Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Feds eye retirement-fund tax to cut $16 trillion-plus deficit (Obama's war on savers)
NY Post ^ | 4/22/12 | REGORY BRESIGER

Posted on 04/22/2012 4:44:53 AM PDT by jimbo123

Uncle Sam, in a desperate attempt to fix its $16 trillion-plus deficit, is leering over Americans’ retirement nest egg as its new bailout fund.

Capitol Hill politicians are assessing tax changes that could let the Internal Revenue Service lay claim to a portion of the $18 trillion sitting in 401(k) accounts and other tax breaks used by middle-class workers, including cutting the mortgage tax deduction.

(Excerpt) Read more at nypost.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: 401k; pensionconfiscation; pensionraids
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-5051-100101-150151-191 last
To: Sequoyah101
Most of the 401K generation will join the largest group of indigent geriatrics ever seen.

The reason for that is they didn't invest enough, made poor choices, drew it down while trying to find another job, or got nailed by high fees. What is the alternative? In-trust your retirement with the state? The federal government is trillions in debt. Many states are broke as well. Should folks be forced into financial contracts like they are trying to do with Obamacare? The 401K is the best solution. If taxes were low enough, you wouldn't need specialized retirement accounts..

151 posted on 04/22/2012 4:27:58 PM PDT by EVO X
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 146 | View Replies]

To: cuban leaf

stop trying to second guess my tax situation and imply I am exaggerating or lying

Losing a $14000 interest deduction will raise our taxes about $6000, you are clueless about some folks’ marginal rates

the reason for congress dropping the mortgage interest deduction is to collect more taxes, not to offset the higher taxes by lowering the rates
D. Oh.


152 posted on 04/22/2012 4:45:24 PM PDT by silverleaf (Funny how all the people who are for abortion are already born)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 115 | View Replies]

To: jimbo123

Look - government workers need OUR money so they can get FULL medical benefits after working for five years. And pensions the rest of us can only dream of...

AND parties!

Parties in Vegas - party, party, party ... someone’s got to pay for that. Who but us?

John Q Public - all of us chumps - need to GIVE MORE.

What about Secret Service whoring? That’s not free - who do you think’s gonna foot the hotel bills for those guys? You got it. Taxpayers. US. So what the hell, quit ya bitchin’ - - citizens should work til they drop AND have their savings taken.

And shut up with the whining.

Liberal elites gotta have theirs, and ours, and our children’s and....


153 posted on 04/22/2012 4:47:52 PM PDT by GOPJ (Hoodies - because you can't kill a security camera for snitchin' - - freeper tacticalogic)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: The Working Man

He needs a self-directed investment plan

Really

No excuse for that kind of loss last year

Only someone passive would let a fund manager fritter away their savings in such poor investments - learned that after losing 1/3 of our investment fund values in 2008, Never again.


154 posted on 04/22/2012 4:54:43 PM PDT by silverleaf (Funny how all the people who are for abortion are already born)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 140 | View Replies]

To: silverleaf

stop trying to second guess my tax situation and imply I am exaggerating or lying


I apologize. That was not my intent. You merely inferred that. I figured you had some rental property.

I was just saying it is a lot, and it is. It is Huge.


Losing a $14000 interest deduction will raise our taxes about $6000, you are clueless about some folks’ marginal rates

$14,000 in interest saves $6,000 in taxes? That’s interesting. Apparently I am clueless about some folks’ marginal rates. Are you the 1% ;-)


155 posted on 04/22/2012 4:56:33 PM PDT by cuban leaf (Were doomed! Details at eleven.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 152 | View Replies]

To: silverleaf

If I remember the plan correctly there are 15 or 16 funds you can divide your funds among. You were allowed ONE change in a 30 day period, not just in a month but in 30 days. It wasn’t the best situation and I can see how he could lose money... easily.


156 posted on 04/22/2012 5:32:53 PM PDT by The Working Man
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 154 | View Replies]

To: dirtboy

Quite frankly, you are a wacko. Have a nice day dirtboy - an apt name for you, if I say so myself. :)

You never answered the question, did you, because it did not fit an answer to your nutty, bully libertarian ideology? Just callin’ in your homies in to smash mouth, rantin’ and ravin’ like a sloganeer global free market rip- off libertarian. Pullin’ all your links together than have nothing to do with anything, trying to pretend your slogans are so much Smarter than anyone else. Aren’t you cute. Ron Paul understands, dirtboy.


157 posted on 04/22/2012 6:06:04 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 150 | View Replies]

To: SaraJohnson
You are a nutcase. A true nutcase. I showed that this country does not export crude except in miniscule quantities. That it exports finished products well below the level of imported oil, so we basically import oil, refine it and export some of it back out again. And that Argentina exports some of its oil because it can't refine it all.

And you say that proves nothing? I just proved how completely full of crap your claims are, and you're just too deliberately ignorant to care.

Oh, and me, a Paultard? Ask anyone who knows me, that is your DUMBEST claim yet. I am someone who lives in the world of what can be proven, not what can be pulled out of one's arse.

I believe in a balanced approach - markets, but regulation of such. I think there are more restrictions needed on commodities exchanges. I am hardly a die-hard libertarian, they have their good points and bad points and I pick what is good from them.

You, on the other hand, wallow in delusions about how oil is produced, refined and consumed in this country. You applaud a socialist takeover. In other words, you are liberal to the bone and too stupid to realize it. Toodles.

158 posted on 04/22/2012 6:16:09 PM PDT by dirtboy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 157 | View Replies]

To: EVO X

No, most of them did not invest enough.

1. They were ignorant of the need and had no idea what is required for retirement.
2. They were actually sold a bill of goods because the “deal” they got with the 401 in almost all cases was a reduction in cost for employers and a pay cut for employees. Most could never make up the difference by saving.
3. They don’t understand risk in investing and most everyone else doesn’t either.
4. You imply spending the 401 is a bad choice because of unemployment? Guess you’ve never been faced with that choice.

Not many states are broke, most are and can’t fund their long term obligations. Obamacare will just make that worse.

I do know that the 401 has been a boondogle for the financial community since they make money on all sides of trades, are dealing with unsophisticated investors, have destroyed bargaining power present with large retirement funds etc.

I really don’t get your drift from your comments. I’m not advocating any of the alternatives you suggest.


159 posted on 04/22/2012 6:23:04 PM PDT by Sequoyah101
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 151 | View Replies]

To: Little Bill
You are lucky! I pay taxes on Two houses

I was referring to mortgage interest, not taxes. I don't pay mortgage interest but like every other home owner, I pay taxes on my home.

My wife, me and the county tax assessor own this house. By the way, about 90% of my real estate taxes go to the public schools in this district plus the local community college.

160 posted on 04/22/2012 7:02:26 PM PDT by Graybeard58 (Romney vs. Obama? One of them has to lose, rejoice in that fact, whichever it is.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 110 | View Replies]

To: Little Bill

I live in a small town, population about 1600. They assess a tax on cell phones of 11¢ per phone, there are 5 phones on my plan, therefore the tax is 55¢ per month. What really gripes my a$$ is one of the phones is my elderly mother’s, she doesn’t even live in this state or area code.

Why do they do this? Because they can.


161 posted on 04/22/2012 7:07:08 PM PDT by Graybeard58 (Romney vs. Obama? One of them has to lose, rejoice in that fact, whichever it is.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 110 | View Replies]

To: Little Bill

I live in a small town, population about 1600. They assess a tax on cell phones of 11¢ per phone, there are 5 phones on my plan, therefore the tax is 55¢ per month. What really gripes my a$$ is one of the phones is my elderly mother’s, she doesn’t even live in this state or area code.

Why do they do this? Because they can.


162 posted on 04/22/2012 7:08:16 PM PDT by Graybeard58 (Romney vs. Obama? One of them has to lose, rejoice in that fact, whichever it is.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 110 | View Replies]

To: Fee
“The American people have no one to blame but themselves.”

The ‘American people’ are not a monolithic entity. Many Americans deserve some blame. Many don't. There are a ton of people who've worked hard and played by the rules. If given a choice whether or not to pay into social security, many wouldn't have, and would have made their own investments. After having part of their paychecks go to social security for any years, they expect - understandably - some payback.

The bottom line is that for most people, getting up in the morning, getting your children off to school, and going to work, takes most of their energy. They don't necessarily see the film flam men and women behind the curtain. Their biggest sin in this regard is trusting the integrity of elected officials. They didn't control the process that has put us in the position that we are in.

That said, I think that if the middle class in the US is truly threatened with extinction, it will not go quietly into the night. You will instead see even conservatives calling for the heads of the ‘wealthy’, and the top will go down with the middle. Yes, this is what the radical left wants (except the part where they lose their ‘stuff’). We can't let this scenario happen. We can grow our way out of much of this, but we need to stop committing national suicide in the name of ‘progressivism’.

163 posted on 04/22/2012 7:45:34 PM PDT by pieceofthepuzzle
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 85 | View Replies]

To: SaraJohnson

They know that Phony-Care confiscation won’t be enough, so the Federal Bloc is preparing with Mandate-Mitt, for the Big Take, in some form.

(And stay alert if a full attempted body take-over, with mandated screenings)


164 posted on 04/22/2012 7:47:18 PM PDT by Varsity Flight (Phony-Care is the Government Work-Camp: Arbeitsziehungslager)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: Sequoyah101
I really don’t get your drift from your comments. I’m not advocating any of the alternatives you suggest. Re-read what I said.
165 posted on 04/22/2012 8:42:54 PM PDT by EVO X
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 159 | View Replies]

To: EVO X

That won’t help.

You are just far too erudite for me.


166 posted on 04/22/2012 9:38:12 PM PDT by Sequoyah101
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 165 | View Replies]

To: The Working Man

I have 10 fund choices and allowed 2 moves in a month and made money last year (just over 5% gain)

You have to pay attention and make your own defensive moves, and time your own risks of coming out of safe harbor

I don’t know anyone on our plan forum who does that and who lost money last year.

Now, 2008 yikes


167 posted on 04/23/2012 8:56:41 AM PDT by silverleaf (Funny how all the people who are for abortion are already born)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 156 | View Replies]

To: jimbo123; rawhide
Provide link. You did not provide it to rawhide. If you don't I will conclude you are BSing us. : )
168 posted on 04/23/2012 2:20:40 PM PDT by Chgogal (WSJ, Coulter, Kristol, Krauthammer, Rove et al., STFU. Thank you.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: Buckeye Battle Cry

How are the standing laws being re-interpreted by the Marxists? Please give me examples of the impact. Mega TYs. : )


169 posted on 04/23/2012 2:39:42 PM PDT by Chgogal (WSJ, Coulter, Kristol, Krauthammer, Rove et al., STFU. Thank you.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 63 | View Replies]

To: Chgogal

If you go to the Employee Benefits Security Administration website and look at their news releases you will see they have been very aggressive in dramatically expanding the definition of “fiduciary” for purposes of the Employee Retirement Income Security Act thereby expanding regulatory authority and control over virtually any one in the employee benefits game. The first time since ERISA became effective in 1975.

They have also dramatically expanded the disclosure requirements and to whom they must apply.

These are just a few of the examples. The other examples are the draconian new regs they have issued under ObamaCare, as EBSA has authority over employer provided healthcare plans.

As the author of six books in the field of employee benefits (all annuals) I have to update these books a great deal more each year under the Obama administration than I ever have in the past.


170 posted on 04/23/2012 2:52:10 PM PDT by Buckeye Battle Cry (Not Romney - Not ever!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 169 | View Replies]

To: Sequoyah101
You are just far too erudite for me.

The point I was try to make in the original post was basically the 401K is the best of the worst options currently available. It would be nice to rely on a pension, but private and public pensions are blowing up all over the place. With a 401K you have some control on how assets are invested. If you decide to change companies, you can roll it over and take complete control.

Personally, I'd like to see a flat tax of somewhere around 10% at the federal level. If you had that, there wouldn't be any need for specialized retirement programs.

P.S. I was probably more rude than erudite on my 2nd post to you..

171 posted on 04/23/2012 4:45:37 PM PDT by EVO X
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 166 | View Replies]

To: jimbo123

Do you have evidence they are for it? I’m sincerely interested in finding out if these two really backa 401K raid and mortgage interest deduction scrap.


172 posted on 04/23/2012 4:52:29 PM PDT by RinaseaofDs (Does beheading qualify as 'breaking my back', in the Jeffersonian sense of the expression?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: Buckeye Battle Cry
“As the author of six books in the field of employee benefits (all annuals) I have to update these books a great deal more each year under the Obama administration than I ever have in the past.”

Your job now is never ending which is a bad sign for this country. You have my admiration.

What happens when Obamacare is declared unconstitutional?

Retirees who rolled over their 401Ks a decade ago, will they fall under the new interpretations now?

173 posted on 04/23/2012 5:30:46 PM PDT by Chgogal (WSJ, Coulter, Kristol, Krauthammer, Rove et al., STFU. Thank you.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 170 | View Replies]

To: EVO X

We can agree on that.

The traditional level of the cost of government to GDP is between 15 and 18% I believe, not he 21% (perhaps 23%) or more that I seem to recall at the present time. The lower level has proven to be sustainable but still too much for my taste. If my raw overhead is more than about 5% I get unhappy. Of course there is considerable capital expense provided in public works some of which are clearly essential and not well suited to privatization such as interstate highways and such.

The tax code provides far too much power to too many who can’t be trusted with it nor do they need it. Too costly, too complex, too unstable. Business and people abhor uncertainty.

Transportability is one of the unintended benefits of the 401. I doubt, when the 401 was conceived, many foresaw the number of job changes most will have. On that level it has been a blessing for many but it has also abetted the severance of what little mutual loyalty was left between employer and employee.


174 posted on 04/23/2012 8:43:19 PM PDT by Sequoyah101
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 171 | View Replies]

To: HangThemHigh
50+ don’t vote much for Zero anyhow. Makes them a likely target for stealing their retirement funds or cutting off their healthcare.

Why not both?

Come on, help me out here. What's a better-sounding phrase for "death panel"?

We need to be positive about this.

175 posted on 04/24/2012 2:13:21 AM PDT by lentulusgracchus
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 12 | View Replies]

To: muawiyah
Now is the time for usurpers to do what they will.

It isn't just Obama, though. What about his politburo, his "kitchen cabinet" of committed, convicted Communists? They still have the reins of his unconstitutional "czars", and his lines to the cabinet officers are still unbroken. Hillary, Panetta, etc., can't refuse a presidential order except by resignation.

And then there are the .... other assets.

176 posted on 04/24/2012 2:18:20 AM PDT by lentulusgracchus
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 48 | View Replies]

To: jimbo123
Mitch McConnell and John Boehner support the proposed 401K raids as well as the elimination of the mortgage interest deduction.

Where did you hear this, or is it just your inference?

If it's true, it's the worst news I've heard all year ...... and a direct act of contempt for the Tea Party Caucus.

177 posted on 04/24/2012 2:20:05 AM PDT by lentulusgracchus
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 17 | View Replies]

To: PapaBear3625
Technological advance has made it highly profitable to invest in additional mechanization, automation, computerization, improved methods and robotics.

The employment necessary to produce any given amount of product is drastically reduced!

178 posted on 04/24/2012 5:27:06 AM PDT by muawiyah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 53 | View Replies]

To: Chgogal

If Obamacare is declared unconstitutional, you will see much rejoicing in the streets and much anger at Obama, Pelosi and Reid. Their adventure in socialism has cost the health care industry untold billions of dollars in costs and fees in order to prepare for the implementation of Obamacare. Some of it went into effect almost immediately, but there has been a slow and steady march of requirements that the industry has been prepping and implementing. It will all be for naught and that frustration will be palpable.

The DOL is, right now, working towards explanding their authority towards roll-over IRAs. Again, this is a stretch, as the “I” stands for Individual and ERISA has NO jurisdiction of Individual Retirement Accounts (yet).

I sit on the Great Lakes IRS Employee Plans Council. We meet in Chicago three times a year (last week was the Spring meeting) and all of the regionsl conduct a national conference in February. Feel free to sit in on a meeting if you are still in Chicago.


179 posted on 04/24/2012 6:00:15 AM PDT by Buckeye Battle Cry (Not Romney - Not ever!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 173 | View Replies]

To: muawiyah
The employment necessary to produce any given amount of product is drastically reduced!

In the 1700's, over 90% of the population was engaged in growing food. Then things like motorized tractors made farming so much more efficient that one farmer could produce more food than 20 of his ancestors could. So what happened was that people figured out OTHER things that could be produced that customers would be willing to buy.

When making a given product becomes more efficient through automation, it means that people are freed up to make other products -- except when you change the environment to where ALL manufacturing has to go to China, because of domestic regulations from EPA, OSHA, EEOC, etc.

180 posted on 04/24/2012 6:13:47 AM PDT by PapaBear3625 (In a time of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act. - George Orwell)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 178 | View Replies]

To: PapaBear3625

I do believe the current estimate is that only 2.4% of all products sold in the USA are made in China.


181 posted on 04/24/2012 6:47:08 AM PDT by muawiyah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 180 | View Replies]

To: lentulusgracchus; jimbo123
Funniest thing is there's nothing outside of FR about Boehner saying anything like that.

WE NEED A SOURCE else this is just a rumor.

182 posted on 04/24/2012 6:56:26 AM PDT by muawiyah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 177 | View Replies]

To: dirtboy; SaraJohnson
Still "dirtboy" you do engage in the very sort of tactics the equally strange "sarahjohnson" notes.

You should both turn your talents to figuring out how to keep natural gas prices in the United States low ~ we are shortly going to be EXPORTING more of it, and that's going to bring the world price home to us in spades.

(Not to hijack the thread, but there you have it)

183 posted on 04/24/2012 7:03:38 AM PDT by muawiyah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 158 | View Replies]

To: GOPJ

Not to sound cynical but if we told the Secret Service guys to sleep in the alley if they want to go whoring ~ that’d satisfy your “taxpayer hotel room’ segment ~ but really now, do we want the Secret Service guys to be sleeping in alleys or whoring/


184 posted on 04/24/2012 7:08:43 AM PDT by muawiyah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 153 | View Replies]

To: muawiyah; SaraJohnson
Still "dirtboy" you do engage in the very sort of tactics the equally strange "sarahjohnson" notes.

I have a VERY low tolerance level for anyone who cheerleads Argentina's nationalization of a private oil company's assets. And who can't be bothered to allow hard facts into their views on the subject.

You should both turn your talents to figuring out how to keep natural gas prices in the United States low ~ we are shortly going to be EXPORTING more of it, and that's going to bring the world price home to us in spades.

That's what I want, but Sara is too busy erecting strawmen about how we export our crude to be bothered. Instead, she launches screeds that could be right from DU.

(Not to hijack the thread, but there you have it)

The thread got hijacked long ago, no problem.

185 posted on 04/24/2012 7:14:49 AM PDT by dirtboy
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 183 | View Replies]

To: dirtboy

Argentina is full of nazis ~ they never did a denazification ~ we could start with their president ~ maybe some waterboarding, then drinks, a big steak dinner?


186 posted on 04/24/2012 7:34:25 AM PDT by muawiyah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 185 | View Replies]

To: muawiyah

Big difference between sleeping on the street and ‘not whoring’ on our dime. May I assume you work for the government? Did you know the wealthiest zip codes in the United States are all clustered around DC? There’s a reason for that...

Consider the security risks involved in whoring in foreign countries - is that a factor for you? Here’s my suggestion - maybe they can do their whoring in DC - lots of hookers there to grease the happiness of our upper middle class ‘public servants’... Or they can operate out of their Mom’s home - give the excuse that they’re on a short business trip. Or tell the wife they’re going out for ice cream. Whatever.

Or maybe like other ‘oh so entitled’ government workers, they could just go to Vegas and spend a few hundred thousand dollars partying. And if the citizens don’t like it, they can look them up and cause ‘trouble’ for them. You know - the North Korean style of ‘getting it all’.

Did you know people in the private sector are downsizing? That jobs are doubling up? That benefits and pensions are being completely done away with?

While we get to watch our ‘public servants’ give themselves more and more stuff.

If real workers did that the companies they work for would go under. But each and every government worker compares themselves to the CEO’s of major companies - not to the workers or management of those companies. I guess when the country goes broke the government workers will ‘do’ a North Korea. Let the population eat tree bark to keep their lifestyles going.

Big difference between sleeping on the street and not whoring on our dime. You must work for the government not to know the difference.


187 posted on 04/24/2012 8:34:50 AM PDT by GOPJ (Hoodies - because you can't kill a security camera for snitchin' - - freeper tacticalogic)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 184 | View Replies]

To: GOPJ
You sure read that wrong ~ I can only imagine you approve of sending the Secret Service abroad to sleep in the streets OR to go whoring.

My thought was that it was irrational to imagine they should do either, particularly while on foreign duty. They are there 24/7 to do what they are supposed to do ~

188 posted on 04/24/2012 8:52:08 AM PDT by muawiyah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 187 | View Replies]

To: muawiyah
My thought was that it was irrational to imagine they should do either, particularly while on foreign duty. They are there 24/7 to do what they are supposed to do ~...

My apology - I did read you wrong. Appears we're on the same page - sorry 'bout that...

189 posted on 04/24/2012 9:41:38 AM PDT by GOPJ (Hoodies - because you can't kill a security camera for snitchin' - - freeper tacticalogic)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 188 | View Replies]

To: GOPJ

No, no, not the same page ~ you just wanted to make you think our Secret Service guys should be in their hotel or in a brothel, and no where else...... ROTFLMAO


190 posted on 04/24/2012 9:43:29 AM PDT by muawiyah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 189 | View Replies]

To: muawiyah

I thought it was a security risk and that they should do their whoring at home... You don’t agree with that?


191 posted on 04/24/2012 9:46:52 AM PDT by GOPJ (Hoodies - because you can't kill a security camera for snitchin' - - freeper tacticalogic)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 190 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-5051-100101-150151-191 last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson