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White House, Republicans Strike Tenative Deal To Raise Debt Ceiling
ABCNews ^ | July 30, 2011 | Jonathon Karl

Posted on 07/30/2011 8:21:33 PM PDT by Beaten Valve

ABC News has learned that Republicans and the White House have struck a tenative deal to raise the debt ceiling before the Aug. 2 deadline.

It's not done yet, but here is the framework of the tentative deal they have worked out, according to a source familiar with the negotiations:

(Excerpt) Read more at blogs.abcnews.com ...


TOPICS: Breaking News; News/Current Events; US: District of Columbia
KEYWORDS: debtdeal; debtdealcavein; debtdealshowdown; debtgraphics; deficit; deficitgraphics; democrats; republicans; taxes; whitehouse
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To: Terry Mross
I’ll change my tagline if you’ll promise to disappear.

Don't like me calling you out on your incessant negativity and demoralizing posts, eh? I'll bet you'd like for me to just disappear, but you're out of luck, pal. I'm not going anywhere, and if you keep up the doom and gloom on every thread you post to, I'm going to make a bigger noise about it.

Or you could just scroll past my posts.

I did that, Terry. Dozens upon dozens of times, until I just couldn't read another one without objecting. You hit my last nerve, friend.

I, and most Freepers, are in this for blood. We want to get our country back on track, and we know we've got the fight of our lives ahead of us to get there. Incessant, demoralizing posts such as yours do nothing to harden the resolve of the troops. They do just the opposite. Which is precisely what the enemy wants.

Now do you understand my objection?

351 posted on 07/30/2011 11:26:02 PM PDT by Windflier (To anger a conservative, tell him a lie. To anger a liberal, tell him the truth.)
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To: prisoner6

The BBA may go down in flames, but everyone will know who voted for and against.


352 posted on 07/30/2011 11:27:07 PM PDT by Eleutheria5 (End the occupation. Annex today)
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To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla
In this country power is decided by elections.

When the only candidates being offered are either outright liberals or fake conservatives the outcome is already decided. Liberals win, either with the mask on, or the mask off. Pick your poison.

353 posted on 07/30/2011 11:27:34 PM PDT by EternalVigilance (They've swindled every penny out of the living, so now they've moved on to looting posterity.)
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To: Venturer

“If Congress does not approve those cuts by late December, automatic across-the-board cuts go into effect, including cuts to Defense and Medicare.”

A lot will have to be explained/clarified. Who decides what the “automatic across-the-board cuts” will be? I think we all know that, ultimately, there really will have to be cuts in all areas to get back on the right track. And, as Allen West introduced in a bill that passed unanimously, there is a lot of waste to pursue in the DOD. (Medicare/Medicaid waste, fraud and abuse also make up many billions of $). But if cuts would be truly across the board, then that should mean throughout government.

Most critical is just who’ll make those decisions (the fatal flaw of McConnell’s plan was that it gave BHO blanket power to decide where to make cuts) - AND who will comprise the Committee.

I’d love to see a stipulation that only those who are up for re-election could serve on it. That’d guarantee some safeguards right there!


354 posted on 07/30/2011 11:28:00 PM PDT by llandres (Forget the "New America" - restore the original one!!)
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To: pgkdan

They ARE sneaking in the possibility of tax increases. If he House Pubs don’t kill this provision, it will come back to haunt them.


355 posted on 07/30/2011 11:29:49 PM PDT by MestaMachine (Guns don't kill people, the obama administration does. (Gunwalker Ping List))
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To: EternalVigilance
"What good are "Tea Party Congressmen" who vote to borrow and spend trillions more dollars?" and "What percentage of real regular folks who consider themselves part of the Tea Party in any way supported any raise in the debt ceiling?"

Amen to both comments. In lots of ways I'm madder than last week. Didn't think that was possible. . What a mess. . November 6, 2012 can't come soon enough.

356 posted on 07/30/2011 11:30:23 PM PDT by Art in Idaho (Conservatism is the only hope for Western Civilization.)
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To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla
Since you are the chairman of a national political party which has never elected a member to public office it is not surprising that you are so dismissive of the peaceful transfer of power.

Well, actually we have. But I don't expect you to know anything about that.

The assassinations thing I'll just chuckle at, because it's such a silly straw man.

357 posted on 07/30/2011 11:30:30 PM PDT by EternalVigilance (They've swindled every penny out of the living, so now they've moved on to looting posterity.)
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To: EternalVigilance
No. It doesn't make you a liberal. However, voting for one that you absolutely know won't pass could well mean you're nothing but a hypocrite trying to gain political cover.

Maybe it won't pass the first time or the second but we need to have the conversation out there. We can make it an issue in 2012 we can make the RATs wear it.

While we are at it we can do a cap bill too and that doesn't need a 2/3 majority. Just doing CCB in stages.

358 posted on 07/30/2011 11:31:15 PM PDT by Mike Darancette (Obama, eat your GOPeas.)
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To: Art in Idaho

I’m just watching these threads fascinated by how many GOP hacks have come out of the woodwork on FR tonight trying to put perfume on this stinking pile of manure. Many of them screen names I’ve never ever seen posting here before.


359 posted on 07/30/2011 11:32:54 PM PDT by EternalVigilance (They've swindled every penny out of the living, so now they've moved on to looting posterity.)
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To: Mike Darancette
another reason to repeal the XVII Amendment and the evil that continues by the direct election of US Senators

.

360 posted on 07/30/2011 11:33:18 PM PDT by Elle Bee
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To: TexasFreeper2009

Plus a vote on the BBA. Yes it’ll fail but it puts everyone on the record and people will still be pissed come election time over it.

Considering the reps only hold 1/3rd of the government, this isn’t that bad of a deal. I do wish they would have held for a limit so Obama would have to go through this during mid-2012.

Let’s see the details but if this is true, Boehner and the TEA-party related reps did well.


361 posted on 07/30/2011 11:33:40 PM PDT by ATLDiver
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To: EternalVigilance

You’re right.


362 posted on 07/30/2011 11:34:02 PM PDT by Owen
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To: Mike Darancette
Just doing CCB in stages.

CCB would have raised the debt ceiling #2.4 TRILLION. Why would anyone want to do it in stages?

Maybe it won't pass the first time or the second but we need to have the conversation out there.

If the Republicans had wanted a balanced budget they had it right in front of them. All they had to do was nothing. Don't raise the debt ceiling.

So, the rest of the charade impresses me not at all.

363 posted on 07/30/2011 11:35:57 PM PDT by EternalVigilance (They've swindled every penny out of the living, so now they've moved on to looting posterity.)
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To: Perdogg

I agree with you. We don’t control the Senate OR the White House (yet :-), but we got Reid and BHO to give up quite a lot considering what they first demanded.

And when it comes to the BBA concession, they will rue the day.


364 posted on 07/30/2011 11:36:43 PM PDT by llandres (Forget the "New America" - restore the original one!!)
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To: Beaten Valve; All

I don’t know why they don’t increase the % of salaries that can have social security deducted up from the 90% level of about $108,000. I’ll bet a lot of those Wall Street guys who were making salaries with commissions of $600,000 a year in the housing bubble days wish that they had that money socked away in their SS fund now that they are unemployed.


365 posted on 07/30/2011 11:38:08 PM PDT by gleeaikin
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To: All
From Here.

"To isolate the real root of the U.S. fiscal problem, one need only tally the growth rates of key figures since 1950, starting with the biggest increase and ending with the smallest: federal spending (+88 times), interest on the national debt (+74 times), the federal debt (+55 times), federal tax revenues (+54 times), nominal GDP (+49 times), inflation (+8 times), and population (+1.4 times). Was it really necessary that federal outlays increase 88 times since 1950, equivalent to 63 times population growth, 10 times the inflation rate, and 2 times the economy’s growth rate? Was it conducive to our prosperity? No. Was it moral? I think not."

So, . . when do we confront this?

366 posted on 07/30/2011 11:38:18 PM PDT by Art in Idaho (Conservatism is the only hope for Western Civilization.)
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To: Art in Idaho

It better be soon, Art. You can only undermine foundations so far before the building collapses.


367 posted on 07/30/2011 11:40:11 PM PDT by EternalVigilance (They've swindled every penny out of the living, so now they've moved on to looting posterity.)
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To: EternalVigilance

‘Pick your poison.’

I pick elections. Do what you want with violence and murder.


368 posted on 07/30/2011 11:41:00 PM PDT by Lucius Cornelius Sulla (Liberty and Union, Now and Forever, One and Inseparable -- Daniel Webster)
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To: Terry Mross; Windflier
Beer Summit!! ;)


369 posted on 07/30/2011 11:41:55 PM PDT by Errant
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To: Art in Idaho

Great link.


370 posted on 07/30/2011 11:47:11 PM PDT by EternalVigilance (They've swindled every penny out of the living, so now they've moved on to looting posterity.)
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To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla
I pick elections. Do what you want with violence and murder.

Are you really that bereft of arguments that you have to stoop to such silly straw men?

371 posted on 07/30/2011 11:48:40 PM PDT by EternalVigilance (They've swindled every penny out of the living, so now they've moved on to looting posterity.)
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To: Perdogg
No tax increases

Wrong.. not only are there tax increases but cuts will be spread out over 10 years...in other words there won't be any spending cuts.

Here, according to Democratic and Republican sources, are the key elements:

•A debt ceiling increase of up to $2.1 to $2.4 trillion (depending on the size of the spending cuts agreed to in the final deal). •They have now agreed to spending cuts of roughly $1.2 trillion over 10 years.

•The formation of a special Congressional committee to recommend further deficit reduction of up to $1.6 trillion (whatever it takes to add up to the total of the debt ceiling increase). This deficit reduction could take the form of spending cuts, tax increases or both .

•The special committee must make recommendations by late November (before Congress' Thanksgiving recess).

•If Congress does not approve those cuts by December 23, automatic across-the-board cuts go into effect, including cuts to Defense and Medicare. This "trigger" is designed to force action on the deficit reduction committee's recommendations by making the alternative painful to both Democrats and Republicans. •A vote, in both the House and Senate, on a balanced budget amendment.

372 posted on 07/30/2011 11:54:10 PM PDT by Mogollon (Resistance to tyrants is obedience to God. -- Thomas Jefferson)
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To: Go Gordon

Great post! As good an explanation of the problem to our idiot liberal family members, friends, and neighbors as any I have seen.


373 posted on 07/30/2011 11:54:28 PM PDT by tdscpa
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To: Perdogg

The one thing we didn’t get was for it to be a short-term deal, with BHO having to come back again in Dec. or Jan. and go through this all again. My guess is Boehner had to trade that to get the very important BBA vote (in a timely manner, too!) concession.

I think time will prove that we got the better end of this trade. Before this year, most folks paid no attention to raising the debt ceiling anyway. But this BBA issue can become a Big F***ing Deal, as Plugs Biden would say.

Not to worry, there’ll be LOTS to vilify BHO for between now and Nov. ‘12.


374 posted on 07/30/2011 11:55:40 PM PDT by llandres (Forget the "New America" - restore the original one!!)
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To: llandres

This is a *tentative* framework. It better be VERY tentative because they have left open the possibilitr for raising taxes here, but they relegated it to a committee, This is a poison pill and needs to be addressed before anything comes out as an actual bill. The thing is, if they remove the possibility for raisng taxes, will the dems and the white hut still go for it?
The rest of it doesn’t look EVIL, but there IS enough crap and crap agencies in the federal government that SHOULD be completely eliminated or at least defunded that NO debt ceiling increase is necessary...and that should be a priority for the next election if we take the senate and the whitehouse.
I would take this, ugly as it is, for NOW. but when primary time and election time rolls around, this better be on the agenda to be altered beyond belief.


375 posted on 07/30/2011 11:55:40 PM PDT by MestaMachine (Guns don't kill people, the obama administration does. (Gunwalker Ping List))
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To: EternalVigilance

Political power is distributed either through elections, as in the US, or by violence. as under Stalin and Mao Tse Tung. The choice is between effectively participating in the electoral process, surrendering to the enemy, or engaging in violence. You have openly opposed effective participation in the electoral process in this thread, and for years on FR. You have criticized me and others for being concerned with gaining votes. Better fighting for votes than fighting with guns and bombs. Those are the only alternatives.


376 posted on 07/30/2011 11:58:31 PM PDT by Lucius Cornelius Sulla (Liberty and Union, Now and Forever, One and Inseparable -- Daniel Webster)
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To: Mogollon

‘This deficit reduction could take the form of spending cuts, tax increases or both’

My understanding of the proposal is that the part of your quote after ‘spending cuts’ is not part of the agreement. If your quote is correct, it would change my position, and also would mean large numbers of defectors in the House GOP. I guess we need to read the bill.


377 posted on 07/31/2011 12:05:16 AM PDT by Lucius Cornelius Sulla (Liberty and Union, Now and Forever, One and Inseparable -- Daniel Webster)
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To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla

THIS election is the most important election I will have participated in in my lifetime. I am not calling for a war, but we ARE in a nonshooting war right here right now. We MUST win this election because our country cannot take another year, let alone four years of this. They will not give up power so easily. I believe they are fully capable and fully prepared to do violence, and we had better be ready for it.


378 posted on 07/31/2011 12:05:42 AM PDT by MestaMachine (Guns don't kill people, the obama administration does. (Gunwalker Ping List))
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To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla

Pure bunkum. You’re really desperate, aren’t you.


379 posted on 07/31/2011 12:06:09 AM PDT by EternalVigilance (They've swindled every penny out of the living, so now they've moved on to looting posterity.)
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To: Go Gordon

Amen. Very well said.


380 posted on 07/31/2011 12:07:29 AM PDT by EternalVigilance (They've swindled every penny out of the living, so now they've moved on to looting posterity.)
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To: BigSkyFreeper
An increase in the debt ceiling means more spending and more taxes. This isn’t a victory for Conservatism, this is a victory for big government establishment types.

--------------------------

Clearly, you cannot cut government by giving it more ability to borrow and spend. I don't think it is possible for this country to have a more sorry bunch of losers running the show.

Again, cut, cut, cut.

 An arrogant Marxist was spending
 Trillions of bucks without comprehending.
 The piss-stream media concurred
 Without saying a negative word
 For the Republic they thought was ending.

Mitch-Peas3
Reid says his 'politics as usual' bill will help the nation... steer for the cliff!   /sarc


381 posted on 07/31/2011 12:08:01 AM PDT by BobP (The piss-stream media - Never to be watched again in my house)
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To: EternalVigilance

‘You’re really desperate, aren’t you.’

Criticism from a political Eunuch — what a laugh.


382 posted on 07/31/2011 12:08:27 AM PDT by Lucius Cornelius Sulla (Liberty and Union, Now and Forever, One and Inseparable -- Daniel Webster)
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To: Recovering Ex-hippie

“don’t like the medicare cuts only because the Dems will use this in the election, but then, the Dems own this too.”

We’ve GOT to start running commercials (and often) like the Dems and AARP ad propaganda regarding Medicare cuts. All we have to do is tell the public (most of whom aren’t aware, I assure you) that Obamacare will cut $500B from Medicare benefits, drive current and future doctors from the profession, and force rationing of care, even denial of many (currently available) procedures for the elderly starting in 2013.

We need to wake them up to just how scary the truth of this law is before it’s too late. That alone would be a real game-changer in the election (even younger voters care about their parents and grandparents).


383 posted on 07/31/2011 12:11:37 AM PDT by llandres (Forget the "New America" - restore the original one!!)
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To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla

Says a guy defending sellout Congressmen who don’t have a pair between them.


384 posted on 07/31/2011 12:14:17 AM PDT by EternalVigilance (They've swindled every penny out of the living, so now they've moved on to looting posterity.)
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To: Go Gordon

Your analogy is flawed because with the banking regulations set forth in this country, the bank can say you’re crazy for asking for a loan you won’t be able to pay back. Even though they know you might be a credit risk because they’re able to look at your credit history. They can’t turn you down because the federal government and it’s asinine banking laws says so.


385 posted on 07/31/2011 12:19:10 AM PDT by BigSkyFreeper (You have entered an invalid birthday)
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To: wolfman23601

“Guarantee BBA goes to the states or no debt ceiling increase.”

Constitution says an amendment has to first be voted on and passed by 2/3 of congress (both houses, I believe), then go to the states and be passed.

But don’t think the voters won’t be watching how these politicians vote on it. All the House and over a third of the Senate have to get re-elected next year, so the BBA has an excellent chance of passing. The states, for obvious reasons, should be a sure thing. The people WANT this.


386 posted on 07/31/2011 12:22:36 AM PDT by llandres (Forget the "New America" - restore the original one!!)
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To: All
They just don't get it.

What about that is rocket science?

387 posted on 07/31/2011 12:22:46 AM PDT by Art in Idaho (Conservatism is the only hope for Western Civilization.)
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To: DestroyLiberalism

“So why should no tax increase on this supposed agreement be considered some sort of victory for our side or America?”

Because BHO himself wanted tax increases so badly. He pushed it daily in his lectures (I mean speeches :-)

Hey, nobody said he lives in reality. He just wanted what he wanted - and that also included NO CUTS. Debbie Wasserman-Schultz said it herself. And THAT little soundbite should be used as often as possible in Republican campaigns.


388 posted on 07/31/2011 12:28:37 AM PDT by llandres (Forget the "New America" - restore the original one!!)
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To: EternalVigilance

“I pick elections. Do what you want with violence and murder.”

He used a similar dopey argument like this against me, EV.


389 posted on 07/31/2011 12:29:40 AM PDT by Qbert ("The best defense against usurpatory government is an assertive citizenry" - William F. Buckley, Jr.)
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To: EternalVigilance

I have been defending being concerned about elections. All politicians are the natural enemy of a free people, and can never be trusted. It is necessary to have their gonads in your hands at all times to keep them in line.


390 posted on 07/31/2011 12:29:46 AM PDT by Lucius Cornelius Sulla (Liberty and Union, Now and Forever, One and Inseparable -- Daniel Webster)
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To: Qbert

Just laugh at him.


391 posted on 07/31/2011 12:32:06 AM PDT by EternalVigilance (They've swindled every penny out of the living, so now they've moved on to looting posterity.)
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To: EternalVigilance

Oh, I have been laughing. :-)


392 posted on 07/31/2011 12:33:50 AM PDT by Qbert ("The best defense against usurpatory government is an assertive citizenry" - William F. Buckley, Jr.)
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To: Qbert; EternalVigilance

‘He used a similar dopey argument like this against me, EV.’

It is not nice to lie about what I said on the same page on the same thread. See my posts, quoted by you in #307 and posted by me in #327. As anyone who can read can easily see, it is not similar to my posts to EV. Try again, sucker.


393 posted on 07/31/2011 12:38:31 AM PDT by Lucius Cornelius Sulla (Liberty and Union, Now and Forever, One and Inseparable -- Daniel Webster)
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To: jeltz25

No tax increase is a big deal because it was a trap. If the republicans fell for the “balanced approach” and “shared sacrifice” b.s. the base would have stayed home in 2012. Further, all the tea party voters would turn on the congressmen they got elected.

The rinos are dumb enough to have fallen for it. The tea party cabal saved the establishment’s rear end by holding the line on this.


394 posted on 07/31/2011 12:44:54 AM PDT by laxcoach (Government is greedy. Taxpayers who want their own money are not greedy.)
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To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla; EternalVigilance

“It is not nice to lie about what I said on the same page on the same thread. See my posts, quoted by you in #307 and posted by me in #327. As anyone who can read can easily see, it is not similar to my posts to EV. Try again, sucker.”

I said in an earlier comment that if there weren’t any real cuts in the near-term that the plan was useless. Then, in a bizarre argument relying solely upon hyperbole (much in the same manner of accusing EV of wanting “violence” for disagreeing with you), you accused me of supporting massive tax increases. (Comment 270). Give it up already.


395 posted on 07/31/2011 12:50:35 AM PDT by Qbert ("The best defense against usurpatory government is an assertive citizenry" - William F. Buckley, Jr.)
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To: Qbert

New tagline ...

Good night.


396 posted on 07/31/2011 12:51:15 AM PDT by EternalVigilance (The only thing still propping up the GOP is the dwindling illusion that it's at all conservative.)
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To: llandres
I like your idea.

Flickr_promo

Lets just do nothing; things'll just work themselves out...

397 posted on 07/31/2011 12:54:23 AM PDT by raygun (http://bastiat.org/en/the_law DOT html)
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To: Beaten Valve

according to the link we got screwed again.


398 posted on 07/31/2011 12:55:30 AM PDT by SUSSA
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To: Qbert

Since you don’t seem to know that the President has been pressing for large tax increases even up to today, and that was the alternative to the current proposal, there is no point in discussion with someone who refuses to see the real world.


399 posted on 07/31/2011 1:05:24 AM PDT by Lucius Cornelius Sulla (Liberty and Union, Now and Forever, One and Inseparable -- Daniel Webster)
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To: Clairity; Beaten Valve
From the brilliant but scary article you cited:

"even if spending was $2 trillion less than that now scheduled in the “baseline,” as proposed this week by Republican House Speaker John Boehner, it would still total $43.8 trillion, or 55% above last decade’s spending level. Since Senate Democrats vow to veto Boehner’s plan, spending will rise by at least 50% in the coming decade."

That is the truth of it. There are no cuts. They are looking for a political solution. None of what they have been doing for the past week is an actual solution, especially without entitlements and Obamacare on the table.

Even the Ryan plan spends more money.

Rand Paul's Penny Plan is the only thing out there that decreases the deficit. They are solving the wrong problem, as usual.

400 posted on 07/31/2011 1:07:21 AM PDT by athelass (Proud Mom of a Sailor & 2 Marines! Not raising the debt ceiling is an automatic spending cut.)
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