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Five myths about diesel engines
www.physorg.com ^ | June 14, 2011 | By Louise Lerner

Posted on 06/15/2011 6:07:50 AM PDT by Red Badger

Diesel engines, long confined to trucks and ships, are garnering more interest for their fuel efficiency and reduced carbon dioxide emissions, relative to gasoline engines. Argonne mechanical engineer Steve Ciatti takes a crack at some of the more persistent myths surrounding the technology.

Myth #1: Diesel is dirty.

"We all have this image of trucks belching out dirty black smoke," Ciatti said. This smoke is particulate matter from diesel exhaust: soot and small amounts of other chemicals produced by the engine.

But EPA emissions requirements have significantly tightened, and diesel engines now have to meet the same criteria as gasoline engines. They do this by adding a Diesel Particulate Filter (DPF), which removes visible smoke. "DPFs are very effective," Ciatti said. "They remove 95-plus percent of the mass of smoke."

The smoke, trapped in a ceramic matrix, accumulates until the car's computer determines it's time to clean it out in a process called a "regeneration cycle."

While running, a small amount of extra fuel is added to the combustion chambers in the engine; the resulting heat and oxygen activate a catalyst in the DPF to burn off the accumulated soot. This renders a small fuel consumption penalty.

"Visible smoke is essentially gone, as of the 2007-2010 regulations," Ciatti said. "If you're buying a diesel car from 2007 or later, it's no dirtier than a gasoline-powered vehicle."

And in the invisible range -- diesel engines actually emit less carbon dioxide than gasoline engines do.

Myth #2: Diesel engines won't start in the winter.

"Today's technologies for cold-start are very effective," Ciatti said. "Modern diesel engines start in cold weather with very little effort."

The problem is that diesel jells at low temperatures. Below about 40°F, certain hydrocarbons in diesel turn gelatinous. "Since an engine depends on aerosolizing fuel, you don't want goopy fuel," Ciatti explained.

Often this is remedied with glow plugs, which are heated by the battery and help warm up the fuel so it can vaporize.

Low temperatures aren't a problem for gasoline engines because gasoline is much more flammable than diesel. Even at room temperature and pressure, gasoline is partly vapor. "Toss a match into a pool of gasoline, and the match will never even hit the surface of the liquid; it will ignite the layer of vapor above the pool," Ciatti said. "That's why gasoline has to be handled extremely carefully around any ignition source. Diesel isn't so volatile; if you tossed that match into a pool of diesel, it would go out."

Glow plugs and other remedies, however, effectively vaporize diesel to prepare it for combustion.

Myth #3: Diesel cars don't perform well.

Because diesel engines are still most common in trucks, many people assume that diesel-powered cars would behave like a truck behaves: slow and sluggish. "But keep in mind, that truck's likely hauling around 50 tons," Ciatti said. "In fact, to some degree, some people who drive diesels find they perform better than gasoline engines."

That's because diesel-powered engines get their best power when the engine's revolutions per minute (RPM) are low -- that is, at speeds below 65 miles per hour, where most driving takes place. Gasoline engines, in contrast, get to peak power by running the engine very high and fast; a gasoline car only reaches its peak horsepower with the accelerator pedal to the floor and the engine running at 5,000 RPM.

"Diesel car performance is far better than the perceived horsepower rating, because you're getting all that power at speeds where you actually drive the vehicle," Ciatti said. "You've got more pulling power and more acceleration at those speeds."

Myth #4: You can't find diesel at the pump.

Diesel-powered pickups and cars are popular enough that the market has taken interest; most neighborhood gas stations now have automotive diesel pumps.

"I drove a diesel car myself for 10 years. I can count on one hand the number of times I had to actually search for a pump," Ciatti said.

Myth #5: Diesel fuel is more expensive than gasoline.

Though Chicagoland diesel prices are generally higher than gasoline, in most parts of the country, diesel fuel and gasoline are priced comparably. Today, Illinois taxes diesel at higher rates than gasoline.

"Diesel fuel is not more expensive to produce than gasoline," Ciatti explained. "Its price usually has to do with the local tax structure."

Bonus: One thing you may not know about diesel!

Diesel engines actually perform better at high altitudes than gasoline engines.

Why? Gasoline engines operate at a very specific ratio of fuel and air. At high altitudes, the air is thinner--literally: there are fewer molecules of air per cubic foot. In the mountains, then, gasoline engines have to add less fuel to keep the ratio perfect, which affects performance.

"But a diesel engine runs fuel-lean; you don't have to keep the ratio perfect," Ciatti said. Diesel engines have turbochargers, which are pumps driven by exhaust gas. They add more air to the combustion chamber, and more air means more fuel can be added. At altitude, it can pull in more air and more fuel, and thus gets more power than gasoline engines can. Turbochargers don't use extra energy; they run off thermodynamically "free" energy that would be lost as exhaust if not used.

"Drive a diesel at altitude and you'll see other cars struggling while you zip past," Ciatti said. "The effect is very noticeable."

Provided by Argonne National Laboratory


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Government; Technical
KEYWORDS: auto; diesel; energy; fuel
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Argonne mechanical engineer Steve Ciatti takes a crack at some of the more persistent myths surrounding the technology of diesel engines. Credit: Argonne National Laboratory

1 posted on 06/15/2011 6:07:55 AM PDT by Red Badger
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To: sully777; vigl; Cagey; Abathar; A. Patriot; B Knotts; getsoutalive; muleskinner; sausageseller; ...

Rest In Peace, old friend, your work is finished.....

If you want ON or OFF the DIESEL ”KnOcK” LIST just FReepmail me.....

This is a fairly HIGH VOLUME ping list on some days.....

2 posted on 06/15/2011 6:08:50 AM PDT by Red Badger (Nothing is a 'right' if someone has to give it to you................)
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To: Red Badger
You might also add, that Diesel engines generate a much longer and higher power band, as well as more HP, 3 times more torq and they get much better mileage to weight, per gallon.

I have a Duramax with 230K and it runs like it did the day it came off the show room floor. Never had to tune it up or do anything to it but change oil & filters. And I have worked it hard as a tow vehicle. I only wish GM had not changed because I would never buy a new one from them now. I'm forced to make this one last and it is doing a great job of doing just that.

3 posted on 06/15/2011 6:20:16 AM PDT by PSYCHO-FREEP (Always Remember You're Unique.......(Just Like everyone Else.))
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To: Red Badger

Diesel engines, stink, very loud, and require regular maintenance, and #2 will jell in very cold weather.


4 posted on 06/15/2011 6:21:28 AM PDT by Big Horn (Rebuild the GOP to a conservative party)
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To: Red Badger

I don’t care about the particulate matter; I care about the stink. VW diesels used to stink to high heaven. Are the new requirements doing anything about the stink, or just making it invisible?


5 posted on 06/15/2011 6:21:53 AM PDT by dangus
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To: PSYCHO-FREEP

#6

When the truck wears out, you can out a new body on your engine............


6 posted on 06/15/2011 6:22:40 AM PDT by Red Badger (Nothing is a 'right' if someone has to give it to you................)
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To: dangus

The new ones have a different odor, for sure. Removal of sulfur from fuel was a big help in the stink area. Newer fuel delivery systems have reduced the pollution and the particulates.
Now, they smell, to me anyway, like a campfire / wood stove burning..............


7 posted on 06/15/2011 6:25:43 AM PDT by Red Badger (Nothing is a 'right' if someone has to give it to you................)
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To: Big Horn

Well I happen to love she smell of D2 in the morning.


8 posted on 06/15/2011 6:25:43 AM PDT by CodeJockey (Poor Al Gore. Global warming completely debunked via the very Internet he invented. Oh, the irony!)
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To: CodeJockey

The new ones don’t smell like the old ones.................


9 posted on 06/15/2011 6:26:17 AM PDT by Red Badger (Nothing is a 'right' if someone has to give it to you................)
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To: PSYCHO-FREEP

What year is your truck?


10 posted on 06/15/2011 6:26:19 AM PDT by mad_as_he$$ (Demons run when a good man goes to war.)
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To: Red Badger
Diesel engines actually perform better at high altitudes than gasoline engines.

Last summer I transported GrandPa's Dodge Ram pickup from California to Virginia. Included in the back was a 1/2 ton of river rock from GrandPa's property as a special gift. So we were pulling some weight.

I remember climbing a fairly steep grade in Wyoming on I-80, at over 7500' at the time. I was holding the speed limit of 75, the overdrive was locked down, and I was passing everything in sight.

That was a mad moment!

11 posted on 06/15/2011 6:27:50 AM PDT by Dustoff45 (A good woman brings out the best in a good man! A better woman might just be what this nation needs)
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To: Big Horn
Diesel engines, stink, very loud,

Don't get out much, do you?............

12 posted on 06/15/2011 6:28:24 AM PDT by Red Badger (Nothing is a 'right' if someone has to give it to you................)
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To: Red Badger
I bought a 2011 BMW X5 X35d and am VERY happy with the Diesel engine. It is a Blu-Tek Diesel and produces only Nitrogen and Oxygen. That's it. I got an $1,800.00 Tax credit because it was considered a green car. It has super power and gets 23 mpg. State inspection is about $20.00 in Texas. No emissions test required.
13 posted on 06/15/2011 6:30:58 AM PDT by PushinTin (Politicians are like diapers, the need to be changed often and for the same reason...)
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To: Red Badger

I got my first diesel car in 1996, and never looked back. That one, I just sold (315,000 miles) to a friend, who loves it.

My 2nd diesel car has 148,000 miles on it (my daily driver), and I just got our 3rd diesel for my wife - brand new - about 400 miles.


14 posted on 06/15/2011 6:31:05 AM PDT by paterfamilias
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To: Big Horn
Diesel engines, stink, very loud, and require regular maintenance, and #2 will jell in very cold weather.

Well, bio-diesel solves some of the cold weather gelling issues.

If made from old oil from restaurants (now jealously guarded!) the exhaust can smell like any designer fragrance from french fires to fish.

15 posted on 06/15/2011 6:34:05 AM PDT by texas booster (Join FreeRepublic's Folding@Home team (Team # 36120) Cure Alzheimer's!)
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To: Red Badger

Turbo diesel just won Le Mans...


16 posted on 06/15/2011 6:34:12 AM PDT by sasquatch
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To: sasquatch

I bet that has the Greenie-Weenies pulling their hair out...................


17 posted on 06/15/2011 6:35:02 AM PDT by Red Badger (Nothing is a 'right' if someone has to give it to you................)
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To: Big Horn
Diesel engines, stink, very loud, and require regular maintenance, and #2 will jell in very cold weather.

20 years ago you would be closer to right. You are far off, now. They do not stink and the fuel in cold weather is not a problem, as it states in the article. The newer ones don't even rattle. Remember the diesel pickups in 1990? You couldn't carry on any sort of conversation near a running one. Now it is no worse than a car and depends entirely on the muffler used.

18 posted on 06/15/2011 6:35:19 AM PDT by arthurus (Read Hazlitt's "Economics In One Lesson.")
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To: texas booster

If it comes from a Chinese Restaurant it smells like #27................


19 posted on 06/15/2011 6:35:49 AM PDT by Red Badger (Nothing is a 'right' if someone has to give it to you................)
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To: Red Badger

The newer VW diesels are sweet.


20 posted on 06/15/2011 6:36:54 AM PDT by Jane Long (2 Chron 7:14)
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To: Red Badger
Today, Illinois taxes diesel at higher rates than gasoline.

That's because state politicians stick it to interstate truckers because they can't vote. Buy a diesel car, pay more taxes.

21 posted on 06/15/2011 6:42:49 AM PDT by Reeses
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To: PSYCHO-FREEP
You might also add, that Diesel engines generate a much longer and higher power band, as well as more HP, 3 times more torq and they get much better mileage to weight, per gallon.

I agree! I own an Excursion with 200K. It has the 7.3 PowerStroke and I get 23MPG on the highway - and can carry all of my family, all our luggage and have even had two car seats and a booster seat (with the extended family included) and we were all still COMFORTABLE! Okay, we SAT comfortable! The NOISE levels were NOT comfortable - LOL!
22 posted on 06/15/2011 6:46:47 AM PDT by ExTxMarine (PRAYER: It's the only HOPE for real CHANGE in America!)
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To: Red Badger

Around here Diesel runs higher than premium gas...DH has a Duramax diesel (very quiet) you can hear a Ford coming for miles....it’s a pain to plug in(and not forget to unplug it in the morning:>) and I don’t like the smell of it but he needs it for different projects. With the price of fuel he takes the Honda most days.


23 posted on 06/15/2011 6:47:54 AM PDT by libertarian27 (Ingsoc: Department of Life, Department of Liberty, Department of Happiness)
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To: Red Badger
My 2006 Dodge Mega Cab Diesel gets 17 to 23 city driving and 27 to 31 mpg highway, unloaded, if I keep my foot out it. Nothing but power and I love it. Hauling a heavy load (myself, 5 passengers, two dogs, and luggage) it may drop 3 mpg, if that. As I said .............. just love the truck.
24 posted on 06/15/2011 6:48:47 AM PDT by Old Badger (I still like Palin because she will tell like it is and she take no prisoners!)
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To: Reeses

Some states and Federal tax is higher for diesel.

http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/ohim/hs00/fe101a.htm


25 posted on 06/15/2011 6:49:36 AM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: Old Badger

Semper Fi!..............


26 posted on 06/15/2011 6:52:49 AM PDT by Red Badger (Nothing is a 'right' if someone has to give it to you................)
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To: Reeses

Sorry, more up-to-date link

http://www.fhwa.dot.gov/policyinformation/statistics/2009/fe101a.cfm


27 posted on 06/15/2011 6:53:07 AM PDT by thackney (life is fragile, handle with prayer)
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To: Reeses

Buy a diesel truck, move out of state...................


28 posted on 06/15/2011 6:54:44 AM PDT by Red Badger (Nothing is a 'right' if someone has to give it to you................)
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To: Red Badger

I just spent almost 3 weeks driving a diesel Opal and a diesel Volvo in France and Spain. Overall the experience was good. However:
1. The fuel stinks and service stations provide disposable gloves to keep it off your hands. They need to factor this into the “greenness” of diesel.
2. The combustion in the engines is still quite noisy and sounds like a dieseling Otto cycle engine. They are nowhere near as quiet as gasoline engines, especially at idle and under load.
3. They are certainly much cleaner and the combustion products do not smell as bad as they used to. But, under heavy load, European diesels still emit some pretty good puffs of soot. Again, not objectionable, but visibly not as clean as gasoline.

Mr. Ciatti’s explanation of glow plugs needs some work. Their purpose is not to warm to fuel to reduce viscosity in cold weather. It is to provide an ignition source when the cold engine block absorbs too much compression heat, thus inhibiting a cold start. I’m sure Mr. Ciatti knows this and this is a problem of the author not getting it right.


29 posted on 06/15/2011 7:01:07 AM PDT by ProtectOurFreedom
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To: thackney

Chart for 2011 (wow-look at California diesel tax!)

http://www.api.org/statistics/fueltaxes/upload/May2011%20gasoline%20and%20diesel%20summary%20pages.pdf


30 posted on 06/15/2011 7:01:59 AM PDT by libertarian27 (Ingsoc: Department of Life, Department of Liberty, Department of Happiness)
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To: Big Horn
Diesel engines, stink, very loud, and require regular maintenance, and #2 will jell in very cold weather.

Diesel engines cause cancer, make people into cannibals, and have destroyed entire galaxies.


31 posted on 06/15/2011 7:03:10 AM PDT by Lazamataz (I am utterly opinionless. About everything. Even the fact I have no opinion.)
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To: Big Horn
Diesel engines, stink, very loud, and require regular maintenance, and #2 will jell in very cold weather.

As everyone who has replied so far has told you: You are wrong.

Today's deisels, especially WV's...and the like...are not much different than their gas counterparts. You might want to come out of the 70's.

32 posted on 06/15/2011 7:03:10 AM PDT by NELSON111
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To: Red Badger

The VW Jetta TDI diesel is very efficient and gets great mileage. It seems that since diesels work well within a narrow rpm range, they could be matched to a generator to power electric motors on the wheels, eliminating the transmission and any need for large, expensive batteries.


33 posted on 06/15/2011 7:05:03 AM PDT by PDGearhead (Obama's lack of citizenship)
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To: ProtectOurFreedom

Re the stinky fuel, I think they add something in Europe to make it stink...........made in France,.................


34 posted on 06/15/2011 7:06:13 AM PDT by Red Badger (Nothing is a 'right' if someone has to give it to you................)
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To: Red Badger
Myth #5: Diesel fuel is more expensive than gasoline.

Here in Southern California, diesel is 35 to 40 cents higher...so no "myth" around these parts.

35 posted on 06/15/2011 7:06:51 AM PDT by ErnBatavia (It's not the Obama Administration....it's the "Obama Regime".)
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To: Red Badger

I had a diesel Mercedes about 35 years ago and all of those myths, except the last one (fuel cost), were true. Glad that diesels have gotten better........... but I still don’t want one.


36 posted on 06/15/2011 7:07:16 AM PDT by Ditter
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To: ErnBatavia

Price per gallon is not price per mile. Do the math..............


37 posted on 06/15/2011 7:11:48 AM PDT by Red Badger (Nothing is a 'right' if someone has to give it to you................)
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To: Big Horn

Let the conspiracy theories begin on why they are not widely available in US passenger cars.

- Their MPG is too high, which will drive down fuel tax revenues.

- They can burn contraband kerosene or even french-fry oil, again depriving the gub-mint of fuel tax revenue.

- They last too long, which is not good for the Democrats’ bosom buddies at GM and Chrysler.


38 posted on 06/15/2011 7:18:50 AM PDT by Buckeye McFrog
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To: PushinTin

Re:
...Blu-Tek Diesel and produces only Nitrogen and Oxygen.

Where does the carbon go?


39 posted on 06/15/2011 7:19:24 AM PDT by 5by5
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To: Red Badger

Myth # 6: deisel engines don’t burn. Maybe it was just me, but my deisel station wagon caught fire in my driveway and burned — 1984, Fort sam Houston, TX, at the corner of Frazer Road and Rittiman Road in San Antonio


40 posted on 06/15/2011 7:24:52 AM PDT by eccentric (a.k.a. baldwidow)
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To: eccentric

What part caught fire?
Fuel leaks on exhaust from deteriorated hoses or shorts from the batteries to chassis can cause a fire no matter the fuel..........


41 posted on 06/15/2011 7:29:06 AM PDT by Red Badger (Nothing is a 'right' if someone has to give it to you................)
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To: Reeses
That's because state politicians stick it to interstate truckers because they can't vote.

My guess is, with the way the International Fuel Tax Agreement (IFTA) works, is that truckers who drive into, or through Illinois, and fuel up there, are getting a net refund from Illinois on fuel taxes every quarter. Of course, that net refund will go to pay taxes in another jurisdiction.

For those not familiar with IFTA, the way it works is to allow interstate truckers to deal with (mostly diesel) fuel taxes for all the lower 48 states, and 10 Canadian provinces, with a single quarterly filing in your home jurisdiction (state or province). With diesel for interstate trucking, you only owe taxes on the fuel you consume in that state/province.

Example, say you drive 500 miles through three states, but you only fuel up in the last state (say 100 gallons for a net of 5 miles-per-gallon).

State A has a $0.23/gallon tax rate, state B has a $0.20/gallon tax rate, and state C has a $0.25/gallon tax rate. You drive 100 miles in state A, 250 miles in state B, and 150 miles in state C. So, you initially paid state C $25.00 in fuel taxes on that 100 gallons, but you only consumed 30 gallons there.

So on your quarterly IFTA return, you fill out that you drove a total of 500 miles, and consumed a total of 100 gallons, for a fleet average MPG of 5.0.

You drove 100 miles in state A for a taxable use of 20 gallons at $0.23/gallon, so you owe state A $4.60 in fuel taxes.

You drove 250 miles in state B for a taxable use of 50 gallons at $0.20/gallon, so you owe state B $10.00 in fuel taxes.

You drove 150 miles in state C for a taxable use of 30 gallons at $0.25/gallon, so you owe state C $7.50 in fuel taxes, but you paid state C that initial $25.00 at the pump, so you get to net the $7.50 due against the $25.00 paid, for a refund of $17.50 from state C.

So, out of that $17.50, you pay state A and C (all netted on the form) the taxes due them (a total of $14.60). Then, at the bottom of the form, you net all the taxes due against the all the taxes paid (due $22.10) and all the taxes paid ($25.00) and get a total due or refund. In this case, you'll get $2.90 back.

The forms get sent, electronically, to the IFTA clearing house for all jurisdictional taxes due/paid, and the jurisdictions settle these taxes amongst themselves based on the filed returns. You only pay the net due to, or get the net refund paid to you by, your home jurisdiction.

42 posted on 06/15/2011 7:30:24 AM PDT by IYAS9YAS (Rose, there's a Messerschmitt in the kitchen. Clean it up, will ya?)
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To: Red Badger

No math required....diesel here is pricier than gasoline, irregardless.


43 posted on 06/15/2011 7:33:21 AM PDT by ErnBatavia (It's not the Obama Administration....it's the "Obama Regime".)
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To: IYAS9YAS
So, out of that $17.50, you pay state A and C (all netted on the form)

Should be states A and B, not A and C.

44 posted on 06/15/2011 7:34:00 AM PDT by IYAS9YAS (Rose, there's a Messerschmitt in the kitchen. Clean it up, will ya?)
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To: PDGearhead
The VW Jetta TDI diesel is very efficient and gets great mileage. It seems that since diesels work well within a narrow rpm range, they could be matched to a generator to power electric motors on the wheels, eliminating the transmission and any need for large, expensive batteries.

Or keep the batteries and you have a diesel/electric hybrid. The Germans are experts with those - think U-boat.

45 posted on 06/15/2011 7:34:49 AM PDT by reg45
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To: Red Badger

One thing I haven’t understood since they started coming out with hybrid cars, is why noone is doing a hybrid with diesel. I would think it was a natural to use as a generator. A diesel engine will run forever at a set rpm.


46 posted on 06/15/2011 7:37:20 AM PDT by zeugma (The only thing in the social security trust fund is your children and grandchildren's sweat.)
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To: Reeses
That's because state politicians stick it to interstate truckers because they can't vote. Buy a diesel car, pay more taxes.

I well remember when Blajoavitch first took office, he proposed a special tax on in state trucking companies. A group of owners got an audience with him and let him know just how mobile their business was and promised him that they would set up operations in neighboring states, if he pursued that "special" tax on them. He quietly dropped his efforts.

47 posted on 06/15/2011 7:42:08 AM PDT by Graybeard58
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To: Red Badger
Below about 40°F, certain hydrocarbons in diesel turn gelatinous.

I think that should be "below about -40F" (which is also -40C). I think the author goofed on this one.

48 posted on 06/15/2011 7:42:56 AM PDT by reg45
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To: ErnBatavia

“Here in Southern California, diesel is 35 to 40 cents higher...so no “myth” around these parts.”

Diesel at 35 to 40 cents more is about 10% more expensive. However, you get between a 25% to 35% mileage increase over a comparable gas engine because diesel contains more energy per gallon.

So, it’s still a net savings - and your engine will likely last far longer to boot. Not to mention that there’s no ethanol in diesel. ;-)

I’m planning on going diesel for my next vehicle.


49 posted on 06/15/2011 7:44:08 AM PDT by PreciousLiberty
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To: Big Horn
Diesel engines, stink, very loud

Yup, especially those ford powder stroke (miss sp intended) diesels. I hate those stinky things.

50 posted on 06/15/2011 7:44:51 AM PDT by Arrowhead1952 (zero hates Texas and we hate him back. He ain't my president either.)
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