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Does Asteroid Mining Violate Space Law? (Libs say yes)
Yahoo News ^ | 4/24/2012 | Yahoo News

Posted on 04/24/2012 6:01:59 PM PDT by Dallas59

Several well-known billionaires are forming the new company Planetary Resources with plans to send a robotic spacecraft to mine precious metals from an asteroid and bring them back to Earth. Google executives Larry Page and Eric Schmidt and their business partners say the enterprise will "add trillions to the global GDP."

But to whom do those trillions belong — the company, or everyone? Does a private company have a right to stake claim to an asteroid, or are celestial bodies such as the moon, planets and asteroids the communal property of all Earthlings?

"The law on this is not settled and not clear," said Henry Hertzfeld, professor of space policy and international affairs at George Washington University. "There are lots of opinions on the status here, and nobody is necessarily right because it's complicated."

The legal ambiguity hasn't needed to be addressed before, Hertzfeld said, because no company has previously come forward with a serious asteroid mining mission plan and the funds to back it. When the debate over space property rights is forced to ensue, old international wounds will likely be reopened.

(Excerpt) Read more at news.yahoo.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Government
KEYWORDS: asteroid; capitalism; law; mining
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Asteroid mining causes Space Warming./s
1 posted on 04/24/2012 6:02:05 PM PDT by Dallas59
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To: Dallas59

I didn’t think it was possible but the whining commie libs become bigger PITAs everyday. It must be hell to be miserable ALL OF THE TIME.


2 posted on 04/24/2012 6:04:44 PM PDT by FlingWingFlyer (It's time for the 47% to start paying their "fair share" of income taxes.)
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To: Dallas59
communal property of all Earthlings?

The following items fall into that category:
Your house
Your car
Your paycheck
Your 401(k)

... and asteroids

3 posted on 04/24/2012 6:05:14 PM PDT by ClearCase_guy (Like Emmett Till, Trayvon Martin has become simply a stick with which to beat Whites.)
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To: Dallas59

You can bet the environmental impact reports will be out of this world.


4 posted on 04/24/2012 6:05:38 PM PDT by umgud (No Rats, No Rino's)
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To: FlingWingFlyer

Can we just deport them all to Guam and enforce a Maritime Exclusion Zone in perpetuity? This is getting silly.


5 posted on 04/24/2012 6:06:56 PM PDT by Riley (The Fourth Estate is the Fifth Column.)
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To: Dallas59

Best current estimates appear to put the number of asteroids that are 1 kilometer or larger at somewhere between 1.5 million and 2 million.
If you consider asteroid 1/10th that size (100 meters across and up) the number would likely be close to 100 times that many ( 150 million +)
If you include 10 meter rocks (the size of a small house), the number would increase by another factor of 100 or so - into the 10s of billions.

Haven’t seen a good estimate for the number of comets/icy bodies there might be in the Kuiper Belt and Oort Cloud. If you stick to bodies 1 km across and up, you would likely have several tens of billions, possibly into the trillions.


6 posted on 04/24/2012 6:09:34 PM PDT by Dallas59 (President Robert Gibbs 2009-2011)
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To: FlingWingFlyer

They hate their own life, and b/c of that, hate all life and everyone else. They want to die, but they want to take the whole planet with them.

“What makes you think they want to live?” - Atlas Shrugged by Ayn Rand.


7 posted on 04/24/2012 6:10:00 PM PDT by Clock King (Ellisworth Toohey was right: My head's gonna explode.)
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To: Dallas59

GUILTY !!!

8 posted on 04/24/2012 6:10:08 PM PDT by Eccl 10:2
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To: Dallas59

I knew this was coming.


9 posted on 04/24/2012 6:10:40 PM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: Dallas59
But to whom do those trillions belong — the company, or everyone? Does a private company have a right to stake claim to an asteroid, or are celestial bodies such as the moon, planets and asteroids the communal property of all Earthlings?


The Federation of course! I say let them mine it. As long they follow the prime directive and Scotty doesn't issue general order 24, everything is good.
10 posted on 04/24/2012 6:11:43 PM PDT by Idaho_Cowboy (Give me liberty, or give me death!)
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To: Dallas59

I think we need to send Sean Connery to investigate!


11 posted on 04/24/2012 6:11:59 PM PDT by Bibman (Tea Party since 1976)
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To: Dallas59

Progressivism...doing everything it can to return us to the stone age.


12 posted on 04/24/2012 6:12:41 PM PDT by Telepathic Intruder (The right thing is not always the popular thing)
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To: Dallas59

Progressivism...doing everything it can to return us to the stone age.


13 posted on 04/24/2012 6:12:55 PM PDT by Telepathic Intruder (The right thing is not always the popular thing)
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To: Dallas59
But to whom do those trillions belong — the company, or everyone? Does a private company have a right to stake claim to an asteroid, or are celestial bodies such as the moon, planets and asteroids the communal property of all Earthlings?

Well in that case all the drug companies and oil companies and food companies and any other kind of company that uses resources from the earth including wind solar all the way down to thermal energy belongs to Earthlings NOT the Government but all Earthlings so lets go for it i want my space rocks lined up along my Driveway and flower beds !

14 posted on 04/24/2012 6:13:46 PM PDT by ATOMIC_PUNK (Any man may make a mistake ; none but a fool will persist in it . { Latin proverb })
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To: Dallas59
Since we have reduced NASA to mooslime outreach why don't we let the private sector go nuts?

Are there any non-gubment jobs libs won't kill?

I hate these people with a burning passion.

15 posted on 04/24/2012 6:14:18 PM PDT by Drill Thrawl (The United States of America, a banana republic since 1913)
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To: Dallas59

Just ask Delos David Harriman or Salvor Hardin...


16 posted on 04/24/2012 6:15:00 PM PDT by freedumb2003 ('RETRO' Abortions = performed on 84th trimester individuals who think killing babies is a "right.")
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To: Telepathic Intruder

LOL you can say that again !


17 posted on 04/24/2012 6:17:07 PM PDT by ATOMIC_PUNK (Any man may make a mistake ; none but a fool will persist in it . { Latin proverb })
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To: Dallas59

imagine if these bed wetters were around during the gold rush days


18 posted on 04/24/2012 6:20:55 PM PDT by capydick (''Life's tough.......it's even tougher if you're stupid.'')
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To: Dallas59

Save the whale, save the environment, save the earth .... and coming to our galaxy, Save the solar system.

I think our historical record kinda intimates that whoever funds it and gets there and militarizes it the most, gets to keep it.


19 posted on 04/24/2012 6:21:02 PM PDT by Usagi_yo
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To: capydick
imagine if these bed wetters were around during the gold rush days

At this point its nothing more than a reflex to oppose with these idiots. They don't even bother to think about things any more.

If they really wanted to save the planet they would be demanding that mining and manufacturing move to space.
20 posted on 04/24/2012 6:28:39 PM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: freedumb2003
"Just ask Delos David Harriman or Salvor Hardin..."

Or Lazarus Long

21 posted on 04/24/2012 6:30:33 PM PDT by Neanderthal
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To: Neanderthal

>>Or Lazarus Long<<

That whole sexual thing with his mom kind of freaked me out a bit. As did the (apparent) sexual “games” with his genetic daughters/clones? (IIRC) while they were still children.


22 posted on 04/24/2012 6:34:48 PM PDT by freedumb2003 ('RETRO' Abortions = performed on 84th trimester individuals who think killing babies is a "right.")
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To: Usagi_yo
I think our historical record kinda intimates that whoever funds it and gets there and militarizes it the most, gets to keep it.

If I were emperor I would incentivize space. Offer 100,000 acre claims on the moon for whoever sets foot there and shows an ability to develop it. I would do the same with asteroids. Anything produced and sent back to earth would be untaxed till the point of sale.
23 posted on 04/24/2012 6:35:32 PM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: Dallas59

I think the Space Law is that he who can make it to space makes the laws.


24 posted on 04/24/2012 6:37:46 PM PDT by WinOne4TheGipper (Fighting the Left does not mean that we have to adopt all of their tactics.)
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To: Dallas59
I would say it is legal as a corporation isn't necessarily bound by treaties signed by nations.

All they have to do is move outside the nation's territorial boundaries.

And no nation “owes” Outer Space.

All they have to do go out and physically stake a claim and start mining operations it, not simply say they own it as that fellow in the article ridiculously did.

Of course, getting the material in nations that prohibit it may be a different matter...

25 posted on 04/24/2012 6:38:33 PM PDT by RedMonqey (Men who will not suffer to self govern, will suffer under the governance of lesser men.)
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To: ATOMIC_PUNK; Dallas59
But to whom do those trillions belong — the company, or everyone? Does a private company have a right to stake claim to an asteroid, or are celestial bodies such as the moon, planets and asteroids the communal property of all Earthlings?

No, poor dear. Though they potentially exist for everyone, they actually belong to those who have the intelligence, drive, and means to get them. The act of taking and converting them from just junk floating around in space is the act that converts them to private property. Have you never read John Locke?
"Though the earth and all inferior creatures be common to all men, yet every man has a 'property' in his own 'person.' This nobody has any right to but himself. The 'labor' of his body and the 'work' of his hand, we may say, are properly his. Whatsoever, then he removes out of the state that Nature hath provided and left it in, he hath mixed his labor with, and joined to it something that is his own, and thereby make it his property. It being by him removed from the common state Nature hath placed it in, it hath by his labor something annexed to it that excludes the common right of other men. For this 'labor' being the unquestionable property of the laborer, no man but he can have a right to what that is once joined to, at least where there is enough, and as good left in common for others."
--John Locke, The Second Treatise of Government, Chapter 5, Section 16 (New York: Barnes & Noble, 2004)
And as far as the universe goes and all that exists within it, there is enough left in common for others. If those others don't want to get off their butts and get some for themselves or help support the enterprise of those who do, then they have no business restricting others from doing so or demanding a cut of the profit for the simple reason of having slid down the chute into this world and drawing breath.
26 posted on 04/24/2012 6:38:45 PM PDT by aruanan
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To: ATOMIC_PUNK
Does a private company have a right to stake claim to an asteroid, or are celestial bodies such as the moon, planets and asteroids the communal property of all Earthlings?

Nothing belongs to us, not even our bodies. We may control it for a time, but we can't take it with us and it will eventually return to the earth.

27 posted on 04/24/2012 6:39:48 PM PDT by oldbrowser (They are Marxists, don't call them democrats)
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To: Dallas59

I have a suggestion for a deal with the libs...

We’ll go mining Asteroids.

They can go mining Hemorrhoids.


28 posted on 04/24/2012 6:41:15 PM PDT by C210N (Go Newt!)
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To: Dallas59

If we want to hamper space exploration and the discovery of new resources, then yes, we should consider it communal property.


29 posted on 04/24/2012 6:43:32 PM PDT by andyk (Go Juan Pablo!)
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To: Dallas59

We can’t even take plants across state lines and they want to bring asteroid turf here? What if there is an alien in it?


30 posted on 04/24/2012 6:43:59 PM PDT by huldah1776
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To: aruanan

There’s a reason why so many sci fi novels are about rebellion against earth.


31 posted on 04/24/2012 6:47:55 PM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: Dallas59

China and India did not sign that treaty. China also did not sign the one that says nobody can mine the seafloor unless you share with everyone.

So like China now has all the rare earth elements, if they get a good asteroid they’ll have all the platinum and iridium.

I say mine the asteroids, and when you actually have a gigaton of iron, a megaton of gold, and sixteen kilotons of platinum, agree to negotiate.


32 posted on 04/24/2012 6:48:14 PM PDT by DBrow
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To: RedMonqey; Dallas59; cripplecreek; Usagi_yo
Does a private company have a right to stake claim to an asteroid, or are celestial bodies such as the moon, planets and asteroids the communal property of all Earthlings?

How can something that is not of Earth be the communal property of all Earthlings?

That is insane. If no person (Earthling or non-Earthling) has set foot or occupied this planetoid how can any individual or communal body lay claim to that which they can not physically possess.

The only law that I can see having any relevance to this argument is the law of salvage.

I would consider an asteroid analogous to a derelict ship at sea. Anyone finding the asteroid and take possession of it can claim salvage rights to the asteroid.

33 posted on 04/24/2012 6:49:31 PM PDT by Pontiac (The welfare state must fail because it is contrary to human nature and diminishes the human spirit.)
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To: cripplecreek

TANSTAAFL!


34 posted on 04/24/2012 6:50:08 PM PDT by DBrow
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To: Dallas59

They should get all these assholes together in one place, bring back an asteroid, and say “Here, catch.”


35 posted on 04/24/2012 6:50:15 PM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh, bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: aruanan

You’d think, wouldn’t you. Unfortunately, places like Alaska have been giving every resident a check representing a portion of the oil value removed from state lands. That sets a nasty precedent.


36 posted on 04/24/2012 6:55:19 PM PDT by Kellis91789 (The ultimate result of shielding men from the effects of folly is to fill the world with fools.)
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To: tacticalogic
They should get all these assholes together in one place, bring back an asteroid, and say “Here, catch.”

LOL Here's your freakin asteroid. Enjoy.
37 posted on 04/24/2012 6:59:39 PM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: Dallas59

Only until George Soros can own them. Then Barry will provide mining “aid” (for the Soros-owned company) so that the mining can start sooner rather than later.


38 posted on 04/24/2012 7:00:10 PM PDT by rod1 (CTLY)
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To: Dallas59

There is only one solution; the progessives, socialists, democrats, greens, peta folk and their supporters need to be sent to a new planet.
We need to do this for the children.


39 posted on 04/24/2012 7:01:54 PM PDT by MrBambaLaMamba (This Message Contains Privileged Attorney-Client Communications)
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To: cripplecreek
Ever read Heinlein's The Moon is a Harsh Mistress? :)
40 posted on 04/24/2012 7:03:05 PM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh, bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: Pontiac
The only law that I can see having any relevance to this argument is the law of salvage.

Sounds plausible to me.

I would aid in case of the asteroid goes awry and heads towards earth, they would be responsible for damages....

That is if anyone is left alive...;--)
41 posted on 04/24/2012 7:05:40 PM PDT by RedMonqey (Men who will not suffer to self govern, will suffer under the governance of lesser men.)
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To: tacticalogic

One of my first sci fi reading experiences.

Revolt on Alpha C

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revolt_on_Alpha_C


42 posted on 04/24/2012 7:08:37 PM PDT by cripplecreek (What does it profit a man if he gains the whole world but loses his soul?)
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To: Dallas59
It is time for us to withdraw from the Outer Space Treaty and to update the 1856 Guano Islands Act to apply to resources found on asteroids and other celestial bodies.

I propose amending the 1856 law to read:

Whenever any citizen of the United States discovers a deposit of minerals on any asteroid, moon, or planet, not within the lawful jurisdiction of any other Government, and not occupied by the citizens of any other Government, and takes peaceable possession thereof, and occupies the same, such asteroid or territory within 50 miles of the point of occupation on such moon or planet may, at the discretion of the President, be considered as appertaining to the United States.
43 posted on 04/24/2012 7:09:12 PM PDT by Salohcin
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To: tacticalogic
Ever read Heinlein's The Moon is a Harsh Mistress? :)

Throw another rock Mike.
44 posted on 04/24/2012 7:10:07 PM PDT by BikerJoe
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To: BikerJoe
Throw another rock Mike.

Wye?

45 posted on 04/24/2012 7:12:45 PM PDT by tacticalogic ("Oh, bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
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To: Dallas59

46 posted on 04/24/2012 7:13:15 PM PDT by Godzilla (3/7/77)
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To: Salohcin

Drop the “at the discretion of the President” crap and I’m with you.


47 posted on 04/24/2012 7:14:02 PM PDT by Lurker (The avalanche has begun. The pebbles no longer have a vote.)
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To: Dallas59

Possession is 99% of the law. Finders keepers losers weepers.


48 posted on 04/24/2012 7:19:43 PM PDT by GreatRoad (O < 0)
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To: cripplecreek
There’s a reason why so many sci fi novels are about rebellion against earth.

In Heinlein's "The Moon is a Harsh Mistress", the lunar colonists use mass drivers to drop meteorites on the earth. ("Here's your tax payment!").

49 posted on 04/24/2012 7:53:20 PM PDT by 6SJ7 (Meh.)
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To: Dallas59

any financial benefit from mining asteroids would obviously belong to those that risked finances and/or worked on the endeavor.

obviously.

only the mentally diseased on the left could think those that take no risks, endure no hardships, and contribute no work deserve anything

and no, the ‘universe’ is not the property of the people of the earth. that’s patently absurd.


50 posted on 04/24/2012 8:00:38 PM PDT by sten (fighting tyranny never goes out of style)
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