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62 Year old grandfather on vacation dies in Florida police custody
The Daily Mail ^ | 01/12/2012 | Lee Moran

Posted on 01/14/2012 12:01:24 PM PST by Duke of Qin

A mentally ill grandfather died after police officers strapped him naked to a chair, smothered him with a 'spit hood' and pepper-sprayed him 10 times during a 43-hour ordeal, it has been claimed.

Nick Christie, 62, was allegedly tortured in the 'Devil's Chair' at Lee County jail after being detained by Florida police officers in March 2009 following a 'mental breakdown'.

The hood, designed to stop him from spitting at officers, meant he could not escape the noxious spray's fumes - and he was never allowed to clean the residue from his body.

His family is now suing Lee County Sheriff's Department for 'wrongful death'.

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2085628/Nick-Christie-Mentally-ill-prisoner-strapped-Devils-Chair-pepper-sprayed-death.html#ixzz1jSkweFsk

(Excerpt) Read more at dailymail.co.uk ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Government
KEYWORDS: donutwatch; murder
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To: caveat emptor
The outcome sounds more like Baghdad under Saddam Hussein than the U.S. Or does it?

Baghdad under Saddam Hussein

America under Barack Hussein

A difference in degree, not in kind.

51 posted on 01/14/2012 1:20:25 PM PST by null and void (Day 1088 of America's ObamaVacation from reality [Heroes aren't made, Frank, they're cornered...])
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To: Duke of Qin

Prayers for his family.


52 posted on 01/14/2012 1:26:11 PM PST by Salvation ("With God all things are possible." Matthew 19:26)
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To: LucyT

Comment #6. I have said this a hundred times if I said once. I even did blog post back in 07 I think because the Daily Mail had a wonderful piece on W with pictures of him with many wounded, amputees, and severely burned veterans. Not one story did I ever see in the AMERICAN press on what W did for veterans. In fact is was at Ft Hood right after the shooting and again that was reported in the Daily Mail.

The MSM in this country is EFFING disgusting. I can’t wait for NBC and the alike to go bankrupt!


53 posted on 01/14/2012 1:31:17 PM PST by GregNH (One Pissed Off Natural Born Citizen OPONBC)
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To: SuzyQue; Respond Code Three

Pepper-spray 10 times is clearly crazy.

But the hood and the initial handling and the chair all seem like proper training. I was just interested because I’ve watched that “Jail” show on TV and I’m surprised at how anything happens right. It’s a hard job.

Lockdown - County Jail (1/5)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O8k_BR_KDe0


54 posted on 01/14/2012 1:38:48 PM PST by donna (This is what happens when America is no longer a Christian nation.)
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To: Duke of Qin

“Tell the truth, warts and all” —the job of the press. BUT NOW, when you want to hear the REAL USA news, you must read a BRITISH newspaper.

Is it any wonder that the really huge scandals in the USA are now broken by former gift-shop clerks & high-school kids...?

When Abu Graib broke, the NYT carried it on page 1 above the fold for THIRTY-TWO CONSECUTIVE DAYS. For how long will we hear of Piss Gate?

HA.

When we get consistent coverage of the real news we will have TWO COMPLETELY SEPERATE MEDIA SYTEMS.


55 posted on 01/14/2012 1:41:39 PM PST by gaijin
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To: Peter from Rutland

I’ll toss in at least one Missouri State Reserve Trooper that is out of control in his civilian job. I never want to run into him with his tin star and sidearm with his temper and lack of judgement. I used to work for the nut for a short while.


56 posted on 01/14/2012 1:55:00 PM PST by wally_bert (It's sheer elegance in its simplicity! - The Middleman)
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To: Jeff Chandler

“You switched forces in mid story.”

I forgot not everyone lives in So Cal and doesn’t know that one of the Orange County cops was ex-LAPD.

When you’re a bad enough cop to actually get fired from the LAPD, you can go peddle your third-string services to any smaller city police force, such as Fullerton (the city in Orange County).

The cop in question was actually let go from the LAPD with a huge disability pension, almost a hundred percent of his salary, because of an injury. The thinking was he couldn’t be a cop anymore. Then he turns around and goes to work — as a patrol cop — for Fullerton.

So he’s a crook as well as a murderer.

Yay LAPD!


57 posted on 01/14/2012 2:07:24 PM PST by Blue Ink
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To: Jeff Chandler
This sounds like one of the syllogisms in the Law School Admissions Test. The answer would be, Unh-uhn.
58 posted on 01/14/2012 2:13:23 PM PST by righttackle44 (I may not be much, but I raised a United States Marine)
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To: LucyT; dsc
I support good cops and proper, constitutional procedures. I don’t ask that cops take unnecessary risks. However, this appears to be completely over the top.

Well-stated, dsc. Thanks for the ping, LucyT.

Condolences to Nick Christie's family and friends.

59 posted on 01/14/2012 2:15:04 PM PST by PGalt
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To: donna
Generalizing again, the hood is only supposed to be a temporary device. In my case, it would have been used while I was transporting someone to the jail. It would have been removed at the jail. Pepper spray is used to overcome resistance in order to get someone into custody. If someone is in custody, and restrained in a chair, further use of pepper spray is uncalled for, and is a definitely not to be used if a person is wearing a spit hood. In all cases of pepper spray or tear gas, we were trained to immediately wash the eyes out out with clean water. If we were outside, we faced the person into the wind after washing the eyes out. All of us had been exposed to tear gas and pepper spray during training, so all us knew what it was felt like when we used it. And if we delivered someone to the jail who had been tear gassed or pepper sprayed, we were required to notify the jail nurse.

A person who is combative can be strapped to a chair to prevent further assaults on detention personnel, and to try to prevent the person from hurting himself. Medical or detention personnel should remove the spit hood if they leave the room and the person is unattended.

I can't emphasize the word "generalize" enough though. The underlying issue in this case is the problem of mental illness. As it is, there is no definitive law enforcement solution to a person who keeps committing crimes, other than incarceration. And if the person has a mental health problem, the closest to solving the problem with that particular individual is the get him some mental health care. And even then, there is no guarantee that at some point he will not commit additional crimes, or harm himself or others.

In the case we are posting about, law enforcement personnel had the ample opportunity to make reasonable decisions, and it appears that some of them failed miserably.

60 posted on 01/14/2012 2:23:35 PM PST by Respond Code Three (Support Free Republic lest we eventually get a Republic which is not free.)
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To: A_perfect_lady

>>It’s always Florida.

Of course its always Florida - that’s where corrupt cops move after they get kicked off their own force.


61 posted on 01/14/2012 2:25:12 PM PST by qwerty1234
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To: Blue Ink
one of the Orange County cops was ex-LAPD.

You are right. I did not know that. I was born and raised in So Cal but escaped in '81.

62 posted on 01/14/2012 2:25:31 PM PST by Jeff Chandler (Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati)
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To: qwerty1234
Florida - that’s where corrupt cops move after they get kicked off their own force.

In Elmore Leonard novels, they move there from Detroit.

63 posted on 01/14/2012 2:27:40 PM PST by Jeff Chandler (Quando Omni Flunkus Moritati)
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To: bamahead

Ping to your list


64 posted on 01/14/2012 2:30:18 PM PST by TheConservativeParty ( Everytime a democrat loses, a Moonbat gets its wings burned off.)
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To: Respond Code Three
If a homeowner shoots and kills an intruder, the Coroner will rule it as a homicide, even if it justifiable. Almost everyday, citizens or sworn officers are shooting and killing someone who is committing a felony. In each case, the Coroner will rule it as a homicide.

The fact is when a ruling of homicide is given that means somebody killed the victim, whether it was justified or not, natural deaths are not ruled homicides. Since this could hardly be called justifiable homicide(or are you saying these cops were in the right to kill this old man?)then it must be murder or man slaughter at the very least

65 posted on 01/14/2012 2:32:43 PM PST by calex59
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To: savagesusie
Just damn....are you posting on the wrong thread, or just forget your meds this morning?

Leon Panetta, God, Marxists, Tebow, Sandusky.....what do ANY of them have to do with this thread?

Replies like yours paint other believers with a broad brush.

66 posted on 01/14/2012 2:33:36 PM PST by diogenes ghost
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To: Jeff Chandler

Fairy-tale land cop humor:

http://youtu.be/HT3QYb7AN6k - Stan Freberg - “St George And The Dragnet”


67 posted on 01/14/2012 2:37:00 PM PST by wally_bert (It's sheer elegance in its simplicity! - The Middleman)
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To: org.whodat
Fla. has the FDLE you can be sure they will be all over this one.

They are a well respected agency often working side by side with the feds.A case like this is right up their alley.

68 posted on 01/14/2012 2:37:00 PM PST by rodguy911 (FreeRepublic:Land of the Free because of the Brave--Sarah Palin 2012)
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To: A_perfect_lady

It’s always Florida.

Lots of old naked people.


69 posted on 01/14/2012 2:37:52 PM PST by bikerman (you can take the man out of the jungle but can't take the jungle out of the man)
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To: JustaDumbBlonde
Police are no different than any other group on the face of the earth. There are bad ones amongst them.

Yeah, it's a shame that the 95% of LEOs who are corrupt, brainless, power-hungry thugs make the other 5% look bad.

70 posted on 01/14/2012 2:40:55 PM PST by Yashcheritsiy
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To: JustaDumbBlonde

“Police are no different than any other group on the face of the earth. There are bad ones amongst them.”

Well, let us know when the good cops come out against this murdering of a prisoner.


71 posted on 01/14/2012 3:00:33 PM PST by CodeToad (Islam needs to be banned in the US and treated as a criminal enterprise.)
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To: Duke of Qin
police officers strapped him naked to a chair, smothered him with a 'spit hood' and pepper-sprayed him 10 times during a 43-hour ordeal, it has been claimed.

Replace Police Officers with MARINES and there would be outrage and the whole
department would be arrested and under investigation.
The would call it the "Florida 25" in the media.

72 posted on 01/14/2012 3:06:28 PM PST by MaxMax
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To: All

Question. Was this man pepper sprayed while restrained in the chair? With the spit hood still covering his head? If so, why? He was already unable to hurt himself or staff. Evil. Obviously, the justice system in this town is too entrenched to work. As much as I despise Holder’s DOJ, the feds need to step into this mess.


73 posted on 01/14/2012 3:10:32 PM PST by redreno (Americans don't go Gault. Americans go Postal.)
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To: savagesusie
WTF? How does that rambling diatribe have anything to do withthe thread?
74 posted on 01/14/2012 3:11:31 PM PST by starlifter (Pullum sapit)
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To: Respond Code Three
The underlying issue in this case is the problem of mental illness.

Which can look the same as a meth user!

75 posted on 01/14/2012 3:17:47 PM PST by donna (This is what happens when America is no longer a Christian nation.)
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To: rodguy911
Fla. has the FDLE you can be sure they will be all over this one.

They are a well respected agency often working side by side with the feds.A case like this is right up their alley.

Happened in March 2009. What's keeping them?

76 posted on 01/14/2012 3:24:17 PM PST by Ken H (Austerity is the irresistible force. Entitlements are the immovable object.)
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To: Duke of Qin

This poor guy was sent to Florida on vacation by his wife, while he’s there she calls the cops and has him picked up for acting depressed, he ends up in custody probalby pissed off as hell and dies in the process. Why isn’t the wife being prosecuted for her involvement? I bet the cops killed him hoping they would get a crack at that bitch too!


77 posted on 01/14/2012 3:43:47 PM PST by tupac
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To: Duke of Qin

Can’t a family member initiate a citizen’s arrest?


78 posted on 01/14/2012 3:50:47 PM PST by Bon mots ("When seconds count, the police are just minutes away...")
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To: Yashcheritsiy

You forgot little dick ‘roided up obama voters on your list.


79 posted on 01/14/2012 3:58:54 PM PST by bobby.223
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To: GregNH

Check the local papers maybe they carried it. Oh yeah, it happened a couple of years ago. There is a local FOX TV station that did a recent story and is embedded in the Brit papers’ piece.


80 posted on 01/14/2012 4:07:00 PM PST by tupac
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To: Yashcheritsiy

Maybe the sheriff hired former marines? I dunno, did they pee on him too?


81 posted on 01/14/2012 4:08:39 PM PST by tupac
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To: org.whodat
Seems to be murder by cop but as always the DA protects the law breakers. Local DA should never be allowed to investigate local cops. Investigation of cops should be out of the governors and state attorneys office.

Of another state, where all of the above are members of a different political party.

82 posted on 01/14/2012 4:10:04 PM PST by elkfersupper ( Member of the Original Defiant Class)
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To: paul51
Hopefully the feds will step in and arrest some of these goons for murder.

Okay, now I'm laughing. What makes you think the feds are any better humans?

83 posted on 01/14/2012 4:12:23 PM PST by elkfersupper ( Member of the Original Defiant Class)
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To: Lazamataz
” Why the hell do we need to go to the British press to get any news any more ?’

Because Las, Our P/C commie oriented Media is afraid to offend Anyone and is busy serving themselves and their master in the white Hut!

84 posted on 01/14/2012 4:33:34 PM PST by mongo141
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To: Lazamataz
” Why the hell do we need to go to the British press to get any news any more ?’

Because Las, Our P/C commie oriented Media is afraid to offend Anyone and is busy serving themselves and their master in the white Hut!

85 posted on 01/14/2012 4:33:58 PM PST by mongo141
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To: Duke of Qin

They must think highly of us in the foreign press that they publish this stuff and our press not even a peep..


86 posted on 01/14/2012 4:40:43 PM PST by Cacique (quos Deus vult perdere, prius dementat ( Islamia Delenda Est ))
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To: paul51

The coroner didn’t make a determination of murder, but of homicide.


87 posted on 01/14/2012 4:40:55 PM PST by Scotsman will be Free (11C - Indirect fire, infantry - High angle hell - We will bring you, FIRE)
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To: Duke of Qin
A mentally ill grandfather died after police officers strapped him naked to a chair, smothered him with a 'spit hood' and pepper-sprayed him 10 times during a 43-hour ordeal, it has been claimed.

But water boarding a head-chopping terrorist is "torture."
We should do the above to the majority of our politicians.

88 posted on 01/14/2012 4:59:37 PM PST by TigersEye (Life is about choices. Your choices. Make good ones.)
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To: bamahead; rabscuttle385; Impy; fieldmarshaldj; GOPsterinMA; JulieRNR21

I support the police, but not police misconduct.


89 posted on 01/14/2012 5:35:08 PM PST by Clintonfatigued (Illegal aliens collect welfare checks that Americans won't collect)
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To: vette6387
"The “officers” involved in this killing need to be charged with this man’s murder, prosecuted, found guilty and sent to jail for a very long time."

43 hours of torture in a special chair? How much more aggravated and premeditated can murder get?

Death.

90 posted on 01/14/2012 6:44:11 PM PST by TXnMA ("Allah": Satan's current alias...)
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To: rodguy911
They are a well respected agency often working side by side with the feds.A case like this is right up their alley.

Right up until Eric (race card) Holder, I would agree with you.

91 posted on 01/14/2012 7:21:11 PM PST by BerryDingle (I know how to deal with communists, I still wear their scars on my back from Hollywood-Ronald Reagan)
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To: donna
"Which can look the same as a meth user!"

Maybe, but I don't see anything that suggested that even the police suspected him of using meth.

92 posted on 01/14/2012 7:21:25 PM PST by Respond Code Three (Support Free Republic lest we eventually get a Republic which is not free.)
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To: DJ MacWoW

Beautiful animals.


93 posted on 01/14/2012 7:35:27 PM PST by Mears (Alcohol. Tobacco. Firearms. What's not to like?)
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To: calex59
"The fact is when a ruling of homicide is given that means somebody killed the victim, whether it was justified or not, natural deaths are not ruled homicides. Since this could hardly be called justifiable homicide(or are you saying these cops were in the right to kill this old man?)then it must be murder or man slaughter at the very least"

Homicide is a ruling the Coroner makes when a person dies at the hands of another person. In this case, the Coroner ruled that the man died at the hands of the police. I support the Coroner's opinion.

There is nothing in the article, nor in my posts, that suggests that this incident is a justifiable homicide. Justifiable homicide would be the ruling by the local DA if the police showed that they were in fear of great bodily harm or death. Nothing in the article, nor in my posts, suggests that the police were in fear of great bodily harm or death.

For a charge of murder of manslaughter to be brought, the local DA, the State DA, or the Federal DOJ would have to file the charges. Since there is no statute of limitations on murder, charges can be filed years from now. I don't know the statute of limitations in Florida for manslaughter, but I suspect that this case is still within the statutory time limit for such a charge to be filed.

94 posted on 01/14/2012 7:38:21 PM PST by Respond Code Three (Support Free Republic lest we eventually get a Republic which is not free.)
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To: Respond Code Three
I just meant that it must be difficult to identify mental illness versus any drug use. It can look the same.
95 posted on 01/14/2012 11:58:33 PM PST by donna (This is what happens when America is no longer a Christian nation.)
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To: JustaDumbBlonde

Thanks. I thought I was the only one here who defended Good Police officers.
Good to see I am not alone.


96 posted on 01/15/2012 1:01:28 AM PST by Yorlik803 (better to die on your feet than live on your knees.)
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To: Clintonfatigued; GOPsterinMA

(Bleep)ing shameful.


97 posted on 01/15/2012 1:39:51 AM PST by Impy (Don't call me red.)
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To: Lazamataz

Nobody does it better?


98 posted on 01/15/2012 1:43:30 AM PST by Impy (Don't call me red.)
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To: Yorlik803

I defend good police officers. A lot of them that I worked with have passed on now, and I remember them when they were younger. Some were my supervisors, some were my co-workers. Good men and women.


99 posted on 01/15/2012 1:47:04 AM PST by Respond Code Three (Support Free Republic lest we eventually get a Republic which is not free.)
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To: donna
Yes, it can look the same. A meth user who hasn't slept for a few days can be psychotic, and very dangerous.

If a DRE is available and if a suspected mental patient can be examined, the DRE can check for signs of drug use, and even if the person has mental problems, a DRE can determine if the person is under the influence of drugs like meth, coke, PCP, marijuana, LSD, certain inhalants, and opiates like heroin. (DRE = Drug Recognition Expert) If a DRE were to examine a person and found no signs of drug abuse, but the person is still exhibiting bizarre behavior, the best course of action is to take the person to a hospital and have the mental health personnel examine him. Naturally, not all officers are DREs, and not agencies have them anyway. IMO, police departments should have as many of them as they can get the training for.

100 posted on 01/15/2012 1:54:46 AM PST by Respond Code Three (Support Free Republic lest we eventually get a Republic which is not free.)
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