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Germans Pull Forces Out of NATO as Libyan Coalition Falls Apart
dailymail.com ^ | Last updated at 11:42 PM on 22nd March 2011 | By Daily Mail Reporter

Posted on 03/22/2011 6:53:59 PM PDT by 11th_VA

Deep divisions between allied forces currently bombing Libya worsened today as the German military announced it was pulling forces out of NATO over continued disagreement on who will lead the campaign.

A German military spokesman said it was recalling two frigates and AWACS surveillance plane crews from the Mediterranean, after fears they would be drawn into the conflict if NATO takes over control from the U.S.

The infighting comes as a heated meeting of NATO ambassadors yesterday failed to resolve whether the 28-nation alliance should run the operation to enforce a U.N.-mandated no-fly zone, diplomats said.

Yesterday a war of words erupted between the U.S. and Britain after the U.K. government claimed Muammar Gaddafi is a legitimate target for assassination.

(Excerpt) Read more at dailymail.co.uk ...


TOPICS: Breaking News; Foreign Affairs; Germany; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: epicfail4obama; gaddafi; germany; libya; nationalsecurityfail; nato; obama; obamaisepicfail; revolution
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To: dynachrome
A Der Spiegel Abu Ghraib-like story about US troops on trial for murder hit yesterday. May sound wierd, but this could be a political firestorm in Germany. The story and the background of the story was front page news on Drudge but curiously missing on AP and NYT. Anyone care to guess why?
101 posted on 03/22/2011 8:20:11 PM PDT by yup2394871293
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To: 11th_VA

102 posted on 03/22/2011 8:21:25 PM PDT by Revolting cat! (Let us prey!)
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To: 668 - Neighbor of the Beast
A true world statesman is he!


103 posted on 03/22/2011 8:23:31 PM PDT by garjog
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To: Frantzie

I think this was supposed to raise Obambi’s approval rating. Epic Fail.


104 posted on 03/22/2011 8:24:18 PM PDT by redgolum ("God is dead" -- Nietzsche. "Nietzsche is dead" -- God.)
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To: 11th_VA

This is the worst fiasco since Iraq. What a joke. These people did nothing to US — nothing that is proven. Who do we think we are? The UN resolution means nothing!!! It is our Constitution and the War Powers Act that govern us. We need to GET OUT OF THE UN!!! We need to GET OUT OF THESE ARAB COUNTRIES!!. No Blood — No money. If they screw with us we turn them to GLASS!!


105 posted on 03/22/2011 8:25:10 PM PDT by Davidlion
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To: farmguy
The zero is making Carter look like a genius.
106 posted on 03/22/2011 8:31:09 PM PDT by TexasFreeper2009 (Obama = Carter 2.0 The Epic Fail Edition)
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To: ConorMacNessa

I can think of others more dangerous to our Republic... but I will leave it at that!


107 posted on 03/22/2011 8:32:11 PM PDT by rcrngroup
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To: rabidralph

“I want this in the Off-Road package.”

Indeed. But see if the dealer will throw in a one year’s supply of ammo for free.


108 posted on 03/22/2011 8:32:33 PM PDT by catnipman (Cat Nipman: Made from the right stuff!)
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To: Islander7
Obama has made it clear he wants no part of any leadership role in Libya

ROFL

He can't even handle the leadership role he already has!

ROFL

wow, if their was EVER an argument against affirmative action in college admissions Obama is it!

109 posted on 03/22/2011 8:33:05 PM PDT by TexasFreeper2009 (Obama = Carter 2.0 The Epic Fail Edition)
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To: 11th_VA

It’s not The Libyan Coalition. It’s The Obama Coalition.


110 posted on 03/22/2011 8:33:55 PM PDT by savedbygrace (But God.)
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To: 11th_VA

And the Germans have been our allies since they surrendered at Pearl Harbor. No good!


111 posted on 03/22/2011 8:34:52 PM PDT by Revolting cat! (Let us prey!)
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To: screaminsunshine
Time to send in the B-52’s.

Why? To salvage 0dumb0's skinny incompetent kenyan negro ass and put our military at risk?

And why should we spend billions of dollars that we don't have anyway, to bomb Gaddafi & Libya? Let the muzzies kill each other off. And let the Arab League or whatever they're called to handle & pay for it themselves.

112 posted on 03/22/2011 8:37:31 PM PDT by rcrngroup
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To: NonValueAdded
"The Germans cut and run before France???

The Germans aren't stupid. They know what an idiot Barry Hussein Obongo is and they aren't going to waste time, money and lives on Obongo's theatrical attempt to pose as sagacious manly "leader" of the West by attacking Libya. Germany and Europe now realize that Obongo has no intention of winning this "war" and securing Europe's access to Libyan oil.

This "war" is for diminishing the US Armed Forces' material (missles, bombs, funds etc.) and for humiliating NATO and ripping apart the alliance -- particularly with the British and Germany.

113 posted on 03/22/2011 8:39:58 PM PDT by StormEye
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To: MindBender26

He’s got the Midas touch.
Everything he touches turns into a rusty muffler.


114 posted on 03/22/2011 8:41:29 PM PDT by Boiler Plate ("Why be difficult, when with just a little more work, you can be impossible" Mom)
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To: screaminsunshine
Time to send in the B-52’s.

If you really think it'll help...

Love shack ba-aaa-byyyy!


115 posted on 03/22/2011 8:41:29 PM PDT by ItsForTheChildren
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To: dfwgator

and yet the Germans are right here, we have no business here in a war which is illegal because he did not get congress to vote on this and no a letter from a vacation does not cut it


116 posted on 03/22/2011 8:45:03 PM PDT by manc (Shame on all who voted for the repeal of DADT, who supported it or never tried to stop it. Traitors)
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To: indylindy

weird hey how the world is going to crap since the messiah came to power, but but but I thought all is well and we are loved.

ARF

The sad part is that there are those out there who still today think obama is good and then there are those who have no clue which the left buses to the voting booth


117 posted on 03/22/2011 8:50:04 PM PDT by manc (Shame on all who voted for the repeal of DADT, who supported it or never tried to stop it. Traitors)
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To: Ramius

because they see this as a waste of time and can;’t understand why the hell what we’re doing there waging war from a man who was on vacation in Brazil in Rio with his family and mother in law and her friend on our dime

Maybe they see the bigger picture of Soros , Petrobas and a deal struck with oil with our tax money

I’m just waiting for the loon left to state this was all a diversion

ARF


118 posted on 03/22/2011 8:57:00 PM PDT by manc (Shame on all who voted for the repeal of DADT, who supported it or never tried to stop it. Traitors)
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To: Tzimisce

the headline is somewhat misleading. it makes it seems like the Germans left NATO entirely and have withdrawmn from the alliance a la the French. They just moved a couple boats and a plane out of the area to avoid being requisitioned. Germany is still very much in NATO.

And I do have to say that imo some of the criticism of Obama on this is overdone. So far there’s been 0 US casualties, it’s barely cost anything, and it’s only been going on for 4 days. W’s war in Iraq resulted in over 4,000 dead, over 30,000 wounded, and close to a trillion dollars and most conservatives and Republicans had no problem with it and cheered it on at every step. Obama has a way to go to reach that.

Lets see what happens. If Qadaffi is gone in a few days or even weeks and there aren’t any US casualties this will seen as a huge success.

It’s still too early to tell.


119 posted on 03/22/2011 8:58:58 PM PDT by jeltz25
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To: 11th_VA

Bush Sr. said “this will not stand”.....and we drove the Iraqi military out of Kuwait.

Obama says “this will not stand” ......and NATO falls apart.

Bush had what....26 coalition members?

Obieboy has, I think 6....now down to 5?

Two Pictures of Leadership


120 posted on 03/22/2011 9:00:31 PM PDT by HardStarboard (I'm sure George and Dick had quiet smiles while watching the election results!)
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To: 11th_VA

Guess Barack was right when he said this thing would be over in a couple days.


121 posted on 03/22/2011 9:07:14 PM PDT by InvisibleChurch (If your PC is running slowly then it will be easy to catch.)
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To: rcrngroup

Time to send in the B-52’s.
>>>>>>>>>>>

Why? To salvage 0dumb0’s skinny incompetent kenyan negro ass and put our military at risk?

And why should we spend billions of dollars that we don’t have anyway, to bomb Gaddafi & Libya? Let the muzzies kill each other off. And let the Arab League or whatever they’re called to handle & pay for it themselves.
<<<<<<<<<<<<

That’s right. 0bama has already stirred up the Muslim hornet’s nest.....on purpose.


122 posted on 03/22/2011 9:07:23 PM PDT by unkus
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To: Bean Counter

Here we go. People better get used to this, because this is what happens when America abrogates their Leadership.


The world is going to miss the United States.


123 posted on 03/22/2011 9:08:45 PM PDT by unkus
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To: 11th_VA
The Brits will be next.

I'll bet the scorned Winston Churchill bust is laughing its plaster off.

Leni

124 posted on 03/22/2011 9:10:57 PM PDT by MinuteGal (Obama....you'll have to pry my incandescent lightbulbs from my cold, dead fingers!)
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To: Krankor

Seemed that Ike did it pretty well, but he learned how to multi-task while doing that pesky little chore in Europe before he was elected.


125 posted on 03/22/2011 9:23:23 PM PDT by CarryaBigStick (My office is an Airtractor 402)
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To: dynachrome
“Germans are rasist!”

Everyone is racist. It's a normal and natural self defense mechanism.

Birds of a feather flock together.

126 posted on 03/22/2011 9:23:33 PM PDT by blam
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To: redgolum

Merkel “disses” the Kenyan. LOL! Good for her.


127 posted on 03/22/2011 9:33:56 PM PDT by Frantzie (HD TV - Total Brain-washing now in High Def. 3-D Coming soon)
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To: Frantzie
So tell me Generalissimo Zer0, this was a well-planned military operation wasn't it?

Or, did you outsource this fiasco to the morons on your so-called “staff” before you went on vacation to South America?

128 posted on 03/22/2011 9:49:59 PM PDT by MasterGunner01 (To err is human; to forgive is not our policy. -- SEAL Team SIX)
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To: Kenny Bunk

“The choice is between being human and being a Muslim”

Bullseye! You are correct, sir!


129 posted on 03/22/2011 9:50:49 PM PDT by Colonel Blimp
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To: Professional

Indeed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


130 posted on 03/22/2011 9:52:09 PM PDT by avacado
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To: 11th_VA

My God, is it really as bad as this article makes it sound?


131 posted on 03/22/2011 10:06:30 PM PDT by americanophile ("this absurd theology of an immoral Bedouin, is a rotting corpse which poisons our lives"-Ataturk)
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To: Revolting cat!

This is (or should be) a European problem. Ghadaffi is right on their border and this just shows how mature the Europeans have become.

We got lots of help from them in Iraq and Afghanistan, didn’t we? And their GDP is larger than USA’s.


132 posted on 03/22/2011 10:11:37 PM PDT by mewykwistmas (No blood for ($4 a gallon) oil!)
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To: 11th_VA

Remember that while Obama was out playing golf, vacationing, visiting other continents it was Clinton crisscrossing the Atlantic helping set this up.


133 posted on 03/22/2011 10:18:03 PM PDT by Java4Jay
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To: 668 - Neighbor of the Beast

The honeymoon is over, Hussein.


I agree about the honeymoon being over. But 0bama doesn’t care. He’ll continue with his destruction and no one will be able to stop him.

We’re headed into The Perfect Storm.


134 posted on 03/22/2011 10:27:55 PM PDT by unkus
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To: americanophile

My God, is it really as bad as this article makes it sound?


It’s only to get worse. We’re on Easy Street compared to what’s coming.


135 posted on 03/22/2011 10:33:30 PM PDT by unkus
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To: 668 - Neighbor of the Beast
But no, he has to cobble together a coalition.

Obama didn't cobble together anything. Hillary drew this up on cocktail napkins then talked Mr. Do-nothing into it.

The lazy being led by the incompetent.

136 posted on 03/22/2011 10:39:16 PM PDT by vlad335
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To: jeltz25
the headline is somewhat misleading. it makes it seems like the Germans left NATO entirely and have withdrawmn from the alliance a la the French. They just moved a couple boats and a plane out of the area to avoid being requisitioned. Germany is still very much in NATO.

I realize that.

But do you remember what liberals howled when Germans (if I remember correctly, it was the Germans) and others started pulling troops out of Afghanistan? This took less than a week.

And I do have to say that imo some of the criticism of Obama on this is overdone. So far there’s been 0 US casualties, it’s barely cost anything, and it’s only been going on for 4 days. W’s war in Iraq resulted in over 4,000 dead, over 30,000 wounded, and close to a trillion dollars and most conservatives and Republicans had no problem with it and cheered it on at every step. Obama has a way to go to reach that.

...so wars are only just and good if there are no American casualities? That's kind of heartless of you. There is a bunch of dead Libyans who would sure disagree.

What are we doing in Libya btw? We're not there to get rid of the tyrant, we're just there too...what? Secure oil for Europe? Who are these rebel groups? What do they stand for? What kind of government do they have in mind? Shouldn't we know before getting involved?

I think this is a fantastic failure in the making. It took Obama's precious international community THREE WEEKS to do anything. It's now taken roughly five days for the coalition to begin breaking down due to lack of leadership. It's an embarrassment on a grand scale - and our other enemies are watching...and probably laughing. And at least the evil George Bush addressed Congress before taking his actions first. Obama hasn't even cut his vacation short.

I have often heard libs attack George Bush for not immediately jumping up and racing off during the 9-11 attacks. But Obama gets weeks/months/years to work on problems going out of control? The simple minded partisan double standard is showing.

Lets see what happens. If Qadaffi is gone in a few days or even weeks and there aren’t any US casualties this will seen as a huge success.

Really? What if the new government is al Queda run? What if it's another terror state? What if the Iranians or the Venezeulans or the North Koreans watch our impotent actions and decide to get aggressive? What if our allies decide they can't trust us to back them up in military matters?

Your simplicity is staggering.

It’s still too early to tell.

Damage is already done. Hopefully the these leadership problems will be remedied quickly - but as we've seen with the economic meltdown, terrorism and all the other things Obama is failing at...well, I guess "Hope" is the only thing we have....
137 posted on 03/22/2011 10:41:12 PM PDT by Tzimisce (Never forget that the American Revolution began when the British tried to disarm the colonists.)
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To: ladyjane

*Won’t it be great when the Muslim Brotherhood takes over and we can have sharia law all over the Middle East.*

It’s gonna happen sooner or later anyway—why wait until they ALL have nukes?

Let ‘em unite, coordinate, invade someone and kick off WWIII for real, yo. Then nuke the bastids.


138 posted on 03/22/2011 10:43:42 PM PDT by j-damn
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To: WhistlingPastTheGraveyard

He could have actually been involved in the planning instead of giving the Ok from the golf course, while being briefed between holes.


139 posted on 03/22/2011 10:44:03 PM PDT by matt04
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To: rabidralph

OK, these guys probably hate the USA and would backstab us in a heartbeat via Sharia Law and all but Damn you gotta admire 'em. They weld an Anti-aircraft gun in the back of a compact pickup and look for something to shoot at!

140 posted on 03/22/2011 10:48:59 PM PDT by Mad Dawgg (If you're going to deny my 1st Amendment rights then I must proceed to the 2nd one...)
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To: Rome2000

Thank you very much for posting this again.

It bears repeating lest we forget.


141 posted on 03/22/2011 10:54:16 PM PDT by bigoil
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To: 11th_VA
Ha.... our boy strikes out....a mulligan...

Caddy: "Barack baby...you teed up on an addled duck egg"

142 posted on 03/22/2011 10:55:56 PM PDT by spokeshave (Half-American, non natural-born, starts war without Congress OK, while on vacation in Brazil.)
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To: Tzimisce

I’m not saying it won’t be a disaster or turn into one. I’m just saying 4 days in is too soon to tell. What if Qadaffi is killed or deposed tomorrow? None of us know what will happen. Anything can happen. I remember how 4 days in to Afghanistan and Iraq the media was already declaring both to be failures and inevitable US defeats. How the operations were already botched.

I have no love for Obama and I’m perfectly willing to go after him on this. I just think we should at least wait and see what happens. If it goes bad there won’t any room for him to hide, there will plenty of time to go after him, and he’ll have plenty of time to fill out his 2013 bracket while watching Romney, Huckabee, Gingrich or Palin on ESPN.

I just don’t see the rush.

One thing I will go after him now for is that his is 100% unconstitutional and the GOP should go after him on that immediately. The House should call Gates, CLinton, Mullen, etc... up for testimony immediately. He’s launched an unconstitutional war and that should be taken care of. Go after on that, not on the results or consequences.


143 posted on 03/22/2011 10:59:37 PM PDT by jeltz25
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To: 11th_VA

Libya is another community Obama can’t organize.


144 posted on 03/22/2011 11:17:07 PM PDT by Dr. Eckleburg ("I don't think they want my respect; I think they want my submission." - Flemming Rose)
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To: 11th_VA
OK, wait. Hold it. Time out. Look - underneath this comic-opera fantasy real people are getting killed. Let's step back a couple and think about this for a moment.

This is a military operation now. It appears to have shocked certain people that a nice, sterile "no-fly" zone could actually involve taking out the opposition, although no one who watched Iraq could possibly have been mistaken in the matter. It appears to be surprising people who should know better that military operations work best in a strict hierarchy with a single individual making the decisions at the top. They don't work well by committee.

Mr. B. Hussein 0bama is the President of the United States. What he needs to do is declare U.S. interests and pursue them. Not UN interests, not idiotic R2P internationalist theory, but what the people who are doing the shooting expect to accomplish. With any sort of leadership the forces in theater could crush Gaddafi in days. With no leadership, this happens.

Collective security is only as strong as the determination of its constituent members allows. Here it has failed. It has failed through incompetent leadership, through each of the "allies" if one can use that word, pursuing his own separate interests. It has failed because the arrogant, grinning fools besotted with "soft power" and diplomatic solutions now find themselves actually in charge of military activity instead of second-guessing and Viewing With Alarm, and they aren't up to the job.

This was supposed to be a slam-dunk, a chance for an effeminate, self-absorbed Caesar to ride the lead chariot in front of real soldiers in the triumphal parade. Given the preponderance of pure power it would take someone of fantastic incompetence to screw it up. Mailing it in from Rio, 0bama managed even that.

145 posted on 03/22/2011 11:19:30 PM PDT by Billthedrill
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To: Ramius; 11th_VA
The Germans are pulling out because it ~isn’t~ the U.S. leading the coalition?

What 11th_VA is saying is what I'm reading here in Germany, too.

The bottom line looks to be that Italy and Norway won't do anything unless NATO has upper command of the operation, while some countries feel that NATO, because of it's action against muslims in Afghanistan, would be bad PR for the muslim rebels in Libya.

Reading between the lines, it looks like there is a push to bring Qatar and the UAE into the forefront, but the UAE is dragging its heels. Obama has said that the US is going to drop it's command role after the initial strikes to take down Libya AA capacity and no one seems to know who will fill the void.

The whole cluster...k can becomes apparent when you read that France calls the operation "Harmattan". the British call it "Ellamy" and the US call it "Odyssey Dawn".

I think that Germany is pulling ships from the Mediterranean because it now appears that NATO ships will be used to enforce a blockade of Libya. IOW mission creep.

Merkel has sufferred some very embarrasing scandals such as her heir apparent and defense minister Karl-Theodor zu Guttenberg (AKA zu Googleberg) having been caught out as amateurishly plagiarizing his doctor thesis and a vicious round of fingerpointing between her government and automakers after the new introduction of E10 biofuel was shown to damage or not run in some older cars.

She has a very big state election coming up Sunday and just doesn't need the risk of another display of ineptitude right now.

These are just my thoughts on the matter.

146 posted on 03/22/2011 11:33:29 PM PDT by longjack
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To: 11th_VA
Why wouldn't Obama want to lead this coalition? As a senator, he gained so much experience! FactCheck: Campaign prevented committee meetings, not rules Obama said that he did not convene any policy hearings as chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee’s Subcommittee on European Affairs because “the issues of Afghanistan, the issues of Iraq, critical issues like that don’t go through my subcommittee because they’re done as a committee as a whole.” FACT CHECK: An Obama adviser acknowledged in March that Obama’s presidential candidacy prevented him from calling hearings, saying to ABC News: “The record is what it is. He didn’t become chairman of that subcommittee until January of 2007. The fact is that he made his announcement for president of the US in February of 2007. So, he had other things on his mind.” Source: FactCheck.org on 2008 first presidential debate-Boston Globe Sep 26, 2008 At least he's consistent--he has other things on his mind now, too.
147 posted on 03/22/2011 11:38:43 PM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Left FR in 2011, and I ain't comin' back! :P)
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To: DWC

Well in all honesty it IS hard to land in a sandstorm..


148 posted on 03/22/2011 11:39:27 PM PDT by Soothesayer9
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To: 11th_VA
Apologies, his post when I meant to correct it first:

Why wouldn't Obama want to lead this coalition? As a senator, he gained so much experience!

FactCheck: Campaign prevented committee meetings, not rules Obama said that he did not convene any policy hearings as chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee’s Subcommittee on European Affairs because “the issues of Afghanistan, the issues of Iraq, critical issues like that don’t go through my subcommittee because they’re done as a committee as a whole.”

FACT CHECK: An Obama adviser acknowledged in March that Obama’s presidential candidacy prevented him from calling hearings, saying to ABC News: “The record is what it is. He didn’t become chairman of that subcommittee until January of 2007. The fact is that he made his announcement for president of the US in February of 2007. So, he had other things on his mind.”

Source: FactCheck.org on 2008 first presidential debate-Boston Globe Sep 26, 2008

At least he's consistent--he has other things on his mind now, too.

149 posted on 03/22/2011 11:40:09 PM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Left FR in 2011, and I ain't comin' back! :P)
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To: 11th_VA
OBAMA: We should describe for the American people in presidential debates & in the presidency, what our foreign policy is and what we’re going to do. We shouldn’t have strategic ambiguity with the American people when it comes to describing how we’re going to deal with our most serious national security issues.

Source: 2007 Democratic primary debate on “This Week” Aug 19, 2007

150 posted on 03/22/2011 11:44:06 PM PDT by Darkwolf377 (Left FR in 2011, and I ain't comin' back! :P)
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