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Certifigate : Donald Trump now casts even more doubt on Obama
WND ^ | DECEMBER 5, 2011 | Bob Unruh

Posted on 12/06/2011 12:01:25 AM PST by RobinMasters

The mainstream media are "protecting" Barack Obama's "unconstitutional" tenure in the White House, refusing to investigate allegations that he fails to meet the Constitution's requirement that a president be a "natural born citizen," according to flamboyant billionaire Donald Trump.

In a conference call today with reporters, WND asked Trump why, if he believes defeating Obama is so significant in 2012, doesn't he use his influence to mount a formal investigation into Obama's eligibility.

There have been allegations since long before Obama's election in 2008 that he is not a "natural-born citizen," a requirement imposed on no other official.

Obama's critics believe that at the time the Constitution was written, the Founders understood "natural-born citizen" to mean the offspring of two citizens.

Obama has claimed he was born in Hawaii, but birth documentation he's released has been judged by a number of document, imaging and graphics experts to be fake.

Others believe he would fail to qualify no matter his place of birth, because his father, Barack Obama Sr., was a Kenyan subject to the jurisdiction of the United Kingdom at the time of Obama Jr.'s birth. They allege the Founders precluded dual citizens by specifically demanding a "natural-born citizen."

(Excerpt) Read more at wnd.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: bc; certifigate; naturalborncitizen; noaccountability; notransparency; obama; patriottrump; trump; undocumentedobama
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1 posted on 12/06/2011 12:01:26 AM PST by RobinMasters
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To: RobinMasters

Natural born or not.. Obama was an Indonesian citizen..
WHEN did he become an American citizen..? or become re-instated as one..?..

Where is the paperwork?..


2 posted on 12/06/2011 12:11:32 AM PST by hosepipe (This propaganda has been edited to include some fully orbed hyperbole...)
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To: RobinMasters
Obama Birth Certificate Faked In Adobe Illustrator - Official Proof 1 ( Layers )

That totally blows 0bozo's phony BC out of the water and there are three followup videos.


3 posted on 12/06/2011 12:27:47 AM PST by TigersEye (Life is about choices. Your choices. Make good ones.)
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To: hosepipe

As much as I wanted to see his LFBC, children do not lose their citizenship even if the parents change. If he was born a citizen he would have to officially renounce at age 18 or after to lose it. One wonders if he enrolled as a “foreign aid” student though.


4 posted on 12/06/2011 12:33:27 AM PST by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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To: F15Eagle

How do you know that?


5 posted on 12/06/2011 12:44:55 AM PST by SatinDoll (NO FOREIGN NATIONALS AS U.S.A. PRESIDENT)
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To: F15Eagle
One wonders if he enrolled as a “foreign aid” student though.

Its been rumored for the longest time.

Note, he won't release any of his academic records. Now maybe he was a poor student (he has said as much in his own book), but at law school, its pretty safe to say he must have grades (leftist teacher, leftist student, blah blah blah), but he won't release any of this stuff, and its quite weird.

6 posted on 12/06/2011 12:55:43 AM PST by Sonny M ("oderint dum metuant")
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To: SatinDoll

Child citizenship?


7 posted on 12/06/2011 12:59:36 AM PST by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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To: F15Eagle

Tonight the following posts appeared on this thread: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2816294/posts?q=1&;page=51

The poster was SvenMagnussen. His statements are intriguing because they indicate a knowledge of the State Department and how it functions, now and it the past. Many people challenge him - I do not. At the bottom I have two comments which dovetail with his statements.


Barry Soetoro returned to the U.S. from Indonesia when he was 10 years old as an unaccompanied minor of Indonesian Nationality. He was immediately taken into custody as an abandoned child by the U.S. INS.

Catholic Social Services of Connecticut took custody of Barry and later appointed Barry grandmother, Madelyn Payne, as his guardian.

Soon, the Soetoro adopted [adoption?] was annulled and Barry’s name was legally changed back to Barack Hussein Obama II. He continued to be an Indonesian National. Catholic Social Services continued to be Barack’s custodian until his 18th birthday, thus the Connecticut SSN. Legally, Barack’s residence was Connecticut even though he was residing with his guardian in Honolulu, HI.

Barack became a Naturalized American Citizen a few years after his 18th birthday.

An American child abandoned by his parents is taken into Child Protective Services managed by a state agency. In the case of Barry Soetoro landing in Hawaii as an accompanied minor, he would have been taken into protective custody by Hawaii Child Protective Services if he were an American citizen.

Since Barry Soetoro was an Indonesian National when he arrived in Hawaii at the age of 10, he was taken into Federal Protective custody. Catholic Social Services of Connecticut was contracted with the U.S. State Department to administer their child services needs in 1971. Consequently, Barry Soetoro was in the custody of Catholic Social Services until his 18th birthday, the age of majority.

Although Barry lived with his grandmother in Hawaii, he was in the custody of Catholic Social Services of Connecticut. His grandmother was his appointed guardian. Catholic Social Services of Connecticut managed his life as a surrogate parent while his grandmother, Madelyn Payne, attended to his day to day needs.

It was Catholic Social Services of Connecticut that filed for Obama’s SSN. Consequently, he has a Connecticut SSN prefix.

Any American citizen, regardless of age, can move out of the country and renounce their citizenship.

Obots like to quote State Department guidance written after Obama was sworn in to claim a parent cannot renounce a child’s citizenship. This is State Department guidance for 2009.

This was not the guidance for 1966,67.

It’s guidance, not law. The Obama Administration instituted the policy a parent cannot move out of the country and renounce a child’s U.S. Citizenship.

Obot’s consider the guidance issued in 2009 to apply to 1966, 1967. It’s laughable.

Obama was adopted by Lolo Soetoro and renamed Barry Soetoro. Lolo Soetoro was listed as the birth father on Barry Soetoro’s Hawaiian COLB after the adoption was finalized.

Why wouldn’t the SoS in 1966 or 1967 accept an Oath of Renunciation from a kid born in Hawaii with an Indonesian father who had moved back to Indonesia to live there indefinitely?

Only the Secretary of State (SoS), representing the Executive Branch of the U.S. (POTUS), can terminate a persons U.S. Citizenship. This is done when the SoS signs a Certificate of Loss of Nationality with an official U.S. State Department Seal is pressed into the document.

An Oath of Renunciation is a request for the SoS to issue a Certificate of Loss of Nationality. Issuing a Certificate of Loss of Nationality is optional. The State Department keeps a policy manual for guidance to ensure everyone is treated the same. But, policies change and there are exceptions to every policy statement.

Several copies of the Certificate of Loss of Nationality are retained and issued to various Executive Branch federal agencies; i.e. State Department, FBI, INS, Secret Service, IRS, etc.

It’s the greatest fraud ever perpetrated on the United States.


1. In July 2007, the Democratic Party sent the American Samoan Congressional Representative to Jakarta, along with about $200,000 in cash, to buy up all government records pertaining to BHO2/Barry Soetoro, and all available Soetoro family photographs.

If BHO2 was a U.S. citizen, there was no need to do this act.

2. When L.Col. Lakin was being tried, his lawyer discovered that Barry Soetoro had an immigration file and requested a copy. The request was denied and the file is now in the possesseion of Janet Napilotano of Homeland Security.

Natural born citizens DO NOT have immigration files!

I would hope this information gets some of your brain cells buzzing; it certainly has mine going!


8 posted on 12/06/2011 1:26:16 AM PST by SatinDoll (NO FOREIGN NATIONALS AS U.S.A. PRESIDENT)
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To: Sonny M

It could be bad grades or ................


9 posted on 12/06/2011 1:28:12 AM PST by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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To: TigersEye

Wow. I just watched all four videos. Have these ever been posted on FR as their own thread?


10 posted on 12/06/2011 1:41:25 AM PST by BagCamAddict (If we let them run Cain out of town, they will do it to EVERY GOP candidate from now on.)
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To: F15Eagle
It could be bad grades or ................

Well, here's my biggest question, at this point, anything he has in those records or files, could be altered or changed, so why hasn't it been done ?

Just to one more step on the hypothetical route, with the birth certificate, why would the POTUS, with access to billions of dollars, access to donors, and people with power, and an entire political party and apparatus, not to mention being in direct charge of the entire US intelligence community, not create the best damn forgery on earth of say a birth certificate ?

If anything, that document should look and be more "real" or realistic, then anything or anyone else's...........Unless, the guy and his minions are honestly that incompetent, something that should never ever be ruled out.

FWIW, I've heard this rumor a long time ago, and have no idea if it is or isn't true, but one is that, years ago, he may have committed financial aid fraud, among other things, which while not exactly totally rare among young students, is also something that could really really tick off a lot of kids today.

11 posted on 12/06/2011 1:41:59 AM PST by Sonny M ("oderint dum metuant")
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To: SatinDoll

Currently section F of the State Dept on renouncing citizenship states that the child can renounce citizenship before 18 if they can convince a US official they are fully aware of what they are doing. It also clearly states their parents cannot renounce for the child. This would probably be arguable for any guardian entity. Now IF he was indeed born on US soil, in Hawaii in 1959 he is a citizen, but admittedly of a foreign father if it was BHO sr. If it was X game over; that is two parents of US. SAD did not meet the age 19 requirement for his foreign birth but if she was divorced or never officially married it doesn+ apply as I understand it (old US Title code now changed). I find his whole birth thing / rearing strange but unless we can prove he renounced at a US embassy on foreign land it just won’t go anywhere. Indonesia I mean. He would not be ‘stateless’ as the US State says if he never renounced. Now he did start this shell game during the battle with Hillary. Something is funky it seems.


12 posted on 12/06/2011 1:56:14 AM PST by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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Comment #13 Removed by Moderator

Comment #14 Removed by Moderator

Comment #15 Removed by Moderator

Comment #16 Removed by Moderator

To: Sonny M

Well according to one of his books, his bc was at grandma’s. He showed up there at the apartment two weeks before and she dies just before the election. Like two days before. Pretty weird.


17 posted on 12/06/2011 2:14:46 AM PST by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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To: SatinDoll

The problem with “Sven”’s SS theory is that Obama’s SSN had already been issued to someone else. That person died in Hawaii, having lived in Connecticut previously.

That a SSN was reused has never happened before, according to the SSA.

The more likely explanation is that Grandma Dunham, with her access to the probate courts in Honolulu as a volunteer worker, lifted the number off of an estate record to give Barry some legitimacy.

That and the Selective Service record signed in 1980 on a 2008 form, along with the layered BC point to a massive fraud being perpetrated on the American people.


18 posted on 12/06/2011 2:23:27 AM PST by exit82 (Democrats are the enemies of freedom. We have ideas-the Dems only have ideology.)
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To: F15Eagle

Way too coincidental.

I would keep the ear and eyes open for whats on the street on the islands for the next month.

See who visits and where they come from, it would also be coincidental I could say if some high ranking members of certain countries also too a vacation, but I would just like to see if anything out of the ordinary occurs in the Governors office, mysterious burglary, suspicious fires etc.

Where barry goes he leaves a black hole of silence.


19 posted on 12/06/2011 2:28:51 AM PST by Eye of Unk
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To: Eye of Unk

Yep I remember when it happened thinking it was pretty dang bizarre - the whole last 1/2 of 2008 was bizarre.


20 posted on 12/06/2011 2:42:31 AM PST by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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To: sneakers

bump to read later


21 posted on 12/06/2011 4:36:02 AM PST by sneakers (EAT YOUR PEAS!)
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To: sneakers

bump to read later


22 posted on 12/06/2011 4:36:16 AM PST by sneakers (EAT YOUR PEAS!)
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To: sneakers

bump to read later


23 posted on 12/06/2011 4:36:20 AM PST by sneakers (EAT YOUR PEAS!)
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To: sneakers

bump to read later


24 posted on 12/06/2011 4:36:23 AM PST by sneakers (EAT YOUR PEAS!)
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To: sneakers

‘ya think?


25 posted on 12/06/2011 4:38:28 AM PST by gortklattu (God knows who is best, everybody else is making guesses - Tony Snow)
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To: F15Eagle
This isn't about citizenship. By now you should know this.

Mere citizenship is NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT enough to become a legitimate president of the United States of America. The Constitution specifically requires NATURAL BORN citizenship!

Sorry, but at this late date, you should know the difference and I suspect your motives for posting.

26 posted on 12/06/2011 5:43:32 AM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: F15Eagle
This isn't about citizenship. By now you should know this.

Mere citizenship is NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT enough to become a legitimate president of the United States of America. The Constitution specifically requires NATURAL BORN citizenship!

Sorry, but at this late date, you should know the difference and I suspect your motives for posting.

27 posted on 12/06/2011 5:44:24 AM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: Sonny M
Well, here's my biggest question, at this point, anything he has in those records or files, could be altered or changed, so why hasn't it been done ?
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

I see several reasons ( from someone who has no experience with this.)

** Too many ( who are still living) have seen the originals and/or created the originals and know the real content.

** There are copies of the originals in too many agencies. Not only would the originals need to be forged but so would all the copies tucked away everywhere else in his life.

** One person likely does not have all the skills needed to produce the high quality forgery. It likely requires a team. And...It would only take one whistle blower ( unwilling to risk his professional reputation and prison time) to cause the whole conspiracy to unravel. Think of the skill need to machine an perfect copy of the typewriter or to find the exact duplicate of the paper. One person likely can't do that.

** Some of the documents are numbered and also entered, in numbered order, into bound and numbered ledgers whose information was in cursive handwriting.

And...I am not an expert. Someone with experience in this area could likely come up with dozens of other reasons.

28 posted on 12/06/2011 6:02:13 AM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: F15Eagle

No sign of the “STOP TALKING ABOUT THIS SUBJECT YOU IDIOTS” trolls yet.


29 posted on 12/06/2011 6:04:32 AM PST by treetopsandroofs (Had FDR been GOP, there would have been no World Wars, just "The Great War" and "Roosevelt's Wars".)
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To: SatinDoll

I wouldn’t rely on SvenMagnussen for your evidence. He says many interesting things, but has never documented any of his claims or provided a third party reference.


30 posted on 12/06/2011 6:24:59 AM PST by Fractal Trader
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To: ASA Vet

Self Ping


31 posted on 12/06/2011 6:25:28 AM PST by ASA Vet (Natural-born citizens, are those born in the country, of parents who are citizens. De Vattel)
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To: wintertime

Well you suspect wrong - by now you should know this but hey, pursue the Indonesian-child-loses-citizenship - good grief


32 posted on 12/06/2011 6:40:57 AM PST by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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To: treetopsandroofs

Lol well a few disappeared - like james777 but others are still here - one or two will show up no doubt


33 posted on 12/06/2011 6:52:17 AM PST by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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To: TigersEye

BUMP FOR LATER!


34 posted on 12/06/2011 6:55:47 AM PST by freebird5850 (Of course Obama loves his country...it's just that Cain loves mine!)
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To: Fractal Trader

He has supplied names or organizations. He told me I could look everything up, just like he did.

I suggest others do so.


35 posted on 12/06/2011 7:04:22 AM PST by SatinDoll (NO FOREIGN NATIONALS AS U.S.A. PRESIDENT)
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To: exit82

When I first started investigation Obama back in March 2008, he had more that one hundred SSNs associated with his name.

The correct question SHOULD BE which Connecticutt SSN? He didn’t start using the one you refer to until the mid-1980s, I believe.


36 posted on 12/06/2011 7:08:14 AM PST by SatinDoll (NO FOREIGN NATIONALS AS U.S.A. PRESIDENT)
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To: F15Eagle
pursue the Indonesian-child-loses-citizenship - good grief
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Again...This issue is NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT about citizenship.

Only a NATURAL BORN citizen can be president.

37 posted on 12/06/2011 7:12:25 AM PST by wintertime (I am a Constitutional Restorationist!!! Yes!)
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To: RobinMasters; All

What ever happened to all that damaging material that combover boy’s team of brilliant investigators was digging up in Hawaii??


38 posted on 12/06/2011 7:21:02 AM PST by Notary Sojac
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To: RobinMasters

Since Obama is the illegitimate son of Malcolm X, he probably IS a Natural Born Citizen. (just a theory in the absence of any provable facts)


39 posted on 12/06/2011 7:22:08 AM PST by A. Patriot (Have we lost our Republic? Do the majority of Americans care?)
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To: wintertime
This issue is NOT NOT NOT NOT NOT about citizenship. Only a NATURAL BORN citizen can be president.

Correct. So the issue is about the definition of a "natural born citizen".

Dead horse? Meet stick.

40 posted on 12/06/2011 7:23:43 AM PST by Notary Sojac
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To: wintertime

OK let’s take it apart - showing why child-citizenship-loss won’t work doesnt affect that - information will save going down that useless path - now if you can get a court to rule Zero ineligible via NBC then more power to you I will applaud - Rubio has a similar problem


41 posted on 12/06/2011 7:26:55 AM PST by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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To: A. Patriot

Unfortunately true. I personally think he looks a whole lot more like X than Sr. It would destroy the myth which might be enough.


42 posted on 12/06/2011 7:39:10 AM PST by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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To: SatinDoll

Whoa. I’d read a lot of the NBC threads before and thought I’d heard everything. My hair is curling after reading this. So many detailed facts. Whoa. This would be the hugest fraud against the American people in history.


43 posted on 12/06/2011 7:39:30 AM PST by Yaelle (I)
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To: F15Eagle
Here are some interesting sites:

http://www.oilforimmigration.org/facts/?page_id=284

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2801934/posts

http://octaman.com/comments/MalcolmO.html

http://www.thecomingattack.com/russian-official-obama-is-a-communist-kgb-agent/

http://terribletruth.wordpress.com/2011/11/02/bari%e2%80%b2-barry-barack/

I don't necessarily endorse or believe the information in these sites, but they do provide interesting food for thought. They are about as provable as Obama’s published nativity story.

44 posted on 12/06/2011 7:49:19 AM PST by A. Patriot (Have we lost our Republic? Do the majority of Americans care?)
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To: A. Patriot

If he was born of X it might would explain the earlier “messiah” statement by Calypso Louie - X assassination and Louie rumor aside - bet that was an interesting bc at granny’s which we will never see - probably destroyed that very week


45 posted on 12/06/2011 7:57:46 AM PST by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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To: F15Eagle

Probably tossed it in the casket before he lit her up.


46 posted on 12/06/2011 8:07:20 AM PST by ROCKLOBSTER ( Celebrate Republicans Freed the Slaves Month.)
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To: SatinDoll

I looked through an entire page of posts. With the exception of a few pictures, nothing was documented with a hyper link or some other form of reference.

Some posts were incredibly detailed and were obvious cut and pastes, but many were not. He has made many provocative, seemingly authoritative statements, but has almost never, within the context of his posts, provided references.

I would like to believe what he says, but anyone can post bold statements with out reference. In addition, I have a fairly broad knowledge of the subject area, and many things that he posts cannot be found in any of the well-known available sources.

Caveat emptor


47 posted on 12/06/2011 8:19:21 AM PST by Fractal Trader
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To: ROCKLOBSTER

Yeah or torn up and flushed down her toilet - funny how he never mentioned it - you’d think he would say ‘here’ but no .......... gotta wait three years for a digital image


48 posted on 12/06/2011 8:20:23 AM PST by F15Eagle (1 John 5:4-5, 4:15, 5:13; John 3:17-18, 6:69, 11:25, 14:6, 20:31; Rom10:8-11; 1 Tim 2:5; Titus 3:4-5)
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To: Fractal Trader

There at one time existed online a radio interview, done in Chicago before BHO2 bcame a US Senator, in which BHO2 said he was born in Kenya. That recording vanished.

Lot’s of things concerning BHO2’s past have disappeared. That doesn’t mean it didn’t exist in the past, and since his time in the White House, we should expect that interference in the existing records, too, has been extensive.


49 posted on 12/06/2011 8:39:55 AM PST by SatinDoll (NO FOREIGN NATIONALS AS U.S.A. PRESIDENT)
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To: F15Eagle
bet that was an interesting bc at granny’s which we will never see - probably destroyed that very week

It was a rather hasty trip "O" took to see his dying grandmother.

50 posted on 12/06/2011 8:55:06 AM PST by A. Patriot (Have we lost our Republic? Do the majority of Americans care?)
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