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Inside the real Birdsong tunnels: Never-before-seen images of the mines dug by British
Mail Online (UK) ^ | January 27, 2012 | Charles Walford

Posted on 01/27/2012 11:39:41 PM PST by Neil E. Wright

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To: Owl558

“You asked earlier if the Confedracy would have fought another Civil War in 1881. Are you kidding? Yeah they would have fought - bravely; because it was their own damn country.”

Well they’re 130 years late; why haven’t they attacked the federal forts again?

France had no means or will to fight; they knew the sacrifice of the “Great War” had been for nothing (even being attacked by their allies of that previous war - Italy & Japan), and they rightly figured this would be as meaningless (the subsequent Cold War validated that).


51 posted on 01/28/2012 3:51:30 PM PST by kearnyirish2
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To: kearnyirish2

“France had no means or will to fight...”

Yes, i think everyone agrees that France had no will to fight. This is an assertion not in dispute.

What is less clear is support for your assertion that the French surrender prevented a Soviet-style takeover of France like happened in Eastern Europe, and how that ties into Vichy resistance during the African landings.

But thank you for answering. I learned all I need to know in the exchange.


52 posted on 01/29/2012 12:08:10 PM PST by Owl558 ("Those who remember George Satayana are doomed to repeat him")
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To: Owl558

“What is less clear is support for your assertion that the French surrender prevented a Soviet-style takeover of France like happened in Eastern Europe, and how that ties into Vichy resistance during the African landings.”

Western Europe was given a preview of what Stalinism represented during the Spanish Civil War (1936-1939); our Popes are still canonizing martyrs among the 7,000 priests (including 12 bishops) that were executed in that short time. Life in the Communist zone had all the hallmarks of what Stalin represented: commissars, political executions, class warfare, starvation. The war ended when the “fascists” (the Spanish Army), with support from Hitler & Mussolini, beat the Communists (supported by Stalin). Months after that war ended, the French were supposed to believe that when Germany & the Soviet Union invaded Poland (yes, the Soviet Union invaded from the east - that is when the Polish officer corps was executed in the Katyn Forest), that they should fight Germany? For unexplained reasons, the heroic allies coming to the defense of Poland failed to declare war against the Soviet Union - an irony not lost on Europeans to this day; the allies also stood by while the Soviet Union invaded the countries of Latvia, Lithuania, and Estonia - and purged them of enemies as well.

Once the US was allied with the Soviet Union, there was no reason for the French in North Africa to treat them with anything but suspicion.


53 posted on 01/29/2012 2:27:47 PM PST by kearnyirish2
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To: Winniesboy
regarding the Italians read about the Alpine Front in WWI
Italy bled & bled & bled until their army just collapsed.
The Italians showed that brave men led by idiots die by the thousands. As if it needed to be demomstrated!
54 posted on 01/29/2012 2:44:56 PM PST by Reily
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To: Reily
Indeed. It tends to be forgotten that what finally broke the Italians was the twelfth battle of Caporetto or the Isonzo. In battles nos. 1 - 11 they fought bravely in conditions every bit as terrible as the Western Front (including losing an entire batallion when it froze to death). Even in battle no 12 it was only the unexpected reinforcement of the Austrians by German divisions, who launched a surprise attack in an early version of blitzkrieg, which broke the stalemate.
55 posted on 01/30/2012 1:33:51 AM PST by Winniesboy
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To: Trailerpark Badass

Cu Chi is the reason I wondered. I watched guys go down in those damned things and wondered if anyone ever lauded them. I was small, but not small enough to go very far in those things. We actually built the base on top of those tunnels.


56 posted on 01/30/2012 2:57:24 AM PST by Safetgiver (I'd rather die under a free American sky than live under a Socialist regime.)
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