Rising Black Social Pathology

Creators.com ^ | February 15, 2012 | Walter Williams

[okie01]

Mainly one specific Whitey named Lyndon Baines Johnson. If and when we begin to overturn the Great Society (welfare) programs that were specifically designed to enslave blacks in poverty and ignorance, will we begin to see change in these ghettos.

LBJ and the "Great Society" are perhaps the worst thing that ever happened to the black family. Far worse than Jim Crow and segregation.

[Vanders9]

:)

[Vanders9]

Absolutely - we have a winner!

[Vanders9]

We may not have concealed carry, but we don't need "school police" either, or metal detectors at the entrance.

The flaw in your argument is that the absence of guns may not make the criminals act any better, but the presence of guns doesn't deter them very much either, as violent crime is still very prevalent over non-gun free zones in the US as well. The reason is very simple.

Pro-gun advocates (if I can call them that), often argue that guns don't kill people, people kill people. Guns are just tools. And that is 100% true, but the argument cuts both ways. As it is people who kill, it follows that the relative availability of firearms is far far less important in crime statistics than the relative willingness of people to pull triggers. In other words, the reason these schools are hell holes of assault, rape, bullying and robbery is mostly due to the moral decay of the kids in them. They have had no discipline, their culture asserts anti-intellectualism, they have no connection to society as a whole, and they seem to think that the sanctity of Human life (specifially other people's lives) is no bar on their personal advancement. Under circumstances like that, it doesnt matter very much whether they know you have a gun or not. The very best that will happen is that they pick on someone else, which is great for you, but as far as society is concerned, it's not solving the problem, its just relocating it. The real answer (as others have said in this thread) is to reinstute morality in society. After all, it might be neccesary to defend yourself, but its far better if you dont need to.

As for the snark - just take a look at any thread about crime in the UK. Inevitably some fool will make some ignorant, insulting snarky comment about gun control, irrespective of the circumstances, irrespective of the fact that in many of them people have been really hurt. So in the light of that, when I saw this article I decided a little payback was well justified.

[PallMal]

Students in West African countries wear uniforms (girls wear long skirts) and discipline is harsh. I don’t think that you can compare those students to black American students and I don’t believe that academic achievers in Africa are called “whitey”.

The derogatory terms, "acting white" or "whitey" if you're educated, is by far a black American phenomena.

What you see in West Africa is the same thing you'll see in the West Indian countries, where the English-speaking countries use the model of the British school system. Education, if it can be found, is valued and respected in these countries.

[aruanan]

The flaw in your argument is that the absence of guns may not make the criminals act any better, but the presence of guns doesn't deter them very much either, as violent crime is still very prevalent over non-gun free zones in the US as well. The reason is very simple.

The flaw in your argument is that it is contradicted by reality. Every state that has passed concealed carry experiences an immediate drop in violent and other crimes and that reduction continues to decrease every year thereafter. Between 1991 and 2009 (last year available in the FBI crime statistics on the FBI site I was accessing), murder rates had fallen over 40% (with an increase of at least 70,000,000 guns). In the earlier days, it was the state across the border from a right to carry state that experienced an increase in crime because criminals were making a conscious choice to go where they were less likely to get shot.

As far as school police and metal detectors go, beware of judging the level of a threat by the moronic crap done by school bureaucrats. They are notorious for all sorts of "zero-tolerance" idiocy. When you combine their penchant for going overboard on everything but actual education with the offer of money by politicians eager to show how "concerned" they are for the children, you get a situation that looks much worse than it actually is. True, there are some schools in some big cities that use metal detectors as a deterrent to kids carrying in weapons of every kind, but in most places they are not needed. The kids face a greater threat from intellectual rot inside the school than they do physical violence from weapons.

[aruanan]

But how is all this violence possible? I thought you-all had constitutional rights to defend yourself with guns?

Poor schmuck. When you create an environment where the kids can have nothing done to them but be suspended or expelled and the teachers can do nothing but talk and refer a troublesome student to the office, you create a situation where there will be a maximum amount of trouble because the students can act with impunity. Oh, and by the way, there have been a number of school shootings that were stopped because teachers ran back to their cars off school grounds to retrieve their guns, long before the police would have arrived to make note of the positions of the bodies shot in what the shooters knew was a gun-free zone. Too bad the teachers had not been allowed to be armed in school to begin with.

In the Dominican Republic a student who had moved down from New York told me I couldn't whip his ass because he would sue me. I told him, "Enrique, you're not in the U.S. any longer and, besides, your dad told me to do anything I needed to prevent you from causing trouble in class," whereupon I proceeded to march him out of the class and around the corner just far enough to be out of sight of the other students but not out of earshot. Enrique's behavior, and that of everyone else, improved dramatically for the rest of the year and there was no need for a repeat performance with anyone. Enrique and everyone else made a conscious decision not to engage in behavior that would have immediate, embarrassing, and painful consequences.

[Vanders9]

Umm...thats kind of what I am saying in #44

[Vanders9]

Years ago kids would bring their guns to school for gun club - they’d walk in the hallways armed. No one thought a thing of it.

Of course not. Because everyone knew that said kids had a mentality and an ethical morality that meant they wouldnt USE said guns - or at least not on each other.

[Vanders9]

The kids face a greater threat from intellectual rot inside the school than they do physical violence from weapons.

The point is that the one eventually leads to the other. Actually the one already HAS led to the other.

[Responsibility2nd]

LBJ and the "Great Society" are perhaps the worst thing that ever happened to the black family. Far worse than Jim Crow and segregation.

 

 

I was having a very civil discussion with a black person the other day over this same idea. They could not believe I would argue that today's liberal racism - foisted on blacks by the government - is worse than the liberal Jim Crow style of racism.

 

But the main issues that decimate black Americans today are Abortion, Welfare and Illegitimate children. Than add in a whole host of other issues, and you have a receipe for disaster.

[GOPJ]

“Contrary to the idiot Mayor Bloomberg, the main issue with violent crime in our cities is not the industrial production and distribution of guns, it is the social production and distribution of the criminal class the uses them.”©Wuli 2012

BINGO! ... and the values that uphold the criminal class...

[PapaBear3625]

Or how about "in earlier periods, black students had more black role models in the forms of black principals, teachers and guidance counselors"?

The main role model kids need is an involved father. And most black students in those schools don't have one.

In the 50's and before, women had husbands before they had kids. There was a simple reason: before welfare it was real hard to support kids without a father. Welfare enabled the pathology.

[PapaBear3625]

Africans who move to the U.S. often express amazement at the level of disruptive behavior of black American students citing that there is no such lack of discipline in schools in their homelands. Many children in those countries don’t attend school but those that do tend to value education and those schools have better discipline.

There you have it. The kids that are in school there are the ones who want to learn. The ones who don't want to learn, or who disrupt the school, are tossed out. Plus, how many of the Nigerians who go to school, go to private schools paid by their families (who would be upset to see their money wasted by laziness)?

[Jack Burton007]

Well said aruanan.

Our UK buddy doesn’t seem to see that his country has more crime related to the fact that they are unable to defend themselves from criminals. Who’s country is it that just had massive riots in the streets and massive violence caused by thousands of yobs?

In a country that has willingly surrendered their rights to firearms and self defense they have little right to throw stones at the US. As Aruanan stated, the fact we have metal detectors and police in our schools is done because school admins know they can get government money to have such things and even if not needed they will spend the money to have them. Now in some of our inner cities, where minorities are the majority, this kind of thing is needed. I won’t go into why I believe that is so. Let’s just say it’s cultural and leave it at that.

When the UK put firearms on a total ban the UK (and Australia as well) saw a 400% increase in violent crime and home invasions. This is also due to the fact that the police will arrest anyone who tries to defend themselves from criminals. Talk about a screwed up idea. I know this is the case. I have numerous friends in the UK and I hear from them first hand.

So Vanders9. It seems you’ve come to a forum that is not liberal, but strongly conservative. We know what works and doesn’t because we learn from the failure of other countries and don’t wish to follow them down the road to ruin.

If you love being defenseless then good for you. Here in America, us Yanks know how do defend ourselves and won’t surrender our rights for some government promise that they will protect us.

Maybe you meant to join the MoveOn.org site. I’m sure you’ll find lots of anti-gun people on there.