The Pima SWAT Commander Sgt. Bob Krygier admits he could not see what was going on inside the house and thought he was in a gun fight.
Posted on 05/28/2011 1:49:58 AM PDT by petitfour
Records released by the Pima County Sheriff's Department this week show that the four houses served with search warrants the morning of May 5 - when Jose Guerena was shot and killed by a SWAT team - are less than four miles apart and are all connected to the Guerena family.
And while initial reports were that doctors told the Guerena family that Jose had been shot 60 times, the Pima County medical examiner's preliminary report says he was shot 22 times. In its sole briefing on the incident, the Sheriff's Department said SWAT team members fired 71 rounds.
Aside from releasing more than 500 pages of documents about the incident, the department has remained mum since the May 10 briefing.
The raid netted drugs, large amounts of cash, bulletproof vests, about 30 cellphones and a stolen vehicle, records show, but no arrests have been made.
(Excerpt) Read more at azstarnet.com ...
It might be good if you didn’t take allegations and reshape them into facts.
Over 71 rounds and only 22 hit?
Remember, Pima SWAT are ‘elite’ riflemen at 15 feet. Sounds like they really need to have a firearms qualifications course with some many misses which children and neighbors at risk.
“Do I have to worry about getting raided”
It would appear we ALL have to worry about that.
Look at this in terms of the recent (and eventually to be over turned we can only hope God help us!) decision in Indianna, that the cops are free to enter your home, at any time, for NO REASON AT ALL.
I’ve always considered myself a law and order person. But on the few occasions where a cop has come to my door, I never let him in. I close the door and speak with the officer outside.
I have my 4th amendment right.
Gosh darn it, this is America people.
THIS IS AMERICA.
We have rights, that our amazing founding fathers had the God given brilliance to enumerate for us. GOD GIVEN RIGHTS, Rights that anyone in their right mind KNOWS they should have.
Rights, that come from God, that mankind has been struggling to gain and protect for thousands of years. So that is is not just a situation of strong against weak, where “might” makes “right”.
SINCE THE FREAKING CAVES.
Honestly, I am a conservative, but I am just about ready to go full libertarian with some of the stuff I see here and elsewhere.
It looks like this guy was clean, but EVEN IF he was not, is he Charles Manson? Is he son-of-sam? Is he Osama Bin-Laden?
The actions of the cops in this situation CANNOT be justified.
Simple official story has changed too many times for it to be veritable.
Originally the reports were of 71 shots upon the victim.
Then the reports from the Sheriff were of only 6 of the 71 shots having struck their target.
Most reports on the web now indicate he was struck by 60 of the 71 shots fired.
It’s as though the story is scrubbed and rescrubbed to fit whatever agenda is at hand.
IMHO, from the video, the team making the assault behaved similar to the type of individuals who lack virtue and wouldn’t discount planting weapons, drugs, or any other evidence at the scene to cover up their criminal actions.
Transcripts of the SWAT Cmdr don’t seem to be consistent.
http://azstarnet.com/online/pdf/pdf_1dcb28b4-8825-11e0-b417-001cc4c002e0.html
They first claim the residents were bad guys, part of an extensive 4 house drug cartel, drug running operation, who had situational awareness of anybody watching them. After the shooting, they receive calls of wounded innocent people being reported at other address numbers, which didn’t exist, so their immediate plan is to go next door and breach that house looking for wounded civilians from errant rounds of the initial assault. All of this happening while a 4 yr old child is still in the house they first attacked, had called the mother out and she surrendered to their custody.
If they assumed this was a dangerous situation, really didn’t know all the address numbers, nor even the name of the person whom they were going after, assumed he had eyes in the back of his head, used weapons which would penetrate walls for blocks in their assault, then reacted to breach the neighbor’s house, but with intent of looking for wounded bystanders,.....wouldn’t anybody with tactical sense first be more cautious of conducting a frontal assault on an overwatch position?
The victim had previously been reported as having body armor and an M16/AR15. SWAT team cmdr reported the victim was only wearing boxer shorts and obviously dead, shot many times with exit wounds in his head, arm, leg, back, arms over his head, laying down with lots of brain matter, bone fragments in the walls and lots of blood,...so much that he was declared dead by a doctor watching via a video on a robot which had bumped into the victim several times to provoke a response, without any movement.
The body armor they discovered was in a 3’x2’ plastic storage container in the garage with a Border patrol hat (aside,..he was a Marine,..sure that wasn’t a DI hat?)
In the transcript, the SWAT CMDR is quoted, “Um, since I’m not going to do a report, can I throw a few more things in that we saw?”
Why wouldn’t the Cmdr at the scene, conducting the operation prepare a formal report? This all falls on the head of those who relieved him of reporting and that person or persons needs to be held fully responsible, including proof that they have not been planting evidence to coverup their inappropriate behavior.
On top of all of this, the SWAT CMDR was scared during the shooting, which after the event now is fairly well documented as being an entirely one sided altercation.
IMHO, there is far more evidence to warrant a SWAT operation on the home of the persons directing these operations than the victims.
The cops have created a culture of perceiving the public as suspects and reinforcements as bodies, while they simply crave adrenaline rushes, then get scared and look for safety. They aren’t saving anybody other than their own lust for control.
This is why military commanders train to prepare 5 paragraph orders. It might not satiate the glandular lust for an adrenaline rush, but it keeps wherewithal controlling deadly force prior to and during the execution of the orders.
This report indicates all their behavior was learned response to a perceived threat when gunfire erupts, then just a series of learned tactics to control an unknown situation, but they all have begun based upon sloppy serving of a warrant and grossly inadequate police work.
Interesting to see how any former Marines have committed felonies. Start with the University of Texas tower shooter Charles Whitman....then of course Lee Harvey Oswald....
Not always a good defense.
Then in post #40 you wrote:
What does it matter what percentage? Its most definitley not 100 so why does every thing hinge on him being a former marine?
Make up your mind, mmmkay?
Cheers!
I take that comment to mean that you're a bootlicker eh? LOL
You have not been keeping up with the police released evidence have you?
I will print it for you.
“Drug SWAT Team That Gunned Down Ex-Marine Found No Drugs”
http://abcnews.go.com/US/swat-team-gunned-marine-find-drugs/comments?type=story&id=13702756
So they killed a man during a search warrant that turned up empty. Good job.
New evidence states that prior to shooting the mine worker in his boxer shorts, they they at flash bang in the house.
“Neighbors described it as a peaceful street.
That peace was shattered when SWAT team members busted open the door that morning and tossed “flash-bang” grenades inside, documents show. Seconds later, bullets started flying through the house, sending splinters and stucco chips through the air.”
So, now we are expected to believe that the police heard the murdered man say something over the effects of a flash bang in the seconds before shooting him.
Combine this this from the police report.
“Several SWAT team members reported later that they saw muzzle flashes and heard shots coming from the hall where Guerena reportedly was crouching.”
Unreliable police witnesses since the evidence states the murdered man never fired a shot.
Source: http://tucsoncitizen.com/arizona-news/2011/05/27/killing-by-swat-team-in-tucson-raises-questions/
I’m trying to imagine the scenario.
A young man joins the Marines to establish a decent identity for himself apart from his crooked relatives.
He gets himself off the streets and out of the trash.
He serves his country two tours in Iraq, comes home and sets himself up with a happy little wife and child.
Then he’s slaughtered by Dupnik’s incompetence.
Dupnik. Who blamed the Giffords’ slaughter on talk radio.
Bah.
Past reports indicated the family involvements in home invasions and a double homicide were THEIR BROTHER’S HOME BEING INVADED AND HIS BROTHER AND SISTER IN LAW BEING MURDERED DURING THE HOME INVASION.
Something is seriously wrong when a families of victims of a double homicide, are now assumed to be guilty by association with their family’s victimization.
The SWAT CMDR performing the assault is briefed and given the impression the victim is a bad guy, but then is told not to give a report, but a transcript taken to apparently provide answers to leading questions posed by those directing the raid.
IMHO, it would be just irony if warrants were issued by others to conduct a similar SWAT raid on the homes of those who directed the raid initially. Let them live by the same laws they have established.
“It might be good if you didn’t take allegations and reshape them into facts.”
You might want to wait for more facts to come out before jumping to hysterical conclusions of police state jack boots taking down poor innocent former Marines.
“So they killed a man during a search warrant that turned up empty. Good job.”
False, the perp’s home was but one of four homes under investigation for illegal drug activity and double homicide.
The did find large amounts of cash and drugs in some of the houses.
Just as you assumed that the allegations made against Jose Guerena are facts you have assumed that what you just accused me of. The fact is that I think the shoddy police work was wrong and un-Constitutional regardless of whether Mr. Guerena is innocent or guilty. Any half-with could have arrested him without incident.
“Past reports indicated the family involvements in home invasions and a double homicide were THEIR BROTHER’S HOME BEING INVADED AND HIS BROTHER AND SISTER IN LAW BEING MURDERED DURING THE HOME INVASION.”
You have a link for that?
That's ok, it turned out pretty good for the Marine Veteran haters. Happy Memorial Day.
“The fact is that I think the shoddy police work was wrong”
That’s called an opinion based on assumptions, not fact.
“and un-Constitutional regardless of whether Mr. Guerena is innocent or guilty.”
Again, just opinion, not fact.
...the four houses served with search warrants the morning of May 5... are less than four miles apart and are all connected to the Guerena family... doctors told the Guerena family that Jose had been shot 60 times, the Pima County medical examiner's preliminary report says he was shot 22 times. In its sole briefing on the incident, the Sheriff's Department said SWAT team members fired 71 rounds... The raid netted drugs, large amounts of cash, bulletproof vests, about 30 cellphones and a stolen vehicle, records show, but no arrests have been made.
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