Skip to comments.Obama: Jesus would tax the rich
Posted on 02/02/2012 8:20:06 AM PST by Sub-Driver
Obama: Jesus would tax the rich By: Jennifer Epstein February 2, 2012 10:12 AM EST
President Barack Obama tied his proposal to raise taxes on wealthy Americans to his faith on Thursday, telling leaders gathered for the National Prayer Breakfast that Jesus teachings have led him to that conclusion.
The rich pay more not only because I actually think that is going to make economic sense, but for me as a Christian, it also coincides with Jesuss teaching that for unto whom much is given, much shall be required. Obama said at the Washington Hilton, delivering remarks at an annual event that every president has attended since Dwight D. Eisenhower.
We can all benefit from turning to our creator, listening to him, Obama said. Avoiding phony religiosity . This is especially important right now when were facing some big challenges as a nation.
When I talk about our financial institutions playing by the same rules as folks on Main Street, when I talk about making sure insurance companies arent discriminating against those who are already sick or making sure that unscrupulous lenders arent taking advantage of most vulnerable among us, Obama said, I do so because I genuinely believe it will make the economy stronger for everybody, but I also do it because I know far too many neighbors in our country have been hurt and treated unfairly over the last few years. And I believe in Gods command to love thy neighbor as thyself.
(Excerpt) Read more at politico.com ...
If you liked him as an individual until today, then you really didn’t do your homework. He was always a despicable a$$H%#e.
That says it all, correctly, precisely, and factually.
I had my suspicions when Obama spoke of the Christian experience as a collective salvation. That is not to assume Obama is a Muslim but it does prove to me he is not a Christian.
You are being too charitable to 0.
He indeed does believe in the “doctrines” of collective sin and collective salvation.
It’s nothing more than humanism, the belief that humans have the calling to create heaven on earth through works and molding societies.
Christians understand that it is more compassionate to encourage men capable of work to work than to give them handouts because the Bible makes it clear that the only way to truly escape poverty is through hard labor. Because a system of giving aid to the poor by taxing the rich,is a system that encourages people to become dependent on the dole, that robs the poor of any incentive to seek ways of helping themselves, that leads the poor into a poverty trap, is hardly a model of genuine compassion or of wise public policy.And also, the rich are the creators of most of the new wealth which aids all of society,including the poor, and taxing them is an assault on that process.
1And he looked up, and saw the rich men casting their gifts into the treasury.
2And he saw also a certain poor widow casting in thither two mites.
3And he said, Of a truth I say unto you, that this poor widow hath cast in more than they all:
4For all these have of their abundance cast in unto the offerings of God: but she of her penury hath cast in all the living that she had.
God, Jesus looks at our intent for giving not how much we have been given.
Then again, Barry is found of twisting the Bible for his own use.
I am not my brother's keeper you godless twit.
Jesus doesn’t save. He just redistributes!
But the tired old, Jesus was a gentle, kind, turn-the-other-cheek, soft spoken leader stuff drives me crazy.
Jesus Christ was (my belief) a STRONG leader. He had to be charismatic in word and action. He was dynamic in his leadership able to preach to children, sinners, the faithful and yes, his foes, alike. He was an activist. He took action to protect and defend others who were being treated unjustly. He was bold to take on a crowd stoning a prostitute. They could have turned on him. He took violent action at the temple. He spoke harshly of the preferred demise of those who would bring sin upon a child.
In his day, Religion was a part of politics, at least for Jews under Roman Rule. The Romans allowed the high priests to govern their own as long as they also collected the taxes, followed the rules and let none disparage Rome or the King.
Jesus went after the high priest, the hypocrites. He road into Jerusalem on a donkey with followers adoring him with palms, as he was their king. It was an insult to Jewish leaders that he should be mocking the arrival of a king.
Jesus knew what he was doing and why this would be his last days. He was, of course, God. And he took it on, as a man, with all the flair, stink, pain and suffering mortality has to offer.
Jesus was no pacifist that just went along with any old thing. I believe Jesus would be phoning the White House to explain to BO how he F’d up that whole “Breakfast Bit.”
But that's just what I believe and love about Jesus. What an awesome example of how to live!
Now he´s the Christian In Chief too.
And to talk about "phony religiosity" from the guy that learned about Jesus from Rev.Wrong!!!
... you are like whitewashed tombs which on the outside appear beautiful, but inside they are full of dead mens bones and all uncleanness.
So you, too, outwardly appear righteous to men, but inwardly you are full of hypocrisy and lawlessness.
The Thirty-nine Articles of the Anglican Church includes this one (no. 38):
XXXVIII. Of Christian men’s goods which are not common.
THE riches and goods of Christians are not common, as touching the right, title, and possession of the same, as certain Anabaptists do falsely boast; notwithstanding every man ought of such things as he possesseth liberally to give alms to the poor, according to his ability.
What he overlooks in such a broad pronouncement is:
1. Such coercive "taking" is implemented by imperfect persons in positions of power in government;
2. Individuals in the society, motivated by the teachings of Jesus, might do far more good with individual charity, if left free to do so;
3. When coercively taken from some and "redistributed" to others, the gratitude (if any) for such redistributed gifts is directed to government, not God, or to whichever tyrant chooses such a method as a vote-getting mechanism;
4. Free will of individuals is a central teaching in most Christian sects, which introduces a question about coerced "charity" if it travels under the banner of Christianity.
Just some questions which might bear discussion, since the President has introduced the topic.
I think you missunderstand me. As the seat holder of the office of the president, I'll give the human there a wide birth (no pun intended). I have not been concerned with the viceral BS that might be his beliefs, though I think are anti-american. I don't care enough about him to classify or consider his likability.
If Obama showed up on my lawn, I'd call 911 to report a tresspasser.
Today, I dislike him in a fashion that I would call to report an intruder.
Just some insight into the liberal mindset/worldview - they believe that persons in positions of power in government are inherently more "perfect" than the masses they are ruling over.
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Talks about the lucky rich needing to give back.
Well, Bari & Mooch are very, very stingy with their new-found wealth.
Hey 0bama, to quote the late Frank Zappa, JESUS THINKS YOU’RE A JERK!
Jesus was not talking about money. He was instructing his disciples on how to care for His flock.
As I understand it, the Lord gave Israel a couple of ways that they were supposed to take care of the poor:
Everybody was supposed to not strip their crops totally bare so that the vulnerable ones who had no way to make a living (widows and orphans) could harvest what was left in the field. That’s how Ruth provided for Naomi.
If a woman was widowed without having children the brother of her husband was to take her in and provide for her to have a child.
Every 50th year the land was to be returned to the tribe to whom the Lord had given it.
None of that involved stealing from one person and giving to another. It was about families providing for their own and the society as a whole leaving enough crumbs/jobs available so that those who were willing to work could provide for themselves.
Jesus noted how the Pharisees gave great gifts to the Lord that allowed them to think they were real hot stuff - at the expense of caring for their families. They took what was supposed to go to care for their parents and declared it Corban - for the Lord. So they gave their gifts to make themselves appear good but left their own parents in want. And Jesus criticized that. They were supposed to be taking care of their families.
The principle of not muzzling the ox while it works because the worker deserves his wages applies equally to rich and to poor. If you starve your workers they do bad work. If you overtax the wealthy they stop creating jobs for others. Either way you’re shooting yourself in the foot.
As somebody else mentioned here, Jesus said that the person who had been able to make more wealth from what he was made steward over was given more money by his master - because he had been faithful in a little and could be trusted with a lot. The one who hid the money in a hole - thereby robbing the master of even getting any interest on that money - because he presumed to know what a “hard” man his master was, had even what he had taken away from him, because he was unfaithful with a little and couldn’t be trusted with a lot.
That is talking about the Kingdom, but I’ve seen the same thing happen with money as well. Dave Ramsey talks about how most self-made millionaires don’t drive a fancy car, don’t live in a fancy house, and live modestly. They made their money because they lived within their means. By contrast, the lottery, paycheck advances, etc are primarily used by people who are poor - and what he means by “poor” is not the same thing as somebody who is temporarily broke. Poor is somebody who acts like a poor person; they’re always looking for a magic pill to make all their problems go away, wanting things that will make them appear successful whether they can afford it or not, etc. They have no self-control. And like it or not, people like that end up with even what they have being taken away, because they don’t know how to manage it and use it correctly.
And THAT describes the US government. Buying what they can’t afford and then looking for a magic pill to make it all better so they can do it all over again and run us all into the poor-house. I am not the person spending hundreds of thousands of dollars of other people’s money on in-flight booze. Nancy Pelosi the millionaire Congress-critter is the person doing that. Robbing us for drinks like the lowest street scum would do. They are wolves in very thin sheep’s clothing. Even when they use the money to “help others” most of it goes into administrative costs rather than actually helping “the poor”.
And it’s bad enough when they do it for secular reasons, but now that Obama is pretending to do it in the name of Christ.... all I can do is spit him out.
I make judgments of people all the time.....and I'm a Christian.
Final judgment? No. Judgments on character, manners, hygiene, honesty...Yes.
You are one of the very, very few that realize that the Presence within, is the "secret decoder ring", which decrypted outputs are meant ONLY for that person. The decoding placed into your mind through the Presence is not meant for anyone else, and thus is open for unlimited misinterpretation if you tell anyone.
This is why each INDIVIDUAL must have the Presence dwell within and must not rely on print, word, TV, radio, mail, or sign language to decypher things for you.
Wow. That is a fantastic quote.
Obama must not have heard what Jesus said about Cessar and God’s to render each in a seperate manner.
The passage has to do with knowledge and punishment for offense and misfeasance, not money or taxes.
It sure doesn't have anything to do with Obama's evil plans. What a mess America is in!
Mark 12:41 And Jesus sat over against the treasury, and beheld how the people cast money into the treasury: and many that were rich cast in much. And there came a certain poor widow, and she threw in two mites, which make a farthing. And he called unto him his disciples, and saith unto them, Verily I say unto you, That this poor widow hath cast more in, than all they which have cast into the treasury: For all they did cast in of their abundance; but she of her want did cast in all that she had, even all her living.
Their Constitution, of course, was all about setting limits and bounds, and then checking and balancing any such powers which "the People" would jealously grant to those imperfect persons who represented them.
The sheer arrogance of this President and his band of "rulers" serve to prove the Founders' wisdom, as well as the need for "the People" to take back their Constitution, "bind down" (Jefferson) their "rulers" "by the chains of the Constitution" (again, Jefferson) and restore their form of self-government under a written Constitution.
Final paragraph of Joseph Story's "Commentaries on the Constitution":
§ 1907. If these Commentaries shall but inspire in the rising generation a more ardent love of their country, an unquenchable thirst for liberty, and a profound reverence for the constitution and the Union, then they will have accomplished all, that their author ought to desire. Let the American youth never forget, that they possess a noble inheritance, bought by the toils, and sufferings, and blood of their ancestors; and capable, if wisely improved, and faithfully guarded, of transmitting to their latest posterity all the substantial blessings of fife, the peaceful enjoyment of liberty, property, religion, and independence. The structure has been erected by architects of consummate skill and fidelity; its foundations are solid; its compartments are beautiful, as well as useful; its arrangements are full of wisdom and order; and its defences are impregnable from without. It has been reared for immortality, if the work of man may justly aspire to such a title. It may, nevertheless, perish in an hour by the folly, or corruption, or negligence of its only keepers, THE PEOPLE. Republics are created by the virtue, public spirit, and intelligence of the citizens. They fall, when the wise are banished from the public councils, because they dare to be honest, and the profligate are rewarded, because they flatter the people, in order to betray them.
What the he** does this jerk know about what Jesus would do??
Jesus said that you will always have the poor with you (Mk 14: 7). Socialism is not going to change that fact.
Mark 8:33 But when Jesus turned and looked at his disciples, he rebuked Peter. Get behind me, Satan! he said. You do not have in mind the concerns of God, but merely human concerns.
He thinks he’s God or government is God then.
If you want to take it in Obama’s context he or government gets to beat you if you aren’t giving enough.
The above is moot anyway, as Jesus isn’t talking about material wealth in this passage.
You can tell what camp Obama’s coming from, distorting Scripture so blatantly to justify tyrannical government taking more and more from whatever demographic of society they are currently demonizing and blaming for the problems they themselves have created. It is as truthful as declaring the statement of King Herod declaring all firstborn boys under 2 be killed, as proof the bible approves abortion or infanticide.
Finally I’d just add that Obama, throwing oyur own liberal objection you always use, keep religion and state separate you clown. You liberals always can’t stand it when we base our morals and living on the Bible, you call us clingers to our bible, and now you have the audacity to quote it, out of context, to further taxing the hell out of us? Asshat.
Jesus knows the government is the richest of rich people. Tax cuts are like taxing the very richest of us all.
The only phrase that keeps coming to mind when he pulls this level of heresy is “Render unto Cesar what belongs to Cesar, render unto God what belongs to God.”
He feels very comfortable making the moral equivalency of charitable works by the government, because so many Americans either don't attend and tithe at Church or don't believe in God at all. Therefore in that vacuum...government becomes both Cesar and God to set the Nations moral compass.
Baloney. YOu can judge him.
As Christians we can judge others. We are just told and warned to judge righteously, not hypocritically. Not rip on someone for doing something we ourselves have not stopped doing.
If we were not able to judge others we’d never be able to tell someone they are doing something wrong, as this very act requires judgment. Judge, but judge righteously. Not out of hypocrisy or to railroad someone or falsely accuse them. Judge righteous judgment.
Besides our “judgment” doesn’t do anything to that person. We don’t send them to jail, we don’t arrest them. Our judgment is that they are doing something wrong and in some cases, very wicked and evil.
The people who say “I can’t judge” or “Don’t judge me” just don’t want to get involved or just want to continue to keep doing evil and not have to deal with anyone hurting their egos.
Actually, yes you can, no, you must judge someone who claims to be a Christian:
For what have I to do with judging outsiders? Is it not those inside the church whom you are to judge? God judges those outside. Purge the evil person from among you. 1 Cor 5: 12-14
He who has been stealing must steal no longer, but must work, doing something useful with his own hands, that he may have something to share with those in need.
We are to wrok to have money to give (willingly not confiscated or taxed) and in turn God Blesses (empowers us to prosper) our giving so that we have even more to give. This is how God's economy is supposed to work when people are properly utilizing the Kingdom of God. (Proverbs 19:17, Luke 6:38, Philippians 4:19)
Remember this: Whoever sows sparingly will also reap sparingly, and whoever sows generously will also reap generously. Each man should give what he has decided in his heart to give, not reluctantly or under compulsion, for God loves a cheerful giver. And God is able to make all grace abound to you, so that in all things at all times, having all that you need, you will abound in every good work. As it is written:
He has scattered abroad his gifts to the poor;
his righteousness endures forever.
Now he who supplies seed to the sower and bread for food will also supply and increase your store of seed and will enlarge the harvest of your righteousness. You will be made rich in every way so that you can be generous on every occasion, and through us your generosity will result in thanksgiving to God. 2 Corinthians 9:6-11
See also Matthew 6 & Luke 12 where Jesus tells his disciples to seek first the Kingdom of God (God's way of doing things) and He will supply all your needs. Seek God, not government or your fellow taxpayers who will never be capable of being your source.
This is the same crap I heard when I was the Vice Commander of the Army-Air Force Center for Low Intensity Conflict. The war in El Salvador was going strong and many leftist, inside and outside of this Country, said, “If Jesus was alive today he’d be carrying an AK-47”.
New International Version (NIV)
48 But the one who does not know and does things deserving punishment will be beaten with few blows. From everyone who has been given much, much will be demanded; and from the one who has been entrusted with much, much more will be asked.
It's talking about degrees of punishment for intentionally doing evil or bad.
Like quoting part of a scripture for personal gain?
VERY ironic and little bammy is messing around with some "juju" that is far beyond his control.
>Avoiding phony religiosity ”<
Look in the mirror fool.
I hope someones preparing to rip this heresy to shreds, preferably a bishop. (I can dream, cant I?)
Could happen. The bishops are pretty ticked at him, as they should be.
>You can judge him.....
I make judgments of people all the time.....and I’m a Christian.
Final judgment? No. Judgments on character, manners, hygiene, honesty...Yes.<
That’s not judgment. It’s discernment.
Yeshua was not a believer in the secular government, and by His own words he denied that His mission, any part of it, had any purpose in placing itself - for any purpose - into the hands of secular government.
In Yeshua’s time the secular government’s tax collector was a hated profession, because it took from the people money that they would have spent more wisely, including money they would have given to the religious leaders for charity for the poor (just as it is today).
Yeshua, like Conservatives today, did not see “the society”, and individuals in society, and their obligations to be merciful and charitable, as synonous with “government” of the secular order of things.
When Satan offered Yeshua the power of all the secular governments (”kingdoms”) of the world Yeshua told Satan to take himself “hence” (meaning there, meaning where it was he had offered to Yeshua).
And His disciple John reminded us that Yeshua said that His kingdom is not of this world - it is not part of the world secular and political order - in any age, prior to His return in power and glory.
Christians are not called by Yeshua to demonstrate their mercy and charity by giving the power and obligation to demonstrate their mercy and charity to government - whose hands are bound by who is in authority, and who is in authority over secualar government is not Yeshua.
I hear you....I feel ill whenever he uses our Lord....makes me sick.
In order to hear from Jesus, you must first have Him in your heart, and O doesn’t have one, so that rules him out.
Then I guess verses such as Psalm 139:13 should come into play when discussing legalized murder...aka abortion.
“For You formed my inward parts; You wove me in my mother’s womb”
I just want to puke hearing him pontificating about what Jesus would do and using that to try to coerce people into submitting to HIM and his plans.
He’s using the tactic I’ve seen so often. Non-Christians have so little opinion of Christians and their mental facilities that they think if they invoke Scripture or Jesus or religion that Christians will just cave being terrified of going against something God would say.
They think that Christians are just sheeple who will follow any directive which references God without argument because heaven forbid someone should think that they’re not Christian because they don’t comply to a non-Christian’s opinion of what a Christian should think or act like.
Well, I have news for you, obama, I know a great deal more about what God thinks than you do and I am NOT being cowed by someone throwing around Scripture or Jesus’ name. You are no spokesman for God to tell me what He thinks of me and what I should do to please Him and I am not afraid of displeasing God by not listening to you, even if you do invoke His name.
Seems to me that someone there doesn’t understand what *Do not take the Lord’s name in vain * really means. It ain’t about cussing.
I don't get offended easily either, but in THIS case, he managed to do it.
Jesus, as always, provides us the example, metmom...
When the devil tried to use scripture against Jesus,
he defeated him with... MORE SCRIPTURE.
The defense against any of Satan’s servants using scripture to coerce certain behaviors out of people
is to know the rest of scripture to put it in context.