Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Life After An EMP Attack: No Power, No Food, No Transportation, No Banking And No Internet
http://endoftheamericandream.com/archives/life-after-an-emp-attack-no-power-no-food-no-transportation-no-banking-and-no-internet ^

Posted on 02/23/2012 8:49:06 AM PST by chessplayer

Most Americans do not know this, but a single EMP attack could potentially wipe out most of the electronics in the United States and instantly send this nation back to the 1800s. If a nuclear bomb was exploded high enough in the atmosphere over the middle part of the country, the electromagnetic pulse would fry electronic devices from coast to coast. The damage would be millions of times worse than 9/11. Just imagine a world where nobody has power, most cars will not start, the Internet has been fried, the financial system is offline indefinitely, nobody can make any phone calls and virtually all commerce across the entire country is brought to a complete stop. A nation that does not know how to live without technology would be almost entirely stripped of it at that point. Yes, this could really happen. An EMP attack is America's "Achilles heel", and everyone around the world knows it. It is only a matter of time before someone uses an EMP weapon against us, and at this point we are pretty much completely unprepared.

(Excerpt) Read more at endoftheamericandream.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: beprepared; empattack; emtattack; getreadyhereitcomes; getyourhouseinorder; moreempscarehype; preparenow; prepperping; preppers; selfreliance; shtf; sourcetitlenoturl; survival; survivalping; teotwawki
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-5051-100101-150151-200201-245 next last
To: Texas Fossil

One of the studies has been posted here already, the State of Washington also has a study posted online.

There are many variables. Any nuclear weapon can generate a EMP spike. They can be designed to create a larger EMP so the smaller bombs are seen as more efficient.

Its one of many threats we face. However it is real and is something to be aware of.


151 posted on 02/23/2012 11:03:29 AM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 148 | View Replies]

To: metmom

Didn’t southern california have a black out a few months ago because of a simple mistake some guy made?


152 posted on 02/23/2012 11:05:51 AM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 149 | View Replies]

To: Twinkie
What you gonna do for gasoline?

Throw my lot in with the Great Humungus.

153 posted on 02/23/2012 11:06:38 AM PST by Rinnwald
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 147 | View Replies]

To: Rinnwald
"Throw my lot in with the Great Humungus."

The Warrior of the Wasteland ...
The Ayatollah of Rock-and-rolla ...

154 posted on 02/23/2012 11:11:18 AM PST by BlueLancer (KOMEN PINK: The color of the water in the basin after Pilate finished washing his hands)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 153 | View Replies]

To: Iron Munro

I don’t see that the blast radius would be linear as that maps suggests.

For one thing, the strength of the pulse would be inversely proportional to the square of the distance from the earth, just like any electromagnetic force.

The other thing is, the earth is not flat. The curvature of the earth would make both the east and west coasts even further away from the center than the map suggests and the pulse would be further weakened by then.


155 posted on 02/23/2012 11:13:29 AM PST by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 112 | View Replies]

To: chessplayer

This comes up every four months, like someone wants the story to stay alive. It is a very unlikely attack scenario.

The attacker would need to not only make a 100% reliable thermonuke, he’d need to deliver it and have it detonate at just the right altitude over CONUS. Oh and it would need to be completely stealthy so AEGIS, THAAD, Standard Missile 3, BSTS, and GMD systems would not see it and zap it.

Then, if they manage all this, they will have hurt commercial and public systems, but would leave potent military systems still running and ready to backtrack the missile path and respond.

Far more likely that they’d smuggle in their warhead disguised as cocaine, put it in a Cessna, and fly it over New York (maybe over Yankee Stadium dragging a banner).


156 posted on 02/23/2012 11:15:08 AM PST by DBrow
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Twinkie

“What you gonna do for gasoline?”

Ever hear of casinghead? There are those who still know how to make it here. We have oil wells.

And, none of this is going to happen. If it were to, the effects would be on a much smaller area.

Should we ignore this? NO

Should be scurry into a dark corner and quake? NO

Prepare and let the cretin know we will make glass parking lots out of all of their country if they try. And we can.


157 posted on 02/23/2012 11:16:30 AM PST by Texas Fossil (Government, even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 147 | View Replies]

To: bigbob

Sure, that report said 70-90% of every is going to DIE!!!!!!!

OK, enough of the BS. That report has been debunked so many times it is just plain stupid that you bring it up again.


158 posted on 02/23/2012 11:21:12 AM PST by CodeToad (NO TAXATION WITHOUT REPRESENTATION!!!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 125 | View Replies]

To: Kartographer; JRandomFreeper

Glad to see there are at least a couple of people here who know what they are talking about.

The danger is real — not theoretical.

I have imagined a scenario that would accomplish the result describe in “One Second After.” Take a terrorist state like Iran that has the funds. Manufacture three small, high-yield EMP nuke warheads, and attach to superscud type missiles. Buy a handful of Club-K missile launchers from Russian, throw out the cruise missiles and replace with nuke-armed scuds. (Or have the Ruskies attach them for you.) (For those who don’t know, Club-K launchers look exactly like shipping containers. Deploy containers via ship and truck at multiple points of entry. Once in position, all they have to do is point and click. War heads explode at set altitude. No need for sophisticated satellite tracking etc.?

America is thrown back to the stone age. Forget the 1800s. The people in the 1800s had tools and technology suitable to live in the 1800s. We will become cave men with personal fire arms...and that’s about it.

Those of you who doubt this better 1) shut up about it being exaggerated, 2) read “One Second After”, and 3) read the 2001 Report of the Commission to Assess the Threat to the United States from Electromagnetic Pulse (EMP).

If I were an islamic terrorist with access to Iran-level funding I would focus on nothing else BUT an EMP strike. Nothing — NOTHING — else comes close. Entirely feasible right now, today.


159 posted on 02/23/2012 11:21:42 AM PST by Lee'sGhost (Johnny Rico picked the wrong girl!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 44 | View Replies]

To: chessplayer

The other day at the library, I checked out “One Second After” for another read but was unable to find “Patriots” by Rawles. Imagine that, someone had not returned it. That evening a friend called to say their brother had lent them his copy of “Once Second After” and was going to give them “Patriots” in a few days. Strange coincidence or are people are slowly beginning to wake up?


160 posted on 02/23/2012 11:22:44 AM PST by bgill (Romney & Obama are both ineligible. A non-NBC GOP prez shuts down all ?s on Obama's admin)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: driftdiver

I don’t recall because I live in NY and don’t worry too much about southern CA.


161 posted on 02/23/2012 11:27:55 AM PST by metmom (For freedom Christ has set us free; stand firm therefore & do not submit again to a yoke of slavery)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 152 | View Replies]

To: katana
I seem to recall that the single largest atmospheric nuclear test ever conducted was by the Soviets and was a stratospheric detonation of something around 50 megatons yield. IIRC it created a second sun in the sky over the USSR for several minutes and was never tried again. The question is whether that test, which was far larger than anything that would likely be used in an EMP attack, has any relevancy since it happened before the digital age.

The Tsar Bomba was set off at an altitude of only 4 kilometers (2.5 mi). The higher the altitude the farther the EMP spreads. So at such a low altitude the blast radius was larger than the EMP radius. It doesn't matter much if your car stops running a fraction of a second before you get vaporized.

Of note the Tsar Bomba massed in at 30 tons. There aren't many launch vehicles that can put 30 tons into LEO. And Iran sure as heck doesn't have any. Iran's best launcher shown to date can put around a hundred kilograms into LEO.

Even very compact H-Bombs W-56 warhead that produces a 1.2 megaton blast is in the 300 kilogram range. Low tech enriched uranium atomic bombs of the type Iran is developing will be like the ones used at the end of WWII. So figure <20 kilo ton and the bomb masses in at a whopping 4,400 kg.

Small thermonuclear bombs (Fusion) are very hard to build. They will not be a nations first attempt. Iran hasn't even been able to fire off an atomic bomb (Fission) yet. And fission bombs are too big to loft high enough for an single shot EMP blast. So that limits you to China, Russia, France and the US. Those nations have the low mass high yield bombs and the launchers to put them at 250 km altitude.
162 posted on 02/23/2012 11:36:19 AM PST by GonzoGOP (There are millions of paranoid people in the world and they are all out to get me.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 92 | View Replies]

To: OldMissileer; DCBryan1; RFEngineer
As most of you have validated the existence of EMP, here's the question: During Carrington or Hawaii, there were no fragile solid state electronics permeating every single facet of everyday life. What are the consequences of EMP or severe solar storm on these devices? It is theorized, but I don't believe that is known.

Also, if I recall, when the government conducted their tests (an oft cited example), many cars etc suffered no damage. However, by their own admission, the level of power (voltage?) they were able to recreate was a fraction of what a modern nuclear explosion would yield.

163 posted on 02/23/2012 11:36:35 AM PST by Axeslinger (Where has my country gone?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 126 | View Replies]

To: chris_bdba

What do you think about turning a canner into a faraday cage? Maybe line one with cardboard? My garden now days is small so there isn’t much excess to can so the canners are collecting dust.


164 posted on 02/23/2012 11:36:44 AM PST by bgill (Romney & Obama are both ineligible. A non-NBC GOP prez shuts down all ?s on Obama's admin)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 14 | View Replies]

To: DBrow
Far more likely that they’d smuggle in their warhead disguised as cocaine, put it in a Cessna, and fly it over New York (maybe over Yankee Stadium dragging a banner).

Let me guess the banner would say:
"TO HELL WITH BABE RUTH!"
165 posted on 02/23/2012 11:39:31 AM PST by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 156 | View Replies]

To: crosshairs

“No FreeRepublic? This is series!”

It’s also hugh.

(Will beebers continue to work after an EMP attack?)


166 posted on 02/23/2012 11:41:58 AM PST by MayflowerMadam (Don't blame me; I voted for the American.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 43 | View Replies]

To: chessplayer

What is an “EMP” attack?

Please spell it out the first time followed by the abbreviation in parenthesize.

That is correct Basic English writing.


167 posted on 02/23/2012 11:43:12 AM PST by Gatún(CraigIsaMangoTreeLawyer)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: DH
Has the EMP bomb actually been tested over a large area? Do they really know exactly what its capabilities are? Have they ever exploded one in the atmosphere?

Actually, they have tested EMPs in the atmosphere and they're more destructive than were originally thought.

One, a 1.4 Megaton hyrdogen bomb was exploded 250 miles over Johnston Island. It caused such a large EMP that it knocked out electronics and communication in Hawaii and New Zealand, almost 1500 miles away.

It also knocked out 3 satellites in low earth orbit and the resulting radiation belts eventually knocked out one third of all low-earth orbit satellites.

168 posted on 02/23/2012 11:49:03 AM PST by Ol' Dan Tucker (People should not be afraid of the government. Government should be afraid of the people)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: katana
Anything with a wire connected to electronics will be affected. Whether it is high voltage power lines or micro circuitry in your phone. The EMP/Carrington induced voltage spike is immediate. Sure fuses and circuit breakers will trip or blow but so will the transistors and other electronics that are designed into circuit boards and protection devices.
Large power transformers (and their electronics) will be harmed. IE- 138k volt to 18k volt utility transformers. Now envision that voltage increases (In one power cycle) to 240k volts on the high side and 36k volts on the other. Anything connected to this transformer will fry. Both protection devices (Digital-If they still work and Mechanical-Metal Oxide varistors used for lightning strike protection) will be destroyed. The coils of wire inside of the transformers (Specifically the insulation on the wire) will break down or fry. I have seen spectacular explosions of these transformers due to insulation breakdown.
Yep, I work in a power generation facility. Some years ago we experienced a power surge. Lightning struck a grounded fenceline on the property 150-200 yards away. It wiped out the electronics for part of our control system. We were not generating at the time, but had we been online I am positive the turbines and generators would have been harmed. On the safe side, we do monitor space weather at work. Anytime NOAA issues an alert on space weather issues we take note. I've received phone calls warning me of possible issues with solar storms while operating. A nuke/emp, well not much of a warning could be expected.
Mind that the control systems are not a typical PC but an industrial computer. The circuitry operates at either 24v DC or 120v AC. These circuits do not like any voltage excursions. We replaced the fried control circuits with spares from the shelf. It was 6 months later that we received replacements for the shelf. They had to be built from scratch at the factory. Then tested. Then shipped.
Imagine (If you can) that happening in a large geographic area. Lotsa facilities will be down. It is possible the spare parts on the shelf won't work either. EMP will be everywhere and any energy conductor will catch it. Most Intel Pentium chips operate at 3-6volts. I don't think they can survive a spike to say 25 volts. Let alone the insulation breakdown due to heat. (wire heats up as the current and voltage increase or printed circuit boards fry)
As far as the electromagnetic fields are concerned- Any device that can generate microwaves (Energy) has to be tested and registered with the FCC. Look on your cell phone for FCC information or imprinted codes. Some have wireless routers for their internet connection. Look at the packaging for the interference information. People with pacemakers avoid microwave ovens for a reason. Interference. Imagine the interference a couple orders of magnitude.
Most people wouldn't place their cell phones in the microwave oven. If the heat created didn't kill it, the microwaves would destroy sensitive electronics
Vehicles are a crap shoot.
Newer vehicles with high energy ignition systems MAY fare well. But,have you ever heard an AM radio broadcast while driving down the road. Rev up the engine and I bet you can hear the whine in the background increase. Similarly driving near high voltage power lines(EMF interference) will pick up static. Now imagine the interference increase a couple orders of magnitude.
Older cars can have issues also. The points in the distributor cap may make it but I think the the condenser will fry. The ignition coil- it takes 12v DC from your car and “transforms” it to a high enough voltage (30k to 60k) to get a spark at the plugs. Say that 12v DC increases to 36v. What voltage would you get to the plugs? Yor condenser wouldn't make the cut at 36volts let alone the saturation in the coil. It's not much current but the volts will kill it. Alternators have electronics too- Rectifiers. Zap.
The high altitude EMP testing done in the 60’s was over remote areas of the USSR and over vast areas of the pacific. Mostly uninhabited. Hawaii had issues when they blew them during Starfish Prime and the USSR didn't come away unscathed either when they did their high altitude testing. ASFAIK.
The Navy has done lower power EMP testing back east. Ships, planes, cars were all zapped. I don't know the results of those tests.
It's a long diatribe on what could happen.
Too many red-bulls.
Agree/disagree? ! ? Anyone
169 posted on 02/23/2012 11:49:30 AM PST by BigpapaBo (If it don't kill you it'll make you _________!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 92 | View Replies]

To: Ol' Dan Tucker
One, a 1.4 Megaton hyrdogen bomb was exploded 250 miles over Johnston Island.

And there is the key. High yield, low mass, Thermonuclear weapon, launched to leo. Iran can't do any of those things. Even if they get a low yield fission bomb that won't do the trick. Too heavy, not enough yield. And any launcher that can loft it will tell everybody who fired the shot. Remember our nukes, especially the subs, are EMP hardened. One second after might be bad for us. However 30 minutes after, when our counter strike arrives, is going to be very bad for them.

170 posted on 02/23/2012 12:01:41 PM PST by GonzoGOP (There are millions of paranoid people in the world and they are all out to get me.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 168 | View Replies]

To: bgill

Galvenized garbage cans will work as well. Any conductive container will work. Insulate the items inside from the metal as well.


171 posted on 02/23/2012 12:09:47 PM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 164 | View Replies]

To: Buckeye McFrog

Indeed, or presidential advisers who believe that the US government has an obligation to halt any expansion of the american population as el rushbo mentioned on his show today.


172 posted on 02/23/2012 12:10:07 PM PST by chris37 (Heartless.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 150 | View Replies]

To: GonzoGOP

A container carrier, a conex box, a gps unit and a nuke = poor man’s ballistic missile.


173 posted on 02/23/2012 12:10:29 PM PST by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 170 | View Replies]

To: Ol' Dan Tucker

http://www.ece.unm.edu/summa/notes/SDAN/0031.pdf

It knocked out some series-connected streetlights.


174 posted on 02/23/2012 12:10:38 PM PST by DBrow
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 168 | View Replies]

To: GonzoGOP

Do you really think Obozo would nuke anyone? I hope you’re in the market for a nice bridge, cause I am selling one.


175 posted on 02/23/2012 12:11:44 PM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 170 | View Replies]

To: Lee'sGhost
Those of you who doubt this better 1) shut up about it being exaggerated,

No, not gonna shut up. Quit acting like a DU'r please.

I'll trust my ten years with DOE OST and the 1945-1992 tests, all with EMP data. Heck, I bet I'm the only Freeper that has been in active Russian missile silo (and they build those damn things VERY DEEP, and VERY thick). Russians wouldn't confirm it, but our DIA guys suspected that our tour of the SS-18 "Satan" Silo housed a 25MT warhead (mod 3 IIRC). Anyways, we were there to help tighten up their nuclear security program in the late 90s.

2) read “One Second After”, and

I have. It is a WORK OF FICTION! just like Lucifer's Hammer, Alas Babylon!, On the Beach, and Earth Abides.
You don't see me moving to high altitude next to a nuke plant, taking my relatives in, storing up on cyanide, or collecting rattlesnakes (re the above books) because of some good fiction writing.

3) read the 2001 Report of the Commission to Assess the Threat to the United States from Electromagnetic Pulse (EMP).

I have....and I have read the peer-reviewed research that thoroughly shoot holes in the entire report.

What are you going to tell me to research next? Al Gore's An Inconvienent Truth, and then point me to a Presidential or ICCC Global Warming Report? Sheesh....get a grip.

Glad you and everyone else are prepping for all eventualities though. Having worked with and for the government, I have come to the conclusion that when TSHTF, you are on your own. Nothing wrong with being prepared, just don't put all your eggs in one basket.

176 posted on 02/23/2012 12:11:46 PM PST by DCBryan1 (Id rather have a man who wrecked his marriage as POTUS than a man who wrecked his country!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 159 | View Replies]

To: Kartographer
A container carrier, a conex box, a gps unit and a nuke = poor man’s ballistic missile.

This was a discussion about EMP. Unless you are going to get that conex box up to 250 miles it won't do the job. And at $10,000 a pound launching a conex box isn't a poor man's anything.
177 posted on 02/23/2012 12:13:29 PM PST by GonzoGOP (There are millions of paranoid people in the world and they are all out to get me.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 173 | View Replies]

To: metmom
I don’t see that the blast radius would be linear as that maps suggests.

For one thing, the strength of the pulse would be inversely proportional to the square of the distance from the earth, just like any electromagnetic force.

The other thing is, the earth is not flat. The curvature of the earth would make both the east and west coasts even further away from the center than the map suggests and the pulse would be further weakened by then.

Sounds like there is no need for concern then.


178 posted on 02/23/2012 12:13:57 PM PST by Iron Munro ("Don't pick a fight with an old man. If he is too old to fight he'll just kill you." John Steinbeck)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 155 | View Replies]

To: cotton
except for the medicines.

Insulin dependent diabetics would eventually die since insulin needs to be refrigerated I believe.

179 posted on 02/23/2012 12:19:11 PM PST by Hot Tabasco (The only solution to this primary is a shoot out! Last person standing picks the candidate)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 9 | View Replies]

To: driftdiver
Do you really think Obozo would nuke anyone?

If we got nuked, and he didn't nuke back, there would be a coup. Because the minute the Russians or the Chinese think we won't shoot back they will empty their silos. So a deterrent only works if you use it. Obama might not understand that, but the generals and admirals do.
180 posted on 02/23/2012 12:19:39 PM PST by GonzoGOP (There are millions of paranoid people in the world and they are all out to get me.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 175 | View Replies]

To: GonzoGOP

Correct.

I just meant that a strike can be made without a full blown ballist missle.

My position has always been that EMP big or EMP effect small the terror and confusion created woukld be as bad or worse than the EMP effect itself.

Yes the damage would more and likely be ‘fixable’, but imagine the LA/SD or the BosNYWash corridor without power for 60 to 90 days? What kind of chaos would result?


181 posted on 02/23/2012 12:21:46 PM PST by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 177 | View Replies]

To: metmom

EMP blast radius is line of sight. So areas behind mountains might be more protected than those which are not.

The map in question takes into account the curvature of the earth.

Iran currently has missiles with a range of 2500km able to carry a 1 ton payload. Those certainly won’t reach the high orbital altitude but are a threat.

Currently reports have them orbiting a 65kg payload into orbit.


182 posted on 02/23/2012 12:24:54 PM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 155 | View Replies]

To: GonzoGOP

yeah and a coup would make us less of a target /s

ha


183 posted on 02/23/2012 12:26:00 PM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 180 | View Replies]

To: GonzoGOP

Or they can get their hands on one of these:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/russia/7632543/A-cruise-missile-in-a-shipping-box-on-sale-to-rogue-bidders.html


184 posted on 02/23/2012 12:27:14 PM PST by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 177 | View Replies]

To: Kartographer
In 2011 Texas a power exporter had blackouts due to just a couple plants going off line due to the weather

Just them turning off the power and turning it back on blew several tranformers. That was supposed to have been in a controlled manner.

185 posted on 02/23/2012 12:35:10 PM PST by bgill (Romney & Obama are both ineligible. A non-NBC GOP prez shuts down all ?s on Obama's admin)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 128 | View Replies]

To: Rinnwald
"It's Lord now actually..."
186 posted on 02/23/2012 12:36:13 PM PST by EEGator
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 153 | View Replies]

To: BigpapaBo
The points in the distributor cap may make it but I think the the condenser will fry. The ignition coil- it takes 12v DC from your car and “transforms” it to a high enough voltage (30k to 60k) to get a spark at the plugs. Say that 12v DC increases to 36v. What voltage would you get to the plugs? Yor condenser wouldn't make the cut at 36volts let alone the saturation in the coil. It's not much current but the volts will kill it. Alternators have electronics too- Rectifiers. Zap.

I agree with all of your post and would like to add another failure point in both old and new vehicles based on the Russian tests. They found failure points in generator and vehicle windings from breakdown in the varnish. This is of particular concern for older "safe" autos.
187 posted on 02/23/2012 12:37:59 PM PST by PA Engineer (Time to beat the swords of government tyranny into the plowshares of freedom.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 169 | View Replies]

To: Kartographer
My position has always been that EMP big or EMP effect small the terror and confusion created would be as bad or worse than the EMP effect itself.

But if all you are looking for is terror, why bother with EMP? Just set off the little cheap fission bomb in the container and blow LA to hell (not a long trip). Now you not only flatten a good chunk of LA, but you close every container port and rail hub in the country as ever single stinking box has to be opened and inspected. The transportation system is wrecked, chaos is caused and you don't have to pay $10,000 a pound to launch your bomb.

More importantly unlike an ICBM or FOBS launch, that tells everybody who sent it, the bomb-in-a-box has no return address. Or if it does you can arrange to have it blamed on someone else. For example let traces in place so that a bomb sent by the Saudis gets blamed on Iran and take out two birds with one nuke.

An EMP attack on the US isn't worth the cost. And is beyond the ability of countries like Iran in any case. The countries that could deliver a high altitude EMP have better ways of trashing us.

EMP only makes sense where you want to take some location in one piece. Hitting the US with no ability for follow up and certainty of retaliation makes no sense.
188 posted on 02/23/2012 12:38:35 PM PST by GonzoGOP (There are millions of paranoid people in the world and they are all out to get me.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 181 | View Replies]

To: LibLieSlayer
I also know that it will take more than that to drive us back into the stone age

Let the east and west coasts wake up tomorrow without working iPhones and see what happens.

189 posted on 02/23/2012 12:41:05 PM PST by bgill (Romney & Obama are both ineligible. A non-NBC GOP prez shuts down all ?s on Obama's admin)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 135 | View Replies]

To: GonzoGOP

I see your point.

But who knows the mind of a terrorist? Not me.


190 posted on 02/23/2012 12:41:39 PM PST by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 188 | View Replies]

To: Kartographer
But who knows the mind of a terrorist? Not me.

The point is terrorists are cheap. Real evil, reasonably priced. Every terrorist attack has been on the cheap. Think bout 9/11, box cutters. Oklahoma City fertilizer, diesel fuel and some 55 gallon drums. USS Cole, a rubber raft and some plastic explosive. Terrorists don't do James Bond super weapons, they do IEDs. Millions of dollars may sound expensive but ICBMs are priced in the billions. Heck Russia can currently only deploy only three new ICBMs a year! There is a reason that only the US, China and Russia have any ICBMs at all. Pakistan, India, Israel, France, England only have IRBMs or SLBMs. And England's SLBMs come stamped Made in the USA.

ICBMs and worse yet FOBS are monstrously expensive. H-Bombs are even more expensive. Simple fission bombs and a container are cheap in comparison. If there is one thing terrorists have been absolutely consistent on is that they are tight with money and will use the least expensive way available to cause terror.
191 posted on 02/23/2012 12:54:26 PM PST by GonzoGOP (There are millions of paranoid people in the world and they are all out to get me.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 190 | View Replies]

To: GonzoGOP

Yeah those saudi’s are dirt poor.


192 posted on 02/23/2012 12:56:45 PM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 191 | View Replies]

To: BigpapaBo

What would happen if an EMP hit near the Tennessee Valley Authority?

A few summers ago, our tv cable was constantly messed up. The company swore it was solar flares. I don’t know if they were cya but if true then it’s something to think about.


193 posted on 02/23/2012 12:57:34 PM PST by bgill (Romney & Obama are both ineligible. A non-NBC GOP prez shuts down all ?s on Obama's admin)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 169 | View Replies]

To: driftdiver

Yes, I want a galvenized garbage can since the neighbors stole ours (and the brand new never used garden rake) but being on a budget I was thinking of what I had on hand already.


194 posted on 02/23/2012 1:03:32 PM PST by bgill (Romney & Obama are both ineligible. A non-NBC GOP prez shuts down all ?s on Obama's admin)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 171 | View Replies]

To: GonzoGOP
Well what Iran is doing isn't cheap. They are bankrupting themselves and causing a lot of misery with thier nuke program spending.
195 posted on 02/23/2012 1:04:02 PM PST by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 191 | View Replies]

To: Axeslinger

“What are the consequences of EMP or severe solar storm on these devices? It is theorized, but I don’t believe that is known.”

It’s important to clear up this confusion. A Solar EMP is very low frequency - geomagnetic in nature. There is no danger to electronics directly from the solar storm EMP.

But, that’s not the end of the story. Solar Storm EMP manifests itself as a DC current on power transmission lines. This DC offset, if significant enough causes transformers to saturate their ferromagnetic cores every half-cycle. One of the effects of this is the imposition of apparent reactive load on a power system - to compensate, a system may switch on capacitor banks. They may switch the on and off repeatedly as they try to compensate - this can cause significant out-of-spec voltage spikes on power systems that can damage electronics.

If the transformer saturation is really bad, they will quickly overheat and potentially go “boom”. This can also have potentially bad effects on connected electronics downstream from that transformer.

For a nuclear EMP, The military standards have been developed with solid state devices in mind. They recommend a 10,000 fold EMP reduction in most frequency ranges.


196 posted on 02/23/2012 1:12:18 PM PST by RFEngineer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 163 | View Replies]

To: Kartographer
They are bankrupting themselves and causing a lot of misery with thier nuke program spending.

Again making my point by another avenue. They are going bankrupt to build a low yield fission bomb and short range low lift missiles. Yet to do the high altitude EMP they need high yield low mass fusion weapons and high mass capable launch systems. If they are going bankrupt building the former, how are they going to build the latter when it is orders of magnitudes more expensive.

As for the Saudis. Why launch an EMP weapon when they can buy the US President for a fraction of the cost?
197 posted on 02/23/2012 1:59:44 PM PST by GonzoGOP (There are millions of paranoid people in the world and they are all out to get me.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 195 | View Replies]

To: bgill

Honestly, I can’t say. Any facility or home will be affected in one way or another. Mostly inconvenience or bad in some cases. Think of what wires do. They convey energy of some sort. If that energy is increased to the point of conductor failure, (degradation of wiring insulation or melting the conductor) well something is going to happen. It doesn’t matter the size of the conductor.
I met one of our fine WI state troopers out on the road early this morning. I couldn’t see him but I knew he was there. My radar detector went nuts. The radar sets in their cruisers operate at a power of 1-3 watts of directed radar microwave energy, (If I remember correctly). Imagine/hypothetically that the microwave energy going up to say 100-300 watts. It might not burn out my radar detector but I know the amout of energy has increased because my detector is screaming at me. Move up to 1000 watts and on and on. Then instead of a radar detector, direct that energy to a conductor. Something will happen eventually. EMP/Carrington event = orders of magnitude greater than a troopers radar gun.
Now, we directed microwave energy/EMP/solar flare to a conductor wasn’t designed to carry alot of energy (Cable TV signals/low voltage). When the conductor “picks up” that higher energy, it will degrade the signal to your TV and most likely will fry them both.
In the case of your cable getting squirrelly, IDUNNO. Most cable TV signals travel on coax cable that is shielded from external interference. If there is a bad connection or broken shielding anywhere in the cable run it will cause interference. High voltage power lines (at 5k-12k volts,higher EMF radiation) sometimes run near cable tv coax on the poles. Look at your power poles on the street. Did the cable TV crew replace the coaxial cable run when you had the signal interference?
On the solar flare/storm side, an S4 or S5 solar storm that hits the earth directly (NOAA spaceweather.gov), we won’t be watching much TV. A solar event like we recently experienced didn’t do much to us terrestrials. I believe they affected some satelites and data repeater facilities.
TVA? As before, if it has a wire connected to it or electronics control it. Assume Zap. The nuke plants, they have systems that are designed with fail safes and back-ups galore. I’m not a nuke operator and haven’t been around them much. I do not know if they have “hardened” control systems or “hardened “ back-ups for emergencies. I do know they can scramble the reactor pretty quickly and I have read most newer nukes can cool themselves down without any external power. If someone can expand on that information i’d be interested in knowing.
We do not have “hardened” control systems at the facility I operate. If the electric grid goes down, I can’t generate either. That and a lack of fuel (NG in my case).


198 posted on 02/23/2012 2:18:52 PM PST by BigpapaBo (If it don't kill you it'll make you _________!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 193 | View Replies]

To: chessplayer
Here's the next piece of gear I've got my eye on (solar-powered Kindle):

http://www.solarmio.com/en/

199 posted on 02/23/2012 2:47:03 PM PST by The Duke
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: metmom

Placemark


200 posted on 02/23/2012 3:08:36 PM PST by Brad’s Gramma (PRAY for this country like your life depends on it....)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 161 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-5051-100101-150151-200201-245 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson