The Spymaster: Meir Dagan on Iran's threat

http://www.cbsnews.com ^ | March 11, 2012 7:06 PM

[deek69]

Meir Dagan has been described as "hard-charging" and "stops at nothing." For more than eight years, Dagan made full use of those qualities as chief of Mossad, Israel's intelligence agency, where he focused on keeping Iran from developing a nuclear weapon. When that job ended, Dagan did something unheard of for an ex-Mossad chief: he spoke out publicly, voicing opposition to Israel launching preemptive airstrikes against Iran's nuclear facilities anytime soon. Dagan believes the Iranian regime is a rational one and even its president, Mahmoud Ahmadinejad - who has called for Israel to be annihilated - acts in a somewhat rational way when it comes to Iran's nuclear ambitions.

[U-238]

There will be nothing of Tel Aviv in a war. Hezbollah has 50,000 missiles of all classes including Scud missiles aimed at targets inside Israel.

[navydad]

Just what Obama wants to hear!
Whatever you joos do... wait until AFTER I’m re-elected. Then I can skate through anything.

[Terry Mross]

I wouldn’t be surprised if Israel goes out in a blaze of glory and takes everyone with them.

I know telling Iran that Israel won’t do anything is sure going to make Iran think twice. sarc

[U-238]

I wouldn’t be surprised if Israel goes out in a blaze of glory and takes everyone with them.

The Samson Option

[jmacusa]

Right up until the end Jews at Auschwitz really thought they were going to take a shower even though they could smell the burning bodies. Before that people thought Hitler was a reasonable man. Chamberlin thought so. The Jewish people can’t let “Never Again’’ happen again and Iran’s leadership is determined to make it ‘’happen again’’. The world has had years to do something about Iran and it’s nuclear ambitions and the clock has been ticking away. If Israel is attacked with a nuke by Iran does anyone doubt we won’t be next? Seventy years ago the Jews of Europe were left to their fate and thus was The Holocaust. The Jews of Israel aren’t going to wait for a world that doesn’t care about their survival, they’ll act or they’ll perish.

[jmacusa]

I thought they called it “The Goliath Option’’?

[lurk]

“I wouldn’t be surprised if Israel goes out in a blaze of glory and takes everyone with them.”

That’s not the way scripture says it will end. It says that the Israelis will spend 7 months cleaning up the bodies and war debris of their vanquished enemies.

[editor-surveyor]

Incipiant alzheimer’s?

[editor-surveyor]

>> “There will be nothing of Tel Aviv in a war.” <<

.
Wake up and read Psalm 83. It is the prophecy of what is going to happen between Juda (present day ‘Israel’) and its neighbors that constantly torment her.

God says Israel wins.

[Chode]

i think the time has truly come...

Posted by David Bogner on July 16, 2006

A difficult lesson

When I was in the Navy, I once witnessed a bar fight in downtown Olongapo (Philippines) that still haunts my dreams.  The fight was between a big oafish Marine and a rather soft-spoken, medium sized Latino sailor from my ship. 

All evening the Marine had been trying to pick a fight with one of us and had finally set his sights on this diminutive shipmate of mine... figuring him for a safe target.  When my friend refused to be goaded into a fight the Marine sucker punched him from behind on the side of the head so hard that blood instantly started to pour from this poor man's mutilated ear.

Everyone present was horrified and was prepared to absolutely murder this Marine, but my shipmate quickly turned on him and began to single-handedly back him towards a corner with a series of stinging jabs and upper cuts that gave more than a hint to a youth spent boxing in a small gym in the Bronx.

Each punch opened a cut on the Marine's startled face and by the time he had been backed completely into the corner he was blubbering for someone to stop the fight.  He invoked his split lips and chipped teeth as reasons to stop the fight.  He begged us to stop the fight because he could barely see through the river of blood that was pouring out of his split and swollen brows.

Nobody moved.  Not one person.

The only sound in the bar was the sickening staccato sound of this sailor's lightning fast fists making contact with new areas of the Marine's head.  The only sound I have heard since that was remotely similar was from the first Rocky film when Sylvester Stallone was punching sides of beef in the meat locker.

Finally the Marine's pleading turned to screams.... a high, almost womanly shriek.   And still the punches continued relentlessly. 

Several people in the bar took a few tentative steps as though they wanted to try to break it up at that point, but hands reached out from the crowd and held them tight.  I'm not ashamed to say that mine were two of the hands that held someone back.

You see, in between each blow the sailor had begun chanting a soft cadence: "Say [punch] you [punch] give [punch] up [punch]... say [punch] you [punch]were [punch] wrong [punch]". 

He had been repeating it to the Marine almost from the start but we only became aware of it when the typical barroom cheers had died down and we began to be sickened by the sight and sound of the carnage.

This Marine stood there shrieking in the corner of the bar trying futilely to block the carefully timed punches that were cutting his head to tatters... right down to the skull in places. But he refused to say that he gave up... or that he was wrong. 

Even in the delirium of his beating he believed in his heart that someone would stop the fight before he had to admit defeat.  I'm sure this strategy had served him well in the past and had allowed him to continue on his career as a barroom bully.

Finally, in a wail of agony the Marine shrieked  "I give up", and we gently backed the sailor away from him.

I'm sure you can guess why I have shared this story today. 

I'm not particularly proud to have been witness to such a bloody spectacle, and the sound of that Marine's woman-like shrieks will haunt me to my grave.  But I learned something that evening that Israel had better learn for itself if it is to finally be rid of at least one of its tormentors:

This is one time an Arab aggressor must be allowed to be beaten so badly that every civilized nation will stand in horror, wanting desperately to step in and stop the carnage... but knowing that the fight will only truly be over when one side gives up and finally admits defeat.

Just as every person who had ever rescued that bully from admitting defeat helped create the cowardly brute I saw that evening in the bar, every well-intentioned power that has ever stepped in and negotiated a ceasefire for an Arab aggressor has helped create the monsters we see around us today.

President Lahoud of Lebanon, a big Hezbollah supporter and a close ally of Syria, has been shrieking non-stop to the UN Security Council for the past two days to get them to force Israel into a cease fire.

Clearly he has been reading his autographed copy of 'Military Success for Dummies Arab Despots' by the late Gamal Abdel Nasser of Egypt.  Ever since Nasser accidentally discovered the trick in '56, every subsequent Arab leader has stuck to his tried and true formula for military success:

1. Instigate a war. 
2. Once the war is well underway and you are in the process of having your ass handed to you... get a few world powers to force your western opponent into a cease fire. 
3. Whatever you do, don't surrender or submit to any terms dictated by your enemy.  That would ruin everything!  All you have to do is wait it out and eventually the world will become sickened at what is being done to your soldiers and civilian population... and will force a truce.
4. Once a truce has been called you can resume your intransigence (which probably caused the conflict in the first place), and even declare victory as your opponent leaves the field of battle.

This tactic has never failed.  Not once. 

In fact it worked so will for the Egyptians in 1973, that to this day they celebrate the Yom Kippur War - a crushing defeat at the hands of Israel -  as a military victory!  No kidding... it's a national holiday over there!

President Lahoud has already begun to shriek like a school girl to the UN Security Council to "Stop the violence and arrange a cease-fire, and then after that we'll be ready to discuss all matters."   

Uh huh.  Forgive me if I find that a tad hard to swallow.  He allowed Hezbollah to take over his country.  He allowed the regular Lebanese army to provide radar targeting data for the Hezbollah missile that struck the Israeli destroyer.  He has turned a blind eye while Iranian and Syrian weapons, advisers and money have poured into his country. 

And now that his country is in ruins he wants to call it a draw.

As much as it may sicken the world to stand by and watch it happen, strong hands need to hold back the weak-hearted and let the fight continue until one side finally admits unambiguous defeat.

[Sequoyah101]

Bravo! I agree but it will probably not be done.

Well written by Mr. Bogner though.

I saw a woman with a dog chain, produced from her purse, clear a bar in Tiptonville, Tennessee one evening. The carnage confirmed my maxim to never get in a fight unless it is to kill. Just not worth the trouble and risk otherwise.

[Verginius Rufus]

The Samson option would mean the Israelis were all dead too. Maybe some version of MAD (Mutually Assured Destruction) would work—if the Iranian leaders know that the Israelis will 10 Iranians for every one Israeli they kill (just using that figure because Iran has about 10 times as many people), they might be more deterred by that than by feeble warnings from the UN or the White House. There is no way the Iranians could take out all the sites from which Israel would launch its attacks so they would be very vulnerable.

[MarkL]

Unfortunately, it's not just Israel... The US has a terribly long history of doing the same thing. The only way to properly end a war is to destroy the ability of the enemy government and the will of the people to make war again. The last time this occurred was WWII.

And we've paid the price over and over again with senseless, never-ending wars.

A war is never really over until there's a complete and total loser. The problem is that "civilized countries" are loathe to do that, especially if the other country is "disadvantaged."

Mark

[Chode]

something has to give, one way or another...

[rednek]

Tehran will be a smoking hole in the desert if the Iranians launch an attack. Bibi’s only comment should be “Anyone else want some?” and then walk silently out of the press room.....red

[MarkL]

Maybe some version of MAD (Mutually Assured Destruction) would work—if the Iranian leaders know that the Israelis will 10 Iranians for every one Israeli they kill (just using that figure because Iran has about 10 times as many people), they might be more deterred by that than by feeble warnings from the UN or the White House. There is no way the Iranians could take out all the sites from which Israel would launch its attacks so they would be very vulnerable.

The problem is that the mullahs control the military, and the "grand ayatolla" was quoted as saying that it would be "worth it" to lose 100 million muslims if it meant wiping out Israel and the Jews. And they don't care how many arabs are killed; There's no love lost between Iranians (Persians) and the arabs (a different "race").

Mark

[Sequoyah101]

You would think wouldn’t you? I mean how long can we go on with the economy just barely hanging on, the decay of almost everything that makes us what we are and protects us, the continuous face off in the Middle East and lots of other places and the growing tension by China? And the list just goes on and on. I challenge people to name one really good thing done in this nation since the Interstate and Defense Highway System... they can’t. Name one success we have had since Regan and the military adventures of his day or the “defeat” of communism. I say “defeat” since I think the Trojan Horses they left behind are now doing their work on our country.

we are rotting as a nation and only a few know it.

[Chode]

yup, war is NOT a civilized thing... it is to kill the enemy and destroy his will/ability to make war again, or you can bet your bottom dollar, he will again given the chance

[Chode]

i heard that...