Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Christian Professor Claims Genetics Disproves Historical Adam
Institute for Creation Research ^ | 8-26-11 | Brian Thomas

Posted on 08/27/2011 10:07:19 AM PDT by fishtank

National Public Radio recently interviewed Trinity Western University biologist Dennis Venema, who stated his belief that humans did not descend from Adam and Eve.1 Venema, an evangelical evolutionist, claimed that genetics studies show "there is no way we can be traced back to a single couple."2 Do the data really contradict the biblical account of human history?

"Given the genetic variation of people today, [Venema] says scientists can't get that [starting] population size below 10,000 people at any time in our evolutionary history," NPR reported.2 But this claim fails for three reasons. First, it relies on the presumption of "evolutionary history," not scientific data. Second, the idea that an initial group of 10,000 humans evolved from primates is mathematically impossible. Third, a descent from Adam and Eve actually does explain the patterns in modern human genetics....

(Excerpt) Read more at icr.org ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events; Technical
KEYWORDS: belongsinreligion; creation; evolution; gagdadbob; genetics; genome; notanewstopic; onecosmosblog
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-100101-143 next last
More at the link...

More political/Marxist attempts from the evolutionists to obscure the truth ...

Thank you ICR for your work!

1 posted on 08/27/2011 10:07:22 AM PDT by fishtank
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: fishtank

I believe in the Biblical Story of Creation AND I believe in Evolution. They are NOT mutually exclusive (Smiling as I toss a grenade!)


2 posted on 08/27/2011 10:10:35 AM PDT by ZULU (Chris Wallace is a flake.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: fishtank
Another "Christian" denying God and the Bible.

Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father who is in heaven. 22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy by thy name, and by thy name cast out demons, and by thy name do many mighty works? 23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. (Matthew 7:21-23)

We know the future of the "Christian" professor. God's word will be vindicated, and everyone will stand before Him and give an account.

3 posted on 08/27/2011 10:15:20 AM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta ("....in the last days, mockers will come with their mocking...." (2 Peter 3:3))
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: ZULU

I would honestly like to see a few articles or references to this point of view.

P.S. I’m familiar with Hugh Ross’s work already ...


4 posted on 08/27/2011 10:15:30 AM PDT by fishtank (The denial of original sin is the root of liberalism.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: ZULU

same here...


5 posted on 08/27/2011 10:17:36 AM PDT by Perdogg (0bama got 0sama?? Really, was 0sama on the golf course?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: ZULU

I agree with you. Nobody I know has ever asked God how long one of his days was.

I can live with that.


6 posted on 08/27/2011 10:18:33 AM PDT by PeteB570 ( Islam is the sea in which the Terrorist Shark swims. The deeper the sea the larger the shark.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: ZULU

“I believe in the Biblical Story of Creation AND I believe in Evolution. They are NOT mutually exclusive (Smiling as I toss a grenade!)”

So Adam was accidentally created by god who shall remain nameless? LOL!


7 posted on 08/27/2011 10:19:13 AM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: ZULU

Book II “Question of the phase in which the moon was made” 15, 30

“God, after all is the author and founder of things in their actual natures. Now whatever any single thing may in some way or other produce and unfold by its natural development through periods of time that are suited to it, it contained it beforehand as something hidden, if not in specific forms and bodily mass, at least by the force and reckoning of nature, unless of course a tree, void of fruit and stripped of its leaves throughout the winter, is then to be called imperfect, or unless again at its origins, when it had still not yet borne any fruit, its nature was also imperfect. It is not only about the tree, but about its seed also that this could not rightly be said; there everything that with the passage of time is somehow or other going to appear is already latent in invisible ways. Although, if God were to make anything imperfect, which he then would himself bring to perfection, what would be reprehensible about such an idea? But you would be quite within your rights to disapprove if what had been begun by him were said to be completed and perfected by another.”

—Augustine, “On the Literal Interpretation of Genesis”, ca. A.D. 401-415


8 posted on 08/27/2011 10:23:53 AM PDT by Claud
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: ZULU

Then you might like...

http://www.amazon.com/Real-Eve-Danny-Glover/dp/B00006AUH1


9 posted on 08/27/2011 10:24:48 AM PDT by dhs12345
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: fishtank

He ain’t that Christian. “Adam” means first man. there had to have been one...........


10 posted on 08/27/2011 10:28:37 AM PDT by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Jack Hydrazine; ZULU

Since Hulu didn’t specify what he meant, you made up your own obtuse and mal-informed logic in an effort to humiliate him?

Should we make up things and pretend you said them?

The answer is “no, because it wouldn’t be Christian.”


11 posted on 08/27/2011 10:30:21 AM PDT by UCANSEE2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: Jack Hydrazine

Creationists should know this one ~ did God install the Heart first, or the Liver?


12 posted on 08/27/2011 10:31:05 AM PDT by muawiyah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: PeteB570

“But do not ignore this one fact, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years and a thousand years like one day.” 2 Peter 3:8.


13 posted on 08/27/2011 10:33:21 AM PDT by Claud
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 6 | View Replies]

To: ZULU
I believe in the Biblical Story of Creation AND I believe in Evolution. They are NOT mutually exclusive

I think the biggest problem in the discussion of GOD and EVOLUTION is that the term EVOLUTION is only loosely defined and understood by the public, and is misused in debate and conversation. Most likely the term GOD is loosely defined and misused as well.

14 posted on 08/27/2011 10:35:10 AM PDT by UCANSEE2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Jack Hydrazine; ZULU

“So Adam was accidentally created by god who shall remain nameless? LOL!”

I don’t believe ZULU said that... Your part of the problem.


15 posted on 08/27/2011 10:36:10 AM PDT by babygene (Figures don't lie, but liars can figure...)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: ZULU

I believe in micro evolution, but not macro evolution.


16 posted on 08/27/2011 10:37:15 AM PDT by Scotsman will be Free (11C - Indirect fire, infantry - High angle hell - We will bring you, FIRE)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: UCANSEE2; ZULU

17 posted on 08/27/2011 10:37:36 AM PDT by Lady Jag (Keep the 'ICk" in Democratic)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: Jack Hydrazine

I think God created the laws of biology and physics and made everything out of nothing ( The Big Bang). I believe he directs the actions of things here on earth - both with respect to evolutionary processes and, at times, the activities - and punishments of mankind when we disobey him.


18 posted on 08/27/2011 10:38:07 AM PDT by ZULU (Chris Wallace is a flake.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: fishtank

There’s always some dolt that attempts to revamp the Adam and Eve Descendant Theory, without any verifiable scientific evidence, at all? They all just wail away in the mire, so to speak, and eventually fall by the wayside? God and his minions always rule here and disbelievers just waste away into obscurity??


19 posted on 08/27/2011 10:38:42 AM PDT by zbogwan2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: muawiyah
Creationists should know this one ~ did God install the Heart first, or the Liver?

Better question. Did GOD create VIRUSES or PROKARYOTES first, and why?

20 posted on 08/27/2011 10:39:22 AM PDT by UCANSEE2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: ZULU
"I believe in the Biblical Story of Creation AND I believe in Evolution. They are NOT mutually exclusive"

Exactly

21 posted on 08/27/2011 10:40:22 AM PDT by Matchett-PI (Obamageddon, Barackalypse Now! Bam is "Debt Man Walking" in 2012 - Rush Limbaugh)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Lady Jag

LOL!


22 posted on 08/27/2011 10:40:58 AM PDT by UCANSEE2
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: UCANSEE2

God is the Supreme Being, Infinitely Perfect, who made all things and keeps them in existence.


23 posted on 08/27/2011 10:43:39 AM PDT by ZULU (Chris Wallace is a flake.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: Jack Hydrazine

Evolution addresses the how; religion addresses the why. The two really don’t cross much at all, and trying to force each study to cover the other is when you run into problems.


24 posted on 08/27/2011 10:43:55 AM PDT by FromTheSidelines ("everything that deceives, also enchants" - Plato)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 7 | View Replies]

To: UCANSEE2
"I think the biggest problem in the discussion of GOD and EVOLUTION is that the term EVOLUTION is only loosely defined and understood by the public, and is misused in debate and conversation."

TRUE

25 posted on 08/27/2011 10:44:12 AM PDT by Matchett-PI (Obamageddon, Barackalypse Now! Bam is "Debt Man Walking" in 2012 - Rush Limbaugh)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: fishtank

Forget the Bible, there’s too much discussion of Adam and Eve in midrashic sources to believe that it’s all fabricated and that they were not historical people. The “Book of Adam and Eve” can probably be found on the web.


26 posted on 08/27/2011 10:45:04 AM PDT by steveshoveler
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: ZULU

I agree. In my view, God gave us our soul and that is what lives forever and longs to be back with Him. Without that, we are just a bunch of hairless apes.


27 posted on 08/27/2011 10:45:48 AM PDT by GreyFriar (Spearhead - 3rd Armored Division 75-78 & 83-87)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: ZULU
I don't think there is any issue with Natural Selection within our species, i.e. why subsets of the Human species are highly variable in terms of hair, skin, body size, etc. Look at what we were able to do over just few thousand years with conscious selection of dogs and other species of domesticated animals. Even the probable mix of Neanderthal genetic material I carry as a descendant (mainly) of Caucasian ancestors to me means that those burly fellows with the barrel chests and receding chins (and larger than "modern" human brains) were part of our species and not much more different than a 7 foot Watusi is from a Bush Pygmy.

Where I fell off the evolution band wagon and began to doubt a dozen years of solid indoctrination was the complete lack of evidence for trans-speciation (sp?) and how little physical fossil evidence is actually out there for older extinct primate species. The presumption that those ancient chimps changed over time into modern humans is a nice theory but (IMHO) it has yet to be proven. Plus, since all humans but no other modern primates possess certain traits that are only seen in aquatic mammals (furless, large brained, subcutaneous fat layers, with slightly webbed fingers and toes) I think the experts are looking in all the wrong places for our ancestral stock.

Therefore, if by "evolution" you mean change over time within species (that one can in good faith believe were created by a benevolent G*d) there is no conflict. But self-described "evolutionists" these days tend to also be vocal atheists who push their beliefs well past where physical evidence warrants.

28 posted on 08/27/2011 10:45:56 AM PDT by katana (Just my opinions)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: dhs12345

Just because I picked the Nom de Plume “ZULU” everyone assumes I’m black. Guess they never saw the movie “ZULU” with Stanley Baker. I’m NOT Black and Danny Glover is a mental midget.


29 posted on 08/27/2011 10:46:42 AM PDT by ZULU (Chris Wallace is a flake.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: fishtank
National Public Radio recently interviewed Trinity Western University biologist Dennis Venema, who stated his belief that humans did not descend from Adam and Eve.1 Venema, an evangelical evolutionist, claimed that genetics studies show "there is no way we can be traced back to a single couple."2 Do the data really contradict the biblical account of human history?

The literal DNA data does NOT contradict the biblical account. Genesis 1:26 is the flesh men/women created on the sixth day.... (course Peter says that a day with the LORD is as a thousand years...) And the Genesis 2 account where it says there was NO one to tend the 'garden' or otherwise called farmer. Genesis 1 and Genesis 2 according to what Peter says in the Heavenly Father's methodology of calculating 'time' are at minimum 2 and most 3 thousand years apart.

30 posted on 08/27/2011 10:46:42 AM PDT by Just mythoughts (Luke 17:32 Remember Lot's wife.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: GreyFriar

Can’t argue with that.


31 posted on 08/27/2011 10:47:25 AM PDT by ZULU (Chris Wallace is a flake.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: fishtank

If there is no first Adam then there can be no ‘2nd Adam’ hence no ‘Gospel’, no ‘Good News’, no hope for anything beyond the here and now. Christianity without Adam is meaningless....


32 posted on 08/27/2011 10:47:40 AM PDT by yadent
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: fishtank

It must have been the Nephilim that added diversity.


33 posted on 08/27/2011 10:49:29 AM PDT by ThomasThomas ( Congressmen should wear uniforms like NASCAR drivers, so we can identify their corporate sponsors.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: GreyFriar

nope we are featherless bipeds according to Plato


34 posted on 08/27/2011 10:49:32 AM PDT by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: katana

Well, the fossil record seems to indicate that those “intermediate” creatures existed once at a time when other creatures did not exist. The fossil records is a snapshot in time of a breeding population. He provides precious little about where that population PRECISELY came from and where it PRECISELY went. A lot of the pre-modern humans may have been dead-ends, biologically.


35 posted on 08/27/2011 10:51:31 AM PDT by ZULU (Chris Wallace is a flake.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

To: fishtank

God added diversity, or dna change, as needed.


36 posted on 08/27/2011 10:53:14 AM PDT by ken21 (ruling class dem + rino progressives -- destroying america for 150 years.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Matchett-PI; UCANSEE2; Slings and Arrows; martin_fierro; potlatch; SandRat; LUV W; Lucky9teen; ...



37 posted on 08/27/2011 10:53:49 AM PDT by Lady Jag (Keep the 'ICk" in Democratic)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: ZULU

Color has nothing to do with it. Have you seen the video?


38 posted on 08/27/2011 10:54:07 AM PDT by dhs12345
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies]

To: yldstrk

That too. It’s been too many decades since I last read Plato.


39 posted on 08/27/2011 10:58:06 AM PDT by GreyFriar (Spearhead - 3rd Armored Division 75-78 & 83-87)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 34 | View Replies]

To: UCANSEE2

Entirely too complex ~ note, though, “everybody” has a liver. Not “everybody” has a heart!


40 posted on 08/27/2011 10:59:05 AM PDT by muawiyah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: katana
Finger webs? Everybody gets those first. The bones show up inside the meat. Then, as muscles are defined one of the last acts is to cut away the webs between the fingers.

All of us get that ~ dogs, cats, people, monkeys.

Fish don't!

41 posted on 08/27/2011 11:06:36 AM PDT by muawiyah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 28 | View Replies]

To: steveshoveler

I agree, revelation suggests rather strongly that Adam and Eve were historical individuals.

Not sure when we can place them within the archaeological and paleontological record, but it’s best when we are not sure of something to simply admit we’re not sure and keep trying to find out, rather than forcing bad conclusions in either the science or theology.


42 posted on 08/27/2011 11:10:01 AM PDT by Claud
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: ZULU; Perdogg; PeteB570; Claud; muawiyah; babygene; Scotsman will be Free; Lady Jag; zbogwan2; ...
The Doctor Fun Page

43 posted on 08/27/2011 11:10:56 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (It's never a bad time to FReep this link -- https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: ZULU
I believe in the Biblical Story of Creation AND I believe in Evolution. They are NOT mutually exclusive (Smiling as I toss a grenade!)

Evem some top religious figure say there is room for both, if you are willing to believe in Creationism for the starting line. I know ther is proof-positive for mutations, but they are almost exclusively fatal changes. Then there is breeding bad traits out for survival (or because the bad traits died out) like monkeys having almost no neck - a longer neck tends to break easier when young ones fall out of trees.

While ther is must evidence that seems to point at evolution, it cannot be proved (as of today anyway) any more than Creationism can be disproved.

Here's your grenade back - it looks like you forgot to pull the pin - although there are sure to be some who will pull it themselves...

44 posted on 08/27/2011 11:11:18 AM PDT by trebb ("If a man will not work, he should not eat" From 2 Thes 3)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: Lady Jag
Smiley - Popcorn
45 posted on 08/27/2011 11:13:16 AM PDT by Slings and Arrows (You can't have Ingsoc without an Emmanuel Goldstein.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: Lady Jag; SunkenCiv

46 posted on 08/27/2011 11:14:40 AM PDT by JoeProBono (A closed mouth gathers no feet)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 37 | View Replies]

To: ZULU

Some of modern humans are dead-ends also

:-)


47 posted on 08/27/2011 11:17:58 AM PDT by PeteB570 ( Islam is the sea in which the Terrorist Shark swims. The deeper the sea the larger the shark.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: FromTheSidelines

Evolution says you are an accident with no purpose.

Religion says just the opposite.

Evolution has never been proven, but religion keeps getting proven based on our studies of the universe.


48 posted on 08/27/2011 11:20:25 AM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 24 | View Replies]

To: ZULU
"I believe in the Biblical Story of Creation AND I believe in Evolution. They are NOT mutually exclusive (Smiling as I toss a grenade!)"

Kinda like the old Dixiecrat bumper-sticker.

"I love God, I own a gun, I vote Democrat."

Always wanted to add, "I are stupid"...

49 posted on 08/27/2011 11:20:41 AM PDT by GourmetDan (Eccl 10:2 - The heart of the wise inclines to the right, but the heart of the fool to the left.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: ZULU

What evolutionary processes where? I have never seen the theory of evolution ever proven. As of today it is still a theory.


50 posted on 08/27/2011 11:21:57 AM PDT by Jack Hydrazine (It's the end of the world as we know it and I feel fine!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-100101-143 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson