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End of the manual transmission?
Fox News ^ | May 02, 2012 | Thomas Bey

Posted on 05/02/2012 1:50:24 PM PDT by Sopater

Go to any given dealership with 100 new cars.

On average, just four of the 2012 models will have manual gearboxes.

The trend of the vanishing third pedal is nothing new, notes The Detroit News.

Even a decade ago, just 8.5 percent of 2002 models were manuals. The paper’s own automotive reporter even confesses she never learned to drive a stick shift until it essentially became a job requirement.

It’s more than a little contradictory to automotive reviews (including many you’ll read here) extolling the pleasure of enthusiastic driving with a true manual gearbox. Likewise, purists gravitate to manuals for tackling their favorite twisting road or occasional track day. It’s the original form of in-car connectivity.

(Excerpt) Read more at foxnews.com ...


TOPICS: Miscellaneous; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: automobiles; cars; manualtransmission
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To: Figment
No reason for a manual tranny in a vehicle other than a work truck these days. Automatics have improved to the point that mpg differences are negligible and they are a lot less likely to have problems than a clutch

For the first 100K then its dicey with potential a HUGE bill (>$3K) coming your way.

101 posted on 05/02/2012 4:44:58 PM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: All

are there any cars that have “paddle shifters” like they have in F1???


102 posted on 05/02/2012 4:51:17 PM PDT by ak267
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To: central_va

250,000 on my Z/28 auto with nary a prob. That would probably be 2 clutches


103 posted on 05/02/2012 5:01:07 PM PDT by Figment
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To: central_va
Ladies and gentlemen the Holy Grail of Manual Transmissions, The Muncie M22 Rock Crusher:

My cousin had one of those in a Buick Skylark GS 455. Dang thing whined like a wife on a small shoe budget.

It's toughness is legendary, though. However, the Ford Toploader has the most rigid case design, which is why Jericho racing transmissions are taken from that design. A big-block Toploader is probably every bit as tough as a Rockcrusher.

The best part about those transmissions is the fact that you'd have to do something spectacularly stupid to really hurt either of them. Modern aluminum-case manuals abound, but I wince at the thought of power-shifting them like I did those old beasts of the Big 3.

104 posted on 05/02/2012 5:01:29 PM PDT by Charles Martel (Endeavor to persevere...)
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To: Figment

I’ve NEVER got more than 175K out of an AT. You got lucky I think. Being in a car when the Tranny blows is a real experience.


105 posted on 05/02/2012 5:03:58 PM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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To: Charles Martel

FWIW the old Muncies are aluminum case and the (weaker) Saginaws are cast iron case.


106 posted on 05/02/2012 5:10:13 PM PDT by nascarnation
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To: Red Badger
I’ve seen this same story written over and over about every ten years or so...........

Back in the mid 80s the Army decided nobody could drive manuals anymore, it was a waste of time and money to try and teach recruits, and they went automatics across the board. That was pretty indicative.

107 posted on 05/02/2012 5:14:04 PM PDT by nascarnation
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To: central_va

My Jeep GC has an auto-manual. I could get used to one. I want to trade it. I’m looking at a Mercedes 230 and a BMW or Volvo but my son(16) is working me for a straight drive car.


108 posted on 05/02/2012 5:15:33 PM PDT by AppyPappy (If you really want to annoy someone, point out something obvious that they are trying hard to ignore)
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To: henkster

I learned on an antique fork lift. but I still remember my first time behind the wheel of a car with a stick. I thought it would be a piece of cake since I knew how to drive the fork lift. But forklifts are never driven on hills. That first hill I had to take off from a dead stop was not pretty.


109 posted on 05/02/2012 5:59:29 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: Figment

Yes, kinda.

Back then, overdrive was a 2 speed manual transmission bolted onto the back side of the regular transmission. It was kinda like the transfer case on a 4wd pickup except without the drive shaft to the front wheels.

You could have an overdive transmission AND a 2speed rear end...so if you had a 3 speed transmission, plus over drive plus a two speed rear end, you would have 12 theoretical gear ratios. Of course many of them would be useless. You would only have 7 useful gear ratios, I think. Maybe only 5.


110 posted on 05/02/2012 6:25:44 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: truth_seeker

All wheel drive is awesome for straight line zero to sixty times. It sucks for handling, braking, and high speed acceleration...as in, say, 75mph to 150mph. So basically, in the real world it is pretty cool. On a race track, not so much.


111 posted on 05/02/2012 6:29:49 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: ak267

Yes

acura had a super duper model integra at one time with paddles. Ferari had a model at one time with paddles. Those are the only two I know of. There are probably a couple others.


112 posted on 05/02/2012 6:32:57 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: Figment

I just remembered another feature of the old overdrive transmissions. It has been nearly 50 years since I had that old 55 so my memory is not that clear.

That feature was “freewheeling’. If the transmission was in overdrive and you took your foot off the accelerator, the car would basically act as if it was in neutral. If you needed to use the gears to decelerate you had to take it out of overdrive.

I am not sure why but probably it was necessary for the overdrive to work properly.

That old 55 would fly. I remember it had a top speed of 110 and it would do that in 3 different gears. 2nd and overdrive, high, and high with overdrive.

My best friend’s Father bought a new 63 galaxy 500 with a 352 and a four barrel. We had a drag race and the old 55 beat it pretty easily.


113 posted on 05/02/2012 6:56:33 PM PDT by yarddog
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To: mamelukesabre

You realize Audi has dominated P1 (top class) in the LeMans series for several years, with quattro (and turbodiesel)?

And soon after quattro was instroduced, it dominated unlimited class, so it got outlawed. 1982 to 1987 Pike’s Peak.

My initial remark was perhaps poorly stated, that modern vehicles are faster than muscle car era smokey, noisy, rubber burning stuff.

IOW to go really fast, not just special effects.

In the real world, if you are seriously interested in performance vehicles, why not get the real thing?


114 posted on 05/02/2012 7:01:35 PM PDT by truth_seeker
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To: yarddog

A friend of mine had a Studebaker Hawk with an overdrive knob on the dash that had to be pulled I believe. I have no idea how it worked. My only idea as to how it worked was that it was in the rear end and not the transmission itself. But that’s always just been a guess


115 posted on 05/02/2012 7:06:22 PM PDT by Figment
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To: central_va

I know of old 400 turbos doing it too. Not to knock manual trannys, but I’ve not seen clutches last that long unless it was all highway miles


116 posted on 05/02/2012 7:10:20 PM PDT by Figment
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To: central_va

For the first 100K then its dicey with potential a HUGE bill (>$3K) coming your way.

true on the cost. I’ve used teflon fluid in the tranny and differential since the first change. That may have helped


117 posted on 05/02/2012 7:13:23 PM PDT by Figment
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To: truth_seeker
I watched a street race between a 2wd BMW M3, and a Subaru AWD WRX STI. The Subaru won easily.

In the winter my 4x4 m/t Suburban (1990) would beat all sorts of sports cars off the line.

118 posted on 05/02/2012 7:16:31 PM PDT by Paladin2
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To: Sopater

Wife and I just traded in a big Diesel truck (Six Speed Manual) for a brand new Hyundai Sedan (Six Speed Manual).


119 posted on 05/02/2012 7:17:23 PM PDT by Rides_A_Red_Horse
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To: Figment

I do remember that the overdrive was in the rear of the transmission but it was not an addition in that everything was enclosed in the same case.

When I had to replace the transmission, I got another one from a junkyard. I had no idea how they worked but remember Daddy hooking up some wires to the replacement and checking to see if the solenoid worked. Sure enough, every time he would put power to the terminals, the solenoid would click and you could tell it was moving something inside the transmission.


120 posted on 05/02/2012 7:22:06 PM PDT by yarddog
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To: truth_seeker

Pikes peak is not a typical road course.


121 posted on 05/02/2012 7:33:52 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: yarddog

Galaxy was not a slow car.


122 posted on 05/02/2012 7:37:15 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: yarddog

I am curious about the “freewheeling” effect. I think this was just an effect of having a very high(low numercally) gear ratio, but not really a “slipper clutch” type of effect. I would say that most likely if you were in first gear, you would have the engine braking effect even in overdrive.

At least I don’t remember any slipper clutch like action from the old overdrive trannys.


123 posted on 05/02/2012 7:41:09 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: mamelukesabre

My old 1955 had a 4.11 rear end.That is one reason it was so quick off the line. That worked just fine in combination with the overdrive.


124 posted on 05/02/2012 7:55:51 PM PDT by yarddog
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To: Sopater

A manual transmission is an excellent theft deterrent these days.


125 posted on 05/02/2012 7:58:37 PM PDT by B Knotts (Just another Tenther)
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To: B Knotts

Yes, and it also keeps people from asking to borrow your car...or truck. Usually people ask to borrow pickups more than cars, but if it is a stick, they ask someone else instead.


126 posted on 05/02/2012 8:23:43 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: central_va
Wow! And with a Hurst Four speed shifter too.

I LOVED that tranny, and I loved the car I installed it in; a 1957 Chevy Bel Air Sport Coup.

Now THAT was a nice car. Wish I still had it. I learned a LOT from that car.

Don't forget the 12 bolt rear end either.

127 posted on 05/02/2012 8:47:11 PM PDT by China Clipper ( Animals? Sure I like animals. See? There they are next to the potatoes!)
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To: mamelukesabre

“Pikes peak is not a typical road course.”

The LeMans series has been dominated by Audi quattro turbodiesels for several years.

LeMans, Sebring, Laguna Seca, etc. Road courses.

Since 2000 Audi won all but two times.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_24_Hours_of_Le_Mans_winners

and here

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_American_Le_Mans_Series_champions


128 posted on 05/02/2012 9:53:49 PM PDT by truth_seeker
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To: truth_seeker

and you think this is because of the 4wd?

I would rebut to you that audi engineering overcomes their 4wd handicap via sheer brain power. No other brand has the brain power to do this.


129 posted on 05/02/2012 10:09:51 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: mamelukesabre

“and you think this is because of the 4wd?

I would rebut to you that audi engineering overcomes their 4wd handicap via sheer brain power. No other brand has the brain power to do this.”

Why would they keep it, if it is a handicap, and they are superior engineers? The only handicap I know of is weight.

BTW the Deutsche Touring Motoring class will start in 2013 licensed with Nascar.

I like racing, but Nascar leaves me bored, round and round, every week. Once in awhile, sure...like Indy 500.

There is nothing like watching cars go through the corkscrew at Laguna Seca and then accelerate past the grandstands.


130 posted on 05/02/2012 10:26:51 PM PDT by truth_seeker
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To: Paladin2
Depends on the gearing for each vehicle. I've always found I get better than EPA mileage on a manual and worse on an auto. YMMV.

I've found I get worse on both. With the auto, I figure they're playing with the numbers. With the stick, I play too much for it to be efficient. ;-)

131 posted on 05/03/2012 6:11:53 AM PDT by IYAS9YAS (Rose, there's a Messerschmitt in the kitchen. Clean it up, will ya?)
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To: Sopater

At least manuals are not completely gone yet.

My 2010 Mustang Gt had a wonderful 5 speed manual, and my 2011 Hyundai Genesis Coupe 3.8 has a 6 speed manual that absolutely rocks.


132 posted on 05/03/2012 6:20:18 AM PDT by commish (Freedom tastes sweetest to those who have fought to preserve it.)
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To: mamelukesabre; ak267

Numerous cars have paddle shifters now.

Almost all Camaros have paddle shifters, Hyundai Genesis Coupes along with other models have them, Nissan Altima had them, etc etc


133 posted on 05/03/2012 6:22:54 AM PDT by commish (Freedom tastes sweetest to those who have fought to preserve it.)
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To: goseminoles

http://partywiththis.com/images/P/beercanhat56163.jpg


134 posted on 05/03/2012 6:23:37 AM PDT by IYAS9YAS (Rose, there's a Messerschmitt in the kitchen. Clean it up, will ya?)
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To: Figment

My Miata now has 277K on the odometer and is on its third clutch, which IIRC went in at around 235K. Clutch #2 lasted close to 140,000 miles.

Yes, changing a clutch is a hassle. On a Miata you have to remove a LOT of stuff to get the transmission out, including the entire exhaust system from the downpipe back, but if you don’t abuse the clutch you don’t have to change it very often.


135 posted on 05/03/2012 7:32:15 AM PDT by ZirconEncrustedTweezers (We apologise for the fault in this tagline. Those responsible have been sacked.)
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To: mamelukesabre
All wheel drive is awesome for straight line zero to sixty times. It sucks for handling, braking, and high speed acceleration...as in, say, 75mph to 150mph. So basically, in the real world it is pretty cool. On a race track, not so much.

I'd imagine AWD has at least some benefit on the race track, given that a lot of racing organizations have banned it.

136 posted on 05/03/2012 7:36:19 AM PDT by ZirconEncrustedTweezers (We apologise for the fault in this tagline. Those responsible have been sacked.)
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To: truth_seeker

Audi’s LMP cars are rear-drive. You are correct that they are turbodiesels (except for the R8).


137 posted on 05/03/2012 7:38:25 AM PDT by ZirconEncrustedTweezers (We apologise for the fault in this tagline. Those responsible have been sacked.)
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To: truth_seeker
What, in a straight line?

You might drive an Audi quattro, and feel differently.


I'm talking about preferences, which include looks and quality of construction. Those old muscle cars were built with solid steel and looked awesome. Here's a '68 to drool over. ;-)


138 posted on 05/03/2012 8:04:13 AM PDT by Sopater (...where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. - 2 COR 3:17b)
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To: nascarnation
In 1967 some of the deuce & half trucks that were to haul us
back from a drop zone about fifty miles had automatic trans.
These were older trucks supplied by GM, the newer multifuel
trucks had std. trans. About 2 or 3 miles after we were loaded one caught fire, driver hadn't released the parking brake totally. I think they had a version of hydromatic trans
My 1st new car 60 Chevy rag top had a 4 speed with a 2.20 1st
gear.Delivery was delayed over 2 mos. waiting or tranny.
almost like starting in second gear, rear axle gearing something like 3.78. Next rod was 1966 Plymoth Sat. w/426 hemi, it would blow my brothers Stingray w/ factor full race
setup except carb instead of FI

As far as shifting gears nothing competes w/Mack 10speed duplex trans,one arm thru steering wheel for one stick,other
hand on 2nd stick to split gears

139 posted on 05/03/2012 10:10:51 AM PDT by TweetEBird007
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To: Charles Martel

Don’t remember the make but I drove a four on the tree truck in Japan.


140 posted on 05/03/2012 10:49:36 AM PDT by GATOR NAVY
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To: Charles Martel

If I remember correctly some British & European cars had 4 on the tree.
A friend had an Austin 4 door that I think had it.
Thanks for the memory.


141 posted on 05/03/2012 1:59:12 PM PDT by certrtwngnut (It's not the people who vote that count, it's the people who count the votes. (Josef Stalin))
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To: cyclotic

Here’s another one...i taught my sister how to drive a stick on her VW bug...when she went solo she kept stalling every time she stopped...turns out she thought you only have to run through the gears once then you were good for the day...e


142 posted on 05/03/2012 3:08:17 PM PDT by wtc911 (Amigo - you've been had.)
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To: ZirconEncrustedTweezers

I don’t know the reason for banning it, but if I had to guess, i’d say it was a safety issue.

AWD must be driven totally different to get through curves fast. So an AWD car will not be braking and accelerating in the same places as all the other cars. That increases odds of a collisions.

Just my hunch.


143 posted on 05/03/2012 4:10:05 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: Sopater

They ruined it. It should be a crime to “tub” a classic like that.


144 posted on 05/03/2012 4:11:50 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: AnAmericanAbroad
Maybe in the US, but not here in Europe. Almost every car, even top-of-the-line cars, come with manual transmissions. You can get automatic, of course, but here if you don’t know how to drive stick, you’re taking the bus.

Last year in France, my car rental agent was worried that I wouldn't be able to drive a manual transmission-equipped car. They had no automatic cars - none. So I did as the French do - looking as put-upon as possible, I heaved a sigh, rolled my eyes and drove off in my little diesel, 5-speed hatchback. Did a damned smooth job of it, too.

145 posted on 05/03/2012 5:28:34 PM PDT by Charles Martel (Endeavor to persevere...)
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To: Figment; yarddog
A friend of mine had a Studebaker Hawk with an overdrive knob on the dash that had to be pulled I believe. I have no idea how it worked. My only idea as to how it worked was that it was in the rear end and not the transmission itself. But that’s always just been a guess

The car companies sourced overdrive units from several companies in the '50s and '60s - some were completely manual, some used electric solenoids, some a combination. Some were attached to the tailshaft housing of the transmission (I think the '55 Ford used a Borg-Warner unit mounted there); some overdrives were part of the rear axle assembly (later 1960s Fords and possibly the Studebaker). One such product was the Hone-O-Drive.

Whenever I find a junkyard with some old pickup trucks, I peek under all the '60s and early '70s Fords - those seem to be the last place that those axle-mounted units were used. They are worth $$$$ to the hot-rodding community, the now rare examples bringing ten times their original price of $300 - $400. Nowadays, though, not many junkyard workers know what those things are. I'd buy the entire axle unit, if necessary, to get the overdrive.

146 posted on 05/03/2012 5:43:04 PM PDT by Charles Martel (Endeavor to persevere...)
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To: Charles Martel

That is interesting.

I am not sure what ever happened to my old 55. The last I saw of it, I traded it to my Uncle for a hog which my parents butchered.

I rode in it maybe two years later and Uncle Milton had spent a little money on it and had it running good again. Don’t remember what he ever did with it but he died maybe 20 years ago.

I always had a soft spot for the Ford 272. Only 164 horsepower but it was a running machine.


147 posted on 05/03/2012 5:55:26 PM PDT by yarddog
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To: yarddog

hmmm

You like tiny V8s and I like big straight sixes. The ford 300six was an awesome motor.


148 posted on 05/03/2012 6:24:52 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: central_va

Automatics should last 200k...probably 250+ on the most recent models. Unless you pull a trailer that is. Vehicles built back in the 80s the automatic was only good for 100k. Not anymore. There have been certain models with notoriously weak trannies. The chevy cavalier comes to mind.


149 posted on 05/03/2012 6:33:58 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: mamelukesabre

I have never had and AT last more than 175K and I really do meticulous maintenance.


150 posted on 05/03/2012 6:50:53 PM PDT by central_va ( I won't be reconstructed and I do not give a damn.)
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