Skip to comments.Cain flip-flops on due process for Americans, criticizes Perry
Posted on 10/07/2011 9:02:40 PM PDT by smoothsailing
October 7, 2011
Back in May, Herman Cain answered a few questions from Conor Friedersdorf of The Atlantic dealing with Libya and civil liberties issues. Cain’s answers on the USA PATRIOT Act were disappointing; and quite frankly, showed a severe lack of respect for the Fourth Amendment, especially for someone that supposedly wants to restore the Constitution.
Oddly though, Cain rejected the idea of a president authorizing the death of American citizen, as in the case of Anwar al-Awlaki, without due process guaranteed by the Fifth Amendment. Here the relevant part of the interview (Friedersdorf’s questions are in bold):
President Obama has said that he has the authority to assassinate American citizens if he’s declared them an enemy combatant in the War on Terror. Al Awlaki is one guy who is on the official government list where he can be taken out. Do you have any thoughts on that? Is it a good policy because it allows us to take out Americans who may have joined Al Qaeda? Or is it a bad policy-
Well first of all, this is the first that I have heard - you’re saying it’s okay to take out American citizens if he suspects they are terrorist related. Is that what you said?!
Yes, that’s what I said.
I’ve got to be honest with you. I have not heard that. I had not heard that’s something that he said. I don’t believe that the president of the United States should order the assassination of citizens of the United States. That’s why we have our court system, and that’s why we have our laws. Even if the person is suspected of being affiliated with terrorism, if they are a citizen of this country, they still deserve the rights of this country, which includes due process. Osama bin Laden was not a citizen of the United States of America. So I would not have changed the decision the president made in that regard. But if you’re a citizen, no, it is not right for the president to to think he has the power to have you assassinated. No. He has the power to make sure you’re locked up, but you have to go through due process.
What about other people who are locked up? Where should we try terrorists when we capture them? Military tribunals? The court system?
I firmly believe it should be military tribunals. I don’t believe we should clog up our court system trying terrorists. They’re not citizens of the United States. They are a threat to the United States. I think they should be tried by military tribunals. The process would move a lot faster, and we are much more likely to get the proper judgment against these people who have killed many of our citizens, and who have a desire to kill more of our citizens.
While Cain was unaware of the situation in question — a troublesome revelation in and of itself, you can see that there is no ambiguity in his answer, even if the American citizen in question is engaged in terrorist activities, as Cain says, “they still deserve the rights of this country, which includes due process.”
But this week, just days after Awlaki was killed without due process, Cain expressed support for President Obama’s action and denied that he ever said anything to the contrary (emphasis mine):
During a brief phone interview this afternoon with The Weekly Standard, Cain responded to questions that have been raised about his positions on the war on terror and taxes.
Asked why he had backed off his opposition to the U.S. military’s targeting Anwar Awlaki, the al Qaeda terrorist and American citizen who was killed Friday by a drone strike in Yemen, Cain denied that he had ever opposed taking out Awlaki.
I never said that [President Obama] should not have ordered [the killing]. I dont recall saying that. I think youve got some misinformation,” Cain said. “Keep in mind that there are a lot of people out there trying to make me sound as if I am indecisive.”
Uh, we didn’t have to try, Mr. Cain. You’re doing a pretty good job of making yourself sound indecisive. Of course, this isn’t the first gaffe Cain has made on foreign policy issues. Remember, he bombed Chris Wallace’s question on Palestinian “right of return” during a visit on Fox News Sunday and other answers on foreign policy questions have been essentially that we’ll have to elect him to find out what he believes. Unfortunately for Cain (but thankfully for the rest of us), it doesn’t work that way.
Cain has also been backing himself into a corner on Rick Perry. It’s become obvious that he’s not Perry’s biggest fan, it seems for political reasons more than anything else, as evidence by overplaying his hand on the hunting camp story that was recently brought to light.
During an interview yesterday with the National Journal, Cain said that he’d consider the vice-presidential spot on the ticket with any of his rivals…except for Perry:
Herman Cain said Thursday that he would consider an invitation to join an eventual Republican presidential nominee as a vice presidential candidate unless the nominee is Rick Perry.
I would not say no to being vice president of the United States, Cain said. But it would depend upon who got the nomination. I will support who gets the nomination. I know I have said that there are some people right now who I cannot support, but I wouldnt say no to it. I could say yes. But it has to be someone who I believe I can complement them in their job by being able to bring my skills to the table.
But, Cain told the National Journal, Quite frankly, based upon Governor Perrys position on some issues, I would not be comfortable being his vice presidential nominee.
Cain said that while he hasnt totally gone through all of [Perrys] positions, but a lot of positions I have questions with including being soft on the border, issues relative to tuition for children of illegal aliens.
Interestingly, Tax Hike Mike Huckabee held a similar position as Perry on in-state tuition for children of illegal immigrants, but that didn’t stop Cain from sending Huckabee $2,300 during the 2008 primary.
We’ll have more on Cain later. Stay tuned.
>>>>>>Cains 999 plan may have its problems but its specific.
Cain's 9-9-9 tax plan is no-no-no in my book. Conservatives don't promote new forms of taxes. We don't need a national sales tax. Besides, we don't need to have a 9-9-9 turn into a 12-12-12 or 18-18-18 once the Dems regain power.
Perry was interviewed by John Hawkins of Rightwing News on specific issue of immigration. Read the entire interview at this LINK
Uh oh. There's more. Yes, Herman you did say it in so many words. Cain must woodshed and get his act together on this issue. No one is cutting Perry any slack and Cain doesn't deserve any special treatment either. They both better tighten up on foreign policy. Iron sharpens iron.
Yea sure, if you have taken the time to read, you would have known, and you didn’t have time to read all that yet anyway. The Homeland Security Plan 2010 to 2015 was dozens of pages in and of itself, and that didn’t include all the other docs. If you want to read and learn, go ahead. If you just write back as you did, you don’t deserve an answer from me.
Come back when you've got a serious analogy.
Little Johnnie, Didn’t you read the answer I gave you YESTERDAY about Perry’s Presidential vision? Why must you ask the same question again, or did you just not read that post yesterday?
Well, here is is AGAIN for you.
Rick Perry’s Presidential Plan and Agenda and where you can find more about it if you want to know:
How to Restore our Founding Fathers vision of American Government: FED UP!, by Rick Perry
How to Renew our commitment to the form of government dictated in The Constitution of The United States: FED UP!, by Rick Perry
How to Empower state and local governments: FED UP!, by Rick Perry
How to Introduce and Maintain Fiscal Responsibility and Conservative Principles to implement Growth in America: FED Up!, by Rick Perry
How to show a Dedication to Rescuing and Restoring personal liberty of individuals as envisioned by our nations forefathers: FED UP!, by Rick Perry
Steps towards Abolishing the Tyranny of the Modern Administrative State, FED UP!, by Rick Perry
How to Regain a Constitutionally-directed Supreme Court System and a Rejection of judges that create laws for our country, FED UP!, by Rick Perry
The Duties the Federal Government Should and Would Honor Under Rick Perry as President as directed by The United States Constitution and our Countrys Laws: FED UP!, by Rick Perry
Standing up Against Non-Conservative Legislation and Apart from Non-Conservative Legislators on either side of the Aisle (and why it is important to do so): FED UP!, by Rick Perry
Upholding the 10th Amendment Principle of States Rights: FED UP!, by Rick Perry
Retaking the Reins of Government: Freedom and Federalism for the Future: FED UP!, by Rick Perry
Our Fight to Save America from Washington
By Rick Perry, Governor of Texas
Foreword by Newt Gingrich
Published by Little, Brown, and Company
New York, Boston, London
You might also like to see an example of one of Rick Perrys brochures.
Governor Perrys Homeland Security Strategic Plan 2010 - 2015:
Oh, and by the way, Read post 112 if you want to see someone “make a case for Rick Perry”. Of course, there are many other acts, programs, legislation, records, etc. I could provide on numerous other issues too, but we’ll leave post 112 as it is for now and add more of Perry’s record on other issues for another time.
Sounds like Mitt Romney’s position.
My problem with Perry is that he stumbles.
You got that right, I sure hope he gets it together. He really locks up and flounders in debates.
I have noticed he does better when he’s moving around and I’ve also noticed he fidgets a bunch when he can’t move around.
I am wondering if he has a bit of stage fright. I sure hope he gets over whatever it is. I would like to vote for him.
Exactly, and to his credit, Perry is going after both Romney and Obama. He's left everyone else alone, even Cain, who hardly deserves it.
When the American is in the field, actively fighting with the enemy, he is an enemy combatant.In effect, he was evading capture after being charged.
However, I do worry that the Obama Administration didn’t go through the FISA courts or Congressional security committees.
There was a sort of due process, when the ACLU challenged placing Awlaki on the kill or capture list last year. http://www.nytimes.com/2010/12/08/world/middleeast/08killing.html
The Federal Court had ruled that if Awlaki wanted the protection of the US courts, he only had to surrender to US forces. Look at where Al-Awlaki was: in Yemen, running around with Al Queda and plotting to attack the UK and the US, and continuing to target people for speaking out against the terrorists.
I am listening to this tonight.
Sorry, but you are just WRONG and very much so! If anyone here can agree with you that an American President can condemn an American to death is okay - well, they are just as lost as you are...
You sir are looking at the short term problem and not looking at the long term conflict that this sets up...
Heh... well good luck with your evaluation via the MSM examination... I’m sure that you will choose the right candidate according to their analysis...
I have great respect for Mr. Cain's accomplishments. However, national and international politics are a whole different ball of wax than managing one or two companies.
Cain is a good speaker, but I want someone who knows the magnitude of the job. I believe that when Perry speaks (even haltingly), he realizes what a crossroads in history we are at. You can see in his face that he understands the depth of the responsibility of the Presidency.
Perry's not chanting slogans, cracking jokes, or standing before the crowd with a smile plastered on is face. The only thing I've heard him say that is even close to a slogan is that if we don't get America working again, we are done. Nothing else matters.
Cain has a bus, a train, that 999 slogan, and the cadence of a preacher. That apparently has impressed enough people to put him in the lead. Heck, Obama won on Bob the Builder's slogan of "Yes we can!" I'm not falling for "Yes, we Cain." I want the man who has experience in government. Who has dealt with various departments, agencies, and lawmakers. At this point, we can't afford to have an apprentice for President. We need someone that has experience.
Regardless, if people agree with every issue, Perry is the conservative candidate that wants to serve this country. He knows he can do the job required of him.
Very cute. ;o)
I hate debates, at least the way they’re manipulated into gotcha shows. Newt is right about that.
Still, Perry has to improve his debating skills or he’s done.
It’s too bad it comes down to that. He’s good one on one and gives very good speeches. But reality is what it is, and either he gets better in debates or he’s through.
Yes, I read that interview and it was excellent and answered one of the questions I had...how would he reconcile his border stance as governor with enforcement of federal law. I understand what you mean about Cain and that’s a concern of mine though his beliefs are as conservative as mine. I don’t want new taxes and prefer a flat tax but none of us are going to get everything we want. Still an overhaul of the whole tax system is long overdue.
I really wish they would run together. What one lacks the other one has and having someone who knows government and someone who knows the private sector the whole country would benefit. I hope if either one of them get’s the nomination Cain will think differently about forming an alliance.
Excellent post! My thoughts exactly.
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