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Was Florida shooter a vigilante or diligent neighbor?
AP via Washington Times ^ | M>arch 22, 2012 | Mike Schneider

Posted on 03/22/2012 5:48:28 AM PDT by libstripper

George Zimmerman once took criminal justice classes at the community college and was practically a one-man neighborhood watch in his gated part of town, calling police close to 50 times over the past eight years to report such things as slow-driving vehicles, strangers loitering in the neighborhood and open garages.

(Excerpt) Read more at washingtontimes.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: flshooting; zimmerman
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This case is not as clearly anti-Zimmerman as many here on FR seem to believe and the MSM is telling us. FTA:

When police officers arrived, Martin was lifeless, face down on the ground, while Zimmerman was bleeding from his head and his back was covered in grass, as if he had been on the ground, the police report said.

Sanford police issued a statement Wednesday defending their decision not to arrest Zimmerman. They said that when officers arrived, he claimed self-defense, “which at the time was supported by physical evidence and testimony.”

The police chief said Zimmerman claimed he was attacked by Martin after he had given up his chase and was returning to his truck.(my emphasis)

As noted earlier here, at least one witness saw Zimmerman on the ground with Martin on top of him, beating him, and Zimmerman crying for help before Zimmerman shot Martin. This is suported by the police finding of grass on Zimmerman's back and Zimmerman having a head injury, apparently from Martin's beating him. As noted above, Zimmerman says Martin attacked him after Zimmerman "had given up his chase and was returning to his truck." If that's true, then Zimmerman, fool that he may have been for initiating the confrontation, still has a solid self defense case. Indeed, since he's the only direct witness to how he and Martin came into physical contact, that could be a very hard case to disprove.

All in all, we should withhold judgment until this case is fully investigated and it's detemined which of the men inititated the physical confrontation. LSM screechers, like the odious Shepard Smith, should shut their collective pie holes.

1 posted on 03/22/2012 5:48:35 AM PDT by libstripper
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To: libstripper

There’s always two sides to every story. Unfortunately, Zimmerman has already been convicted thanks to lame stream hysterical media who never get the facts in a case.


2 posted on 03/22/2012 5:54:01 AM PDT by kenmcg (How)
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To: libstripper

“This case is not as clearly anti-Zimmerman as many here on FR seem to believe and the MSM is telling us. FTA:”

A few years ago, there were a string of burglaries in our neighborhood and we had the misfortune to be among the victims. It took the police 45 minutes to get here and another time while we were out—after we put in an alarm—almost an hour. Nobody, and I mean nobody now drives a strange vehicle through the neighborhood without the license plate being taken down or if a stranger comes through, someone will “chat” with them to see if it might be friend or foe. I can tell you that if one of the “aliens” would become hostile, I’ll be calling the cops and telling them the “alien” is dead just to get them here in a reasonable aount of time regardless of whether I shot them or not.


3 posted on 03/22/2012 5:55:46 AM PDT by freeangel ( (free speech is only good until someone else doesn't like it)
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To: libstripper
One thing I'm not particularly clear on...

Did Treyvon's family also live in the gated community?

If not, what was Treyvon doing in it? Most gated communities I know, you have to check in at the gate and be either a resident or the registered guest of one. So if Treyvon was neither, he was just taking a short cut or whatever and didn't bother to check in at the gate. Then he really was "acting suspiciously" and Zimmerman had every right to stop him and ask what he was doing there, as gated communities aren't "public property". At a minimum he was trespassing.

4 posted on 03/22/2012 5:58:56 AM PDT by apillar
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To: apillar
"Then he really was "acting suspiciously" and Zimmerman had every right to stop him and ask what he was doing there,"

Some FReepers will say Zimmerman didn't have that right.

5 posted on 03/22/2012 6:02:07 AM PDT by RabidBartender (The above statement is not meant to be offensive to women. Please don't whine and have me banned.)
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To: apillar

Supposedly, the sperm donor of the 6’3/200lb ‘boy’ lived somewhere thereabouts.


6 posted on 03/22/2012 6:02:47 AM PDT by tomkat (FU.baraq)
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To: libstripper
“As noted earlier here, at least one witness saw Zimmerman on the ground with Martin on top of him, beating him, and Zimmerman crying for help before Zimmerman shot Martin.”

Early on, I recall hearing a 911 tape from a resident inside her home. She called because someone was outside screaming for help, then there was a gun shot. You could hear the whole thing through the phone. At that time, I assumed it was the teen who was screaming. Now, it sounds like it was Zimmerman. Still, Zimmerman could have chosen to avoid a confrontation, was even advised to, so I he will have a hard time convincing anybody he “feared for his life”.

7 posted on 03/22/2012 6:04:20 AM PDT by ryan71 (Dear spell check - No, I will not capitalize the "m" in moslem!)
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To: kenmcg; libstripper

If we go no further than what Zimmerman says to the 911 dispatcher he is in big trouble.


8 posted on 03/22/2012 6:04:57 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: libstripper

.

While the Zimmerman ‘white’ on black killing is covered 24/7 on the MSM with an outpouring of rage and charges of a racial hate crime, where is the concern- where is the rage about the home invasion, torture, beating, rape and murder of the elderly white couple by ‘African Americans’ in Oklahoma just the other day?

The 90 year old war veteran husband was beaten, his jaw broken, shot in the face with a BB gun and now barely clings to life.

The 85 year old partially blind wife was raped and beaten to death.

.

There’s a lot more here than a home invasion and robbery.

WHERE ARE THE CHARGES OF A RACIAL HATE CRIME??

90 year old husband’s jaw broken and shot in face with BB gun?

85 wife year old semi blind wife RAPED and BEATEN to death??

Where is the 24/7 MSM coverage

Where is the outrage?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2117695/Brutal-home-invasion-Oklahoma-couple-ends-65-year-romance-meeting-blind-date.html


9 posted on 03/22/2012 6:06:04 AM PDT by patriot08 (TEXAS GAL- born and bred and proud of it!)
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To: ryan71

“Zimmerman could have chosen to avoid a confrontation”

Confrontation is legal. Martin’s right to swing his fist ended at Zimmerman’s nose.


10 posted on 03/22/2012 6:07:15 AM PDT by AppyPappy (If you really want to annoy someone, point out something obvious that they are trying hard to ignore)
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To: RabidBartender
Read Florida's own laws on trespassing. An old custom called "posting" is pretty evidently still in place. I used Google.Earth to find if there were actually "gates" and "signs" and couldn't find them. Doesn't mean they don't exist, but they aren't immediately obvious.

Seemed to me this was a formerly gated community that fell on hard times so they laid off the guards.

11 posted on 03/22/2012 6:09:22 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: apillar
You are asking the question that I can still not find an answer too. “Did he live in the gated community? Yes, or no?”

If he lives there, then Zimmy Boy brought this beating on himself and should have not shot him.

If he does not, he should not have been there. He was on Private Property.

12 posted on 03/22/2012 6:09:28 AM PDT by WakeUpAndVote
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To: RabidBartender
"Then he really was "acting suspiciously" and Zimmerman had every right to stop him and ask what he was doing there,"

Some FReepers will say Zimmerman didn't have that right.

And I would agree with them if Treyvon was walking down the sidewalk in the middle of town. But this was a gated community, not "public property". Gated communities by there nature are "private" usually run by a homeowners association and you are expected to abide by the rules if you are on the premises. Now was Zimmerman working "for" the homeowners association in his capacity as Neighborhood Watch Captain and therefore had the right to enforce the rules? I don't know. But if this goes to court, this is what it could hinge on. If the the Association rules say that paid security or volunteer neighborhood watch can challenge anybody they don't recognize, then Zimmerman is on pretty safe ground doing what he did (even though the 911 operator advised him against it).

13 posted on 03/22/2012 6:10:13 AM PDT by apillar
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To: tomkat

Tomkat, I think the donor will be appearing in a new game show on liberal TV, titled “Whose Your Babies Daddy.” Not fiction just reality in the USA


14 posted on 03/22/2012 6:12:32 AM PDT by No Surrender No Retreat
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To: libstripper
““That is crazy. That is totally crazy,” Gaffar said. “Why does he have to carry a gun? Something is totally wrong with that picture.””

What picture? The one of the founding fathers writing the Constitution?

15 posted on 03/22/2012 6:14:18 AM PDT by faucetman ( Just the facts, ma'am, Just the facts)
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To: AppyPappy
I wonder why we just see pictures of this kid's 12 football Photo.

I am sure their are High School pictures of him in his year book and each Football roster I seen tells the height and weight of each player on the team.

Yet the media has chosen not to give out that information.

16 posted on 03/22/2012 6:14:38 AM PDT by scooby321
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To: AppyPappy
Reading through the relevant Florida laws, Zimmerman's right to follow and accost Martin and instill in him fear for his life ended the second he got out of his car carrying a gun and advancing on Martin.

There are two sides to this "stand your ground" issue, and the guy with the gun isn't the only one with rights. You add to that the fact that Florida law does not require CONTACT, it gets a tad murky.

Still, after the killing it was pretty obvious Martin wasn't suspicious at all, wasn't armed, and had been going about his business quite lawfully.

No wonder the local cops were so willing to let Zimmerman go ~ they simply couldn't figure it out. So, time to toss more lawyers on the fire.

My bet is Zimmerman goes to jail.

17 posted on 03/22/2012 6:15:20 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: patriot08
All in due course ~ first, have they caught the perpetrators? If so you have something comparable to the Florida situation if and when the cops let the perps loose. Otherwise it's not the same.

We have a guy who used a gun to kill a fellow he'd been stalking and the cops turned him loose.

18 posted on 03/22/2012 6:18:13 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: libstripper

I agree.

If the kid attacked Zimmerman, he MIGHT have been justified. But as this was not in Zimmerman’s home and the kid was unarmed and appeared to be behaving in a non-suspicious manner, I question Zimmerman’s actions. But am willing to wait and see.

There are legitimate reasons for people to go about armed. I support this. But whnever somebody abuses that right, it creates opportunities for left-wing ideologues like Shppard Smith etc to attack us and that right.

We need to wait and see what more materializes here. Trying people in the press is an insidious abuse of our right to a fair trial by our peers.


19 posted on 03/22/2012 6:20:05 AM PDT by ZULU (LIBERATE HAGIA SOPHIA!!!!!)
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To: libstripper
All in all, we should withhold judgment until this case is fully investigated

Frankly, that's universally good advice. Rarely does a news account of an incident tell enough of the whole story to make an informed decision, and more often than not, only contains one side's views of the event.

20 posted on 03/22/2012 6:21:03 AM PDT by kevkrom (Note to self: proofread, then post. It's better that way.)
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To: kenmcg; All

Since I posted this, I’ve come on more information posted here on FR that shows we FReepers are a lot better journalists than, among others, “the journalists at Fox News,” as self-described by Shepard Smith. It turns out there are one or more independent witnesses who corroborate Zimmerman’s testimony that Martin attacked Zimmerman after Zimmerman dropped off his pursuit of Martin. Please see:

http://www.wesh.com/r-video/30696935/detail.html

It always helps to get the whole story before jumping to conclusions.

Now it looks like this started with Zimmerman following Martin and then getting out of his truck to have some type of ill-advised personal interaction with Martin. Then, for one reson or another, Zimmerman chose to break off the contact. Martin, however, being s somewhat high-strung, athletic young man, decided to get even with Zimmerman for being hassled, jumped Zimmerman, got him down, and started beating Zimmerman. At that point Zimmerman, being beaten by this large, powerful football player, legitimately feared suffering death or great bodily harm and legally shot Martin.


21 posted on 03/22/2012 6:21:16 AM PDT by libstripper
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To: scooby321

I’m with you on this. There is a paucity of information on him and the media continue to ignore it. My guess is that what background there is does not fit the template. sd


22 posted on 03/22/2012 6:21:41 AM PDT by shotdog (I love my country. It's our government I'm afraid of.)
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To: muawiyah

There’s a lot more. Take a look at my excerpt from the article.


23 posted on 03/22/2012 6:24:40 AM PDT by libstripper
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To: apillar
NOTE: Zimmerman just followed him in his car and did not challenge Martin until he ran.

Zim then got out of his truck/car and followed him on foot carrying a firearm which he then used to kill Martin.

So, anything that leads back to the theory that Zim could "challenge" any visitor is a dead end. That's because he actually didn't "challenge" him earlier. He challenged him "later", on foot, after he'd reported what he was doing to the 911 clerk who advised him to not follow him.

Not that Zimmerman had to obey the clerk, but the next legal issue up after that event is whether or not Martin had a reasonable fear for his life, and since he's dead, we'd have to say YES!

Really folks, keep in mind that this case has a dead body and whatever theories you come up with have to deal with that fact. So far no one has come up with any reason why the shooter had to shoot the victim!

24 posted on 03/22/2012 6:26:21 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: libstripper

I’m amazed at rush to judgement here. It’s the opposite side of the same coin you all are complaining about.

Pathetic.


25 posted on 03/22/2012 6:26:55 AM PDT by SengirV
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To: libstripper

Does anyone know if the neighborhood watch vehicles are marked or if Zimmerman was wearing a jacket or cap that would identify him as a member of the neighborhood watch?


26 posted on 03/22/2012 6:27:34 AM PDT by smokingfrog ( sleep with one eye open (<o> ---)
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To: libstripper

I figured there was more to this. The way the media makes it sound, including Fox, is that the Watch guy phoned in, said there was someone suspicious, then chaesed the kid down, and that the kid was on the cell phone to his girl friend who said he was scared and running and then they heard gun shots.

Not ONE WORD about any potetnial scuffle that had Zimmerman on the ground and bleeding, or any witnesses stating as much.

This one piece of information, if true, changes my opinion and view of the case 180 degrees. From a guy chasing a young kid down and killing him to a guy chasing a young kid who he couldn’t catch and then getting blind sided by that same kid and having to defend himself.


27 posted on 03/22/2012 6:27:44 AM PDT by Jeff Head (quivalent of our AEGIS and they already have six of them. They need to build 16 f those. Their Ast)
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To: libstripper
Two things about the witnesses: (1) Even professional journalists found the witnesses tell inconsistent stories ~ probably having to do with where they were at the time, and (2) None of the witnesses has said s--+ under oath.

You drag a witness out who is willing to go on camera, in a magistrate's or other court, and swear then we'll listen.

Part of their reluctance may have to do with the fact that Zimmerman is on the loose and presumably still armed and dangerous. Which is a disturbing aspect ~

28 posted on 03/22/2012 6:31:49 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: tomkat; apillar

Actually, it was the sperm-donors current sperm-depository’s house that the kid was walking back to. I have only seen it mentioned that it was “near” or “by” the Retreat gated community.


29 posted on 03/22/2012 6:34:29 AM PDT by Dead Corpse (Steampunk- Yesterday's Tomorrow, Today)
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To: Jeff Head
Jeff Head, Zimmerman provided a written statement to the cops along the lines of "he ran so I followed him, gave up, returned to my truck and he attacked me".

That statement has been known almost since the beginning of the case!

The family got a lawyer to go after the police 911 call recordings to see if that confirmed Zimmerman's statement.

Turned out there are some serious discrepancies.

The discussion of the discrepancies touched off the firestorm. Until then NOBODY CARED!

30 posted on 03/22/2012 6:36:26 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: WakeUpAndVote
“If he lives there, then Zimmy Boy brought this beating on himself and should have not shot him.”

“Zimmy Boy”???? I wonder where your bias lies?

“brought this beating on himself”??? How do you bring a beating on yourself? Following someone? Being a neighborhood watch captain?

I don't care if he followed Trayvon Martin all over the area calling Trayvon’ mom a crack whore. It doesn't allow him to assault Zimmerman or take away Zimmerman's right to defend himself.

31 posted on 03/22/2012 6:39:22 AM PDT by faucetman ( Just the facts, ma'am, Just the facts)
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To: SengirV

You can differentiate between “discussion” and “judgement,” can’t you? People use the word “judge” so loosely. No one has been “judged.” People are allowed to talk and exchange ideas.


32 posted on 03/22/2012 6:40:15 AM PDT by Clara Lou (ABO! Go Newt!)
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To: ryan71
Now, it sounds like it was Zimmerman. Still, Zimmerman could have chosen to avoid a confrontation, was even advised to, so I he will have a hard time convincing anybody he “feared for his life”.

If a 6' 3", 200 pound, football playing male is sitting atop your body, beating you in the head and face, regardless of how he got there, you would BE fearing for your life and could use self defense.

If that is a real, provable fact, there is no way Zimmerman gets convicted.

What was the brother in a hoody doing in a gated {i.e. PRIVATE NO TRESPASSING ALLOWED} community? Just axing, bro?

33 posted on 03/22/2012 6:40:22 AM PDT by USS Alaska (Nuke the terrorists savages.)
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To: libstripper
I'll just set these down here for the folks who'll be needing them for facial application after the enemedia/race pimp hysteria is eventually outted as blatant incitement.

It's cool in here, so they'll keep for a couple days . . .


34 posted on 03/22/2012 6:45:09 AM PDT by tomkat (FU.baraq)
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To: USS Alaska

He was in the community with his father and his father’s girlfriend.


35 posted on 03/22/2012 6:51:22 AM PDT by Ratman83
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To: No Surrender No Retreat

Maury Povich already has just such a show.


36 posted on 03/22/2012 6:52:43 AM PDT by lacrew (Mr. Soetoro, we regret to inform you that your race card is over the credit limit.)
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To: libstripper

From what I’ve read, your account seems the most likely.

Good summary.

Zimmerman probably started the trouble. Somewhere along the way, he became the one in danger.

Eventually he was using self-defense. Though the fact (if it’s a fact) that he initiated contact, armed, is not a point in his favor.

He does seem to meet the criteria toward the end of the altercation, to have been in real fear for his life.

At that time - once the larger Martin had Zimmerman on the ground pounding his head by some accounts, one or the other of the two was probably not going home that day.

I’m no lawyer, so I’ll not pretend to opine as to what crimes may have been committed.

However clearly the story is being wildly spun in the media.


37 posted on 03/22/2012 6:55:21 AM PDT by Cringing Negativism Network ("The door is open" PALIN 2012)
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To: muawiyah
Turned out there are some serious discrepancies.

Only in your fevered imagination.

Don't you have an episode of The View to go watch?

38 posted on 03/22/2012 6:55:21 AM PDT by Dead Corpse (Steampunk- Yesterday's Tomorrow, Today)
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To: libstripper

Zimmerman created the confrotation that lead to the altercation, Martin didn’t drag him from his car, bring him within arms reach and pummel him.

There is no self defense here, just a overzealous neighborhood watch guy who thought he was a cop who bit off more than he could chew, and when it didn’t go his way, shot the guy.

Zimmerman clearly created the situation, for him to claim victim status is laughable.


39 posted on 03/22/2012 6:55:40 AM PDT by HamiltonJay
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To: ryan71

If the kid jumped Zimmerman and had him on the ground beating him then Zimmerman was well within his rights to shoot in self defense. If thats what really went down especially if Zimmerman was withdrawing from the fray and heading back to his truck he is probably home free. Fla gun laws are pretty lenient.


40 posted on 03/22/2012 6:57:11 AM PDT by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: AppyPappy

>>>“Zimmerman could have chosen to avoid a confrontation”

Confrontation is legal. Martin’s right to swing his fist ended at Zimmerman’s nose.<<<

I think we need to define confrontation. If Zimmerman confronted Martin by approaching him and saying, “Excuse me, can you tell me what you are doing here? Do you iive here?” he would be perfectly within his rights. Even if he was ruder about it, it would not give Martin the right to attack him.

Now, if Zimmerman tried to apprehend Martin or physically assaulted or verbally threatened him, Martin would have the right to fight back, and Zimmerman would be at fault.

We still don’t know how Zimmerman “confronted” Martin. I suspect that he did not lay hands on him or threaten him with violence, prior to Martin attacking him, but at this point we don’t know.

The media has used the fact that Zimmerman has called the police about 45 times against him. What they generally don’t mention is that this was over a period of 8 years (roughly 1 call every 2 months) and that he apparently never physically assaulted any of the prior “suspects”. In my mind, this makes the idea that Zimmermn initiated the physical contact with Martin seem rather unlikely.

The more details that come out, the more I am convinced that Zimmerman is probably innocent.

I also am suspicious about the fact that all the photos of Martin seem to be of clean cut, baby faced 12 or 13 year old, often in a football uniform. If he still had such an innocent, non-threatening appearance at the time of his death, why are we not seeing any more recent photos? The media and the family seem to be trying to paint the picture of Zimmerman killing a sweet, helpless, little puppy dog, that nobody could possibly be afraid of.


41 posted on 03/22/2012 6:59:40 AM PDT by Above My Pay Grade (.)
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To: HamiltonJay
No. The Hood-rat skulking around the gated community in the rain created the problem. If you aren't casing peoples homes, you have nothing to worry about.

"Hey, what are you doing here."

"Going to my Dad's girlfriends place. Piss off..."

"Oh... Need a lift?"

"No. Go away..."

"ok...."

Nope. Instead, the Hood-rat ran. When he had a chance, he jumped Zimmerman and ended up dead for it.

42 posted on 03/22/2012 7:00:07 AM PDT by Dead Corpse (Steampunk- Yesterday's Tomorrow, Today)
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To: Above My Pay Grade

Martin felt he had the right to attack Zimmerman because Zimmerman “dissed” him...


43 posted on 03/22/2012 7:02:38 AM PDT by MrB (The difference between a Humanist and a Satanist - the latter knows whom he's working for)
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To: Dead Corpse
I can tell you are still lurking about suspiciously and want us to just ignore the fact that the "stand your ground" law gave Martin the right to do whatever he needed to escape from Zimmerman.

It's disgusting to find enemies of the "stand your ground" law on FR.

44 posted on 03/22/2012 7:05:03 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: libstripper
The media also fills their articles with outdated baby-faced pictures of Trayvon. Very few include that he was a towering 6’2” football player. Is the media really reporting the news, or is this classic agitation/propaganda to advance a political agenda?

Police played the 911 tape for Trayvon Martin’s father, who tells police that the voice screaming is not the voice of his son.

The media also characterizes Trayvon as a “model student.” In fact, he was under a five day suspension when the shooting took place. That is why he was staying at a house so far from his school on a school night. A lawyer for Trayvon’s family has blocked access to his school records

45 posted on 03/22/2012 7:07:03 AM PDT by Larry381 ("Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.")
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To: Clara Lou

Sure I can. Some of the posts here are discussion, others are a rush to judgement.


46 posted on 03/22/2012 7:08:54 AM PDT by SengirV
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To: muawiyah
It's disgusting to find enemies of the "stand your ground" law on FR.

You are projecting again. Isn't that a liberal trait?

47 posted on 03/22/2012 7:10:17 AM PDT by Dead Corpse (Steampunk- Yesterday's Tomorrow, Today)
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To: Dead Corpse

Wow, that’s some nice fiction there. Given it doesn’t remotely fit the known facts of the case, but keep living in that dillusion.

Zimmerman reported the kid FROM HIS CAR.. so, Zimmerman got out of his car, not only did he get out of his car, he shadowed Martin, coming close enough for physical altercation, which frankly I suspect this wanna be cop, most likely started.

He didn’t just step out of his car and as ask the kid a question.

You are flat out ignorant or dillusional to propose what you have, not to mention the inate bias in your terminology of Martin.

Zimmerman claiming self defense has zero merit, you can’t start a confrontation and then claim self defense when it doesn’t go the way you want. Zimmermans actions completely created the situation, and as such, the self defense claim is laughable. He’s going to face manslaughter charges and very likely going to lose.

Claiming this idiot was a victim is patently ignorant and laughable.


48 posted on 03/22/2012 7:11:38 AM PDT by HamiltonJay
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To: Cringing Negativism Network
I think the recording shows Zimmerman still in his truck when Martin ran away. Then Zimmerman gets out of his truck and tries to find Martin.

Hmm.

Did you realize Florida's "stand your ground" law does not require you to stay around ~ you can still flee if you wish ~ and that doesn't repeal your right of self-defense under that law.

We have Zimmerman's own words regarding Martin fleeing the scene!

When Zimmerman exited his truck he began tracking his quarry.

Hmm.

49 posted on 03/22/2012 7:12:32 AM PDT by muawiyah
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To: HamiltonJay

>>>Zimmerman created the confrotation that lead to the altercation, Martin didn’t drag him from his car, bring him within arms reach and pummel him<<<

Is it against the law to approach someone and ask them what they are doing? Does doing this give that person the right to attack you violently?

Zimmerman might not have been wise to get out of his car. It could also be considered unwise to walk through certain rough neighborhoods at night. Does that make victims of muggings, rapes and murders responsible for “creating the confrontation”?

What if a woman walked alone, through a dangerous neighborhood, at night, and a group of thugs tried to rape her. If she pulled out her gun and shot them, would it be her or the thugs who “created the situation”?

One’s own unwise behavior does not nullify one’s right to protect oneself, if attacked.

What we need to know, if who initiated the violence. If it was Zimmerman, then he would seem to be guilty. If it was Martin, then Zimmerman would seem to be innocent.


50 posted on 03/22/2012 7:14:36 AM PDT by Above My Pay Grade (.)
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