hit "Post" I still sometimes have regrets down the road. That's the risk we take on forums like FR.
Verbal venting is fine, I suppose, because the spoken word, if not recorded, vanishes into the ether within moments. Written venting lingers quite a bit longer.
I have commented several times on the increasing lack of civility here on FR. Many others have agreed. I have no answers on how to handle it.
I'm right there with you. No, I don't think I've commented previously about the lack of civility on FR. Shoot, on this thread I'm defending it to some degree.
I also have no definitive answers on how to best approach it. That's one of the reasons why I jumped in on this thread. To ask questions, and perhaps find some answers.
I think we can all better the environment here by simply pointing out stupid when we see it. Maybe the perpetrators will slowly come to realize what line they have stepped over - maybe they won't and will self-destruct. Either way the garbage gets taken out.
Agreed. Though I took a slightly different tack on this thread. I wanted to point out that maybe some of the more ugly comments were spoken, not by ugly people, but by people whose hearts have been hardened by the vitriol of the Left. Why did I take this tack? Good question.
Mainly because I want to say to those who, like me, seem to have checked our humanity at the door, that, "I get where you're coming from. I too, at some base level, feel that Ms. Logan got what she deserved. But feelings are one thing. Thoughts are another. Is it more beneficial to be motivated by one's feelings than ones thoughts? Wouldn't it be more beneficial to perhaps put a cork in it rather than to transcribe our verbal venting for all the world to see (and the Looney Left to exploit)?"
Ever Onward.
And Eagles Up! Time to get ready for work. Cheers.
“...it is war against Western Civilization and against intelligence itself.”
We are seeing that breaking out all over the place now.
Ms. Piven should be proud of all of the chaos going on.
They won’t win, though...not in the good ole USA.
Push has come to shove...
Yes, Jesus did. Thank you for the reminder. :-)
With that now in mind I invite you to consider: I don't have Jesus's moral authority. Not. Even. Close. If I wish to chastise you or anyone for your/their inappropriate behavior then I must first establish some credibility. Otherwise I'm just some guy on a website wagging my finger at your face. And because I genuinely believed that Ms. Logan in some measure reaped what CBS had sown--and later realized I was not proud that I had had that reaction--I thought maybe I could turn my reaction to some small measure of good. How? By identifying with both those who seemed to be saying "good riddance" as well as those who seemed to be pleading "where is your humanity?"
Maybe I was wrong to attempt to thread this needle. I don't know. But I'm glad that I have had the opportunity to interact with you and several others. I especially like your tag line, for it is one of the thoughts that often flows through my mind. More on this later.
There is a time and place where such vitriolic sentiments might well be justified for the irony of the situation, if nothing else, and almost all of us can be unsympathetically brutal in such instances (Darwin Awards, for instance).
However, there are times when even the assumption that the person was there of their own free will and knowing all of the risks does not tip the balance in favor of brutality. The events which have occurred so far outweigh any verbal trashing that to do so only makes those who do so seem cheap, as cheap as the littlest one in the gang kicking the victim the toughest have put down.
Well spoken. Thank you for saying that. I needed to hear it. Wow.
Your thoughts there bring to mind one of my favorite Thomas Jefferson quotes: "Error of opinion may be tolerated where reason is left free to combat it."
I think it's safe to say that your use of reason has better equipped me to combat my own error of opinion. For that I thank you.
The blame belongs first and foremost with the perpetrators of the crime.
Had they not acted as they did, all else would be moot.
Hear, hear. No doubt God wept--and wept bitterly--when these brutes did what they did to Ms. Logan.
As for who misinformed whom or who made bad decisions, let the lady sort that out with her employers and those who may have informed her erroneously or with disregard for her safety. That is their matter to settle.
Another well spoken point, FRiend. Again I say, wow.
I can only offer my prayers, that, despite her politics, she heal as well and as quickly as possible from what must have been a very nasty experience.
I concur.
And now to more about your tag line. Isn't it fascinating that God would love us humans so much that He gives us the freedom--that terrible freedom--to choose our own damnation if that's what we really want? I for one simply cannot wrap my feeble little mind around such a love. And oh, the weeping He must endure because of it.
Grace and Peace to you.
It is a love every parent fortunate enough to have a child who reaches adulthood tastes of in that relationship, however faintly, and that is at best but a dim reflection of the love God Has for us all. Tremendous, and with certainty not without pain.
Grace and Peace to you.
And with you and all your house. God Bless, FRiend.
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