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Mark Steyn: Sorry, Newt. Only the debt ceiling will reach the moon
OC Register ^ | 29 Jan 2012 | Mark Steyn

Posted on 01/29/2012 9:05:14 AM PST by Rummyfan

Had I been asked to deliver the State of the Union address, it would not have delayed your dinner plans:

"The State of our Union is broke, heading for bankrupt, and total collapse shortly thereafter. Thank you and goodnight! You've been a terrific crowd!"

I gather that Americans prefer something a little more upbeat, so one would not begrudge a speechwriter fluffing it up by holding out at least the possibility of some change of fortune, however remote. Instead, President Obama assured us at great length that nothing is going to change, not now, not never. Indeed the Union's state – its unprecedented world-record brokeness – was not even mentioned.

(Excerpt) Read more at ocregister.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: marksteyn; steyn
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1 posted on 01/29/2012 9:05:17 AM PST by Rummyfan
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To: Rummyfan

I like the idea of a moon base, I think Newt went too grandiose by saying a 13,000 citizen colony, and the 51st state.

In the long run Newt will be correct.


2 posted on 01/29/2012 9:07:49 AM PST by Williams (Honey Badger Don't Care)
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To: Rummyfan
A moon base is an exciting idea. Someone should write a movie about it. But we are broke. The grand idea that we need to focus on is paying off our debt.

I keep thinking about this like a family around the table. Imagine if dad is laid off, the credit cards are maxed out, the family is almost out of savings and is having a hard time paying the mortgage. The rich uncle is tired of loaning them money. And then dad comes home one day and tells the family he has booked a vacation for Disneyland. That is what a moon base is.

3 posted on 01/29/2012 9:10:29 AM PST by Opinionated Blowhard ("When the people find they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the republic.")
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To: Rummyfan

Steyn must have been under pressure to fill space before a deadline because he’s smart enough to realize that Newt is talking about reducing, not increasing, the role of government in the space program, and in using incentives, prizes, etc (which have little if any impact on the debt) to encourage private investment.

All you have to do is look at the 1960s and all the spin-offs ranging from teflon to solar cells to personal computers to realize the leverage this had on the national economy.

Private. Not Public.


4 posted on 01/29/2012 9:12:23 AM PST by bigbob
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To: Rummyfan

Mark Styne is a wet blanket, doom saying, douche bag. I don’t listen to Rush when he fills in anymore.


5 posted on 01/29/2012 9:12:41 AM PST by Artcore
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To: Rummyfan

I like Mark Steyn and think he does an excellent job filling in for Rush. But that doesn’t mean he’s always right.


6 posted on 01/29/2012 9:13:09 AM PST by ILS21R (Never give up.)
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To: Artcore

Styne = Steyn


7 posted on 01/29/2012 9:13:54 AM PST by Artcore
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To: Williams

at least Newt is still talking about Space, Obama killed the STS program for the Chevy Volt..


8 posted on 01/29/2012 9:15:06 AM PST by cardinal4 (Bolton/Arpaio 2012 "Kick the UN across the border!")
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To: Rummyfan
Fine Mark Steyn...yet another full of crap not really conservative jackass who is telling us he at this point prefers a man with a track record of supporting abortion, homosexual agenda, higher taxes, his own version of govt healthcare long before the Feds tried it and strict gun control

over his only real challenger who although imperfect and a few missteps has a history of conservatism and a lifetime ACU score just 2 points behind Jesse Helms...and several AHEAD of Rick Santorum

Just two years ago sir you were in an uproar over govt healthcare and now you and the rest of the Chablis and Brie GOP have handpicked a man who was the first ever to do that exact thing in Massachusetts as our man to replace Obama.

Are you effing crazy you jackass?

like they say down here...you talk all fancy and say nothing...nothing anyone can believe

9 posted on 01/29/2012 9:15:41 AM PST by wardaddy (I am a social conservative. My political party left me(again). They can go to hell in a bucket.)
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To: Rummyfan

Clever viciousness seems to be running rampant lately.


10 posted on 01/29/2012 9:19:07 AM PST by sheikdetailfeather (Click "UNDO" on OBAMA! VOTE NEWT!)
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To: Artcore

he is, after all, an “undocumented anchorman” ;-)

I can only take about 20 minutes of him. Clever only gets you so far...


11 posted on 01/29/2012 9:20:32 AM PST by bigbob
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To: Rummyfan

As usual, the only time leftist freaks care about the debt is when Republicans are in the equation.


12 posted on 01/29/2012 9:20:54 AM PST by treetopsandroofs (Had FDR been GOP, there would have been no World Wars, just "The Great War" and "Roosevelt's Wars".)
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To: Rummyfan

NASA, illegal immigration, ethanol—there’s no state-by-state or corporate-by-corporate interest that Newt won’t pander to:

http://newhampshireprimary.blogspot.com/2011/12/newt-gingrich-talks-ethanol-in-hiawatha.html

And I don’t think our other three candidates are any better.


13 posted on 01/29/2012 9:24:30 AM PST by 9YearLurker
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To: ILS21R
I like Mark Steyn and think he does an excellent job filling in for Rush. But that doesn’t mean he’s always right.

You mean you can disagree with him and not hate him? What a novel idea. Why, I bet we could apply that principle to other witty, interesting pundits who occasionally depart from the hymnal like, oh, I don't know, Krauthammer and Will.

Nah, what could I be thinking?

14 posted on 01/29/2012 9:24:43 AM PST by BfloGuy (The final outcome of the credit expansion is general impoverishment.)
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To: Rummyfan

I got some choice words for Steyn...

You dear friend who talk so well,
You can go to Hartford, Hereford and Hampshire.

Here it is in a form he will appreciate.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t3mC4485Ue0


15 posted on 01/29/2012 9:26:59 AM PST by Lady Lucky (A tea party in name only is worse than no tea party at all.)
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To: Rummyfan

Newt`s moon base.. hopefully that`ll be his obligatory Gaffe of the Week.

What say we tackle issues in America, Newt?? They`re a bit more pressing than moon bases.


16 posted on 01/29/2012 9:28:09 AM PST by ScottinVA (Liberal logic: 0bamacare mandate is acceptable... but voter IDs are unconstitutional.Oh, let me gues)
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To: Rummyfan

Grandiose talk by Gingrich, but the US manned space program is gone and it will never come back. Future manned space exploration is for China and Russia, not the US. And if Romney is elected, he will bury our unmanned program, also.


17 posted on 01/29/2012 9:28:38 AM PST by chessplayer
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To: BfloGuy

Amen to that.


18 posted on 01/29/2012 9:30:53 AM PST by ScottinVA (Liberal logic: 0bamacare mandate is acceptable... but voter IDs are unconstitutional.Oh, let me gues)
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To: Rummyfan

A moon base is symbolic of US or A’s can do spirit.
30 years ago if you said personal computers will be a intrical part of life in a large part of world most would have said, “yeah sure” and then likely rolled their eyes.

In contrast Obama’s visions of government controlled socialist america yeilded us the Chevy Volt and about a dozen or so Solyndras, not to mention trillions of dollars of additional debt, with nothing to show for it.
What is Obama’s vision for America nearly four years later. He wants every one, regardless of whether they make an effort, to have a “fair share” of OPM.


19 posted on 01/29/2012 9:34:08 AM PST by Leep (It's gonna be a Newt day!)
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To: Opinionated Blowhard
A moon base is an exciting idea.

Actually, it is, especially now that Obama has killed it off (seemingly). What we took for granted really has given us much in the way of collateral knowledge/technology. Newt's reiterating the dream of it (so why not dream big?) and the practicality of it (useful tech).

There's just something wrong about turning away from innovation. We may be "broke" but American brio has never paused for a balanced book. No big dreamer or achiever can afford to think in such limited terms. Risk is required.

That said, hunkering down to get our house in order is a worthy adventure in its own right. No need for all the sad-sack baloney we see everywhere. I appreciate Newt's story about George Washington and his troops' secret password: Victory or Death! We need to embrace that courageous attitude, it does not befit heirs of the Founders to whine and moan and wring hands (especially since we've had it so good for so long).

20 posted on 01/29/2012 9:34:39 AM PST by avenir (I'm pessimistic about man, but I'm optimistic about GOD!)
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What a sad and weak people Americans have degenerated into to be against a vision of pioneering space.

Maybe they’ll wake up when there’s a Chinese Communist Party logo emblazoned across the lunar surface.


21 posted on 01/29/2012 9:35:40 AM PST by Utmost Certainty (Our Enemy, the State | Gingrich 2012)
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To: bigbob

He laughs at his own jokes. Thinks they are hilarious. Same reason the incessant chuckling of Dennis Miller and his sycophant make his show hard to listen to.


22 posted on 01/29/2012 9:38:14 AM PST by TheLawyerFormerlyKnownAsAl
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To: Rummyfan

While I would love to have a moon base, I think Gingrich should detail how it would be paid for, given our current financial mess. What would he cut to support this spending?


23 posted on 01/29/2012 9:43:03 AM PST by Vince Ferrer
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To: Rummyfan

While I would love to have a moon base, I think Gingrich should detail how it would be paid for, given our current financial mess. What would he cut to support this spending?


24 posted on 01/29/2012 9:43:06 AM PST by Vince Ferrer
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To: avenir

This is usually what happens before a civilization dies. It turns inward in an appeal to address its internal problems, dismissing innovation, exploration, and expansion. And then the civilization simply disappears into irrelevance.


25 posted on 01/29/2012 9:46:27 AM PST by Utmost Certainty (Our Enemy, the State | Gingrich 2012)
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To: Williams; KevinDavis

Once we have spending under control and are reducing the debt to a manageable level and we aren’t electing leftists maybe we could actually do that.


26 posted on 01/29/2012 9:46:27 AM PST by GeronL (The Right to Life came before the Right to Pursue Happiness)
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To: chessplayer

Newt needs to stop proposing new federal spending programs


27 posted on 01/29/2012 9:50:50 AM PST by GeronL (The Right to Life came before the Right to Pursue Happiness)
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To: GeronL

Except that won’t ever happen if there’s no bold and creative vision to go forward on. The US will simply commit slow suicide, mired in stasis and stagnation.

People like you are the reason civilizations die.


28 posted on 01/29/2012 9:53:00 AM PST by Utmost Certainty (Our Enemy, the State | Gingrich 2012)
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To: Opinionated Blowhard
A moon base is an exciting idea. Someone should write a movie about it.

Will a TV series do? Remember Space: 1999? In that series, the Moon venture was used to make the Moon a high-tech Yucca Mountain, a place to put all the radioactive trash, to make the whole effort worthwhile. With unforeseen consequences and catastrophic results, both Moon-side and Earth-side.

If you really want to make a movie, there are several stories, from the Cold War years, describing a joint venture of multiple nations building and occupying such colonies. In the vast majority of the stories it wasn't one country in the venture, but a consortium. In 2001: A Space Odyssey the space station was multi-country, although in the same structure, and the Moon colonies were separate but dependent on each other.

Even in the Star Trek universe, the moon settlement was not the efforts of a single country, or continent.

My candidate: Heinlein's The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress. The story of the exploitation of the Moon's resources for the benefit of the Lunar Authority, a bureaucracy of the successor to the United Nations, makes for an interesting cause of a revolution.

29 posted on 01/29/2012 10:00:06 AM PST by asinclair (Think outside of the airlock)
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To: Utmost Certainty

If we’d invested in the Moon instead of that worthless space station we could have had a colony there. Use guided craft to drop prefab sections (just like the station) and put a crew there to put the most important pieces together and then stay there till the next ship arrives.


30 posted on 01/29/2012 10:02:26 AM PST by Mmogamer (I refudiate the lamestream media, leftists and their prevaricutions.)
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To: Utmost Certainty

Right. I am totally in favor of going farther, it’s just that this country is bankrupt and the politicians refuse to do anything about it.


31 posted on 01/29/2012 10:07:14 AM PST by GeronL (The Right to Life came before the Right to Pursue Happiness)
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To: bigbob
spin-offs ranging from teflon to solar cells to personal computers

Are you kidding? Teflon:

It is commonly believed that Teflon, like velcro, is a spin-off product from the NASA space projects. However, that is not so, even though both products have been used by NASA. (A href=http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polytetrafluoroethylene>Source)
Don't like Wikipedia? Try:
Tang, Teflon, and Velcro, are not spinoffs of the Space Program. General Foods developed Tang in 1957, and it has been on supermarket shelves since 1959. In 1962, when astronaut John Glenn performed eating experiments in orbit, Tang was selected for the menu, launching the powdered drink’s heightened public awareness. NASA also raised the celebrity status of Teflon, a material invented for DuPont in 1938, when the Agency applied it to heat shields, space suits, and cargo hold liners. Velcro was used during the Apollo missions to anchor equipment for astronauts’ convenience in zero gravity situations. Although it is a Swiss invention from the 1940s, it has since been associated with the Space Program. (Source)
Solar cells were first developed in 1954 by Bell Labs. They have been used in the space program since before NASA exisited. But saying they are a spin-off from the space program is a bit like saying that airplanes are a spin-off from NASA because NASA uses airplanes too. There is a NASA web page that explains how solar cells work. Their claim there is that: "Through the space programs, the [solar cell] technology advanced."

As for personal computers, the claim that NASA had anything to do with them is a bit like suggesting that they developed electricity. Intel developed the first microprocessor (4004) , and that development had nothing to do with the space program. It was developed for a small electronic calculators. The first microprocessor I programmed was an Intel 8080. At that time the company I was working for also had some project going on for the Shuttle program. That project used a minicomputer. Intel kept improving their micros and none of those improvements had anything to do with government contracts so far as I know. IBM developed the PC using an Intel 8088 for the hobbyist market. It was a sort of afterthought for them then. If you look at the Wiki page for Personal Computers, you will see that NASA isn't even mentioned.

ML/NJ

32 posted on 01/29/2012 10:07:14 AM PST by ml/nj
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To: ml/nj

big BUMP


33 posted on 01/29/2012 10:13:40 AM PST by GeronL (The Right to Life came before the Right to Pursue Happiness)
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To: asinclair
My candidate: Heinlein's The Moon Is A Harsh Mistress. The story of the exploitation of the Moon's resources for the benefit of the Lunar Authority, a bureaucracy of the successor to the United Nations, makes for an interesting cause of a revolution.

And the beauty part of the story was that the economic motivation for going to the moon was to use it as a penal colony with slave labor to exploit the resource. Heinlein realized that any real colonization requires an economic rational.

Newt's moon base to harvest He3 only makes sense if you have a working fusion technology (only 20 years away, always).

But there are plenty of worrisome rocks in Near Earth Orbit. Apophis is scheduled to make a very close pass in some 26 odd years. It would be nice if we could nudge it out of the way if need be.

34 posted on 01/29/2012 10:16:54 AM PST by Mycroft Holmes (Returned for regrooving...)
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To: Utmost Certainty
This is usually what happens before a civilization dies. It turns inward in an appeal to address its internal problems, dismissing innovation, exploration, and expansion. And then the civilization simply disappears into irrelevance.

Exactly right. This is why Newt's idea isn't crazy or grandiose, it's exactly the right medicine for an ailing nation. If everyone thought space exploration was more important than frakking welfare for moochers, the nanny state would be history and we would be the first starfaring nation.

35 posted on 01/29/2012 10:18:47 AM PST by Valpal1
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To: ScottinVA

This is the kind of rhetoric that is so worrying with Newt. he just can’t control himself. obama will eat him in the Fall if he gets the chance. After the last 2 debates we geet to see how short the ‘Great Debater” Newt falls when he’s on the defensive all night. Not a pretty sight.


36 posted on 01/29/2012 10:31:50 AM PST by pgkdan (Rick Santorum 2012. Conservative's last, best chance!)
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To: Valpal1

Sarah Palin discussed this very subject last night:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U5Es4YJ8W1U


37 posted on 01/29/2012 10:31:50 AM PST by sheikdetailfeather (Click "UNDO" on OBAMA! VOTE NEWT!)
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To: BfloGuy
You mean you can disagree with him and not hate him?
38 posted on 01/29/2012 10:33:29 AM PST by pgkdan (Rick Santorum 2012. Conservative's last, best chance!)
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To: ILS21R

I generally agree with Mark Steyn but the Newt bashing is getting to be a little much.


39 posted on 01/29/2012 10:36:16 AM PST by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: Rummyfan

I don’t like the idea of spending billions on a moon base, but in this case it very really may be an important national security issue. China has already made it quite clear they plan to send a man to the moon in the next few years and establish a base on the moon. What happens if the Chinese set up a base, say “sorry folks, we are withdrawing from all those silly space treaties and by the way the entire moon is now Chinese territory.” What could we do about it? Very little it would seem... China would control the ultimate “high ground”.


40 posted on 01/29/2012 10:50:45 AM PST by apillar
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To: Rummyfan

I don’t like the idea of spending billions on a moon base, but in this case it very really may be an important national security issue. China has already made it quite clear they plan to send a man to the moon in the next few years and establish a base on the moon. What happens if the Chinese set up a base, say “sorry folks, we are withdrawing from all those silly space treaties and by the way the entire moon is now Chinese territory.” What could we do about it? Very little it would seem... China would control the ultimate “high ground”.


41 posted on 01/29/2012 10:50:45 AM PST by apillar
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To: Opinionated Blowhard
>> And then dad comes home one day and tells the family he has booked a vacation for Disneyland.<<

Newt didn’t say he had “booked it”. He said he wanted to set that as a goal. Take the same family situation. The father sits at the table and says there’s going to be no way the family can get out of the situation they are in as opposed to the father who sits down and begins to make plans and goals with the understanding that things are going to be turned around to the point that goals are reachable.

I would much rather have a leader that has goals that we should strive for. Getting our house in order should be a given when goals are set. Everyone who has ever set goals understands that background support needs to be accomplished first. Anyone who does not have forward thinking plans should not be our leader.

Mitt has none of those goals in fact from what he said in the debate he would have fired Kennedy and we would never have had a space program which gave us multiple products from the research and made the US a proud and successful nation.

42 posted on 01/29/2012 10:53:37 AM PST by CynicalBear
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To: Rummyfan

America, grounded forever because of welfare mommas.


43 posted on 01/29/2012 10:55:01 AM PST by Sybeck1 (Mitt Romney, a piss poor choice)
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To: Rummyfan

The last para presents the true bottom line:

“There are times for dreaming big dreams, and there are times to wake up. This country will not be going to the moon, any more than will be the British or French. Because, in decline, the horizons shrivel. The only thing that’s going to be on the moon is the debt ceiling. Before we can make any more giant leaps for mankind, we have to make one small, dull, prosaic, earthbound step here at home – and stop. Stop the massive expansion of microregulatory government, and then reverse it. Obama has vowed to press on. If Romney and Gingrich can’t get serious about it, he’ll get his way.”

This is pro-reality, not anti-Gingrich.


44 posted on 01/29/2012 11:08:23 AM PST by headsonpikes (Mass murder and cannibalism are the twin sacraments of socialism - "Who-whom?"-Lenin)
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To: Rummyfan

So what Mark Steyn is saying is that the US is irreversible decline, that our best days are behind us, and we should just get used to it. Who’s his candidate again?


45 posted on 01/29/2012 11:11:30 AM PST by Truthsearcher
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To: Rummyfan

So, we’re going to have to just get used to knowing the moon is Chinese territory while we gut our space program.

Gingrich’s plan is to end NASA’s monopoly on space exploration, which is about time, since the Chinese are going to end it irreversibly.


46 posted on 01/29/2012 11:29:00 AM PST by marron
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To: Truthsearcher

A vibrant country with its best days in the future wouldn`t let 10 + years pass without already having the new “Freedom Tower” completed and functioning over Ground Zero.

A country with a bright future doesn`t surrender large chunks of its southwest territory to illegals and cartels.

A country hopeful about its future doesn`t succumb to the job-killing socialist idea of taxing the rich yet even more.

A country that has a bright future doesn`t allow its culture to be usurped by perverted, anti-traditional “new thinking progressivism” to replace cultural mores and values.


47 posted on 01/29/2012 11:35:24 AM PST by ScottinVA (Liberal logic: 0bamacare mandate is acceptable... but voter IDs are unconstitutional.Oh, let me gues)
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To: Rummyfan

Newt is a futurist and a moon base is a good goal. It is a good thing to have positive, active goals, rather than being completely focused on fighting defense. All my life I’ve heard that the money spent on Nasa would be better spent on “lifting the people up from poverty”. The ~40% of the federal budget spent on social programs is just creating more dependence. Nasa is a very small percentage of the Federal Budget, less than 1% and they have accomplished a lot. There are ways to make a moon base pay such as offering private companies access and defending private property rights on the moon. We are going to crash into a fiscal wall soon, that is true, but it won’t be the end of the world. People will have to learn to live without welfare state. However, unless we plan as a nation on curling up into a ball and whimpering to death, we should be looking to the future.


48 posted on 01/29/2012 11:44:54 AM PST by Dan Cooper
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To: Rummyfan

Another brilliant article by Mark Steyn. It is 99% about Obama and his idiocy, so read it even though there is a teensy bite re Newt and the moon. We must defeat Obama or perish.


49 posted on 01/29/2012 11:57:38 AM PST by Yaelle
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To: Utmost Certainty
What a sad and weak people Americans have degenerated into to be against a vision of pioneering space. Maybe they’ll wake up when there’s a Chinese Communist Party logo emblazoned across the lunar surface.

Steyn for one is from Canada. The American pioneering spirit he may not be familiar with.

50 posted on 01/29/2012 12:12:00 PM PST by FreeReign
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