Skip to comments.Where Would General Motors Be Without the United Automobile Workers Union?
Posted on 08/04/2011 6:45:30 PM PDT by Recovering_Democrat
This is a question that no one seems to be asking. And so I've asked it. And here, in essence, is what I think is the answer. (The answer, of course, applies to Ford and Chrysler, as well as to General Motors. I've singled out General Motors because it's still the largest of the three and its problems are the most pronounced.)
(Excerpt) Read more at mises.org ...
We were “screwed” by GM and refused to ever buy a GM product again. That was 23 years ago. Unfortunately, we are paying for their lousy existence now via our taxes.
The big labor bosses would be working for a living.
My union rant... It never gets old, at least not for me.
Im distressed by the fact that the narrative currently in vogue, (even among conservatives, and this is horrifying for what it means for the future of the country) seems to run like this,
Public sector unions are REALLY bad. There are some bad things in private sector unions, too, but they arent pure evil like public sector unions. Private sector unions, especially at the turn of the century, were actually pretty good.
This is pure BS! It is very, very, very scary when, even here on FR, for Petes sake, people do not recognize ALL UNIONS AS GOVERNMENT SANCTIONED THEFT OF PRIVATE PROPERTY FOR THE PURPOSE OF BUYING DEMOCRAT VOTES.
I expect ignorance of this fact elsewhere, but here on FR??????????????????????
Heres how the purely evil, anti-American, communistic, welfare-begging private sector unions work ..
I set up a business, using MY PRIVATE PROPERTY (my capital and/or cash money).
I pay for the space, using MY PRIVATE PROPERTY.
I pay the taxes using MY PRIVATE PROPERTY.
I supply the parts and inventory, using MY PRIVATE PROPERTY.
I pay for the insurance, using MY PRIVATE PROPERTY.
I pay the labor, using MY PRIVATE PROPERTY.
I recruit, hire, and advertise, using MY PRIVATE PROPERTY.
Oftentimes an entire lifes savings (MY PRIVATE PROPERTY) is at stake.
My future, my standing in the community, my credit, and MY PRIVATE PROPERTY are all at stake.
If I fail, I stand a good chance of being economically crippled for life.
One day, on MY PRIVATE PROPERTY that I own and acquired using MY PRIVATE PROPERTY, one of my employees, who is only in my presence because of the risk of MY PRIVATE PROPERTY, comes to me and says, Heres the story, Bub. From this moment forward I am going to begin organizing your other employees to work AGAINST YOUR PRIVATE INTERESTS and do everything in our power to TAKE BY FORCE AS MUCH OF YOUR PRIVATE PROPERTY AS WE CAN GET OUR HANDS ON. We are going to spend a great deal of time and effort ORGANIZING AGAINST YOUR INTERESTS TO DO EVERYTHING IN OUR POWER TO GROW STRONGER AT YOUR EXPENSE, IN ORDER TO TAKE YOUR MONEY. You might as well have your business competitors working here on the shop floor. If you do not agree to our demands, we will go on strike, make your life miserable, harass and threaten and/or MURDER IN COLD BLOOD anybody you may want to hire in our place.
Now the one and ONLY way that such a thing could EVER take place is for the government to step in and say, Mr. Employer, if you fire this union man, you are going to jail.
Plainly and simply, no union could ever exist in a free society. Yes, in a free society, you should be able to form and join a union of any type at any time for any purpose whatsoever. AND YOUR EMPLOYER SHOULD BE ABLE TO FIRE YOUR HAPPY ASS IN A HEARTBEAT FOR DOING SO. FREEDOM IS A TWO WAY STREET.
I find this ABSOLUTELY AMAZING. Truly. A man strolls onto the PRIVATE PROPERTY of another man and tells him how he will employ his PRIVATE PROPERTY going forward, OR ELSE!, and hundreds of millions, if not billions, of people the world over think that the first man is not only somehow better than sub-human filth, they actually see him as a hero! To me, this is one of the most perverse and mystifying examples of twisted human thinking the world has ever seen. I cant say it enough; you come onto my PRIVATE PROPERTY, and bargain with me, using the THREAT OF GOVERNMENT SANCTIONED FORCE, about how much of my PRIVATE PROPERTY you will allow me to keep! And this is somehow acceptable?
As I say, even conservatives, (who have escaped the liberal brainwashing that begins when we are still in the womb on guns, race, US history, etc., etc., and do not subscribe to the easy notions that are so readily picked up by the unthinking) seem to fall for this trap. Seem to believe that
The work place is filled with mean managers and mean bosses who were/are really mean to kids and women and workers and paid them pennies instead of the legitimate millions that they were REALLY worth, making evil white male capitalists even richer, and they enslaved them and coerced them and made them work real hard and were really, really mean. THANK GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! for the government stepping in and saving women and children from mean bosses and really mean white capitalist men.
Needless to say, each and every single word of that narrative is as totally false and ridiculous as the liberal narrative on US history, or bad guns, or evil white men. If you know people who believe that stuff, you cannot help them. Do not waste your breath on them, do not do their research for them; have them read Sowell or Williams or von Hayek, or von Mises, or Friedman, or even Stossel when they write of sweatshops either in todays 3rd world or in America at the turn of the century.
I used to work in a GMAD plant. I was a UAW member.
I can say without fear of contradiction that the average UAW member doesn't give a flying f**** about the quality of the product they put out/assemble. They care about;
Unions are always and everywhere nothing but the theft of private property to be steered to Obama and Al Franken to steal elections. Period, end of story. Unions steal the property of (largely) white, capitalist, men, and give it to Obama, so that he can give it to others in exchange for their votes.
Maybe I wouldn’t have had my GM bonds go from $38500 value to $3850 overnight.
I am able to say for certain that I will never own a GM product again
Apparently, the engine (and other parts) weren’t put together correctly. Some servos on the carb were installed backwards along with a dozen other serious problems with the car. Maybe they were smoking pot when they put the car together.
We dumped the car after 14K miles. Notice that it was just above the 12K mile warranty. GM stopped supporting us after the warranty expired.
BTW, I fault the GM management who made the decisions to cut corners at the expense of my safety and their quality.
Without the UAW GM would still be the world’s largest, most profitable automaker with the largest cash reserves in the industry.
Where would Community Organizer Barack O’Bozo be without the UAW?
You’d be stunned at the number of dumb asses on this forum who swallow the “mean managers were mean to people, so thank God for the federal government and unions saving poor child workers” line. I USED to believe it until I read the works of Sowell, Friedman, von Mises, von Hayek, Stossel, etc.
I was going to say profitable and privately owned.
My last new Crewcab Diesel truck the headliner was falling and it leaked water from the cab marker lights pouring inside,and the Oil leaks,but Chevy did nothing what the hell 54K with @1700 in union extortion/Health care balled up in the price,I kept the 04 Dodge dually Cummins diesel I have now and got rid of the new chevy duramax.
“Maybe I wouldnt have had my GM bonds go from $38500 value to $3850 overnight.”
(I use the oxymoron "government workers" in the real sense, in that their is no work that really means anything that gets done by them)
A lot better off. Unions are for the lazy scum of the Earth
Except for the fact of property taxes which in my opinion is nothing more than protection money.
If you think we are a free country I have beach front property to sell you in Oklahoma.
When I was a freshly graduated engineer, I was starting up industrial power plants for a living. I still recall learning with shock the electricians in the Longview, WA area called themselves (with PRIDE) the "FLEs" --> "Fat Lazy Electricians." True story. Those guys could featherbed the end of a construction project like you wouldn't believe. It was easier to get the ticks and fleas off the dog than get those guys out of the plant.
Wonder what is going to happen when the next labor talks start and the UAW is on both sides of the bargaining table.
They are 47% owners of the company and the represent the workers? Bet Odumbo will have a great solution for that conflict of interest.
The companies were in a conspiracy with the union for decades to plunder the public.
The union extorted higher wages, but the company just passed the costs on to the public. So why should management care? All US auto companies were unionized, so the playing field remained level. The cost of the union was in essence the same as a tax.
It wasn’t until the massive flood of imports that the US companies had to truly compete with with more or less free market alternatives.
If there were no significant numbers of imports or US non-union car makers, the companies would still be fat and happy. They’d all just charge more.
In the black?
Privately held and NOT "Government Motors".
I always bought GM cars mostly Chevy’s. I bought two new ones in 1990 that the paint literally pealed off the car in huge spots. It was spot fixed by the dealers several times until the warranty expired then they blamed it on acid rain and told me I was on my own. One vehicle in particular, a 1990 Chevy S-10 pickup needed so many other repairs amounting to several thousand dollars that GM sent engineers to inspect the vehicle because I had purchased an extended warranty that covered the drive train and suspension. The truck only had 40k miles on it and was never taken off road or driven hard. GM paid for the repairs and then refunded me the cost for the extended warranty and told me again I was on my own. From then on I swore I would never buy another GM car as long as I live.
Well, they'd have one less new Camaro sitting on their lot. My first new car was a 68 Camaro, 327, four on the floor. I'd like to buy another new one. Unfortuantely, it will be a cold day in hell before I buy a product from Government Motors and the scumbag union thugs there.
Good point. Wonder what Deming though of Unions.
They certainly affect quality.
And he blamed 85% of the problems on management. Ironically, that could include Unions.
I worked for a unionized Wal-Mart esque store, Meijer for those of you not in Michigan or Ohio. It would take a long damn time to fire some of the worst employees you could imagine. Some were good, some were rotten. There was (is?) a union steward named Bonny that was the meanest person I ever had the misfortune of working with. She looked like a vulture and hissed like a stray cat. Hours and raises were always on time spent, never on merit. I currently haaaaaaate my current company and would love to get a new job, but I would never make things worse by dealing with the devil. We do have union workers in my company and they are horrible, some can barely read if at all.
Very successfully introducing real trucks/cars that americans have loved for 60 years.
Today, sorry...the hurt the american economy when they teamed with Obozo.
I have thought for a long time that the unions have ruined a lot of American workers, it taught them that they do not nned to do a good job, all they need to do is be present to collect their pay check!
Garde la Foi, mes amis! Nous nous sommes les sauveurs de la République! Maintenant et Toujours!
(Keep the Faith, my friends! We are the saviors of the Republic! Now and Forever!)
LonePalm, le Républicain du verre cassé (The Broken Glass Republican)
Let’s not forget General Motors body parts by Fisher Body, Pittsburgh, PA. If it weighed the correct amount, it passed.
Seems like GM had a lot of problems in the late 80s and through the 90s. Ours was a brand new ‘86 Transam. Don't know about quality now and don't care.
We drove 50 miles to the nearby major city and limped into the Dodge dealership. We traded it for a “K” car. There was a rattling sound coming from the rear end. The paint and decals were pealing (like you) and the damn thing would randomly stall out — fuel/carb system problems. Of course, you'd lose all power (steering and brakes).
Apparently, the Dodge dealership had to put a lot of money into the car to sell it.
My in-laws were big fans of the K car and had little problems with theirs. We were so angry with our experience we had little patience for more car problems. We certainly got our money out of our K car.
>>>> We'll never forgive GM for how they treated us.
Yep, whether or not it had a loose bolt inside the door or not. hee hee hee
My wife bought a Saturn Vue with a VTI transmission. At 108,000 miles the transmission went out. We were quoted $4,500 to repair. It will never run again, has been setting idle for over 2 years. There was a class action lawsuit and settlement over the VTI tranny, but since we purchased it with 1,500 miles on it, not new, we were out of the loop.
GM wouldn’t be trading at $25.99 [10 bucks BELOW its recent IPO price] ...
Most contracts were written that way back then.
It is pretty much the same way today, UNLESS, the origional buyer has got the service from the dealer and done on time and at a premium price. (My comment: anti-trust is being ignored today) You must have accurate records. 100,000 miles warranty, my arse.
They are still getting away with it.
GM Vehicles would be of higher quality, and cost at least 20% less (and quite possibly more).
Regardless of what is right or wrong, that will be my last GM auto. Still have an old Silverado Pickup, but will never buy another GM vehicle again....
We may all be riding horses again if Obozo has his way.
My step-father grew up in Detroit (and in fact, he and my mother are moving back to that area later this month...).
While he is relatively conservative overall in political matters - FAR too many years of brainwashing by a union environment and one negative word about unions and you are cross-ways with him.
ping for later
I just bought a jacked-up ‘86 Ford Bronco for my alternate getting around town in the winter time vehicle so I can preserve my very nice F-150. I never, ever, considered a vintage GM product because of the nationlization of a once great American company. I’ll stay Ford until I die.
More to the point...
Where Would the United Automobile Workers Union Be Without General Motors ?
Cleaning toilets if they were lucky.
For the most part, business will not go up against the government. Rather they will use their influence through lobbyists to get favorable terms to conduct their craft looking to maximize their short term profits, and not caring of the influences their accepted regulation has on the market place at large. Wilson and FDR began the destruction of American Industry. Obama intends to complete it.
Well said; thank you.