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DISHONORABLE FACEBOOKING? Off-Duty Marine facing discharge over Anti-Obama facebook posts
888webtoday.com ^ | 4/7/12 | unknown

Posted on 04/07/2012 5:23:10 AM PDT by kindred

While off-duty, a Marine Sergeant by the name of Gary Stein has been somewhat open about his dislike for Barack Obama. In particular, he said that he would not obey an unlawful order and gave the example of being ordered to confiscate the guns of American citizens.

Gary Kreep, president of the United States Justice Foundation (USJF) is making a last ditch effort to help prevent the Marines from giving Stein what amounts to a dishonorable discharge on April 5th.

“This is truly an urgent situation,” Kreep says. “The Marine Corps is moving at blistering speed to make an example of Sergeant Stein. They will throw him out of the Marines this Thursday, unless we can persuade a U. S. District Court Judge to intervene. AND, they want to remove him from the Corps under 'less than honorable' circumstances, a finding normally reserved for criminals!”

As for Stein's facebook posts being made known to Department of Defense officials, Kreep points to recent reports that the Obama administration is closely monitoring social network sites. News of these tactics even roused Fox News Channel's Greta Van Susteren (link below).

Kreep seems to think it quite possible that these tactics may have been used to single out Stein. “I imagine that one of the Obama campaign's "AttackWatch" staff members, using the high-tech computer monitoring systems that the Obama Administration employs to track criticism of Barack Obama on the social media, came across the website and reported back to the White House.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: garystein
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Attack watch, a brigade of the obamanation regime, has been destroying American liberties and rights gauranteed by the American Constitutional Bill of Rights as the obamantion brings in the evil communist "hope and change" agenda.
1 posted on 04/07/2012 5:23:16 AM PDT by kindred
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To: kindred

2 posted on 04/07/2012 5:27:22 AM PDT by SF_Redux (Sarah stands for accountablility and personal responsiblity, democrats can't live with that)
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To: kindred

This is among the many reasons I’m not on facebook.

Why make it easy for the tyrants to hunt you down?

What this Marine did was very foolish. Of course I don’t think he should get a dishonorable discharge but it’s hard to argue it was not a violation of the UCMJ.


3 posted on 04/07/2012 5:28:07 AM PDT by jtal (Runnin' a World in Need with White Folks' Greed - since 1492)
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To: jtal

He’s not getting a dishonorable discharge. That can only come from a General Court Martial. He’s getting an Admin Discharge under less than honorable conditions, assuming the Commanding General approves that recommendation. Still too much punishment for the “crime” but he was warned to stop his activity, so should not be surprised.

TC


4 posted on 04/07/2012 5:34:15 AM PDT by Pentagon Leatherneck
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To: jtal
A brave stance...but the commander in chief he must hold allegiance to is the office not the man.
5 posted on 04/07/2012 5:34:46 AM PDT by Vaquero (Don't pick a fight with an old guy. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: kindred

our armed services have a chain of command starting with “The President” who unfortunately happens to B. Obama.

My seven year hitch (only 2 years active) reminds me of how many times I was told to keep my “politics” to myself.

So, this guy had to have known that. Therefore, if some good marine officers are sincerely and “honestly” taking this action “in the interest of “The Corp”............then I would probably support them IF I knew exactly what the violator did.

But, on the other hand, if this action is coming down from the White House, particularly based upon them snooping on social sites then it is reprehensible to the highest degree and I hope it blows up in their face..............big time!


6 posted on 04/07/2012 5:36:38 AM PDT by Cen-Tejas (it's the debt bomb stupid!)
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To: jtal
Of course I don’t think he should get a dishonorable discharge but it’s hard to argue it was not a violation of the UCMJ.

Also hard to argue that if it had been a Republican President's face on a jackass, he would even have been brought up on charges.

7 posted on 04/07/2012 5:52:46 AM PDT by UCANSEE2 (Lame and ill-informed post)
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To: kindred

The good Sgt should have kept his mouth shut and stayed in place where he could do the most good if the time comes.


8 posted on 04/07/2012 5:53:34 AM PDT by BigCinBigD
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To: Cen-Tejas

Too bad there is no such thing as ‘jury nullification’ in the UCMJ.


9 posted on 04/07/2012 5:54:06 AM PDT by UCANSEE2 (Lame and ill-informed post)
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To: kindred
So this is what it's come to; criticize the fuerer and you pay.
10 posted on 04/07/2012 5:54:50 AM PDT by patriot08 (TEXAS GAL- born and bred and proud of it!)
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To: Vaquero

He swore an allegiance to uphold the Constitution. As did Obozo.


11 posted on 04/07/2012 5:57:20 AM PDT by Texas Fossil (Government, even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one)
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To: kindred

There was NO shortage of active duty folk Tweeting and Facebooking the same message from 2000-2008. Funny how the MSM failed to notice.


12 posted on 04/07/2012 5:57:37 AM PDT by Teacher317 ('Tis time to fear when tyrants seem to kiss.)
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To: UCANSEE2
Also hard to argue that if it had been a Republican President's face on a jackass, he would even have been brought up on charges.

Countless examples of worse than this being said about Commander in Chief GW Bush can surely be found, and surely we can find evidence of the Left cheering them on!

Paging Cindy Sheehan...

13 posted on 04/07/2012 5:58:44 AM PDT by .30Carbine (God bless you with the spirit of wisdom and understanding)
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To: kindred

Discharge my ass! A Marines first oath upon enlistment is to support and defend the Constitution against ALL enemies foreign and DOMESTIC (on the other hand Obama could qualify as foreign as well) and THEN his oath is to the POTUS not the other way around! This Marine did absolutely nothing wrong, the Constitution is CLEARLY being attacked by this current administration and this Marine should be promoted for following his oath.


14 posted on 04/07/2012 6:03:06 AM PDT by GrandJediMasterYoda (Someday our schools will teach the difference between lose and loose.)
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To: SF_Redux

Hassan the murderer still enjoys full pay and military status for guning down military peoples while Gary Stein is being persedcuted for freedom of speech gauranteed to all American citizens. Remember the bill of rights and the first ammendment to the Constitution? The unconstitutional dictaorship of the obamanation regime continues and I wonder if their will be a free America by the 2012 elections.


15 posted on 04/07/2012 6:04:49 AM PDT by kindred (Jesus Christ is the Lord God and Messiah of Israel, a present help in time of trouble.)
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To: kindred

Why not just apologize? It’s worked in so many other cases. It should be deep, sincere and heart-felt. This Marine made an honest mistake and I’m sure his mother, aunt or grandmother would testify that their son, nephew and grandson is a good person and would never even think of such things if he wasn’t under so much stress and adversity and who among us hasn’t had a bad day and wanted to blame somebody for our troubles...It’s not like he shot, carjacked or rapped somebody.


16 posted on 04/07/2012 6:05:37 AM PDT by equaviator
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To: Pentagon Leatherneck
but he was warned to stop his activity, so should not be surprised.

There's got to be more to this story. I'm on facebook and I see comments disparaging of Obama from fellow sailors all the time. There's plenty of "Nobama 2012" bumper stickers on base as well.

Is he getting separated simply because of his anti-Obama comments or is he getting separated because he continued posting them from a government computer after he was told by his superiors to knock it off?

17 posted on 04/07/2012 6:06:46 AM PDT by Drew68
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To: kindred
I hope for the day... Photobucket
18 posted on 04/07/2012 6:12:26 AM PDT by baddog 219
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Comment #19 Removed by Moderator

Comment #20 Removed by Moderator

To: kindred
I'm sorry, and as much as I hate to admit it but Marine Sergeant Gary Stein was wrong. Article 134 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice (UCMJ) prohibits disloyal statements toward a superior (either enlisted or officer) and anything to the prejudice of good order. The part of “Good Order and Discipline” in the military is first and foremost, always. You don't know how many times I had to bite my tongue during the Carter and Clinton presidencies, but I made my voice heard in the ballot box.
21 posted on 04/07/2012 6:23:29 AM PDT by Traveler59 ( Truth is a journey, not a destination.)
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To: BigCinBigD
The good Sgt should have kept his mouth shut and stayed in place where he could do the most good if the time comes.

The time came and went.

22 posted on 04/07/2012 6:26:27 AM PDT by .30Carbine (God bless you with the spirit of wisdom and understanding)
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To: kindred

I’m glad to see that Gary Kreep is involved. He was active in the Young Americans for Freedom in the 1970’s and 1980’s.


23 posted on 04/07/2012 6:29:29 AM PDT by Fiji Hill (Deo Vindice!)
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To: UCANSEE2

“Also hard to argue that if it had been a Republican President’s face on a jackass, he would even have been brought up on charges.”

Wrong. When GWB ws President, we had a few enlisted who didn’t want to deploy because GWB was ‘selected, not elected’. Facing jail time, they deployed. And everyone was reminded that you do NOT make political statements while in uniform, or an civilian clothes if you have identified yourself as military.


24 posted on 04/07/2012 6:54:17 AM PDT by Mr Rogers ("they found themselves made strangers in their own country")
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To: Texas Fossil
He swore an allegiance to uphold the Constitution. As did Obozo.

but the congress who should impeach the Messiah for trashing the constitution, does not hold zer0bama’s feet to the fire as they should...cowards all.

25 posted on 04/07/2012 7:02:22 AM PDT by Vaquero (Don't pick a fight with an old guy. If he is too old to fight, he'll just kill you.)
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To: kindred

“he said that he would not obey an unlawful order and gave the example of being ordered to confiscate the guns of American citizens.” ......................................... LOL, do you really think he is alone in those thoughts? He is expressing his thoughts outwardly where others remain silent. We can not sanction that kind of thoughts in this current regime. Das ist verboten! Geeez, you have to even watch out if you try to defend yourself from criminals these days. Why do I feel that the Thought Police are out there, and they work hand in hand with the Propagandists?


26 posted on 04/07/2012 7:04:46 AM PDT by Bringbackthedraft ( WHO WE ELECT AS PRESIDENT IS NOT AS IMPORTANT AS WHO THEY APPOINT.)
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To: kindred

27 posted on 04/07/2012 7:16:58 AM PDT by combat_boots (The Lion of Judah cometh. Hallelujah. Gloria Patri, Filio et Spiritui Sancto.)
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To: kindred
“While off-duty”, EXCUSE ME? I believe he was on ACTIVE DUTY in the Marine Corps. Active duty is 24/7, 365. There is no such thing as “off duty”.

I can't stand that POS Obama, but he is the commander in chief, legitimate or not. This Marine knew better, he will have to accept the consequences.

28 posted on 04/07/2012 7:17:37 AM PDT by faucetman ( Just the facts, ma'am, Just the facts)
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To: faucetman
I can't stand that POS Obama, but he is the commander in chief, legitimate or not. This Marine knew better, he will have to accept the consequences.

This.

The FReepers making the moronic claim that he had a duty to "uphold the constitution" are advocating chaos.

What they're saying is that any-ol' enlisted guy can simply throw discipline and the UCMJ to the wind if he decides that someone or something in their chain of command is unconstitutional.

Dumbasses.

29 posted on 04/07/2012 7:55:20 AM PDT by AAABEST (Et lux in tenebris lucet: et tenebrae eam non comprehenderunt)
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To: kindred

If he was specifically told to “STFU” about his personal politics, but did so anyway, he should simply face administrative punishment. A less than honorable discharge is way over the top.


30 posted on 04/07/2012 8:16:11 AM PDT by DTogo (High time to bring back the Sons of Liberty !!)
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To: Traveler59

Yup.. and the ONLY time I mentioned anything political, was the night I was in the NCO club and Clinton won his first term election... I told my friends that I was NOT re-enlisting...


31 posted on 04/07/2012 8:19:00 AM PDT by Bikkuri
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To: Traveler59

Oh, forgot to mention HOW I said it; “I’m not going to be under the command of a fag loving, pot smoking, draft dodging pussyjerk”. ;)


32 posted on 04/07/2012 8:21:10 AM PDT by Bikkuri
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To: faucetman; .30Carbine

40 years ago, I’d have agreed with you. But not today, not with our government in the hands of a mad man. I agree with .30Carbine above.

Loyalty goes both ways.


33 posted on 04/07/2012 8:31:27 AM PDT by Gaffer
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To: kindred

we have been free since 02/07/2012, legally according to the Declaration of Independence, paragraph 2, Thomas Jefferson left us the key to getting it done

http://freedomreigns.us/Our_Team.html

Drake

It has come to my attention that a lot of people want to know who I am. I will offer a part of the base of what I know without endangering myself or others. The basis of the knowledge I hold is extraordinary in its scope (content and reach) and those whom I am in contact with.

Not being willing to take anyone’s word for it, I went behind the scenes and found who ‘they’ were talking to. This involves most of the ‘news’ web sites many are familiar with, credible or not.

My military service includes nuclear weapons, very high security clearances, and Vietnam. Most of the “incidents” from this time forward, I was involved in at some level, major, minor, and local. I started in the field of information in the late nineties and progressed from that time forward. I use a portion of the old cold war spy network, people in several sensitive positions, and those who agree to pass along info no one else gets. There are several contact avenues that also offer info, military, political and citizen eyes. In all, an extreme information highway.

The validity of what I’ve sent out has been the best at the time, almost all of which was verifiable. And yes, I was called on to prove a lot of it at first. This was not an easy task and caused me to be able to protect and out the info at the same time, I learned how.

Forces in the main stream media took most of what I offered and called it everything but true, and I was a nightmare head case trying to cause problems through the use of my imagination, and the internet...

Those who own the media control its content, most of which is questionable at best...I know, because I was directly involved in a few of those ‘international and local incidents’ that were reported as something else altogether...So I have first hand knowledge of this.

I have been a patriot since taking my oath of service in the 60’s. I had always been raised to be a patriot, but that oath haunted me all the time...until I decided I would start taking action.

The present information I have shared comes from a plan I was privileged to read some years ago. To date it has been in the works well over twenty (20) years. Many old fashioned old timers knew better than the direction our country was headed, even way back then, so they started writing the plan. It deals with offering the basic freedoms our country was founded on, and how to return to that freedom.

My research extends into a lot of law, application, and the origin of law itself. The offerings used in the manner in which I stated them to be used, when used correctly, I never lost. This includes local, state, federal, and international applications.

A group of individual people in individual states, has completed the paperwork that sets our nation free.

It is my hope that we all can keep our freedom this time...that is up to We The People.

The extent of the information offered on the recording is, at this time, the limit I use to protect the many who are involved in our efforts. If anyone who reads this believes that freedom can still be available, then I urge all those to play the recording to others of a like mind.

A qualified person does not have to be a rocket scientist. Try finding someone who is so honest it hurts to be around them. A person who knows the meaning of right and wrong according to their conscience...and who listens to it. In order to start to turn things around, it will take as many people as possible to stand up in any way they can. Put together groups all over our country at the local level. Get everyone to know each other and look into using your group to put the right kind of people in office.

Who am I to speak and by what authority do I do so?
•It is each persons constitutional ‘duty’ to remove a repressive government...the present one qualifies.
•I feel a moral obligation to stop the theft so hungry children in our own country of plenty, can eat.
•It ain’t doing this for me.
•It is for my children and grandchildren, because their future hangs in the balance...I feel it is the least I can do for them. As one voice in the wilderness...I CRY FREEDOM...!

~Drake


34 posted on 04/07/2012 8:34:44 AM PDT by SF_Redux (Sarah stands for accountablility and personal responsiblity, democrats can't live with that)
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To: kindred

Also see: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2868427/posts


35 posted on 04/07/2012 8:36:37 AM PDT by shove_it (just undo it)
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To: SF_Redux

Drake’s message to military.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P7xCtfQfQx4


36 posted on 04/07/2012 8:39:36 AM PDT by SF_Redux (Sarah stands for accountablility and personal responsiblity, democrats can't live with that)
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To: kindred

Soldiers dont have those rights. You cannot publicly go negative on your chain of command and keep your job at the same time.


37 posted on 04/07/2012 8:44:47 AM PDT by Raider Sam (They're on our left, right, front, and back. They aint gettin away this time!)
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To: combat_boots
Check out this video on YouTube:

U.S. Marine Cloy Richards - Iraq Veterans Against the War

38 posted on 04/07/2012 8:50:21 AM PDT by .30Carbine (God bless you with the spirit of wisdom and understanding)
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To: patriot08

No, it isnt coming to this. It has always been the rule. If you criticize the CIC while in the military, you are giving aid and comfort to the enemy.


39 posted on 04/07/2012 8:52:58 AM PDT by Raider Sam (They're on our left, right, front, and back. They aint gettin away this time!)
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To: Teacher317

Im sure some of them were discharged, if they were found out.


40 posted on 04/07/2012 8:54:09 AM PDT by Raider Sam (They're on our left, right, front, and back. They aint gettin away this time!)
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To: GrandJediMasterYoda

It’s not the job of a soldier to determine that policy is threatening the Constitution. It is their job to defend from attacks in the physical realm. Otherwise, you could constantly have soldiers on either side claiming the Constitution is under attack.


41 posted on 04/07/2012 8:56:14 AM PDT by Raider Sam (They're on our left, right, front, and back. They aint gettin away this time!)
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To: kindred

Soldiers are not citizens.


42 posted on 04/07/2012 9:06:07 AM PDT by Raider Sam (They're on our left, right, front, and back. They aint gettin away this time!)
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To: Raider Sam
Check out these videos on YouTube:

3 US Soldiers Speak Out on McChrystal's Firing (Democracy Now)

Active Duty Soldier Talks Politics on PressTV

43 posted on 04/07/2012 9:08:22 AM PDT by .30Carbine (God bless you with the spirit of wisdom and understanding)
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To: .30Carbine

Why?

If they are representing themselves as military and are talking down the Chain of Command, then they should be kicked out.

If the Marine had said what he believed without using a negative image of the President, there would be no problem.


44 posted on 04/07/2012 9:11:51 AM PDT by Raider Sam (They're on our left, right, front, and back. They aint gettin away this time!)
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To: Raider Sam

from: www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Sto...8,00.html
Letters from Soldiers Against Bush

Tuesday 05 September 2004

Civilian contractors are fleecing taxpayers; US troops don’t have proper equipment; and supposedly liberated Iraqis hate them. After the release of Fahrenheit 9/11, Michael Moore received a flood of letters and emails from disillusioned and angry American soldiers serving in Iraq. Here, in an exclusive extract from his new book, we print a selection.

From: RH
To: mike@michaelmoore.com
Sent: Monday, July 12, 2003 4:57 PM
Subject: Iraqi freedom veteran supports you

Dear Mr Moore,
I went to Iraq with thoughts of killing people who I thought were horrible. I was like, “Fuck Iraq, fuck these people, I hope we kill thousands.” I believed my president. He was taking care of business and wasn’t going to let al Qaeda push us around. I was with the 3rd Squadron, 7th Cavalry, 3rd Infantry division out of Fort Stewart, Georgia. My unit was one of the first to Baghdad. I was so scared. Didn’t know what to think. Seeing dead bodies for the first time. People blown in half. Little kids with no legs. It was overwhelming, the sights, sounds, fear. I was over there from Jan’03 to Aug’03. I hated every minute. It was a daily battle to keep my spirits up. I hate the army and my job. I am supposed to get out next February but will now be unable to because the asshole in the White House decided that now would be a great time to put a stop-loss in effect for the army. So I get to do a second tour in Iraq and be away from those I love again because some guy has the audacity to put others’ lives on the line for his personal war. I thought we were the good guys.

From: Michael W
Sent: Tuesday July 13 2004 12.28pm
Subject: Dude, Iraq sucks

My name is Michael W and I am a 30-year-old National Guard infantryman serving in southeast Baghdad. I have been in Iraq since March of 04 and will continue to serve here until March of 05.

In the few short months my unit has been in Iraq, we have already lost one man and have had many injured (including me) in combat operations. And for what? At the very least, the government could have made sure that each of our vehicles had the proper armament to protect us soldiers.

In the early morning hours of May 10, one month to the day from my 30th birthday, I and 12 other men were attacked in a well-executed roadside ambush in south-east Baghdad. We were attacked with small-arms fire, a rocket-propelled grenade, and two well-placed roadside bombs. These roadside bombs nearly destroyed one of our Hummers and riddled my friends with shrapnel, almost killing them. They would not have had a scratch if they had the “Up Armour” kits on them. So where was [George] W [Bush] on that one?

It’s just so ridiculous, which leads me to my next point. A Blackwater contractor makes $15,000 [£8,400] a month for doing the same job as my pals and me. I make about $4,000 [£2,240] a month over here. What’s up with that?

Beyond that, the government is calling up more and more troops from the reserves. For what? Man, there is a huge fucking scam going on here! There are civilian contractors crawling all over this country. Blackwater, Kellogg Brown & Root, Halliburton, on and on. These contractors are doing everything you can think of from security to catering lunch!

We are spending money out the ass for this shit, and very few of the projects are going to the Iraqi people. Someone’s back is getting scratched here, and it ain’t the Iraqis’!

My life is left to chance at this point. I just hope I come home alive.

From: Specialist Willy
Sent: Tuesday March 9 2004 1.23pm
Subject: Thank you

Mike, I’d like to thank you for all of the support you’re showing for the soldiers here in Iraq. I am in Baghdad right now, and it’s such a relief to know that people still care about the lemmings who are forced to fight in this conflict.

It’s hard listening to my platoon sergeant saying, “If you decide you want to kill a civilian that looks threatening, shoot him. I’d rather fill out paperwork than get one of my soldiers killed by some raghead.” We are taught that if someone even looks threatening we should do something before they do something to us. I wasn’t brought up in fear like that, and it’s going to take some getting used to.

It’s also very hard talking to people here about this war. They don’t like to hear that the reason they are being torn away from their families is bullshit, or that their “president” doesn’t care about them. A few people here have become quite upset with me, and at one point I was going to be discharged for constantly inciting arguments and disrespect to my commander-in-chief (Dubya). It’s very hard to be silenced about this when I see the same 150 people every day just going through the motions, not sure why they are doing it.

[ Willy sent an update in early August ]

People’s perceptions of this war have done a complete 180 since we got here. We had someone die in a mortar attack the first week, and ever since then, things have changed completely. Soldiers are calling their families urging them to support John Kerry. If this is happening elsewhere, it looks as if the overseas military vote that Bush is used to won’t be there this time around.

From: Kyle Waldman
Sent: Friday February 27 2004 2.35am
Subject: None

As we can all obviously see, Iraq was not and is not an imminent threat to the United States or the rest of the world. My time in Iraq has taught me a little about the Iraqi people and the state of this war-torn, poverty-stricken country.

The illiteracy rate in this country is phenomenal. There were some farmers who didn’t even know there was an Operation Iraqi Freedom. This was when I realised that this war was initiated by the few who would profit from it and not for its people. We, as the coalition forces, did not liberate these people; we drove them even deeper into poverty. I don’t foresee any economic relief coming soon to these people by the way Bush has already diverted its oil revenues to make sure there will be enough oil for our SUVs.

We are here trying to keep peace when all we have been trained for is to destroy. How are 200,000 soldiers supposed to take control of this country? Why didn’t we have an effective plan to rebuild Iraq’s infrastructure? Why aren’t the American people more aware of these atrocities?

My fiancee and I have seriously looked into moving to Canada as political refugees.

From: Anonymous
Sent: Thursday April 15 2004 12.41am
Subject: From KBR truck driver now in Iraq

Mike, I am a truck driver right now in Iraq. Let me give you this one small fact because I am right here at the heart of it: since I started this job several months ago, 100% (that’s right, not 99%) of the workers I am aware of are inflating the hours they claim on their time sheets. There is so much more I could tell you. But the fact is that MILLIONS AND MILLIONS of dollars are being raped from both the American taxpayers and the Iraqi people because of the unbelievable amount of greed and abuse over here. And yes, my conscience does bother me because I am participating in this rip-off.

From: Andrew Balthazor
Sent: Friday August 27 2004 1.53pm
Subject: Iraqi war vet - makes me sound so old

Mr Moore, I am an ex-military intelligence officer who served 10 months in Baghdad; I was the senior intelligence officer for the area of Baghdad that included the UN HQ and Sadr City.

Since Bush exposed my person and my friends, peers, and subordinates to unnecessary danger in a war apparently designed to generate income for a select few in the upper echelon of America, I have become wholeheartedly anti-Bush, to the chagrin of much of my pro-Republican family.

As a “foot soldier” in the “war on terror” I can personally testify that Bush’s administration has failed to effectively fight terrorists or the root causes of terror. The White House and the DoD failed to plan for reconstruction of Iraq. Contracts weren’t tendered until Feb-Mar of 2003, and the Office of Reconstruction and Humanitarian Assistance (the original CPA) didn’t even come into existence until January 2003. This failure to plan for the “peace” is a direct cause for the insecurity of Iraq today.

Immediately after the “war” portion of the fighting (which really ended around April 9 2003), we should have been prepared to send in a massive reconstruction effort. Right away we needed engineers to diagnose problems, we needed contractors repairing problems, we needed immediate food, water, shelter, and fuel for the Iraqi people, and we needed more security for all of this to work - which we did not have because we did not have enough troops on the ground, and CPA decided to disband the Iraqi army. The former Iraqi police were engaged far too late; a plan should have existed to bring them into the fold right away.

I’ve left the military. If there is anything I can do to help get Bush out of office, let me know.

From: Anthony Pietsch
Sent: Thursday August 5 2004 6.13pm
Subject: Soldier for sale

Dear Mr Moore, my name is Tony Pietsch, and I am a National Guardsman who has been stationed in Kuwait and Iraq for the past 15 months. Along with so many other guard and reserve units, my unit was put on convoy escorts. We were on gun trucks running from the bottom of Iraq to about two hours above Baghdad.

The Iraqi resistance was insanity. I spent many nights lying awake after mortar rounds had just struck areas nearby, some coming close enough to throw rocks against my tent. I’ve seen roadside bombs go off all over, Iraqis trying to ram the side of our vehicle. Small children giving us the finger and throwing rocks at the soldiers in the turrets. We were once lost in Baghdad and received nothing but dirty looks and angry gestures for hours.

I have personally been afraid for my life more days than I can count. We lost our first man only a few weeks before our tour was over, but it seems that all is for nothing because all we see is hostility and anger over our being there. They are angry over the abuse scandal and the collateral damages that are always occurring.

I don’t know how the rest of my life will turn out, but I truly regret being a 16-year-old kid looking for some extra pocket money and a way to college.

From: Sean Huze
Sent: Sunday March 28 2004 7.56pm
Subject: “Dude, Where’s My Country?”

I am an LCPL in the US Marine Corps and veteran of Operation Iraqi Freedom. Mr Moore, please keep pounding away at Bush. I’m not some pussy when it comes to war. However, the position we were put in - fighting an enemy that used women, children, and other civilians as shields; forcing us to choose between firing at “area targets” (nice way of saying firing into crowds) or being killed by the bastards using the crowds for cover - is indescribably horrible.

I saw more than a few dead children littering the streets in Nasiriyah, along with countless other civilians. And through all this, I held on to the belief that it had to be for some greater good.

Months have passed since I’ve been back home and the unfortunate conclusion I’ve come to is that Bush is a lying, manipulative motherfucker who cares nothing for the lives of those of us who serve in uniform. Hell, other than playing dress-up on aircraft carriers, what would he know about serving this nation in uniform?

His silence and refusal to speak under oath to the 9/11 Commission further mocks our country. The Patriot Act violates every principle we fight and die for. And all of this has been during his first term. Can you imagine his policies when he doesn’t have to worry about re-election? We can’t allow that to happen, and there are so many like me in the military who feel this way. We were lied to and used. And there aren’t words to describe the sense of betrayal I feel as a result.

From: Joseph Cherwinski
Sent: Saturday July 3 2004 8.33pm
Subject: “Fahrenheit 9/11”

I am a soldier in the United States army. I was in Iraq with the Fourth Infantry Division.

I was guarding some Iraqi workers one day. Their task was to fill sandbags for our base. The temperature was at least 120. I had to sit there with full gear on and monitor them. I was sitting and drinking water, and I could barely tolerate the heat, so I directed the workers to go to the shade and sit and drink water. I let them rest for about 20 minutes. Then a staff sergeant told me that they didn’t need a break, and that they were to fill sandbags until the cows come home. He told the Iraqis to go back to work.

After 30 minutes, I let them have a break again, thus disobeying orders. If these were soldiers working, in this heat, those soldiers would be bound to a 10-minute work, 50-minute rest cycle, to prevent heat casualties. Again the staff sergeant came and sent the Iraqis back to work and told me I could sit in the shade. I told him no, I had to be out there with them so that when I started to need water, then they would definitely need water. He told me that wasn’t necessary, and that they live here, and that they are used to it.

After he left, I put the Iraqis back into the shade. I could tell that some were very dehydrated; most of them were thin enough to be on an international food aid commercial. I would not treat my fellow soldiers in this manner, so I did not treat the Iraqi workers this way either.

This went on for eight months while I was in Iraq, and going through it told me that we were not there for their freedom, we were not there for WMD. We had no idea what we were fighting for anymore.


45 posted on 04/07/2012 9:13:12 AM PDT by .30Carbine (God bless you with the spirit of wisdom and understanding)
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To: Pentagon Leatherneck

After nine years he’s only a Sgt. That in and of itself would be reason enough to RIF him.


46 posted on 04/07/2012 9:15:06 AM PDT by A.A. Cunningham (Barry Soetoro is a Kenyan communist)
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To: Raider Sam
http://militaryagainstbush.tribe.net/thread/ff307e67-4ed6-4d67-be55-14dac1deafea
47 posted on 04/07/2012 9:15:20 AM PDT by .30Carbine (God bless you with the spirit of wisdom and understanding)
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To: .30Carbine

Not sure what your point is.


48 posted on 04/07/2012 9:24:00 AM PDT by Raider Sam (They're on our left, right, front, and back. They aint gettin away this time!)
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To: Raider Sam
Christian Science Moniter

A strident minority: anti-Bush US troops in Iraq
Though military personnel lean conservative, some vocally support Kerry - or at least a strategy for swift withdrawal.

Inside dusty, barricaded camps around Iraq, groups of American troops in between missions are gathering around screens to view an unlikely choice from the US box office: "Fahrenheit 9-11," Michael Moore's controversial documentary attacking the commander-in-chief.

"Everyone's watching it," says a Marine corporal at an outpost in Ramadi that is mortared by insurgents daily. "It's shaping a lot of people's image of Bush."

The film's prevalence is one sign of a discernible countercurrent among US troops in Iraq - those who blame President Bush for entangling them in what they see as a misguided war. Conventional wisdom holds that the troops are staunchly pro-Bush, and many are. But bitterness over long, dangerous deployments is producing, at a minimum, pockets of support for Democratic candidate Sen. John Kerry, in part because he's seen as likely to withdraw American forces from Iraq more quickly.

"[For] 9 out of 10 of the people I talk to, it wouldn't matter who ran against Bush - they'd vote for them," said a US soldier in the southern city of Najaf, seeking out a reporter to make his views known. "People are so fed up with Iraq, and fed up with Bush."

(More at link)

49 posted on 04/07/2012 9:25:31 AM PDT by .30Carbine (God bless you with the spirit of wisdom and understanding)
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To: Vaquero

Yes, Cowards All. And Traitors all, they swore the exact same oath to the Constitution.


50 posted on 04/07/2012 9:27:22 AM PDT by Texas Fossil (Government, even in its best state is but a necessary evil; in its worst state an intolerable one)
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